editing slice markers

[Tom Wacker]

I´d like to fine-tune an audio loop by moving the start- and end-markers of that loop. To do it precisely, I have to zoom in to the max. Now the problem is, when I´m focused on the start-marker, the end-marker of that loop is miles away. No way to scroll to that position... Is there a script or workaround, to switch between start- and end marker in focus, while the loop is playing ? Something like "go to slice number x" maybe ?  I know, you can edit start and end points in the slice time window, but I would prefer, to do it visually...

[micpool]

I'm not sure what you mean by no way to scroll to that position. As soon as you zoom into the waveform  you get a scroll bar at the bottom. A mouse with a scroll wheel will enable you to zoom from max to minimum with the flick of a finger. If you are using a  track pad 2 fingers up and down zooms, 2 fingers  left to right scrolls, and if you have a magic mouse you can do the same with one finger.

Quickest way is to click roughly where you want, zoom in to max, add the slice, zoom out, click your second point, zoom all the way in, add your slice, zoom out.  With a magic mouse or trackpad it takes 5s for the whole process.

Check you are running the latest version. Scrolling around the waveform wasn't quite as good in some earlier versions.

Having said that, the maximum zoom is not always enough and there are no tab to  transient features or other navigation shortcuts either in the GUI or the scripting dictionary. If you are doing a lot of precise looping then an external editor that will carry it's markers into QLab can be  invaluable. You can right click on a waveform to open it in the application that is set in the finder to open that file i.e the 'Open with:' pop up menu in the files 'Get Info' window.   

Mic

[micpool]

There are some useful applescript things that can help a bit when you are in the waveform. 

For instance when you are zoomed fully in it's handy just to be able to drop the start or end  marker on the cursor without having to scroll about to find the physical marker to move.

These 2 scripts on separate hotkeys will do it.

tell application id "com.figure53.qlab.3" to tell front workspace

set thecue to the last item of (selected as list)

try

set the start time of thecue to (the action elapsed of thecue) + the (start time of thecue)

end try

end tell

tell application id "com.figure53.qlab.3" to tell front workspace

try

set thecue to the last item of (selected as list)

set the end time of thecue to (the action elapsed of thecue) + the (start time of thecue)

end try

end tell

The only problem is that you can only click the cursor on the currently active portion of the waveform so you then need hotkeys to clear the start and end points in case you do want to click in those areas.

tell application id "com.figure53.qlab.3" to tell front workspace

try

set thecue to the last item of (selected as list)

set the start time of thecue to 0

end try

end tell

tell application id "com.figure53.qlab.3" to tell front workspace

try

set thecue to the last item of (selected as list)

set the end time of thecue to 9999999

end try

end tell

Finally a  set of 10ms nudge hotkeys can be useful

tell application id "com.figure53.qlab.3" to tell front workspace

try

set thecue to the last item of (selected as list)

set the start time of thecue to the (start time of thecue) + 0.01

end try

end tell

etc.etc.

Attached is a workspace with a full set of the above cues.

[micpool]

One other useful script (to go on a hotkey)

tell application id "com.figure53.qlab.3" to tell front workspace

try

set thecue to the last item of (selected as list)

stop thecue

reset thecue

repeat

set thetime to (the end time of thecue) - 0.5 - (the start time of thecue)

load thecue time thetime

start thecue

delay 1.5

stop thecue

delay 0.1

end repeat

end try

end tell

Will loop round loop point playing last ½ second of end of loop and beginning 1.5s.  (Press Esc twice to stop). You should be able to adjust the start and/or end points live while this is running, by typing in the fields, sliding the markers, or using the nudge marker scripts I posted earlier.

Mic

[Tom Wacker]

first of all micpool, thank you for your help. 

What i meant with "no way to scroll there" is : when I´m zoomed in on e.g. the start slice-marker and the end slice-marker is like 30 sec away, that´s a lot to sroll, unless of course, you zoom out again. What I didn´t notice until now - believe it or not - is, that if you zoom in, the fix point is always the cursor. Therefor, because I didn´t place the cursor directly on the marker, I always lost focus, what made it kind of uncomfortable to edit the marker position...

You are right in saying, I could use an external editor to edit loops more precisely, but I don´t know any, that would import slice markers from Qlab. If you have any suggestions, please let me know.

thanks again

Thomas

[micpool]

On Monday, June 15, 2015 at 8:46:14 PM UTC+1, Tom Wacker wrote:

You are right in saying, I could use an external editor to edit loops more precisely, but I don´t know any, that would import slice markers from Qlab. If you have any suggestions, please let me know.

thanks again

I might use  an external editor to set up slice markers or precise in and out points, dropping slices regularly through an audio file, e.g every 2s for bars of 4/4 at tempo=120, or making crossfade loops for hard to loop material, 

But, I think, for all the reasons outlined below, that this is pretty much a once only event, as opposed to a workflow where you can switch back and forth seamlessly from editing in QLab and an external editor.

QLab has no way of writing its markers back to the audio file, and you can't access the marker times through scripting. Therefore any work carried out in QLab puts QLab out of sync with the markers actually embedded in your audio file.

Even if Qlab could edit the embedded markers in a file,  this would still not allow a full comprehensive workflow for too and fro-ing to an external editor as the markers are only part of the story.  In addition to the markers in the external program, which equate to slices in QLab, you also have the repetition number for each slice and the start and end points for playback of the file. Unless figure53 created their own stand alone  audio editor,  then this info is not going to be editable externally.

Generally, if you want to edit start and endpoints in an external editor this editing has to be destructive. 

Retargetting a cue that imported with embedded markers and refreshing of markers edited externally does not seem to be 100% consistent.  I can't work out when start and end markers are reset to the bounds of the file/stay where they are, or when the existing slices remain or are cleared  by the retargeting to an audio file with no embedded markers.

If an audio cue is opened in an external editor, the markers edited, and  the file saved , the new marker positions do not immediately update in QLab

This script, generally, successfully forces the update:

tell application id "com.figure53.qlab.3" to tell front workspace

set selectedcue to the last item of (selected as list)

set currentFileTarget to file target of selectedcue as alias

set the file target of selectedcue to currentFileTarget

end tell

There was a recent in depth discussion about looping in this thread which explores some other points:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/qlab/Loop%7Csort:date/qlab/FUxNxAmXJPg/8cAV7aSGiwUJ

I will use external editors for placing and moving slices used for devamp cues or slices used by devamp  cues to fire other events. I have created crossfaded loops for notoriously difficult cues with lots of bass content.  But generally, I have had few difficulties using the basic tools provided within QLab to achieve successful loops.

Finally, either an OSC cue  or an applescript cue  on a hot key allows you to set looping on or off for multiple cue selections:

Applescript:

repeat with eachCue in (selected of front workspace as list)

try

set infinite loop of eachCue to true

end try

end repeat

or

repeat with eachCue in (selected of front workspace as list)

try

set infinite loop of eachCue to false

end try

end repeat

OSC:

/cue/selected/infiniteLoop 1

to switch the loop on or:

/cue/selected/infiniteLoop 0

Mic