Main Ek Jhonka Hoon Thandi Pawan Ka.mp3
Evaristo Nicholls
I agree with the above. Before we blame Anu Malik let me tell you something.
Blatant copying has been going on for years. I know this will hurt R D
Burman fans in this NG but it's a fact that he also used to copy a LOT. I am
giving below some songs which RDB copied blatantly with no shame:-Name of the song Singer FilmChura liya hai tumn Asha and rafi Yaddon ki baratMehmooba Mehooba RDB SholayJab andehara hota hai Asha and Bhupinder Raja RaniAaja meri bahon Kishore Kumar Some Anil Dawan
movie of early 70's.Dekta hun koi ladki haseen Kishore Kumar Sanan teri kasamMil gaya hum ko Asha and KK Hum kisi se kam nahinTu hai meri jindagani Asha and Amit Kumar Inderjeetand many more.I am sure RDB must have copied much more. His source varies from english
songs to even pakistani song. The last song in the above list is lifted from
a pakistani song to glorify benazir bhutto.The list mentioned above are authentic copy as I have myself heard the
original songs. Also Usha Uthup in a program in "Z" TV sang some of the above
mentioned songs (original). Jatin Lalit in some interview also showed how
RDB use to copy.I have been accused of flame provoker but this is not a flame. I am only
telling a fact. I myself is a fan of RDB but I can't accept his copying.
On this count I give RDB very low marks.I have bashed Rehman but I do concede that he is ORIGINAL. He may have done
some cut and paste but he adds something. Can't be termed as copying. What
RDB did was to copy it w/out any change.Why blame Anu Malik or Bappi Lahiri.
>Blatant copying has been going on for years. I know this will hurt R D
>Burman fans in this NG but it's a fact that he also used to copy a LOT. I am
>giving below some songs which RDB copied blatantly with no shame:-
>
>Name of the song Singer Film
>
>I have bashed Rehman but I do concede that he is ORIGINAL. He may have done
>some cut and paste but he adds something. Can't be termed as copying. What
>RDB did was to copy it w/out any change.
They are both still great songs, though. The good thing is that even in
the "copying" of a song, RD Burman, and many other MD's put their own
style into the songs. Not to point fingers, but songs like Tu Cheez Badi
Hai Mast Mast and such which are blatant copies don't have that
"something" added from the MD.--Vishal Ailawadhi
Copying folk song is OK. Folk song like public domain software is everyone's
property. RDB use to copy from english pop songs which I don't
approve of. However this is not the credit away from him when he composed
excellent indian tunes like in Amar Prem , Aandhi , Kinara , 1942 love story
and scores of others.
>I have bashed Rehman but I do concede that he is ORIGINAL. He may have done
>some cut and paste but he adds something. Can't be termed as copying. What
>RDB did was to copy it w/out any change.
>
>Why blame Anu Malik or Bappi Lahiri.
I think people have basic doubts about creativity of these kinds of MDs.
Pancham Daa gave many creative and original compositions. Even if he copies
some
songs in between here and there we do not mind. MD is the ONLY job
in the world where the fellow needs to be consistently creative every time.
MDs like the above two could not establish that kind of impression on the
audience. That is why they face lot of criticism. --
Harish Kumar
su...@mti.sgi.com
Yes, he did say in "phool khile hain gulshan gulshan" (tabassum's
programme), that this song was quite similar to another song by SD
(and i think he mentioned "thandi hawayen, lahraa ke aayen", and not
"yahi hai tmanna.."). I also read (i think in an article in Illus. weekly) that this song
by SD was copied by someone (MM?) before RD did. Anyone knows which
was the 'first' copy of the song ? -nitin
If I recall correctly RD debuted as an MD in 1962 (with Lata
singing 'ghar aaja ghir aayi badraa' --- something very easily
confirmed on the HMV RD Burman GC). 'Bhoot Bangla' came out within 2-3
years and it has Manna Dey going rock 'n roll in 'aao twist
karein'. Even in his asstt. MD days (with SDB) he was into western
tunes (e.g. 'baiThe hai kya us ke paas' in Jewel Thief is supposedly
entirely RD's creation). So I disagree with your observation above. RD's ability always has been to fuse western and Indian music
with a very distinctly unique flavour that remains unmatched, and this
can be inferred even from his very early songs... (check out the 'Asha
sings for RD' GC on HMV as well for more examples)...
> Although he used different equipments the tunes essentially remained
> Indian. It is only his later songs that started to have
> western-tune-copy stuff. If we listen to his tunes for Amar Prem
> ,KatiPatang one can get an idea. But his tunes in late seventies
> started showing more direct adaptations ( I cannot call them as
> lifting ;-) ).
