Most reliable way to trigger a back up copy of QLab

[nizer]

If I’m running two identical computers, one with an identical copy of the show, I’m currently currently running. What is the most reliable way to have both machines be synced as I’m running two identical computers, one with an identical copy of the show, I’m currently running. What is the most reliable way to have both machines be synced as I use the Go Button through the queues. I’m guessing a hardwired Midi out of computer one into a midi in cable into computer two would be the best?

[Sam Kusnetz]

The most reliable is hardwired MIDI or OSC out of a dedicated controller to both Macs, and no direct connection between the Macs.

If you use one to talk to the other, then a failure on main could cause a failure on backup.

sk

––
Sam Kusnetz [he/him/his] (what is this?)
Figure 53
https://qlab.app | https://figure53.com

On Jul 7, 2024 at 9:16 AM -0400, nizer <ma...@nizer.com>, wrote:

If I’m running two identical computers, one with an identical copy of the show, I’m currently currently running. What is the most reliable way to have both machines be synced as I’m running two identical computers, one with an identical copy of the show, I’m currently running. What is the most reliable way to have both machines be synced as I use the Go Button through the queues. I’m guessing a hardwired Midi out of computer one into a midi in cable into computer two would be the best?

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[Iain Simons]

Hey Sam, 

I'm trying to figure out the most (frankly) low-budget version of doing this too... 

Could you give an example of what other dedicated controllers might be? Right now, we're using a streamdeck (as it's a complicated show with lots of non-linear stuff that an operator needs explaining), and having companion fire cues to both master and backup (from the master) into a switcher. This obvs doesn't protect against the master failing... I know we could add a third mac to fire out midi / osc to both, but was wondering if there's another option we've not considered. 

I understand that you could run companion on a raspberry pi, but not quite had time to figure that setup out...

[micpool]

8:56 PM (1 minute ago) 

Whatever the solution employed is, it has to be a third device additional to the 2 QLab computers to provide dual triggering that is not reliant on both machines being functional.

The cheapest is a MIDI GO box style remote  with 2 parallel MIDI  outputs.  If you need lots of buttons for a non linear show, a MIDI keyboard (with a standard MIDI  output socket) split with a MIDI thru box would give, you up to 88 buttons (keys) which are completely silent in operation and very reliable.

If you don't need tactile feedback a device running TouchOSC  (preferably wired, through an ethernet adapter), can send any number of MIDI or OSC messages to multiple destinations, from as many buttons as you can safely cram onto the display of the device.

If you need to use Companion then it would need to run on a third device, and the cheapest device, is likely to be a raspberry pi.

All the above solutions can be reliably achieved with readily available equipment for between 100-200 pounds/dollars.

Mic

[S!mon-R]

I’ve dreamt about a little go box with 4 buttons , and 2 independant usb out, possibly isolated.  I found one on AliExpress which worked well, just had to ask firmware with midi capability which was kindly provided.  So far, it works very well :

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004797808618.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.order_list_main.217.7b851802ww0eNL

[w.ch...@iatse107.org]

Hiya.

I’ve used ThatLittleBox in the past to trigger two computers via USB..

I also just got one of these

https://www.amazon.com/Button-compatible-QLab®-Single-Dual/dp/B0B9VDVGTN/ref=sr_1_3?crid=1LLNK657RT5G5&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.poVJkuZVwTftZGBcWzggpcV2kES6MO6mxqqQ-GboLhA5UHRek80rweADb2AA4TAuHN3f2_AvxE6n_OL2FUtH4yOASfPxhTVnzgmnC1WibWMql6jgf7c75JilpAZ_yI0oQ1G8JrEGErhvdaNtcl3O61Br0TuHpfJdu0ye5VbdyQyTRVFk-Rvr5cID3PE_9_7zgN__X4TDscrg0-PjSDXxFqfdj0O8R74m7kq8LqEGdBdw_BKwEf6UiTxtYAfzKPAOZyP2tzeuAk1s4nbhFp4cjSpxW_2827jv5OxxR8k_fNw.zI4Rb13ygvSLL1e6ypIzjSbprJDXhbnO-7LK0IJKOHs&dib_tag=se&keywords=Go+button&qid=1720442746&sprefix=go+button%2Caps%2C190&sr=8-3

Make sure to order the one with two. USBs.  Still need to switch if the master fails.  I’ve used a simple HDMI switch if visuals only, or a media switcher for both visual and audio.

