CNXML conversion

Rob Beezer

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Apr 13, 2018, 1:52:05 AM4/13/18

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A conversion of Open Stax Calculus 3 [1] is now at [2].

This is accomplished with a 300-line stylesheet that converts CNXML to PTX, then
PTX does its usual thing to create HTML. With one exception - the math begins
as MathML, a hack copies it into PTX HTML, and then a broader MathJax
configuration is used to render that. (So a conversion to LaTeX will need some
work.) Works for me in Firefox. A few rough edges, but nothing insurmountable.

Next test would be a totally different math book, then an Open Stax book from
some other discipline.

Rob

[1] https://cnx.org/contents/oxzX...@2.102:72YaCFgv@2/Introduction

[2] http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/beta/20180412-calc3

Paul Seeburger

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Apr 13, 2018, 2:20:51 PM4/13/18

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Wow, Rob!

It looks amazing!

In viewing on Chrome on a Mac, I noticed that the Solution knowls for examples in the text don't populate (they're blank), but those with a Hint first seem to work fine as well as the Answer knowls for the exercises at the bottom of the page. I was looking at section 6.2 on vector fields, in particular.

One Hint knowl (for Example 6.2.18) had the following error message in it:
Follow <<Unresolved xref, reference "fs-id1167793354224"; check spelling or use "provisional" attribute>> and first compute the distance between the asteroids.

Thank you for working on this, Rob!

Paul

Paul Seeburger

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Apr 13, 2018, 2:27:41 PM4/13/18

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Another issue (as I am sure you know) is that the Introduction to each chapter seems to be missing.

Paul

Rob Beezer

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Apr 13, 2018, 2:39:11 PM4/13/18

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Very good, you found all three of the three (bigger) "rough edges."

One solution goes totally haywire, a fatal error, so I killed them all. Just a
"Calc 3" problem, I think. And the OpenStax "xref" system is a bit goofy, so a
healthy fraction of the targets don't get marked off right. I could fix most of
them in an hour or two.

A CNXML "introduction" just needs to get flagged into a PTX "introduction" and
then section numbering will mostly align.

Amazingly, it is harder than it seems it should be to locate the authors, as well.

Thanks for the survey and the report on Mac/Chrome. That all helps. If this
was cleaned up more, would you have a use for it?

Rob

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Seeburger, Paul (Mathematics)

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Apr 13, 2018, 3:02:16 PM4/13/18

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I think so, Rob. I am trying to learn PreTeXt while also working to figure out LibreTexts. I've committed to using an OER text in my Calculus 3 course this fall, and I will use whatever I can see a way to beat into good shape by that time. I just know that I did NOT like the presentation of this textbook in OpenStax, although I like the material in it quite well.

Both systems have advantages and (in opinion at this point) disadvantages. PreTeXt is fine-tuned and allows inline WeBWorK problems and so much more, but it seems somewhat artificially constrained to the left third of wide screens. And I still have to master its editing process, although it seems very doable. PreTeXt also has the HUGE attraction of being very sustainable, creating a series of standalone HTML/CSS files on my server (right?).

LibreTexts is fairly easy to edit in a WYSIWYG format, although there are some peculiarities that I do not understand yet, and the exercises are all separated from the text material right now. It also is not yet clear how to incorporate WeBWorK practice problems in the flow of the text, although I know they intend to make this happen too.

I guess I am working to do what I can to improve both systems as I learn both systems, for the time being. I also hope to use PreTeXt for a CalcPlot3D Help manual at some point, once I figure out how to create the PreTeXt files.

But I am on an NSF grant proposal for the LibreTexts project as a co-PI. We'll see if it gets funded, but I have some motivation to work hard to make it look good too.

So what would I download once you have converted this textbook to PreTeXt to edit it myself.

For example, I'd like to incorporate the dynamic figures I already created for the LibreTexts version of this text. Some are in Section 2.6, Equations of Lines and Planes in Space. I believe I would need to edit the code in the files on my computer and then run a conversion file that would recreate the file structure of the PreTeXt HTML pages. Is this correct?

Thanks!

Paul

Paul Seeburger
Professor of Mathematics
Monroe Community College
1000 E. Henrietta Rd.
Rochester, NY 14623
585-292-2946
www.monroecc.edu/wusers/pseeburger (Faculty webpage)
web.monroecc.edu/calcNSF (NSF Project website)
www.monroecc.edu/faculty/paulseeburger/calcnsf/CalcPlot3D/ (NSF Project Visualization JavaScript App)

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David Farmer

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Apr 13, 2018, 3:56:06 PM4/13/18

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> PreTeXt ... seems somewhat artificially constrained to the

> left third of wide screens.

It warms my heart to see that as the main complaint about the
output and functionality of PreTeXt!

Just make your browser 1/3 the width of the wide screen. The
text will take up the width of the browser, and you can also see
other things at the same time.

Regards,

David

Rob Beezer

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Apr 13, 2018, 4:19:53 PM4/13/18

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On 04/13/2018 12:02 PM, Seeburger, Paul (Mathematics) wrote:
> And I still have to master its editing process, although it seems very doable.

Get a good programmer's editor, if you don't have one, it is a huge help. But
I'd guess that is not the hurdle. I get closing tags with one keyboard combination.

