Remote Mac App

[Alexander (Mailing List) Taylor]

Hello,

I'm wondering if there's a QLab Remote (like exists for iOS Devices) for the Mac? It would be very handy to use a laptop to control the show computer. I use multiple cuelists for dance shows, one for all the master cues that start audio, the gio, etc. and other cuelists for each show (most numbers repeat). I have the main cuelist per show open on my iPad, and then have the master list open on the computer to change levels, times, etc. as needed. If I had a remote app for the Mac, I could use my laptop, and do everything from the house.

Just a thought...

Alexander

Alexander R. Taylor
ata...@orcsd.org
(603) 280-4202

[John Evans]

I would love this capability - if QLab could connect to a remote instance of QLab as a client and edit without disturbing the operator, in much the same way as Eos lighting consoles can, this would be great. Designer KVM/screen sharing is useful but definitely not as transparent to the op.

Thanks,

John

[Mike Post]

Actually, people do this all the time using the Screen Sharing feature built into OSX.  It’s easy to connect and see and control the show computer as if you were sitting at it.

There’s a few caveats to this though;  It creates a bunch of CPU overhead which is always problematic for a mission critical machine.  I would recommend having an operator for actual performances but for building a show it’s very helpful.

Also - WiFi isn’t a great option for this or any other remote connection.  Running a dedicated Cat5 or 6 cable to make the connection eliminates a world of problems.

Mike Post

mdp...@mac.com

http://mdpostdesign.com

(601) 307-8657

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[Anthony Narciso]

I would also like this. The iPad app is great, but not precise enough for me to get by with just that.

[Alexander (Mailing List) Taylor]

Yes, but using Screen Sharing/VNC/ARD requires a change to the running workspace window.  Limiting you if there's an operator there, or if you want to work on multiple cue lists simultaneously.  For instance, I have my iMac running the dance show right now with the "Master Cues" list open so I can adjust levels and time, and my iPad with the "Show 1" list selected so I can start the show in the correct order (this is a rehearsal).  That's why I'd like a Mac Remote App.

Alexander

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[Lists]

the alternative to this is to have the OP dialed in, using OSC commands to fire the workspace with actual audio in it.  designer edits, operator takes cues.  It would take a bit of trickery to have the remote workspace query for current cue name, but i'm sure it's doable...

Charles Coes

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www.charlescoes.com
"Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction?  Fiction after all has to make sense" - Mark Twain

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[Craig K]

I seem to remember something on the forum here that I tried - that you could build custom interfaces for QLab with. But I don't recall what it was called.

Craig K

[Craig K]

ah, found it.

it was QBee - not sure if that will do what you want, but it's worth a look.

Craig K

[Drew Schmidt]

The solution I've always imagined for this is that QLab could control QLab; that you could add remote cue lists from a remote machine. My QLab would then be the interface for the remote machine. 

This would allow us to access a specific cue list from a specific workspace that is open on another specific machine. Changes made here would then be pushed to the remote machine (and vice versa). If you were to add a piece of media (video, image, sound) to a remote cue list, that media would push to the remote machine (which might want to be done only on command). Finally, you could also adjust the workspace settings on a remote machine (i.e. Adjust the surface settings of the Mac Mini sitting way up in the catwalks or the booth that can barely see the stage).

I assume that all this done over OSC (or whatever) would be much more efficient than VNC or the like? 

I walked through a number of museums this week with a group of university students. This type of solution could easily help create the sort of distributed systems that I saw there. 

Just an idea!

[Craig K]

Well, this could all be accomplished using variety of tools, but I don't know of an all-in-one solution.

creating, changing and triggering of cues could all be done with OSC providing you know exactly the path for any media. Pushing the media would be a simple file share and having the media directory on the remote machine open on the local so you can drop files there.

The biggest problem I see with all of this is that unless you have screen sharing on, I don't know how you can confirm any of your workflow. You'd be programming blind essentially.

Unless you added an applescript cue that when triggered publishes an updated cue list (as a text file or something) to the local machine. Then at least you can see that the list has been updated and with what values.

Craig K.

[Mike Post]

Just can’t help sticking my neck out…

I have a friend who has been a QLab user and supported since the early days of version 1.  He works in larger theatres and has large theatre needs but always found QLab to be an invaluable tool for his purposes.  For years now, he’s argued that the system should move to a server-client paradigm to allow for truly distributed production systems.  This would probably serve this remote access idea well.

I work in smaller houses, more in projection than sound, who have difficulty affording even one machine and so have always appreciated Figure53’s philosophy of affordability, quality and accessibility.  I also am highly appreciative of the clarity of the programming, how cleanly it works within the native environment of OSX despite Apple’s frequent mucking around with the platform.  I feel it really keeps the system stable.  I make sure the licensing they require is honored in theatres where I work since the price-point is so ridiculously reasonable and they’ve earned that pittance 10 times over.

