[QLab] Remote access to playback system

[Jeromy Hopgood]

Hey all,

I am installing a new playback system in the 2 theatre spaces of my theatre department. I will have an iMac attached to an Echo Audiofire 16 channel FireWire device running full versions of QLab V2 (finally!) for my setup.

As part of tech, it frequently would be handy to:

1) Control my Qlab workspace remotely (from my MacBook in the house) and

2) Update audio files from my MacBook to the playback computer

I know there are a number of different approaches to this (remote desktop, setting up a shared network, etc) I am just curious to hear what has worked for you in a similar setting and any advice you might offer on this topic.

Jeromy Hopgood
Ass't Professor: Entertainment Design & Technology
Eastern Michigan University
www.jeromyhopgood.com

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[Matthew Haber]

I use a pretty run-of-the-mill VNC setup to actually access the computer and for transferring files I just use a standard shared folder over the network. There may be a more elegant way to handle this but this has worked fine enough for me.
Matthew

[Daniel Perelstein]

My default is screen-share over wired ethernet, which also allows me to drag and drop files from one machine to the other.
Dan

[Charles Coes]

If it is being installed, I would recommend a KVM extender (not entirely sure how this works with an iMac, but I'm sure there is a way.)  and an additional cat5/6 line for networking the computers.  This means that no matter how computer savvy the designer, they can still control Q-lab, and that they aren't obligated to bring a computer to tech (not sure if anyone is good enough to avoid it, but...)  

Belkin makes a good one, Gefen makes better, but more expensive ones.

If it is just for you, the built in Mac Screen Sharing vnc client is great.  

Charles Coes
cco...@gmail.com 
www.charlescoes.com
"When I'm working on a problem, I never think about beauty. I think only how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong." - Buckminster Fuller

[trel...@yahoo.com]

Hi Jeromy
I tried the screen sharing on the mac and this worked fined also.

Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Digicel

[Andy Leviss]

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 8:44 PM, Charles Coes <ccoes...@gmail.com> wrote:
> If it is being installed, I would recommend a KVM extender (not entirely
> sure how this works with an iMac, but I'm sure there is a way.)

The iMac has an output for a second monitor, so you'd attach the KVM
extender to that via whatever appropriate adapter, and put the second
display in mirror mode.

This is actually similar to what's becoming my standard recommendation
for redundant rigs, now that I spec Gefen extenders, which don't have
a local output. Budget allowing, it's a marginal cost bump from an
active DVI splitter to a second KVM switcher, and Gefen's switchers
are remote controllable via a contact closure. So just mirror to the
second output, letting the graphics card be the splitter, and the
designer has his own split of the two machines, independently
selectable from the engineer/operator. It's like having a 2x2 KVM
matrix, but for a fraction of the cost.

--Andy

[dr.light]

Jeromy - 

i vote for ARD and shared folders. As long as you are running cat6 and gigabit everywhere that should be more than fast - wouldnt reccomend over WIFI, but if you have a robust enough network it could be ok.  Especially if you're not doing video, just audio.

I would also advise investing in a legitimate license of Apple Remote Desktop, as screen sharing will limit your viewing window to a fixed window, and if you ever have to do video - it will allow you to select just the 1st monitor (or any monitor for that matter).

KVM would be difficult as you would need a multi-user station setup (one for FOH one for CTRL), which is 'spensive.  Or be in the habit of re-patching a lot.

IMHO - Dont ever buy anything Gefen except for DVI detectives if you can help it. 

Rose would be the lowest end KVM you would even want to begin investing your money in. 

-jf

[Emery Roth III]

On Jan 27, 2011, at 12:34 PM, dr.light wrote:

I would also advise investing in a legitimate license of Apple Remote Desktop, as screen sharing will limit your viewing window to a fixed window, and if you ever have to do video - it will allow you to select just the 1st monitor (or any monitor for that matter).

ARD became available with a single user license on the app store, so it's now only 79$ per computer, this is great news as we only need it on one machine (the remote side of our equation).  Previously it was 5 license minimum for 499$

Our remote control solution has been to get two identical imacs, and a good reliable wifi network 802.11n, and apple remote desktop.  Since the screen sizes are identical and you can go to full screen in ARD the remote machine feels just like the local machine.  We do this in tech for VERY long hours and it works great.  

--Emery

[Charles Coes]

Untrue, the inbuilt screensharing application of osx will show you any one screen or all of them.  Admittedly all of them can be a bit much, but is still an option.

