Aliases from owner server failing

[ShoestringWebs]

I use a large number of aliases (forwarders) for various sites that I
own/manage. Those addresses are failing to forward with the following
error:

bobg @ shoestringwebs.com
(ultimately generated from somebody @ millagerate.com)
SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data:
host shoestringwebs.com.s7a1.psmtp.com [64.18.6.14]:
571 Message Refused

I am in the process of installing an SPF record on the accounts:

"v=spf1 ip4:64.18.6.12 a a:outbounds7.ga.obsmtp.com
include:aspmx.googlemail.com ~all"

Question 1: Is this an (lack of) SPF problem?

Question 2: I have seen several different IPs listed for psmtp.com. Is
my SPF record sufficient or do I need to make a change?

Thanks in advance for the help. My server mail queue is filling up
with these rejected messages. Sure, it's mostly spam but I need all
forwarded mail to be accepted.

[FrankM]

Are you using both Google Apps Gmail and your own mail server?

[ShoestringWebs]

I have various forwarders (in this instance,
somebodyATmillagerate.com) pointed to my primary Google Apps address,
bobgATshoestringwebs.com. Mail to somebodyATmillagerate.com is being
forwarded by my server and, apparently, refused by Gmail.

[FrankM]

Problem here is that you have your MX pointed to Postini, which is OK
but the user at shoestringswebs.com and the domain millagerate.com
both need to be listed in Postini. Postini is third party to this
scenario and it needs to know what to pass through or filter.

If the user name, e.g., bobg in the primary Apps domain is the same as
bobgATwhatever.com, then in Postini you can setup a domain alias. If
the user names are different, then with the same domain alias setup,
you then would add the alias to the primary user account.

I know the above explanation is distilled, but I think you get the
point and can go through the Admin guide for Postini's Policy
Management and Message Recovery service.

> > > forwarded mail to be accepted.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Bob Griggs]

But I get this error message whenever I send to ANY address on my own
server, not just when I sent to/from one of my own aliases/forwarders.

Another example, resulting from an email sent to a mailbox on my server:

Technical details of permanent failure:
PERM_FAILURE: SMTP Error (state 13): 550-Verification failed for
<bo...@shoestringwebs.com>
550-Previous (cached) callout verification failure
550 Sender verify failed

Where is this coming from and how do I resolve it?

--
Verify I-9, LLC
www.VerifyI9.com
678-528-2121
866-406-2297 Toll Free
866-681-3898 Fax

[FrankM]

When you say "my server", are you referring that you are using dual
mail routing?

On Mar 24, 10:50 am, "Bob Griggs" <b...@shoestringwebs.com> wrote:
> But I get this error message whenever I send to ANY address on my own
> server, not just when I sent to/from one of my own aliases/forwarders.
>
> Another example, resulting from an email sent to a mailbox on my server:
>
> Technical details of permanent failure:
> PERM_FAILURE: SMTP Error (state 13): 550-Verification failed for

> <b...@shoestringwebs.com>

> 866-681-3898 Fax- Hide quoted text -

[Bob Griggs]

As a small web hosting company, I have a number of client sites hosted
on a dedicated server. I cannot email any of my clients from my
Google Apps account if their email address is associated with their
account on my server.

Something is happening in the verification process and the
communication between Google Apps and my server. I just can't figure
out where the problem is.

[Bob Griggs]

I eliminated the callout errors by disabling callout for sender
verification on my server. That eliminated most of the errors.
Apparently, Google doesn't respond correctly to verification callouts.

Senders get the following error when they send to a forwarder on my server:

host shoestringwebs.com.s7b1.psmtp.com [64.18.6.11]:
571 spam source blocked

Although it appears that my server is blocked by Google, I can send
email directly from a mailbox on my server to my Google account.
Apparently, Google doesn't like email redirected via an
alias/forwarder address.

[FrankM]

OK, email is not the best sometimes in explaining a problem. Please
break down my server, my Google account etc.. and who is who. What are
the senders forwarding, e.g., from what domain to your "my" server?
Maybe a simple flow chart would help.

