Error message

[Nina Owczarek]

Dear All,

Today I received an error message that interrupted my collection and shut down the S1PXRF software. It read: Run time error overflow 6
Can anyone explain this error to me?

I am using a Bruker SDIII. It was set in "lab rat" mode (i.e. 40kV, 13mA, no filter). I was looking at blue pigment on a thick wooden substrate.

Thanks so much for any thoughts on this.
Best,
Nina

[Vanessa Muros]

Hi Nina,

I've been getting this error recently as well, but I thought it might haveto do with software trouble I've been having with a new laptop we are using with our XRF (the Tracer III-V+).  Now that I see you are having the same error message, I'm curious to see what is causing it.

Vanessa

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[Dennis Piechota]

I too get the overflow error repeatedly and I don't know what causes it (looking up the error definition is no help unless you live to program) but in looking back it seems to me that it occurs most often:

1- when I try to use the software to do two things at once e.g. doing an element ID while a reading is being taken;

2- when I do NOT religiously follow the hardware/software start up instructions.

Dennis

Dennis Piechota

Archaeological Conservator

Fiske Center for Archaeological Research
UMass Boston
Office: 617-287-6829

XRF Group Admin

pXRF for Cultural Heritage

RTI Group Admin

RTI_help

[pant...@aol.com]

That error occurs occasionally when Microsoft begins an update or save operation in the middle of data acquistion.

Be sure to not have any other operations going on during data acqusition

You just restart the software and repeat the acquisiion

pant...@aol.com

Dr Bruce Kaiser

A brilliant old fellow seeking the Truth in every thing

Call him any time to discuss 509 528 7608

Or visit him in Salt Lake UT

 

[Dennis Piechota]

Hi Bruce,

To be clear are you saying that common background operations like automated virus database updates of software like AVG or Windows update checks could trigger the overflow error if they occur during a reading and need to be disabled or set to perform manual update checks only?

And within S1PXRF can we expect to be able to begin doing element IDs during a read without triggering the overflow?

Dennis

Dennis Piechota

Archaeological Conservator

Fiske Center for Archaeological Research
UMass Boston
Office: 617-287-6829

XRF Group Admin

pXRF for Cultural Heritage

RTI Group Admin

RTI_help

[Bruce Kaiser]

Dennis

These items do not in general cause the   Error

It is just when a very random set of them come together when you are doing certain pxrf operations 

Interesting to note when is using Apple it never crashes :)

We are investigating windows 8

It appears Microsoft has fixed a lot of issues with that platform 

Time will tell
Thanks

Dr Bruce Kaiser

509 528 7608

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[MacKenzie, Mark, DCA]

Good day all.  Just a small note on this thread and one question.

1.  After losing a MuSIS system due to an IT background "system update" requiring a trip to Holland to get both a hardware update and a software system fix, I do not allow our PC computers which control analytical equipment to be part of our state IT network.  So far, no further problems.

2.  Referring to the above, I believe I have been able to do element IDs within S1PXRF on our factory supplied Bruker system laptop without every causing a crash or lock up.  That laptop is never connected to our IT network or at least not when being used to control the Tracer unit.

3.  Now for my question.  Bruce, you tantalized me with your reference to Apple.  Do you have a version of S1PXRF which runs on my MacBookPro's or are you using a Windows system on the Macs to do this?

Regards from Santa Fe.

Mark MacKenzie, Chief Conservator
Dir. Museums of New Mexico Conservation
Santa Fe, NM
505-476-5081

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From: px...@googlegroups.com [px...@googlegroups.com] on behalf of Bruce Kaiser [pant...@aol.com]
Sent: Monday, October 29, 2012 12:51 PM
To: px...@googlegroups.com
Cc: px...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: [pxrf] Error message

[Dennis Piechota]

Thanks Dennis T.,

I checked my version and it was already uptodate (3.8.0.30). BTW I'm using the S1PXRF installation on the HP laptop supplied with my Tracer IIISD. So I deleted the .Mca file and restarted Windows XP Pro and restarted the analyzer and software per the instructions (Quick Startup List for Tracer IIISD). It worked well for several hours with me taking computer controlled timed readings while simultaneously doing Elem IDs on the developing spectra. Then, as though some necessary file became corrupted the overflow errors (Runtime error 6 overflow) began again. I was IDing fewer than 10 elements per spectrum when the overflow errors started again.

I repeated the recommended process (deleting .Mca, restarting etc.) and had the same experience again.

My most reliable performance from S1PXRF comes when I dedicate the software to just taking the readings and do not attempt element IDs until the readings are complete.

Dennis P.

[Dennis Torres]

Hi Dennis P.,

 

Thanks for this information you have provided.  This is a trend we have seen as well.  Can you tell me what system you are using (Windows 64 bit? Windows 7?).  Thanks.

 

Best Regards,

 

 

 

Dennis Torres
Customer Support Specialist, Handheld XRF

 

Bruker Elemental 415 N. Quay Street Kennewick, WA 99336 USA

Phone:    +1 509 783-9850 x268 Fax:         +1 509 735-9696

dennis...@bruker-elemental.net www.handheldxrf.com

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From: deep...@gmail.com [mailto:deep...@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Piechota
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2012 8:03 AM
To: Dennis Torres; px...@googlegroups.com
Cc: B Kaiser; Bruce Kaiser; HH Service
Subject: Re: [pxrf] Error message

 

Thanks Dennis T.,

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[David Dempsey]

Hi Dennis,

We are still on Windows XP.

I wondered whether that might be an issue.