[Sam Kusnetz]

In addition to the other suggestions you’ve received…

I am the co-creator of Team Sound which makes the Go Box, expressly designed for this purpose: https://www.teamsound.nyc. This is my favorite solution, of course! Obviously I’m biased, but the whole reason I created this product and this company was to offer a simple, dependable solution to this problem.

You could also use any MIDI controller at all with a 5-pin output (drum pad, keyboard… whatever) and connect that controller to a MIDI Solutions Thru, which takes one MIDI input and gives you two identical outputs. Then connect each output to a MIDI interface connected to each Mac.

You could also use something like Touch OSC on an iPad and direct it to send messages to both Macs. Touch OSC can send MIDI messages or OSC messages or both. If you went this route, I would recommend attaching an ethernet adapter to the iPad so that the impishness of wifi cannot stop you.

Best

Sam

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[Jumpcut Jeff]

I, too, have used the Go Button Box Remote: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0B9VDVGTN

It works well and the owner of the company is awesome. When I received it, I didn't like how noisy the buttons were. Very noticeable 'click' sounds. I was about to direct a show from a position in the back of house and the sounds would've been noticeable to people seated around me. I messaged her and she happily agreed to replace a couple of the buttons with quieter buttons...for free. Highly recommend!

[Philip Perkins]

How much do you want to rely on an obscure device with no tech support or reputation from an unknown small co. in China?  All of the solutions for this problem I’ve tried (yes, including GoBox) have some issuer sooner or later, human, Mac or who-knows caused.  Test test test.

phil p

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[Paul]

Most budget friendly and most reliable way is to have two (small) keyboards and have the operator press space on both. If you have Companion then you can set up the button to have two actions via different networks to direct /go to both of the Qlab machines. (obviously you need a third computer to run Companion, which is another point of failure). You will still have a single point of failure in the computer running Companion or in the Streamdeck or the cables or network connecting the computers. Even in the first case  you will still have a single point of failure.in the operator (and maybe others as well).  It just depends on how you access the risk of failure of each component in your chain (sound, video whatever) and the amount you are willing to spend to ameliorate that failure. My experience suggests Qlab / MacOS is pretty reliable when not doing anything else/silly on the computer. 

[José Miguel Mayoral]

I have to investigate carefully but right now I imagine it would be to duplicate the Go on machine 1 and 2 on the same Companion button and the same with all the commands you want to execute.

[José Miguel Mayoral]

Hi.

Isn't there a way to do it with Companion?

El jueves, 11 de julio de 2024 a las 18:54:57 UTC+2, Paul escribió:

[Paul]

Yes, with Companion make two Qlab connections with your IP addresses, ports and passcodes.

then create a button with 2 actions - Go for the each of the first and second qlab connections.

[Sam Kusnetz]

On Sep 6, 2024 at 7:42:17 AM, Paul <paulthom...@gmail.com> wrote:

Yes, with Companion make two Qlab connections with your IP addresses, ports and passcodes.
then create a button with 2 actions - Go for the each of the first and second qlab connections.

Just remember that if Companion is running on either your main or backup QLab Mac, then it’s not truly a backup because if the computer that’s running Companion crashes, both your QLab Macs lose access to your controller.

The safest way to use Companion to drive a main/backup QLab system is to run it from a third computer, either a “regular” computer or a Raspberry Pi.

-sk