I’m also a ‘dyed in the wool’ Mac supported.  My first mac was an SE with a whopping 40MB hard drive and my personal and production machines have gone through most of their offerings.  The only time I have serious problems with a Macintosh are when 3rd party gear is necessary or it’s not configured properly for production.  Given the options in computing, I still feel Apple despite the occasional annoying hiccup has the best philosophy for the future of computing.  Their move to internet appliance style consumer machines scares the pro user in me, but I’m waiting to see how that shakes out.  Relying on wireless networking cloud access is a bit frightening for a guy who started this party on an ASR-33 teletype at 110 baud.  Hard wires are my comfort zone.

So the question in my mind is can both theatre worlds still be served with QLab?  Can version 4 (hinted at by Chris in his 10 year celebration) achieve a truly distributed system for power users while maintaining the usability for us little folk?  I think the answer to this is yes given Figure53’s approaches but it will take a minute or two to suss it all out in the brave new world of cloud computing.

Mike Post

mdp...@mac.com

http://mdpostdesign.com

(601) 307-8657

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[Daniel Perelstein]

How about the operator triggers a "play / start" cue, targeting the intended cue list by assigning that "play / start" cue to the keyboard trigger of your choice, or a midi control, as you prefer. You also would need to disable the preference "lock playback position to selection", of course.

You can then muck around in any cue list you'd like, and your operator should be able to continue running down your show in order without worrying about what you're editing.

Dan 

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[Alexander (Mailing List) Taylor]

I really like this idea!  The Mac home automation software Indigo (yes, I try to automate every part of my life I can) prompts you on startup if you want to start a local server, or connect to a remote one.  It allows both client and server to be integrated into one, fairly transparently to the user.  The ability to have a headless server could even be a Pro feature.

That way you license the server, and the GUI we all know and love connects behind the scenes (OSC would make sense) to the server (transparently unless you enable headless mode or something).  Any install of QLab could control any pro-licensed headless server.  That would of course be a configuration option, so it's not enabled unless you want that behavior.

Alexander

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[Chris Ashworth]

Good morning everyone,

Last summer I spent a few weeks prototyping a version of remote access via QLab itself, very similar to what Drew described below.  In the experiment I did, editing one workspace would “mirror” those changes to other workspaces as they happened (via OSC).  It was a pretty fun experiment and I think definitely proved that this can work.

To make it fully useful will require figuring out the right conceptual framework and putting in a lot more polish than my two week experiment. One thing I learned when trying to use it was how critical it is to have clear visual feedback about the communication that is happening between the remote and local machines, to know what changes have happened at what times. I also learned that my first stab at a conceptual framework wasn’t great for a number of reasons, so we still need to explore exactly how to design what is happening between the QLab machines.

Because of all the design and engineering required to make this work well, I don’t expect to see it in QLab 4, but it’s very high on our list of interests. I’m excited to get back to working on it soon.

-C

[Waschfeld, Maik]

Hi Figure-Team,

 

To add my one or two cents to the Server-wish-list:

-          “QLab” as server-based installation should be switchable between “I’m the main-client” or “I’m the backup-client” or “I’m another (sounddesigner’s) client” and the servers between “I’m the main-server” or “I’m the backup-server” (announced by ZeroConfig/Bonjour) and manages behind the scenes that every programming change from the “QLab Remote”- (iOS) or “QLab”-clients (OS X) and sound-/video-/whatever-files that are used, will be transferred to all server-instances.

-          Actually switching between main- and backup-state by a button with “last switches priority”.

-          Main-client’s button switches between “Main” and “Offline”, backup-client’s button switches between “Backup” and “Main”.

-          Above mentioned main- and backup-clients don’t hold copies of the used files.

-          Those machines, that are defined as “another (sounddesigner’s) clients” hold copies of the used files.

-          All instances should follow the “main-clients” progression within the project, with exeption of the “another (sounddesigner’s) clients”.

-          “Headless”-mode on the servers should be possible on machines, where no user is logged in and the screen rests on the logging-screen.

 

 

Regards…

…Maik Waschfeld

 

 

Von: ql...@googlegroups.com [mailto:ql...@googlegroups.com] Im Auftrag von Alexander (Mailing List) Taylor
Gesendet: Sonntag, 5. Juni 2016 21:34
An: ql...@googlegroups.com
Betreff: Re: [QLab] Remote Mac App

 

I really like this idea!  The Mac home automation software Indigo (yes, I try to automate every part of my life I can) prompts you on startup if you want to start a local server, or connect to a remote one.  It allows both client and server to be integrated into one, fairly transparently to the user.  The ability to have a headless server could even be a Pro feature.

 

That way you license the server, and the GUI we all know and love connects behind the scenes (OSC would make sense) to the server (transparently unless you enable headless mode or something).  Any install of QLab could control any pro-licensed headless server.  That would of course be a configuration option, so it's not enabled unless you want that behavior.

 

Alexander

.

[Chris Drohan]

To add a further 2 cents to this, I think the way I see it is from a designers point of view, as needing at times to adjust levels and times, but without putting the operator out of sequence. I know of course there is a function to allow selecting cues while not moving the Go position. But this comes at the cost of the operator seeing these changes and having things move about which can put people off and distract. 

This would fill a gap of something I find myself needing/wanting on a daily basis!