> PreTeXt also has the HUGE attraction of being very sustainable, creating a series of standalone HTML/CSS files on my server (right?).

Exactly. All we expect an author to do is push HTML output up onto a server
(FTP, whatever). I host all the examples on a very old server, and was only bit
hard once recently. (SVG MIME type, iirc.)

> I guess I am working to do what I can to improve both systems as I learn both systems, for the time being. I also hope to use PreTeXt for a CalcPlot3D Help manual at some point, once I figure out how to create the PreTeXt files.

That'd be a great warm-up exercise. What start-up help do you need? Mitch
Keller posted this preliminary bit of "getting started" material a few days ago:

http://rellek.net/ptx/cheatsheet/frontmatter-1.html

> So what would I download once you have converted this textbook to PreTeXt to edit it myself.

I'd solve the three rough edges (or mostly solve them), test a non-calculus math
book, then test an Open Stax chemistry book that I think we are using here at
UPS. And solve the MathML -> LaTeX piece. Then I'd feel good enough to release
the converter. May not happen too fast, this is not a primary project right now.

In the meantime, I could put the PreTeXt through a pretty-printer and zip it up
for you (and anybody else) at most anytime. (Though because of processing time
and git branches, I tend to do it overnight.)

For anybody reading this far, I could entertain suggestions of a second book.

> For example, I'd like to incorporate the dynamic figures I already created for the LibreTexts version of this text. Some are in Section 2.6, Equations of Lines and Planes in Space. I believe I would need to edit the code in the files on my computer and then run a conversion file that would recreate the file structure of the PreTeXt HTML pages. Is this correct?

Right now, the CalcPlot3D interactive functions by an author specifying the
query-string portion of the URL they get out of your app version. Is there
another way to accomplish that? Not clear to me what you mean by "edit the code
in the files on my computer."

Rob

Paul Seeburger

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Apr 13, 2018, 4:33:40 PM4/13/18

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Thanks, Rob!

Yes, the hurdle is just getting my system set up with the proper files and figuring out how to edit the proper code for the text and figures, etc. for a book. I started this process, but have not fully followed through yet. I got confused when I could not read the intro video I was trying to follow. =) I'll look at the link you just shared with me.

Concerning my last question, I cannot add dynamic figures to your PreTeXt book on your site, so I am asking how to get the book's PreTeXt code files that I can edit to experiment and post on my site (once you have it in a form you are happy sharing). I expect the code to modify to replace a figure with my dynamic figure is not hard to copy and paste from what you've posted earlier.

It would be best if some of these issues were addressed first, I expect, as I don't want to get confused about which version I am editing, and would love to know that anything I improve would be in a version I can use with my students in the fall.

Something done in LibreTexts is the figures are created in a separate repository and then a link to them is placed in the actual textbook version. This way the same figure can be shared among many texts, if desired, and a change to the dynamic figure's source addresses every use of it.

Paul

Rob Beezer

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Apr 13, 2018, 6:41:53 PM4/13/18

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On 04/13/2018 01:33 PM, Paul Seeburger wrote:
> I'll look at the link you just shared with me.

Try reading, and working, the first bits of the Author's Guide. But maybe you
are on Windows? A Dave Rosoff's Vagrant box, a linux virtual machine, or CoCalc
are all options to get started.

> Concerning my last question, I cannot add dynamic figures to your PreTeXt book
> on your site, so I am asking how to get the book's PreTeXt code files that I can
> edit to experiment and post on my site (once you have it in a form you are happy
> sharing). I expect the code to modify to replace a figure with my dynamic
> figure is not hard to copy and paste from what you've posted earlier.

I'll try to polish a few rough edges and post PTX that you can experiment with
(days, not hours or weeks).

> Something done in LibreTexts is the figures are created in a separate repository
> and then a link to them is placed in the actual textbook version. This way the
> same figure can be shared among many texts, if desired, and a change to the
> dynamic figure's source addresses every use of it.

We have some ideas about doing simething similar, but nothing yet.

Alex Jordan

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Apr 13, 2018, 10:19:49 PM4/13/18

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Pretty cool Rob.

If you have no other reason to choose your next OpenStax conversion, this one may give side benefits:
https://openstax.org/details/books/intermediate-algebra

Another CC in Oregon is interested in using ORCCA. But they need an exponential and logarithms chapter that we do not need. This OpenStax book's chapter 10 could work, and if I understand OpenStax licensing I think we could put it into ORCCA and give attribution, and be fine.

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Rob Beezer

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Apr 14, 2018, 12:00:49 AM4/14/18

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On 04/13/2018 07:19 PM, Alex Jordan wrote:
> Pretty cool Rob.

Thanks. Fairly straightforward, since we have a wider range of options, so
(mostly) don't lose any information/structure.

> If you have no other reason to choose your next OpenStax conversion, this one
> may give side benefits:
> https://openstax.org/details/books/intermediate-algebra

Early bird gets the worm. Will do. Zipped version is 1 GB! Random selection
of one section suggests it is very similar. A table, which I did not see in
Calc3, some stray Unicode, and an un-protected percent sign.

