Help - PTGui not recognising RAW pre processing in JPEGs

[RickG]

I have begun to notice that PT Gui does not recognise RAW editing that has been applied to RAW images, and then exported to JPEGS. This is a new issue. We work off proprocessed jpegs, exported via Bridge. We then import the jpegs, all nicely processed, but only the import dialog recognises the adjustments. The detail viewer etc, simply. show the  RAW (unprocessed) data. This is obviously no good, as our clients cannot recieve the images without us preprocessing our raw files BEFORE PT Gui stitching.

Greatly value assistance, as we have clients awaiting work and cannot find a solution. I;'m gussing I can re-export my jpegs, and remove metadata, or export say from lightroom to see if that helps??  Thank you

[RickG]

To assist, here is what occurs. You can see the Camera RAW adjustments on the JPEGS are recognised by the imput/project assistant, but the resulting pano (deail viewer) do not show these adjustments. Worse, it appears random. I did 8 perfect panos recently, only to have the 9th show this issue. Today, all my panos using JPEGS do this. The exported pano is useless as it does not reflect what should be baked in jpeg adjustments. PT Gui somehow is reading a carrage file or something, attached to a jpeg? I've not seen this behaviour elsehere. Image attached

[RickG]

OK - I have solved my own problem! One must export the JPEGS from bridge, but ensure NO METATDATA (otehr than copyright) is attached. Although it will mean the lens information dialogue box will open, it will fix the issue!  Phew. Still, it's strange as I'm pretty sure this did not used to occur with metadata tagged jpegs before

[PTGui Support]

Hi Rick,

Judging from your screenshot, your images are taken in automatic
exposure mode. To improve blending, PTGui will bring the images to a
common identical exposure, by brightening the dark images and darkening
the bright images. The blending will be much more seamless, and the idea
is you can use tone mapping or shadow/highlight correction afterwards to
compress the dynamic range.

If this is not what you want: go to the Panorama Editor, Blending side
bar and uncheck this box:

Exposure compensation

Kind regards,

Joost Nieuwenhuijse
www.ptgui.com

On 06/04/2022 02:47, RickG wrote:
> To assist, here is what occurs. You can see the Camera RAW adjustments
> on the JPEGS are recognised by the imput/project assistant, but the
> resulting pano (deail viewer) do not show these adjustments. Worse, it
> appears random. I did 8 perfect panos recently, only to have the 9th
> show this issue. Today, all my panos using JPEGS do this. The exported
> pano is useless as it does not reflect what should be baked in jpeg
> adjustments. PT Gui somehow is reading a carrage file or something,
> attached to a jpeg? I've not seen this behaviour elsehere. Image attached

> Screen Shot 2022-04-06 at 12.43.55 PM copy.jpg
>
> On Wednesday, April 6, 2022 at 10:10:46 AM UTC+12 RickG wrote:
>
> I have begun to notice that PT Gui does not recognise RAW editing
> that has been applied to RAW images, and then exported to JPEGS.
> This is a new issue. We work off proprocessed jpegs, exported via
> Bridge. We then import the jpegs, all nicely processed, but only the
> import dialog recognises the adjustments. The detail viewer etc,
> simply. show the  RAW (unprocessed) data. This is obviously no good,
> as our clients cannot recieve the images without us preprocessing
> our raw files BEFORE PT Gui stitching.
>
> Greatly value assistance, as we have clients awaiting work and
> cannot find a solution. I;'m gussing I can re-export my jpegs, and
> remove metadata, or export say from lightroom to see if that
> helps??  Thank you
>

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[RickG]

Thank you. I have looked into your suggestion, however, it is not what seems to be occuring. What is actually occuring, randomly, is PTGUI is not importing the Camera Raw processing that is usually 'baked into' exported JPEG files. It appears to be ignoring this, and instead, reverting to the RAW camera capture data (without noticing my Camera Raw editing) - this is unusal behaviour, as prevoiusly, any jpeg would simply input into PTGui as seen on screen. I 'fixed' this by impoting jpegs into PTUGUI 'without' metadata. But to me, that is a workaround and a compromise, not a true fix. Do you have any other explaination?  It has occured only on occasion in the past, but now is common.  If I use the 'work around', I then get lens data dialoges pop up, as the softwre cannot get the lens data from the metadata that I had to delete to fix the issue. Anyway, I thought you best know, as it could be a bug?

[PTGui Support]

Hi Rick,

There's no original raw data 'baked into' jpeg images, it can't work
that way. PTGui can't revert your raw processing because the original
raw data is not in your jpeg files anymore.

The explanation I gave is the only explanation I can think of. But I'd
be happy to investigate if you could make your images available for
download.

Kind regards,

Joost Nieuwenhuijse
www.ptgui.com

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[John Houghton]

Rick, I think there may be some confusion about Camera Raw metadata here.  A jpeg file can contain the Camera Raw metadata that was used to convert the original raw data into the currently stored jpeg format, OR it can contain the Camera Raw metadata that needs to be applied to the currently stored jpeg data in order for it to display correctly - as intended by an edit to the jpeg file using the Adobe Raw converter. In the latter case, the original jpeg image will be shown when the file is opened by programs generally and by PTGui in particular.  This is for the same reasons that the sidecar data is ignored when raw files are directly input.  See FAQ item https://ptgui.com/support.html#3_21 .

