Help requested to update my software

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smp

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Aug 1, 2022, 6:18:18 PM8/1/22
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Hello all,

Some years ago I purchased and built my PiDP-8.  At that time (late 2016 or early 2017, I think) I was able to purchase a Raspberry Pi 2, Model B, and I performed a number of arcane (to me) processes to get Oscar's PiDP-8 software onto a 2GB memory chip (or maybe it was a 4GB chip?). I performed a number more arcane setups to get the whole thing to communicate over WiFI so I could use SSH to connect to the PiDP-8.  Some time later, I performed some Linux commands to be able to use two USB-TTL interfaces tied together to be a hard-wire connection to my laptop as the terminal.

I've been using Oscar's original PiDP-8 software in my PiDP-8 ever since then.

As you may surmise, I do not know much of anything about getting a Raspberry Pi to work with any other software, and I go to the software archive set up by the fellow named Warren, but I do not know much of anything about tarballs or how to "make" software or much of anything like that, so I am mostly confused by what is there.

I would dearly love to get the latest PiDP-8 software running on my PiDP-8, but doing so myself presents a mountain of things that I do not have much or even any experience with.

I understand that I could get myself a clean 8GB memory chip and somehow copy an image of the v2021.02.14 software running on my PiDP-8.  I have no idea of what other things I would need to do in order to get my PiDP-8 up and running again after copying that image onto a new memory chip.

Is there anybody here who would be available via messages here on the forum, or via personal e-mails, who could help me go step-by-step to do this upgrade to my PiDP-8?

Thanks for listening - and thanks in advance, if there's some folks here who may be able to guide me in this effort!

smp


Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 1, 2022, 8:19:22 PM8/1/22
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I'm sure we can talk you thru the procedure.

Just to give you an idea of what needs to be done  (with help from the good people here)

You will need:
 * a new micro SD card , minimum 8 GB size
 * a PC with an SD card reader (internal or as a USB device) and internet connection
 * a keyboard with USB cable
 * an HDMI cable and an HDMI monitor


1) Buy a new microSD card (one with an adapter to SD-card form factor)  , liike in this picture https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/MicroSD#/media/Datei:Micro-SD-Adapter.jpg
     8GB is the minimum size , but 16 GB could be even more useful and easier to get. I would not recommend to overwrite your existing SD card!

2) you will need to download the binary image from Warren's site: currently this is https://tangentsoft.com/dl/pidp8i-2021.02.14-ils-buster-lite.img.zip  , but for the records you can find up to date links here :

3) you'll need to transfer the image contained in that ZIP file to your new SD card. I'll asume that you have a Windows PC with a fairly recent version of Windows? So you can use a program like Etcher  ( https://www.balena.io/etcher/  ) or the Raspberry Pi Imager (  https://downloads.raspberrypi.org/imager/imager_latest.exe  ) to do this. Ask if you need help

4) You will eventually be able to log into your Raspi with SSH  , but to enable SSH, you need to do one operation manually, so you need to connect a USB keyboard to your Raspi  and a monitor via a HDMI cable.

5) put the newly imaged SD micro card into the Raspberry Pi , connect the keyboard and HDMI monitor, and connect the Raspi to power. No need to connect it to the PiDP-8 PCB at this moment

6) once the Raspi has booted, follow instructions at  https://tangentsoft.com/pidp8i/doc/trunk/doc/OS-images.md   to log into the Raspi and enable SSH via keyboard44

7) configure WiFI if you cannot connect the Raspi via Ethernet.  This depends a bit on the WiFi dongle that you use, so again feel free to ask if you get stuck in this step.

8) rebbot the Raspi (e.g. with "sudo reboot"). Once the Raspi boots up again , you should be able to log in via WiFi and SSH

9) power down the Raspi (e.g. with the command "sudo shutdown now"  ... this will take a few seconds),  disconnect the Raspi from power  and connect the Raspi to the PiDP-8 PCB's connector

10)  In case something doesn't work as expected, it's also useful to still keep the USB keyboard and HDMI monitor connected, just in case. connect the Micro USB power cable but don't plug in the power supply just yet

11) make sure all switches on the PiDP-8 front panel are in the "UP" position

12) power up the Raspi again.

13) after some time the PiDP-8 front panel should come back to life again

14) optionally you will want to clean up the installation by changing the password perhaps,
 
I'm quite sure some stuff will need additional explaining along the way but the above script gives us a way  to track progress  and see at which step you are at a given time.

Ready to give it a try?

Cheers
HB

smp

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Aug 2, 2022, 10:08:46 AM8/2/22
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Thanks very much, HB, for the roadmap!