> Another CC in Oregon is interested in using ORCCA. But they need an exponential
> and logarithms chapter that we do not need. This OpenStax book's chapter 10
> could work, and if I understand OpenStax licensing I think we could put it into
> ORCCA and give attribution, and be fine.

Their license varies, and on Calc3 on a file-by-file basis. Sometimes CC-BY,
sometimes CC-BY-SA-NC.

Rob

Mitch Keller

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Apr 16, 2018, 9:29:28 AM4/16/18

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I would also add that the “artificial” constraint is a big boon to readability, given the way that the human eye scans across text when it’s reading. If the lines get really long, then it’s too easy to lose your train of thought during the (seemingly tiny) amount of time it takes the eye to scan from the end of one line to the beginning of the next.

I think we all envision coming up with good uses for the right side of the screen when using wider browser windows. Asides are one use, but I could envision coming up with a layout that pushes small figures out into the margin or putting a calculator out there in certain texts. I’m sure we’ll find good uses for that screen real estate, but I’m pretty sure it won’t be done by just letting the body text get wider.

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Paul Seeburger

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Apr 16, 2018, 2:06:16 PM4/16/18

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I understand that some authors prefer constraining the PreTeXt books to a narrow part of the screen, and I can see a reason this might be beneficial for just text. It seems it would even be ideal for reading on a phone or a tablet in portrait mode.

So I'd be fine to make it the default behavior, as it already is.

But I believe the user should have an option to use the whole screen on a desktop (or even a laptop or large tablet), particularly when it contains interactive elements like CalcPlot3D, Geogebra, Sage visualizations, etc. As Mitch points out, at least having the option to use the extra space for asides, figures, and interactive elements would be better (in my opinion) than having the space left unusable, or having no option to have much text next to images and interactives. Of course in mobile (phones or portrait mode on tablets) the constrained width would need to encompass everything, as it does now.

As a developer, I am always trying to fully use the screen real-estate to make as much visible at one time as possible. Two columns is another option I think could work, although the scrolling behavior would need to change. We'd probably have to use fixed height pages for this option, not much longer than the screen.

As a professor, I would prefer my students be able to fill their screens with my book, if desired, since this would help them focus on it exclusively, rather than having other applications open on the same screen to distract them from reading the book. Maybe they are different than I am, but I know how easily I am distracted in such a situation.

Paul

David Farmer

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Apr 16, 2018, 2:30:42 PM4/16/18

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I am getting ready to change how asides work, although there might
not be that much difference when the browser is wide.

When we finish incorporating an on-demand calculator, it will
go in the margin when the margin is wide enough. Possibly the
same for some interactive widgets, but we would have to look
carefully at the possible use cases. It always makes sense to
put a calculator there if there is room, because it is not part
of the flow. Interactive things that are in the text may not
always be better in the margin. If so, then there would need
to be a way to indicate whether to move one of them when the margin
is wide.

At some point the margin will be a place for taking notes
or making annotations. And maybe chatting with other students
in the class.

There also is a longer-term project to populate the margin with
supplementary material.

Feel free to think about how two-column layout would work --
if you want to get a headache! I agree that it seems like an
attractive idea, but the technical and user interface issues
seem overwhelming.

Let me point out an important distinction: the *author* has
no business thinking about the length of a line of text.
The *publisher* should think about that. An *instructor*
could also reasonably have an opinion. But not the author.
These are important distinctions, and it helps the discussion
when we keep in mind what sort of person is expressing an opinion.

Regards,

David

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Rob Beezer

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Apr 16, 2018, 2:45:56 PM4/16/18

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Dear Paul,

On 04/16/2018 11:06 AM, Paul Seeburger wrote:
> particularly when it contains
> interactive elements like CalcPlot3D, Geogebra, Sage visualizations, etc.

Go to Figure 16.13.c

http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/examples/sample-article/html/section-video.html

and use the "pop-out" link (not the best name). The video is significanlty
wider that the usual text width. Not the best example, since the original video
can go full-screen easily. Sage Cell has a full-screen option (which I don't
think always works right).

The additional page will exist for links (QR code) from PDF/print anyway, we'd
just need a way to get to them from HTML (a more discreet link, or a clever
device from David F). Not sure if "full-screen" is something we could
manufacture for every possible interactive.

Would some of this help?

Rob

Paul Seeburger

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Apr 16, 2018, 3:03:13 PM4/16/18

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Yes, Rob,

That sort of thing (like the video pop-outs) would help for interactive content, although ideally the student could still see the text describing the figure/interactive in many cases. Is there an option to use the whole available screen with a pop-out like this? Or to specify a percentage of the screen to use?

I understand David's comments about sometimes wanting the interactive in the line of text in all cases. But perhaps there could be a tag for placing an interactive element, a figure, an aside box or a table in the margin beside the text when space is available.

I can see that two-column navigation may not fit this model, although it works well enough with fixed page length documents in PDF or Word. We have a fixed page width in PreTeXt already, so a fixed page length option may not be impossible. =) But placing the page breaks at good points on the fly would be quite a challenge.

Paul

Rob Beezer

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Apr 16, 2018, 3:30:10 PM4/16/18

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On 04/16/2018 12:03 PM, Paul Seeburger wrote:
> That sort of thing (like the video pop-outs) would help for interactive content,
> although ideally the student could still see the text describing the
> figure/interactive in many cases.