John

[PTGui Support]

Are you sure about that John? So Lightroom can make edits to jpeg files
that would be only visible in Lightroom? That would be confusing and
useless because no other application would see those edits.

Also it wouldn't explain the original problem:

"I 'fixed' this by impoting jpegs into PTUGUI 'without' metadata"

because PTGui would have ignored such metdata anyway.

Kind regards,

Joost Nieuwenhuijse
www.ptgui.com

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[John Houghton]

Joost, I'm not too familiar with Lightroom, but you can certainly edit jpeg files with Bridge + ACR , which doesn't generate sidecar files but embeds the raw settings in metadata instead.  When you open the file in Photoshop, it goes into the raw image dialogue so that the settings can be applied/changed before opening into Photoshop itself.  Other programs only display the un edited jpeg image.  I assume LR is the same.  Here's a screen grab showing Windows Explorer not showing the red edit on one image in Bridge (which has the edit symbol at its upper right).

John

[Erik Krause]

Am 07.04.2022 um 14:58 schrieb John Houghton:
> Joost, I'm not too familiar with Lightroom, but you can certainly edit jpeg
> files with Bridge + ACR , which doesn't generate sidecar files but embeds
> the raw settings in metadata instead.

It depends on what you do to close ACR. If you click "Ready" ACR saves
the edit to meta data. If you click "Save" a new file is saved. You can
do that to both jpeg and raw images. However, if you have a raw image
opened and save that to jpeg (you do a conversion by clicking "Save")
the edits are also visible outside Adobe programs.

--
Erik Krause
http://www.erik-krause.de

[John Houghton]

On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 4:10:01 PM UTC+1 Erik Krause wrote:

It depends on what you do to close ACR. If you click "Ready" ACR saves
the edit to meta data. 

Erik, In my increasingly elderly version of ACR  (CS6) , there is no "Ready" button.  I have "Done" instead, which appears to do the same.

John

[Erik Krause]

Am 07.04.2022 um 18:46 schrieb John Houghton:

> Erik, In my increasingly elderly version of ACR (CS6) , there is no
> "Ready" button. I have "Done" instead, which appears to do the same.

"Done", yes. Bridge uses a german ACR version here ;-)

[RickG]

Thank you - I was exporting via Bridge to JPEG. However, I shall try exporting via lightroom (which is actually more intelligent via exporting, as it discerns subfolders, and can export an entire set of nested folders, direclty back into their own locaiton, whereas Bridge speicfies only one locaiotn (original - which appears only to use the base folder, or specific). Last time I used LR, I had no issue with jpegs. In all my time, I've never had a jpeg present as an unedited RAW, in the dozens of software I've used. So I'm confused. Unless PT gui is reachign back into the folder, where I also had the RAW files? Let me retest. The only other option, is I accidentially imported the RAW files?? But would the import dialoge show raw adjustments? In my experience no. And I'm postiive I tested and restested this. I'll test with LR and report back

[John Houghton]

Rick, It all seems quite straightforward from the point of view of PTGui.  If you display a folder of jpeg images with Bridge and the images have the edit icon at top right of the thumbnails, then there are embedded image adjustment settings that only Adobe programs will be aware of and adjust the stored image accordingly.  PTGui (and other programs) will simply ignore those settings.  For PTGui to open the images with the adjustment settings applied, you must first Save the images with either ACR or use Tools->Photoshop->Image Processor in Bridge, or some other Lightroom export function.  Similarly, PTGui will ignore sidecar files accompanying RAW files.

John

[RickG]

Thank you all for your assistance. Regarding the Sidecar issue, yes, I'm aware of the way RAW data is read by PT Gui, hence i always convert (SAVE) to jpeg via export. This creates a regular jpeg. Usually, PT GUI reads the JPEG as is, and does not refer to metadata of the original RAW file, as it is now a completely separate JPEG. I definately imported SAVED JPEGS into PT Gui, not RAW files (with adjustments).  I recognise the difference between the two. My only other explianation, is the problem is with BRIDGE itself. PErhaps the jpeg save command has a flaw, and does did not output a regular jpeg for some reason?  As I said, this has occured more than once, and the give away to me, is that in the 'import' project window, PT GUI DOES show jpeg processing, but in the DETAIL VIEWER, the JPEG is not applied, but RAW data only. That is a conflict. The resulting pano output is simply unprocessed RAW. This is also random, as some JPEGS work as normal, some sets, have this error/

[Erik Krause]

Am 08.04.2022 um 22:10 schrieb RickG:

> That is a conflict. The resulting pano output is simply unprocessed
> RAW.

I suspect you interpret this wrongly. The fact that the output is
different when you remove the metadata does not mean that the raw data
processing is reversed. It is simply that PTGui does not receive
exposure data to correct for different exposures.

You should get a similar difference if you check or uncheck "Exposure
compensation" in the Blending side menu in Panorama Editor using your
images with meta data.

[RickG]

Thank you . I will check that out again, and see if this is occuring. Thank you for the support. We use this product for all our panoramas now. It is excellent and essential!

[PTGui Support]

Erik is right, this must be it.

If you can't figure out the problem, please post a set of images so we
can investigate. Otherwise we can only guess.

Joost

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