On Saturday, 4 June 2016 17:04:57 UTC+1, Alexander (Mailing List) Taylor wrote:

[Tyler]

I have always wishes QLab would operate similar to an MA lighting network. I won't go into absurd detail but the basic idea of nodes joining a session and running all working within the same show file. One node is defined as master, the rest slaves.

[danny erdberg]

To me, the lighting world model (MA/ETCNet) seems right on.  Lots of networked clients being able to share/view/edit a common session/cuelist with one machine acting as master and one acting as backup.

This is similar to the D3 Video model- Which also includes provisions for offline pre-production programming and auto-pushing of content from main to backup machines.

Designer and assistant being able to work independently on the show while an operator is running would be a huge workflow improvement.  Very excited to hear it's on your radar!

[KHX]

Hello all; I just had a thought that this would be a great thing to have - Server/Client - mirror - whatever you want to call it, so I did a search and found this discussion - but to my dismay it's from 2016! So anyway I wanted to put in a vote for such a feature since now I'm swimming in old macs at school (harvested some from the e-waste pallet), and I'd like to set one up backstage so "someone" could activate the cue remotely without having to leave them my personal iPad for a remote. 

Anyway hopefully whatever comes down the pipes in v4.?? or v5 will also still be compatible with our old machines! (even if the remote app could work on MacOS as it sounds like iOS apps may one day be able to merge onto an Mac machine, that'd be perfect too!)

Thanks!

[Corbin White]

You could just use a second QLab session with OSC cues, or screen sharing. 

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[Joseph Heil]

Mac has a built in screen share/remote desktop function.  The backstage user could effectively control a Mac (with qlab) at the control position.

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[KHX]

Thanks all.

I tested it at home - hadn't used screen sharing in years on the macs.

For now that may solve the problem!

Also, I tried the OSC solution too - and if we can get upgraded to v4 that's going to be a brilliant solution - since for roaming dance groups I can setup a workspace with "buttons" that will refer to a list of cues 1-30 and they can just push the button which would activate a group in the booth.

Thanks again!

On Wednesday, June 19, 2019 at 9:43:34 PM UTC-7, Joseph Heil wrote:

Mac has a built in screen share/remote desktop function.  The backstage user could effectively control a Mac (with qlab) at the control position.

On Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 6:45 PM Corbin White <white....@gmail.com> wrote:

You could just use a second QLab session with OSC cues, or screen sharing. 

On Wednesday, June 19, 2019, KHX <kyle_...@nvusd.org> wrote:

Hello all; I just had a thought that this would be a great thing to have - Server/Client - mirror - whatever you want to call it, so I did a search and found this discussion - but to my dismay it's from 2016! So anyway I wanted to put in a vote for such a feature since now I'm swimming in old macs at school (harvested some from the e-waste pallet), and I'd like to set one up backstage so "someone" could activate the cue remotely without having to leave them my personal iPad for a remote. 

Anyway hopefully whatever comes down the pipes in v4.?? or v5 will also still be compatible with our old machines! (even if the remote app could work on MacOS as it sounds like iOS apps may one day be able to merge onto an Mac machine, that'd be perfect too!)

Thanks!

On Saturday, June 4, 2016 at 9:04:57 AM UTC-7, Alexander (Mailing List) Taylor wrote:

Hello,

I'm wondering if there's a QLab Remote (like exists for iOS Devices) for the Mac?  It would be very handy to use a laptop to control the show computer.  I use multiple cuelists for dance shows, one for all the master cues that start audio, the gio, etc. and other cuelists for each show (most numbers repeat).  I have the main cuelist per show open on my iPad, and then have the master list open on the computer to change levels, times, etc. as needed.  If I had a remote app for the Mac, I could use my laptop, and do everything from the house.

Just a thought...

Alexander

Alexander R. Taylor
ata...@orcsd.org
(603) 280-4202

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[micpool]

If you want a server that can serve a panel of 30 buttons to start QLab cues 1 to 30 (or any other number of any type of OSC controls) to any number of  devices Mac, PC, iPad, Android Phone etc.) on the network that can run a Chrome browser, then Open Stage Control will allow you to do this:

Top window Chrome Browser on a Mac, bottom Chrome on an iPhone

Open stage control set up should look like this:

json file attached

Set LOAD to load this file from wherever you store it. 

URL at bottom will be whatever  IP your computer is set to  and is what you use to point your chrome browser on any device on the network to this server.

Open Stage Control is an immensely powerful OSC tool. Because it is a cross platform server, it is very un Mac Like, but you can design really extraordinary and complex  OSC control panels with it. 

Mic

[KHX]

Ahhh, this is exactly what I laid out at home in advance in Qlab, then came in and discovered that the tech used a differrent convention for the numbering and once I took over there wasn't time to go through and even implement this, this time around! Can't wait to try it out though! Thanks for the ideas and sample.

[Corbin White]

The OSC API supports your Go, Panic, and Previous/Next controls. This is how I’ve set up a remote session for an SM to control at a tech table. I only use the /cue/{}/start command when specific cues are triggered remotely, e.g. from the orchestra pit.

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