While I am doing this, I think it may be a good idea to start with a new Pi as well.  Since I do not intend to be doing a lot of mucking around in the internals of SIMH or Linux, do you have a suggestion for a good up-to-date Raspberry Pi to get?

smp

August Treubig

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Aug 2, 2022, 10:22:42 AM8/2/22
to smp, PiDP-8
The one you have.  Raspberry Pi have become unobtanium like many other things.  

Aug
AG5AT 

Sent from my iPad

On Aug 2, 2022, at 9:08 AM, smp <stephen.m....@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks very much, HB, for the roadmap!
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smp

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Aug 2, 2022, 10:36:50 AM8/2/22
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Thanks, Aug.  I didn't know that!
I'll go about obtaining the new 8GB or larger Micro SD chip.
I already have the keyboard and the HDMI cable from the beginning, so I'll dig those out.
I'm sure that I'll be back with questions, so please stand by!

smp

smp

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Aug 2, 2022, 3:39:23 PM8/2/22
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OK folks, here is my first question...

I have successfully loaded the v2021.02.14 software from TangentSoft onto my new 32GB Micro SD chip, using the Raspberry Pi Imager tool.  Yay!

The next step in the roadmap provided by BH above says that eventually I'll be able to use SSH, and then goes on to provide instructions for how to perform the manual bits in order to get SSH running.

I do not want to use SSH to connect to my PiDP-8, but I want to use a serial connection like I already have, using two USB-to-TTL adapters wired together to connect from my PiDP-8 to my laptop being used as a terminal.

Do I have to get SSH running first, no matter what?  How do I go about getting the PiDP-8 to connect to a terminal via one of the USB connectors?  Can I simply use the old instructions that I used before to make this happen?
Instructions from long ago:
- - - - -
Copy the file 'serial-getty@???.service'  from  '/lib/systemd/system'  to  '/etc/systemd/system'
Rename the file so that it points to your terminal, ttyUSB0.  The filename becomes:  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 
You may need to change the first line of the file to be:  ExecStart=-/sbin/agetty ttyUSB0 9600 vt100
Enable the service with:  'sudo systemctl enable  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 
You should see a 'Creating sim link ...' message.  The service will now start on every boot.
- - - - -

Next I will have to disassemble my PiDP-8 to get the Raspberry Pi and put the new Micro SD chip in.  I'll attach the keyboard and an HDMI monitor and see if I can log in.  If I can, I'll take a look and see if I can find all those places and that file.  If I can, that will verify at least that I can perform those steps again to attempt to activate my serial connection.

Thanks for listening, and for all of your advice!

smp

Clem Cole

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Aug 2, 2022, 4:34:33 PM8/2/22
to smp, PiDP-8
Below...

On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 3:39 PM smp <stephen.m....@gmail.com> wrote:
OK folks, here is my first question...

I have successfully loaded the v2021.02.14 software from TangentSoft onto my new 32GB Micro SD chip, using the Raspberry Pi Imager tool.  Yay!

The next step in the roadmap provided by BH above says that eventually I'll be able to use SSH, and then goes on to provide instructions for how to perform the manual bits in order to get SSH running.

I do not want to use SSH to connect to my PiDP-8,
No - but it's a good idea as a back up to be able to get back into the RPi if you need too later even without a head on it.

I >>highly<< recommend making sure you can login into the RPi via from ssh/VNC.

Remember - while you want to be running a PDP8, what you are doing is this:

Running a modern UNIX-based system on an RPi called 'Raspian Linux', that then runs a Unix application called Simh to create the emulated HW for a PDP-8.  In order to maintain the emulated HW, you need to mess with Simh and occasionally the core Unix under the covers.


 
but I want to use a serial connection like I already have, using two USB-to-TTL adapters wired together to connect from my PiDP-8 to my laptop being used as a terminal.
That's different ... that's ensuring that Linux sees the adapters, then assigning then to simh so that simh can provide an emulated UART . 

Do I have to get SSH running first, no matter what?
No - but it's a good idea.

Step 1) install Raspian on the SD chip

Step 2) Boot the RPi  - use a traditonal display and keyboard OR follow the 'headless' directions on the RPI site (I can send you a URL if you can not find it).

Step 3) Get the RPI running on your network as you might expect.  I recommend traditional ethernet (RJ45) as WiFI != 100% ethernet and adds to the Simh issues later.

Highly Suggested Step 4) Make sure ssh and VNC are enabled and you can log in with ssh and/pr VNC from a mac or PC

Now ... Install USB to TTL converters and ensure that Linux sees them in /dev/*USB* AND you can write to them. [I can help with this offline when you get this far].  Don't even bother with anything until you know this works.
Now turn on Simh and set the *.ini files to assign and open the /dev/*USB* as appropriate as PDP-8 serial ports.
Finally fire up the DEC SW and you should be in good shape. 