Can you name a few instances of this 'adaptation'? I know of a
few copies (even 'complete' copies) of songs by RD and I'll list them
here, but I'm still waiting for people (especially Ravi who started
this thread to substantiate his claim). The frequency of copying was
highest in the mid-to-late '80s though (when he had two heart
surgeries and was very far behind his deadlines).Examples: R D Burman *did* copy here.1. Satte pe Satta'zindagi mil ke bitaayenge' is a complete
adaptation of 'The longest day', a WW2
marching song that also found its way in some
hollywood war flick.2. RockyThe saxophone piece at the beginning of 'hum
tum se mile'. Don't recall the name of the
artist or the song (I basically remembered the
English song as the one that sounds like Rocky)
;-)3. Paalay KhanThe beginning of 'kaabul se aaya hai'. Again,
the saxophone is from an early '80s rock hit.
Genesis? Police? Forgot again... :-(
However, those still unclear on where I stand on this whole
'inspiration vs plagiarization' issue might want to dig back in the
annals of RMIM and read my related post of a couple of months back.
As you point out Neeraj, Kishore's initial hypothesis was untrue. It becomes
even more obvious when one thinks about the music in "ChhoTe Nawaab" itself.
One does not have to go to "Bhoot Bangla" for that.
While "ghar aaja ghir aayi" is a very "Indian" composition (define this phrase
as meaning a tune that has little to no influence from western music), songs
like "Jeenewaale muskuraake jee", "Matwaali aaNkhoNwaali" and "Aaj hua mera dil
matwaala" in the same film have strong spanish and other influences.
By the time RD composed "Teesri Manzil", there was no doubt as to the fact that
a lot of his influences came from the west.
I always find it amusing how people on rmim make the distinction between Bappi
and RDB when it comes to being "influenced" by the West. Bappi may be more
blatant, but that does not negate some of the fantastic tunes he has composed
over the years, which are not copied. While people are willing to grant all
sorts of artistic discounts to RDB, similar ones are not given to Bappi. The
latter is put in the same category of no-talent hacks like Anand-Milind (who
have produced nothing of lasting value other than QSQT) or Nadeem-Shravan.
Bappi has gone for the quick buck, sacrificing quality at several points, but
so have a lot of composers over the years. Perhaps it is Bappi's unashamed
in-your-face blatant attitude that angers people, but somewhere down the line,
his talents have been forgotten/ignored. Bappi is NOT the greatest, he is
not even in the 10 best list (of all time), but ignoring him is like throwing
the proverbial baby out with the bathwater.
BUT, when it comes to borrowing from the west, Bappi can be put in exactly the
same category as RD. However, while evaluating the composer as a whole, RD may
come out ahead on several other counts such as creativity, or lasting value of
the music, or strong classical/folk roots in the music.
>RD's ability always has been to fuse western and Indian music
>with a very distinctly unique flavour that remains unmatched, and this
>can be inferred even from his very early songs... (check out the 'Asha
>sings for RD' GC on HMV as well for more examples)...
While this ability to fuse western and Indian music is certainly a cornerstone
of RD's ability, it is certainly not unique to RD and not in flavor either.
C. Ramachandra had been doing it for years as had O. P. Nayyar. While CR was
more of a purist, OPN combined them typically by having a westernized "mukhDa"
and a typically Indian (probably Punjabi) "Dholak" rhythm in the "antara".
Naushad (who apparently was quite an accomplished piano player) used a lot of
western influences in films as early as "Dastaan". The introductory music to
the Suraiyya song "Aaya mere dil me tu, ban ke dil ki aarzoo" from that film
always blows my mind when I put it into the context of when it was composed;
and as to "Yeh saawan rut tum aur ham" by Rafi/Suraiyya, well both the scene
and the composition itself speak volumes for the influence of the west. And
remember this was happening when RD was still in diapers (figuratively speaking
of course :-) :-) ).
>> Although he used different equipments the tunes essentially remained
>> Indian. It is only his later songs that started to have
>> western-tune-copy stuff. If we listen to his tunes for Amar Prem
>> ,KatiPatang one can get an idea. But his tunes in late seventies
>> started showing more direct adaptations ( I cannot call them as
>> lifting ;-) ).
>
>Can you name a few instances of this 'adaptation'? I know of a
>few copies (even 'complete' copies) of songs by RD and I'll list them
>here, but I'm still waiting for people (especially Ravi who started
>this thread to substantiate his claim). The frequency of copying was
>highest in the mid-to-late '80s though (when he had two heart
>surgeries and was very far behind his deadlines).