There is already an "instructions" element (could become singular) that is meant
to migrate with the interactive (but not to PDF).

Elsewhere, there is limited support for "prelude" and "postlude" that will be
associated with "blocks" so they can move with them. But to the reader the
association in the original appearance might look very loose (or almost not at all).

So it sounds to me like including support for prelude/postlude would be useful.
(And now this thread has been totally hijacked!)

Rob

Rob Beezer

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Apr 18, 2018, 12:26:32 AM4/18/18

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More progress on the conversion of CNXML Calculus 3 to PTX. I believe I've
caught all the explicit and implicit formatting and converted it to PTX
equivalents. Subject to caveats below. MathML is being converted to LaTeX,
fairly reliably, with an XSLT library that is available freely.

Various improvements over the OpenStax version, I think. Knowls, numbering,
accurate cross-references, David's image zoom, etc.

New URL: http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/beta/20180417-calc3/index.html

Caveats:

* About 10 "xref" to other books, these just give a warning.

* Proofs are in their own subsection, which partway through contains a
tombstone, and then may have an exercise or two and an example or two. I can
certainly unwind all that and pack the proof in with the theorem, but was
uncertain if I wanted to make that much of a change.

* "Objectives" should say "Summary"

* Conversion to LaTeX leaves things like \text{sin}. Post-processing, or
surgery on the library could correct this.

* [T] exercises are "technology" exercises. We'll have something for this
eventuallly.

* A little bit of bad LaTeX, often a right parenthesis as part of a sentence
being part of the math, with an unbalanced result.

* Vectors have been authored in two or three different ways, leading to uneven
presentation.

* Some math symbols in paragraphs authored like:

<emphasis effect="italics">C<sub>2</sub></emphasis>

but sometimes the same construction is used for a book title.

Next Up:

* Rewrite XSLT file management to exploit CNXML source structure and simplify
build script to two lines.

* Pretty print PTX files.

* Test on algebra text, then chemistry text.

Rob Beezer

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Apr 18, 2018, 12:27:31 AM4/18/18

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Paul, et al,

PreTeXt source from this project is at:

http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/beta/20180417-calc3/os-calc3-ptx.zip

You may want to run it through xmllint or some other tool to make it look
prettier and more readable.

I wouldn't call this final, but its worth taking a look at. You need to get the
images from the OpenStax source and pack them in one directory, batteries not
included. (That'll change.)

Rob

Paul Seeburger

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Apr 18, 2018, 10:13:37 AM4/18/18

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It looks amazing, Rob!

Thanks for your (and others) work on this!

Paul

Paul Seeburger

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Apr 18, 2018, 10:16:07 AM4/18/18

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Quick licensing question:

I see your license notice below the OpenStax notice at the bottom of each page. Would other authors who take your version and further edit it, add a third license below yours? (Perhaps just added on pages they actually change?)

Thanks!

Paul

Mitch Keller

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Apr 18, 2018, 10:49:56 AM4/18/18

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We definitely need to have some licensing and attribution discussion as we try to move into a more mix and match sort of culture for our OER projects. I find the OpenStax attribution instructions rather obnoxious, and it honestly makes me disinclined to reuse any of their materials. For example, here's what one page says (my comments inserted between quoted parts):

How to Reuse & Attribute This Content
© Feb 26, 2018 OpenStax. Textbook content produced by OpenStax is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike License 4.0 license.
Under this license, any user of this textbook or the textbook contents herein must provide proper attribution as follows:
The OpenStax name, OpenStax logo, OpenStax book covers, OpenStax CNX name, and OpenStax CNX logo are not subject to the creative commons license and may not be reproduced without the prior and express written consent of Rice University. For questions regarding this license, please contact sup...@openstax.org.

Does this cause problems with reproducing the preface, since it uses the OpenStax name and talks about OpenStax, or does that just mean that they don't want you to make a derivative work and promote it as OpenStax calculus but still want you to give them attribution. (I don't mind them not CC licensing their logos or covers, really. I think saying that you can't reuse those makes sense, but the name thing confuses me.)

If you use this textbook as a bibliographic reference, then you should cite it as follows:
OpenStax, Divergence and Curl. OpenStax CNX. Feb 26, 2018 http://cnx.org/contents/6f668e5d-300d-4e6c-aec3-70b59f71fe69@3.

This is actually useful.

If you redistribute this textbook in a print format, then you must include on every physical page the following attribution:

Download for free at http://cnx.org/contents/6f668e5d-300d-4e6c-aec3-70b59f71fe69@3.

I have some issues with this, because a common reading of "this textbook" would mean that you're redistributing the *entire* thing. That reading is backed up by what the next bullet says, too. It seems excessive to put that statement on every page. Oh, and that link goes to one specific section of the book, which seems rather nonsensical. What if a section spans across physical pages. Do you need to give both of the URLs that are not meant to be retyped by humans? Would Rice's lawyers come after you if you decided to put the URL for the entire book on every page instead of each section's URL? (I trust university lawyers to do the sensible thing about as much as I trust my ability to throw a university lawyer the length of a football field.)