> >  out where the problem is.- Hide quoted text -

[Bob Griggs]

Thank you for your patience.

I lease a dedicated server ("my server") using cPanel/WHM/Exim from a
reputable company. On it, I host a number of accounts including many
of my own. For our example, one is BOBGRIGGS.COM.

There exists an actual mailbox of BOB-@-BOBGRIGGS.COM. I have no
problem sending and receiving email between that mailbox and my Google
Apps account, for which the primary account is
BOBG-@-SHOESTRINGWEBS.COM.

I also have a forwarding address (not an actual mailbox) of
CONTACT-@-BOBGRIGGS.COM. The alias is configured to forward to
BOBG-@-SHOESTRINGWEBS.COM.

If you send to CONTACT-@-BOBGRIGGS.COM, the email is not delivered and
the sender receives an error like the one below or no response at all:

host shoestringwebs.com.s7b1.psmtp.com [64.18.6.11]:
571 spam source blocked

So the problem is not that mail from my server is blocked by Google
but that Google balks at accepting email redirected through
forwarders.

It is not a solution to set up BOBGRIGGS.COM as an alias domain in
Postini; I have a dozen or more such domains. It is also not a
solution to create an actual mailbox for each forwarder and use Google
POP3 as I think that would bypass the Postini filtering.

[FrankM]

Have you tried white listing the IP of bobgriggs.com in your Gmail
dashboard? It's under Service Settings -> Email.

On Mar 24, 4:36 pm, "Bob Griggs" <b...@shoestringwebs.com> wrote:
> Thank you for your patience.
>
> I lease a dedicated server ("my server") using cPanel/WHM/Exim from a
> reputable company. On it, I host a number of accounts including many
> of my own. For our example, one is BOBGRIGGS.COM.
>

> There exists an actual mailbox of B...@-BOBGRIGGS.COM.  I have no

> problem sending and receiving email between that mailbox and my Google
> Apps account, for which the primary account is

> BO...@-SHOESTRINGWEBS.COM.

>
> I also have a forwarding address (not an actual mailbox) of

> CONTA...@-BOBGRIGGS.COM. The alias is configured to forward to
> BO...@-SHOESTRINGWEBS.COM.
>
> If you send to CONTA...@-BOBGRIGGS.COM, the email is not delivered and

> the sender receives an error like the one below or no response at all:
>
> host shoestringwebs.com.s7b1.psmtp.com [64.18.6.11]:
> 571 spam source blocked
>
> So the problem is not that mail from my server is blocked by Google
> but that Google balks at accepting email redirected through
> forwarders.
>
> It is not a solution to set up BOBGRIGGS.COM as an alias domain in
> Postini; I have a dozen or more such domains. It is also not a
> solution to create an actual mailbox for each forwarder and use Google
> POP3 as I think that would bypass the Postini filtering.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 3:33 PM, FrankM <Frank.M...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >  OK, email is not the best sometimes in explaining a problem. Please
> >  break down my server, my Google account etc.. and who is who. What are
> >  the senders forwarding, e.g., from what domain to your "my" server?

> >  Maybe a simple flow chart would help.- Hide quoted text -

[Bob Griggs]

I whitelisted all three; the primary and the two used for the DNS.

[FrankM]

Try adding bobgriggs.com to the SPF of shoestringwebs.com.

> >  > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[Bob Griggs]

I added "include:bobgriggs.com" to the SPF record, with no change. The
record is on my server while the MX, of course, points to
Google/Postini. Is there an SPF record on Google or is the SPF on my
server sufficient?

I apologize for the problems; I know just enough to be dangerous.
Thanks for the help.

--
Verify I-9, LLC
www.VerifyI9.com

[Bob Griggs]

Incidentally, Gmail accepts the forwards. For example, I can point
CONTACT-@-BOBGRIGGS.COM to a Gmail account and mail sent to it is
delivered successfully. It is just when that same forwarder is pointed
to my Google Apps / Postini address that the failure occurs.