Charles Coes
cco...@gmail.com 
www.charlescoes.com
"When I'm working on a problem, I never think about beauty. I think only how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong." - Buckminster Fuller

On Jan 27, 2011, at 12:34 PM, dr.light wrote:

[Benjamin Stickels]

On Jan 27, 2011, at 12:34 PM, dr.light wrote:

KVM would be difficult as you would need a multi-user station setup (one for FOH one for CTRL), which is 'spensive.  Or be in the habit of re-patching a lot.

I'm confused here.  What would he need to re-patch?  I use a KVM setup all the time, and I simply have the QLab rig where ever it will be for the shows, and I have a monitor, keyboard, and mouse at my tech table.

IMHO - Dont ever buy anything Gefen except for DVI detectives if you can help it. 

Do you have some specific examples that back this up.  I don't use Gefen quite as much as other gear, but I have yet to have a major problem.

Rose would be the lowest end KVM you would even want to begin investing your money in. 

Again, why?  I've never used a Rose brand KVm extender, but a quick search shows the cheapest option to be over $600.  What's wrong with a less expensive unit?  I personally use a Avocent I picked up for much cheaper, and at UMKC we got an IOGear USB KVM extender for use with our Macs and PC's as needed (and it's used almost daily) with no problems thus far over 2 or 3 years.  I fail to see why it is necessary to get one for 3-4x as much to do the same tasks.

Just as some info, my typical setup for this is to have 2 Cat5 lines run to the tech table.  One is for file sharing with my laptop, the other is for the Cat5 KVM extender.  This has worked without flaw for several years now.  If it's a smaller show (or we have less room on the tech table), I leave out the KVM rig entirely and just use the built in screen sharing on the macs.  I also have a wireless router setup without being attached to an external network so if I need to roam and check the screen, I can.

Benjamin G. Stickels

[Emery Roth III]

Just to be clear Builtin OS X screen sharing WILL let you view multiple monitors, but it WON'T let you go FULLSCREEN.

Also, ARD lets you go into observe only mode which i find pretty handy.

--E

[dr.light]

but will it allow you to select just ONE screen, say for instance if
the machine you are using has 4 display outputs. If it does, ive
somehow magically overlooked it thus far.

observe mode VERY handy for when you are running a designer's remote
and dont want to freak your operator out.

On Jan 27, 2011, at 4:10 PM, Emery Roth III wrote:

> Just to be clear Builtin OS X screen sharing WILL let you view
> multiple monitors, but it WON'T let you go FULLSCREEN.

________________________________________________________

[Emery Roth III]

Yes, you can choose to just look at one, or multiple displays. Make sure you have the toolbar showing (pill shaped button in the upper right hand part of the window). If it still doesn’t show (should be a little drop down menu) then maybe you have to customize the toolbar. Just right click the toolbar, select customize and drag it in.

--E

[dr.light]

Sweet - thanks Emery!

this will be helpful, i hadnt ever really hunted around for the
toolbar before because ive just always had ARD kicking around.

-jf

[Jeremy Lee]

On Jan 26, 2011, at 8:44 PM, Charles Coes wrote:

> If it is being installed, I would recommend a KVM extender (not entirely sure how this works with an iMac, but I'm sure there is a way.)

MiniDisplay Port to VGA adapter and video mirror mode.

> and an additional cat5/6 line for networking the computers. This means that no matter how computer savvy the designer, they can still control Q-lab, and that they aren't obligated to bring a computer to tech (not sure if anyone is good enough to avoid it, but...)

Crucial for updating files,

> Belkin makes a good one, Gefen makes better, but more expensive ones.
> If it is just for you, the built in Mac Screen Sharing vnc client is great.

I recently had a weird issue with a Geffen one- it wouldn't play nicely with some widescreen monitors. Everything came out in some weird aspect ratio. And it needed 2x CAT-5 lines just for the KVM. Masque sends out IO Gear KVMs, and they work great.

--
Jeremy Lee
Sound Designer, NYC - USA 829
http://www.jjlee.com

[Andy Leviss]

On Sat, Jan 29, 2011 at 6:02 PM, Jeremy Lee <jerem...@jjlee.com> wrote:
> I recently had a weird issue with a Geffen one- it wouldn't play nicely with some widescreen monitors.  Everything came out in some weird aspect ratio.  And it needed 2x CAT-5 lines just for the KVM.

I haven't seen the former issue. The 2 lines are because they're going
DVI, and full USB 2.0. So DVI is on one line, and USB and DDC are on
the other. A nice benefit is that, if you need, you can plug a drive
into the remote unit, too, and it'll work. Pen tablets? No prob.

The other thing to beware of is that they advertise 200', and they
advertise cat 5E cable, and they advertise full 1920x1080, but they
*don't* make clear that, for the combination of all three together,
you should use cat 6, and ideally shielded cat 6. You have to read the
manual to learn that.

--A