If you redistribute part of this textbook, then you must retain in every digital format page view (including but not limited to EPUB, PDF, and HTML) and on every physical printed page the following attribution:
Download for free at http://cnx.org/contents/6f668e5d-300d-4e6c-aec3-70b59f71fe69@3.

So, I think that means Rob's license statement is noncompliant with the OpenStax instructions. One could argue that Rob's is a better statement, although perhaps using the OpenStax name violates the earlier instruction about the name not being subject to the CC license. (Unless they've trademarked it, I'm not sure that there's any reason you can't say it, but lawyers.) I haven't looked at the CNXML source. Do these horrific URLs come bundled in the files at all so that one could include them on a per-section basis?

We should probably start a broader discussion about how materials picked up from other locations under an open license get attributed and linked. I kind of thing that some of that discussion belongs on -support, since authors who aren't on -dev may have thoughts on what text and where they would like to show attribution for material they borrow as well as how they would like those who remix their content to give them attribution. If we can develop a consensus on best practices (perhaps a couple of different models), then discussion could move back to -dev to talk about how to implement in the schema and conversions.

Paul Seeburger

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Apr 18, 2018, 10:57:37 AM4/18/18

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I suggest we open up a dialog with someone at OpenStax/Rice University directly, so as to clarify what they really desire for reuse licensing, and perhaps giving them some reasonable suggestions about what we think might suit our needs to see if they are ok with it.

Paul

David Farmer

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Apr 18, 2018, 11:25:31 AM4/18/18

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I will contact Kathi Fletcher, who is the Technical Director for
OpenStax. I'll include a link to this thread. (She will know who
is the right person for this, and Rob and I have talked with her
many times.)

David

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Rob Beezer

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Apr 18, 2018, 11:34:51 AM4/18/18

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Each CNXML "module file" has license information in it, and iirc, a URL for that
material (which becomes a PTX "section").

Interestingly, the license varies from one module to the next.

I was doing my best to conform with their terms. Asserting my own copyright on
my changes was just a test.

In practice, *you* would download the CNXML source, *you* would run the
conversion, and *you* would add whatever copyright/license you were entitled to
and desired. We'd make it semi-easy to conform with OpenStax's desires.

The use of PreTeXt as a tool makes no assumptions about the prvenance of your
source, nor obligates you to treat your output in any certain way. We do
appreciate it if you leave PTX advertising in the HTML sidebar. ;-)

See Principle 8:

http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/doc/publisher-guide/html/pretext-principles.html

Rob

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Paul Seeburger

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Apr 29, 2018, 3:28:58 PM4/29/18

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Hi, Rob!

For some reason, many of the figures in the OpenStax Calc 3 in PreTeXt on your site appear to be enlarged beyond their normal/original size (and bitmap size), thus making them look pixelated and awkward, but not all of them are this way, particularly those that are wider than they are tall. Is this something new? Or did I just not notice this before.

This appears to be the most recent version: http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/beta/20180417-calc3/m53897.html

See for example, Fig. 2.2.22. It almost appears as if they are being enlarged to fill the screen width allotted to the PreTeXt text.

The image below shows what I see.

Thanks!

Paul

Rob Beezer

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Apr 29, 2018, 6:28:30 PM4/29/18

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Dear Paul,

It seems to me that CNXML gets converted so that images receive no scaling at all.

Most images in the text seem to fit most of the width. For example, where we
would use a "sidebyside", CNXML just has single graphics file with several
images in it, like a collage.

In the exercises, it seems images tend to be smaller.

So I added text images at 100% width, and exercise images at 50%. The CNXML
source gives no indication of the intended size of the image, so the best we can
do is guess. (Its not the only place I had to guess.)

To be really useful, somebody will need to go through the generated PTX and tidy
up a few things like this.

I'm making progress on Intermediate Algebra in my "free" time, so may do another
round of conversions soon. At some point, I'll add the converter into the
repository, after enough experimentation.

Rob

On 04/29/2018 12:28 PM, Paul Seeburger wrote:
> Hi, Rob!
>
>
> For some reason, many of the figures in the OpenStax Calc 3 in PreTeXt on your
> site appear to be enlarged beyond their normal/original size (and bitmap size),
> thus making them look pixelated and awkward, but not all of them are this way,
> particularly those that are wider than they are tall. Is this something new?
> Or did I just not notice this before.
>
>
> This appears to be the most recent
> version: http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/beta/20180417-calc3/m53897.html
>
>
> See for example, Fig. 2.2.22. It almost appears as if they are being enlarged
> to fill the screen width allotted to the PreTeXt text.
>
>
> The image below shows what I see.
>

> <https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-zhhOpIgoejo/WuYcE-iBThI/AAAAAAAAAUU/g0cCrgL1X7U9BvLThw_YEYsj2-n1hPLHgCLcBGAs/s1600/Screen%2BShot%2B2018-04-28%2Bat%2B7.53.38%2BPM.png>

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Paul Seeburger

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Apr 29, 2018, 11:02:52 PM4/29/18

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Thanks, Rob!

So, am I correct to understand that I will be able to change the CSS for images in my version of a book, to perhaps add another option to use a smaller percentage or a certain maximum size?

I'm still quite new to what settings I will have control over for these things.