Thanks,
David

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David Dempsey
Associate Director for Museum Services
Smith College Museum of Art
Northampton, MA 01063 USA
ddem...@smith.edu
phone: 413-585-2766
fax: 413-585-2782

[Bruce Kaiser]

The software only runs on windows

So yes you must be running windows on the Mac

Thanks

Dr Bruce Kaiser

509 528 7608

[Dennis Piechota]

Hi Dennis T. (and all),

Sorry for answering so slowly. I missed the question. I run the latest version of S1PXRF under Windows XP Pro v2002 with SP3, 32-bit, on the HP Compaq 6510b laptop that was provided with my Tracer SDIII.

Another question. We've focussed on the need to follow carefully the quick start routine. Is there also a quit procedure that should be followed? Specifically should we clear all spectra before quitting S1PXRF? Or at least make sure the B spectrum is clear? I ask because I've noticed there are times when I launch S1PXRF by clicking on the S1PXRF.exe icon and it opens usually with a previous spectrum already loaded. To follow the quick start procedure completely I clear the spectrum (when one has loaded) by going to PDZ Preview and open an existing spectrum. 

I notice that though I quit with two spectra visible with spectrum overlay set to A/B, S1PXRF.exe re-opens with overlay in A only and with the previous A spectrum visible. If I open spectrum overlay and try to move that spectrum to B I can get the Runtime error 9- subscript out of range error after pressing the OK button.

Dennis Piechota

Archaeological Conservator

Fiske Center for Archaeological Research
UMass Boston
Office: 617-287-6829

XRF Group Admin

pXRF for Cultural Heritage

RTI Group Admin

RTI_help

[Jeff]

I had this error at the end of October/early November. I tried running the XRF on several of my computers and consistently got the same error--very frustrating! I then removed the USB to serial adapter from the cable and connected the instrument directly to the serial port (I have an older laptop). I haven’t had any errors since (fingers crossed).

[Orion Analytical (gmail)]

Hi All,

I have recently encountered zirconium (Zr) in pXRF analyses of a group of paintings attributed to different artists.

I would be grateful to know whether -- and in what contexts -- other members of this group have found Zr in XRF or other elemental analyses of paintings or painted surfaces.

All the best,

Jamie

James Martin
Orion Analytical, LLC - A Materials Analysis and Consulting Firm
www.orionanalytical.com
mar...@orionanalytical.com

(sent using our Gmail alternate account)

[Glenn Gates]

Chris at MoMA put Zr paints in tests in the Round Robin of paint samples circa 2008ish
I'd direct your query there.
As I recall, he sees it lots

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[Aaron Shugar]

Ok,

This is a real problem that I have encountered and I think I have it figured out. There are two potential interference that can make one think there is Zr present.  1st is the Strontium Kb peak that is at 15.84 keV (Zr is at 15.78).  The second is more plausible with paintings and it deals with higher concentrations of Pb.  The L-1 absorption edge is at 15.86keV and is not labeled as Pb in the Artax software (for those using Bruker systems). See  http://skuld.bmsc.washington.edu/scatter/AS_periodic.html and http://www.kayelaby.npl.co.uk/atomic_and_nuclear_physics/4_2/4_2_1.html for examples).

Remember, there should be a Zr Kb peak to confirmation.

Hope that helps

Aaron

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Aaron Shugar
aaron....@gmail.com
shug...@buffalostate.edu

Shugar, A. and Simmons S. (2013)

Archaeometallurgy in Mesoamerica: Current Approaches and New Perspectives

http://www.upcolorado.com/book/New_Titles/Archaeometallurgy_in_Mesoamerica_cloth

 

Shugar, A. and Mass J. (2012)

Handheld XRF in Art and Archaeology

http://upers.kuleuven.be/en/titel/9789058679079

[Orion Analytical (gmail)]

Thank you Aaron.

In the various paint spectra, I have a Zr Ka peak at 15.74 Kev and Zr Kb at 17.67 Kev.

In these spectra, other detectable elements vary by element and abundance -- frequently significant amounts of zinc (Zn) -- including some spectra that show no detectable lead (Pb) or strontium (Sr).  In spectra that contain Pb or Sr peaks, Zr Ka and Kb peaks are evident.

I understand that Zr can occur as an oxide as a white pigment, as a coating on certain pigments, and as a paint drier.

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[Jillian Huntley]

Hi Jamie - I'm not surprised. I see Zr in a lot of mineral pigments
(ochres) used in rock art.
In a few recent cases I have actually seen the zerconium crystals in
the ochre during SEM work.

Jillian Huntley
Archaeologist
PhD Candidate, Archaeology and Palaeoanthropology, University of New
England
e: jfo...@une.edu.au


On Apr 17, 11:08 pm, "Orion Analytical (gmail)"

<orionanalyti...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I have recently encountered zirconium (Zr) in pXRF analyses of a group of paintings attributed to different artists.
>

> I would be grateful to know whether -- and in what contexts -- other members of this group have foundZrin XRF or other elemental analyses of paintings or painted surfaces.

[Orion Analytical]

Thank you Jillian.

While I am detecting zirconium (Zr) in paints that contain iron oxides, I also am detecting Zr in other paints that (a) do not contain iron oxides and (b) do not lay over paints that contain iron oxides. For example, I am finding Zr in metallic paints and white paints, in some cases with detectable cobalt (Co).

The Zr (Ka and Kb) occurs in original paints from a group of works that purport to have been created by different artists in the late 1940s and 1950s. All the works are suspect and share a common source.

My working hypothesis is that the Zr stems from drier added to accelerate hardening of the paints.

I would be grateful to hear from anyone who has found Zr in documented paintings from the 1940s, 1950s, or 1960s.

Thank you.

All the best,

Jamie

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