[p3rtp] Future of pinnacle

[Omar Ali]

I am currently consulting for a group desiring to build a new center in joint venture with hospital on the east coast. I have been a Pinnacle user for most of career and also used Eclipse. We had presentation with both Elekta and Varian in last two weeks. Both companies are promoting the future of treatment planning being integrated with their record and verify which seems appealing. This makes me question the future existence of Pinnacle in this type of market. I also understand some very key Pinnacle savvy employees have left over the last couple of years most recently being Dave Robinson. Who is driving their Physicist work? I just do not feel that Philips has supported this product line in the last few years the way ADAC once did.

I want to make a good decision for this practice and  like Pinnacle very much but it is a difficult decision to make based on what I am hearing and seeing for the future. Can someone help me on this.

O. Ali
Ample Clinical Consulting LLC

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[Bee Gary (Taunton and Somerset NHS Foundation Trust)]

I have been using Pinnacle for the past 18months, before that I used it in 2001.

In between I have been an CMS Xio/Focal and Eclipse user.

 

Pinnacle used to be my number 1, I always had good memories of it. But having come back to it after a long break I have to admit that I was disappointed.

Graphically it has not changed since 2001. The way it deals with multiple plans, multiple phases and planning CT’s is ,frankly, awful. Often we have to do ‘Forensic Planning’ here with patients returning for re-treats or multiple radiotherapy treatments, in Pinnacle this is very difficult.

Calculation speed and scripting are huge plus points however.

 

In my previous job I was using Eclipse with Aria. I think in the past few years Eclipse has seen some huge improvements in its user interface, the fusion tools, and the ability to ‘forensic plan’ (summing dose cubes, dicom connectivity). Using one system for delivery and planning does take a bit of getting used to, but once there makes the whole process allot simpler.

 

I wouldn’t want Pinnacle to disappear off the map but am agreed with others that Philips cannot afford to let it ‘stagnate’ any more.

I am eagerly anticipating V9.0, hopefully that will fix some of the issues. It seems to me that when they do release extra functionality it is always as an ‘add-on’ to the program (just look at the DVH tools and how they are completely separate and unconnected to the planning workspace), at some point it will need a complete re-write to smooth out the functionality and usability – do Philips have the resources or desire to do this?

 

 Unless they ‘do a deal’ I cannot see them improving the connectivity with treatment delivery systems.

 

This is all my personal opinion as an end user, sorry that it reads as a bit of a rant!

 

Gary

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[Freddie Cardel]

I will preface this reply by saying I am biased toward Pinnacle.  Some of you may remember me as I used to take many of your calls at Philips.  That being said, I have been away from Philips for over a year now and have been using Eclipse.  I have to say, that in my humble opinion Eclipse is terrible, I have the latest version and if this is a vast improvement I hate to see what it was like before.  I consistently get blue screens of death whenever I push the system by only doing 4 plans at the same time and they cannot even explain what the Plan Normalization factor is!  Varian has told me that I need to upgrade to 64 bit and load v8.9 on the system so that it can access more RAM.  The problem here is that the system is barely one year old and they already are telling me I need an upgrade that will take 3 days to do and that it will not be backwards compatible and to make matters worse I will not be able to open ARIA on the eclipse station after the upgrade.  So there goes the fully integrated solution.  There solution is to run a remote session on the PC if I want to have Patient Manager on the system.  Not a great solution.  I agree with Gary that Pinnacle's interface needs a serious updating, but it is still the strongest and most accurate system out there.  After all these years the competitors still do not have an algorithm as good as Pinnacle's.  I also heard through the grapevine that Philips is undergoing a product restoration in which it is going to pour a bunch of resources and money into Pinnacle.  This is good news.  Although many good folks left for other endeavors, there are still many very good and capable people still there.  I think with v9 out and Smart Arc costing hundreds of thousands less then Rapid Arc upgrades we should wait and see a little bit more before throwing Pinnacle under the bus. 

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Regards,

Freddie Cardel

[Bee Gary (Taunton and Somerset NHS Foundation Trust)]

Thank you Freddie

It is very useful to get a point of view from another angle. I do not disagree with any of your points, except that I do not think Eclipse is terrible.

 

Gary

[Freddie Cardel]

You are welcome Gary,  OK, OK, there are a few things I like about it but it certainly frustrates me sometimes.  :-)

[Freddie Cardel]

BTW, here is a job posting for an Advanced Clinical Product Specialist for a dosimetrist, there is a physicist position listed as well.

 

http://jobs.philips.com/WI/Advanced_Clinical_Product_Specialist_Dosimetry_PROS/015481784/job

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Regards,

Freddie Cardel