Paul

Rob Beezer

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Apr 29, 2018, 11:45:33 PM4/29/18

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Dear Paul,

Widths of images are given in your PTX source as percentages of the available
width. Remember the hard right margin? ;-)

So for the example you sent, you might go

<image source="images/Calc_3D_12_015.jpg" width="55%" />

Right now, the PTX in the zip file likely has width="100%"

Caveat - I'm just making up the filename above. And I have reworked the
conversion so that it "looks" for the image files in the same directory
structure as in the zip file distributed by Open Stax (so you don't have to move
them all into one directory). I think that change is not available yet.

So do not do massive tedious editing - yet!

You'll have to think how you are going to capture typo-fixes, etc that OpenStax
makes in the future, if you are also making edits like the above. (I think
clever use of git is the solution.)

Rob

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Rob Beezer

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Apr 29, 2018, 11:50:31 PM4/29/18

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Almost forgot, there is a way to set *one* default width for all images.

I think if you specify @width, that will get used, but the default will be used
if it is not given on teh image. Perhaps it would be better if I set the
conversion to go that way.

David Farmer's "zoom on click" will expand the HTML versions if too small, LaTeX
has no such mechanism. So maybe underestimating will be better.

On 04/29/2018 08:02 PM, Paul Seeburger wrote:

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light...@lanecc.edu

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Jul 19, 2018, 12:34:15 PM7/19/18

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Did you ever find a solution to the issue of giving proper attribution to OpenStax? I plan to use some of their material in a book I'm currently editing and I'd really like to know how to properly give them attribution.

Wendy Lightheart

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Rob Beezer

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Jul 19, 2018, 1:18:40 PM7/19/18

to prete...@googlegroups.com, Kathi Fletcher

Dear Wendy,

OpenStax uses standard CC licenses, but they are not consistent in applying
them. Their "modules" are like a PTX "section" and their source contains
indicators of the license. But one book may contain modules with different
licenses. Of course, if their material is SA, then you must also use whatever
license they have.

On each book they do have a single license in the HTML rendering. They ask that
you put an acknowledgement on every "page". Unclear to me if CC gives you the
freedom to acknowledge as you please, or you must follow their directions.

You could use a PTX "conclusion" on each "chapter" or "section" to get something
on every HTML page. We do not have a good way to get something onto every PDF
page, though I think Alex has hacked something up for his projects.

David Farmer and I spoke to Kathi Fletcher (of Open Stax) about this recently,
but I can't recall the exact outcome of that conversation. I've cc'ed Kathi in
the event she'd like to join the discussion here in the group to shed more light
on what needs to be done, legally and technically.

I've not done much in a while on my conversion of CNXML to PTX. Are you
expecting to use the results of that?

Rob

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light...@lanecc.edu

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Jul 19, 2018, 2:31:00 PM7/19/18

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Hi Rob,

Yes, I was hoping to use the results of that, but I'm very new to PreTeXt, so I'll need a lot of guidance. Do you have separate documentation on the CNXML to PreTeXt conversion process?

Wendy

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Alex Jordan

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Jul 19, 2018, 3:48:30 PM7/19/18

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This is about taking ORCCA and adding a chapter or two from an OpenStax book with a CC BY license (https://openstax.org/details/books/intermediate-algebra).

If nothing better comes about, an inelegant approach could be:

In the output .tex file, sed something into the footer starting on the OpenStax chapter and then sed it back out at the end of that chapter.
In the output .html, sed something into every footer for sections of the OpenStax chapter.

I helped Wendy get started, but not knowing Windows well, I didn't try to set up a build script. To go the route I describe above, it would be important to set up a build script to make sure the insertions happen on every run.

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David Farmer

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Jul 19, 2018, 3:57:10 PM7/19/18

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The best alternative, if it works, is to contact OpenStax
and ask them to grant you (and you only) a less burdensome
requirement for your use case.

That is something that often goes missing in licensing
discussion: the license is for anyone anywhere. If you
are building a wonderful and valuable product that makes use
of some other person's work, then it may make sense for them
to enter into a personal relationship with you.

On Thu, 19 Jul 2018, Alex Jordan wrote:

> This is about taking ORCCA and adding a chapter or two from an OpenStax book with a CC BY license
> (https://openstax.org/details/books/intermediate-algebra).
>
> If nothing better comes about, an inelegant approach could be:

> * In the output .tex file, sed something into the footer starting on the OpenStax chapter and then sed it

> back out at the end of that chapter.

> * In the output .html, sed something into every footer for sections of the OpenStax chapter.

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Rob Beezer

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Jul 19, 2018, 4:35:46 PM7/19/18

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Kathi Fletcher did not request a membership in pretext-dev but did try to send
the following there (and to me and Wendy):

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Hi Rob and Wendy,

We are always super excited to see our content being used in innovative ways to
advance access to students. Thank you!

I am forwarding you to our Customer Service (in...@openstax.org). They can
provide guidelines for properly attributing OpenStax. That attribution is key to
our mission, because it helps us track the impact of our content, share that
impact with our funders whose investment has already returned 16X savings to
students.

Kathi
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So it appears Wendy could follow David's advice by contacting that "info" address.

Rob

Rob Beezer

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Jul 19, 2018, 5:19:27 PM7/19/18

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And a good answer, to both Wendy and me, for the record:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hello All,

Thank you for reaching out to us about this. Yes, thanks to the textbook’s CC BY
licensing you are able to copy and redistribute the material in any medium or
format. We mainly only ask that you give appropriate credit, provide a link to
the license, and indicate if any changes were made. You may do so in any
reasonable manner, but not in any way that suggests the licensor endorses you or
your use. (For more information on licensing:
https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)

I hope this information is helpful. Please let me know if I can assist you further.

Sincerely,
Osiris

Osiris Flores
Customer Support Specialist
OpenStax

ref:_00DU0Kwch._5000BlJ4fQ:ref

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Rob Beezer

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Jul 19, 2018, 5:57:35 PM7/19/18

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Dear Wendy,

There is some good documentation, some is missing, and there is some good
Windows information. Plus folks here in the group who have everything working
on Windows. I'm glad you are asking good questions here in the group. See the
"Welcome to the PreTeXt Community" appendix for even more about the best ways to
get guidance:

http://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/doc/author-guide/html/welcome.html

The CNXML conversion isn't even public, so it is definitely a bit rough. And
deducing CNXML intent is a bit of a crap-shoot in places. So there will be some
iteration and some hand-editing involved.

How big a pieces do you want: examples and exercises, or chapters and sections?
Is this to augment ORCAA for use at Lane? (I forget which project you are
working on.)

Most important question: are you after the Intermediate Algebra text? Or
something else? Let me know, since I can concentrate my testing on what will be
useful to you.

Rob

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light...@lanecc.edu

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Jul 20, 2018, 11:00:13 AM7/20/18

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Hi Rob,

I'm wanting to add a chapter to PCC's ORCCA book, using material from some modules that I've "authored" in OpenStax, which were derived from the Intermediate Algebra and PreCalculus books from OpenStax. I don't want to use their exercises, since I think we should be consistent in using WeBWorK throughout the book for exercises, but everything else from my "authored" modules..

Here is a link to the collection where they are located (they are the last 3 modules, covering exponential and logarithmic functions): https://cnx.org/contents/8xG8nd5x@1.1:6pzoBn1I@1/Introduction

Thanks for your help!

Wendy

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Rob Beezer

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Jul 20, 2018, 4:20:04 PM7/20/18

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Dear Wendy,

Thanks for the link. Looks like I can download the whole thing as a zip file,
and then the converter I have should be able to deal with it easily.

Maybe I'll zip the results and post them on the "beta" portion of the PTX site
for you to download? Perhaps early next week.

Rob

On 07/20/2018 08:00 AM, light...@lanecc.edu wrote:
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Alex Jordan

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Jul 20, 2018, 4:35:07 PM7/20/18

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...that I've "authored" in OpenStax

Wendy, if you actually wrote this content in the OpenStax book, do you know if you retained copyright? If, say, you still own that content and just licensed it to OpenStax with CC BY, then maybe you can do as you like with it and don't need to fuss about the attribution.

Or maybe OpenStax required you to give up copyright when you submitted that content?

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light...@lanecc.edu

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Jul 20, 2018, 5:15:04 PM7/20/18

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Alex, I put quotes around "authored" because I didn't necessarily write the content. When you derive a copy of a module in OpenStax, so you can do some editing and reuse it, you are automatically considered the "author". I was uncomfortable with this title when I first started editing OpenStax content and wrote to them about it. They assured me that it was accurate since I was editing the content and not to worry. I mostly corrected the errors I found, reworded a few things for clarity, cut out content that we didn't cover, etc. Otherwise, it was truly authored by someone at OpenStax. So, unfortunately, I don't think I would have the sole copyright to it.

Wendy

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light...@lanecc.edu

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Jul 20, 2018, 5:54:49 PM7/20/18

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Rob,

That would be amazing! Thank you so much!

Wendy

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Jul 23, 2018, 1:29:20 AM7/23/18

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Dear Wendy,

A quick, cursory, conversion so we can together figure out what needs to be
fixed automatically. So do not fret if it looks a bit messy right now.

Sample at:
https://mathbook.pugetsound.edu/beta/20180722-wendy-algebra/html/chapter-1.html

Four files attached:

Introduction = m67532.xml
Section 11.1 = m67527.xml
Section 11.2 = m67528.xml
Section 11.3 = m67526.xml

Notes:

* CNXML "manipulative-math", "precalculus_try", and "precalculus_howto"
variants of the "note" element are missing. Maybe from early parts of the book.
(These vary within OpenStax from book to book.)

* There are images in tables, a no-no in PTX.

* Some dollar signs converted oddly. I suspect they were authored as math to
make print version succeed?

* Lots of "random" \hspace in 11.2.

* Source created assumes images are organized in directories like the zip file
download.

* Ignore my messing around with copyright notices.

Next:

1. Look around at source and at HTML output for weirdness and missing content.
Take notes. Identify systematic problems.

2. Cut and paste some PTX into your current project. See how much you need to
edit. Take notes.

3. Post notes.

Rob

On 07/20/2018 02:54 PM, light...@lanecc.edu wrote:
> Rob,
>
> That would be amazing! Thank you so much!
>
> Wendy
>
>
> On Friday, July 20, 2018 at 1:20:04 PM UTC-7, Rob Beezer wrote:
>
> Dear Wendy,
>
> Thanks for the link. Looks like I can download the whole thing as a zip file,
> and then the converter I have should be able to deal with it easily.
>
> Maybe I'll zip the results and post them on the "beta" portion of the PTX site
> for you to download? Perhaps early next week.
>
> Rob
>

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m67526.xml

m67527.xml

m67528.xml

m67532.xml

Wendy Lightheart

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Jul 23, 2018, 11:16:15 PM7/23/18

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Hi Rob,

Thank you SO much! I really appreciate this. I will get right on this.

Wendy

>>> Rob Beezer <bee...@ups.edu> 07/22/18 10:29 PM >>>

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light...@lanecc.edu

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Rob,

Thank you so much for this! I've been playing around with the section on using the change-of-base formula. It seems like there is a lot to change, but it's definitely a good starting point.

The images in this section are all ones that I can replace with math code, so I'm not too worried about that. However, in the exponential functions section, there are a lot of images that are graphs or diagrams, many of which are edited versions of the original OpenStax images because I wanted to change the variables to match what we typically use in our courses. So, I already have those files saved on my computer. The ones that I didn't need to change are files saved on the OpenStax Legacy Site, so I could download them from there. However, I've been having issues (in all my source files, not just these CNXML conversion files) with images not being cropped, so when you view them in the html, they appear very small with a zoom tool provided. Has anyone figured out how to solve this issue?

Thanks,

Wendy

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Alex Jordan

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Jul 24, 2018, 2:49:52 AM7/24/18

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Wendy and I had one day together face to face to get started and I
saw this image issue. When processing a latex-image, the svgs are
being built from pdfs that aren't getting cropped. I don't remember
details but I think it was a head-scratcher. I chalked it up to some
Windows detail to work out later. The pdfcrop utility seemed to be
there, but the mbx script wasn't using/finding it.

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Rob Beezer

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Jul 24, 2018, 9:53:30 AM7/24/18

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Dear Wendy,

The "zoom tool" provided by PreTeXt HTML is always there, so no indicative of
anything special.

In the PTX source, you can change the width attribute to makre an image larger
or smaller.

Any whitespace provided around an image is an OpenStax artifact and beyond our
control. You could crop manually.

The sample I sent you a link for uses the images that come in the zip file I
downloaded from OS for your version of the book. Are you using those versions
of the images?

I think Alex's message is about something different, but I could be confused.

I actually do not know much about how OpenStax works (such as the "Legacy
Site"), so please provide details if I am not understandint his correctly.

Rob

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Alex Jordan

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Jul 24, 2018, 12:17:36 PM7/24/18

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Sorry, I maybe mixed up another issue. But when Wendy processes ORCCA, and processes the latex-image elements to svg for the HTML output, they haven't been cropped. We had mbx make just the pdf images, and those weren't cropped either. Hoping this is a familiar issue to a Windows user (and that a solution is known).

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Rob Beezer

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Jul 24, 2018, 1:57:54 PM7/24/18

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Not a Windows user anymore, but perhaps this will have enough hints to get you
started (I've not reviewed it carefully).

https://github.com/rbeezer/mathbook/pull/328

On 07/24/2018 09:17 AM, Alex Jordan wrote:
> Sorry, I maybe mixed up another issue. But when Wendy processes ORCCA, and
> processes the latex-image elements to svg for the HTML output, they haven't been
> cropped. We had mbx make just the pdf images, and those weren't cropped either.
> Hoping this is a familiar issue to a Windows user (and that a solution is known).
>
> On Tue, Jul 24, 2018 at 6:53 AM, Rob Beezer <bee...@ups.edu
> <mailto:bee...@ups.edu>> wrote:
>
> Dear Wendy,
>
> The "zoom tool" provided by PreTeXt HTML is always there, so no indicative
> of anything special.
>
> In the PTX source, you can change the width attribute to makre an image
> larger or smaller.
>
> Any whitespace provided around an image is an OpenStax artifact and beyond
> our control. You could crop manually.
>
> The sample I sent you a link for uses the images that come in the zip file I
> downloaded from OS for your version of the book. Are you using those
> versions of the images?
>
> I think Alex's message is about something different, but I could be confused.
>
> I actually do not know much about how OpenStax works (such as the "Legacy
> Site"), so please provide details if I am not understandint his correctly.
>
> Rob
>
> On 07/23/2018 11:16 PM, light...@lanecc.edu

> <mailto:light...@lanecc.edu> <javascript:> wrote:
> > Rob,
> >
> > That would be amazing! Thank you so much!
> >
> > Wendy
> >
> >
> > On Friday, July 20, 2018 at 1:20:04 PM UTC-7, Rob Beezer wrote:
> >
> > Dear Wendy,
> >
> > Thanks for the link. Looks like I can download the whole
> thing as a
> zip file,
> > and then the converter I have should be able to deal with it
> easily.
> >
> > Maybe I'll zip the results and post them on the "beta"
> portion of the
> PTX site
> > for you to download? Perhaps early next week.
> >
> > Rob
> >
> > On 07/20/2018 08:00 AM, light...@lanecc.edu

> <mailto:light...@lanecc.edu>

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