 
 How do I go about getting the PiDP-8 to connect to a terminal via one of the USB connectors?
It depends ... 
a.) on the version of Linux
b.) the type of USB devices you have


 
 Can I simply use the old instructions that I used before to make this happen?
Instructions from long ago:
- - - - -
Copy the file 'serial-getty@???.service'  from  '/lib/systemd/system'  to  '/etc/systemd/system'
Rename the file so that it points to your terminal, ttyUSB0.  The filename becomes:  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 
You may need to change the first line of the file to be:  ExecStart=-/sbin/agetty ttyUSB0 9600 vt100
Enable the service with:  'sudo systemctl enable  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 
You should see a 'Creating sim link ...' message.  The service will now start on every boot.
- - - - -
Maybe ...   this look good IIRC the USB devices are named ttyUSB0 

After step 2 above type: ls -l /dev/tty* | more
After you have plugged in the USB to serial adapters and see if Linux finds it (them).  If so, go ahead and try it and see if you get a serial prompt on when running a terminal on the other of the (or a PC with a serial emulator).

Good luck,
Clem

smp

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Aug 2, 2022, 5:14:42 PM8/2/22
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OK, thank you very much again for all the advice and support here.

I have logged in to my Rasperry Pi with the new Micro SD chip installed.  I was asked to change the password, and I did.  I made sure that I can shutdown from the keyboard, and I can log in again using the new password.

I performed the one command indicated to reconfigure the SSH, as in the instructions pointed to.

Those instructions then say: 'You should be able to log in via SSH immediately after that command completes.'

How do I do that?  After my RPi boots up and I've logged in, I take a look on my WiFi device, but I do not see any new device appear on my network.  Is there some other command that I have to execute?  How do I figure out what the ID of the RPi wireless is?

Thanks very much, again, for all your advice and assistance.

smp

Clem Cole

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Aug 2, 2022, 5:34:45 PM8/2/22
to smp, PiDP-8
below ...

On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 5:14 PM smp <stephen.m....@gmail.com> wrote:
OK, thank you very much again for all the advice and support here.

I have logged in to my Rasperry Pi with the new Micro SD chip installed.  I was asked to change the password, and I did.  I made sure that I can shutdown from the keyboard, and I can log in again using the new password.

I performed the one command indicated to reconfigure the SSH, as in the instructions pointed to.

Those instructions then say: 'You should be able to log in via SSH immediately after that command completes.'
Sure -- assuming it's on the network.  Which I bet it's not.

How do I do that?  After my RPi boots up and I've logged in, I take a look on my WiFi device, but I do not see any new device appear on my network.
Danger Will Robinson ...Danger ...  Simh and WiFI is not a good mix, particularly for folks that are not fluent in Unix and IP.  

Seriously, if this is a RPI2 it should have an RJ45 on its IIRC.  Can you run a cable from a switch to the unit.
It should show up probably as as host named 'raspberrypi' 





 
 Is there some other command that I have to execute?  How do I figure out what the ID of the RPi wireless is?
If you must use WiFi, you need to follow the directions found in: https://raspberrytips.com/raspberry-pi-wifi-setup/ 
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Rick Murphy

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Aug 2, 2022, 6:09:14 PM8/2/22
to Clem Cole, smp, PiDP-8
Assuming that you've got it networked (and I agree with Clem that hardwired is a lot easier), then it should show up as "raspberrypi.local" assuming that "raspberrypi" is the hostname.
(Log in and give the 'hostname' command to find out what the hostname is.)
    -Rick



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Clem Cole

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Aug 2, 2022, 6:25:23 PM8/2/22
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On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 6:09 PM Rick Murphy <k1mu....@gmail.com> wrote:
Assuming that you've got it networked (and I agree with Clem that hardwired is a lot easier), then it should show up as "raspberrypi.local" assuming that "raspberrypi" is the hostname.
(Log in and give the 'hostname' command to find out what the hostname is.)

I'll not explain in detail here -- if you want to know why - go back and read the simh mailing list archives where this has been discussed a great deal.  The basic issue is that simh (in order to do what it has to do WRT to its own networking), needs to do raw network device access.   The simh's virtual device support is for traditional ethernet that DEC, HP, and the like supplied in those days.  WiFi does not have exactly the same characteristics, so mapping the emulation to a WiFi network is fraught with compromises.   These compromises and rough edges are amplified when you get as many layers as we are using when running an old DEC OS on top of it. 

The simh designers have taken Bob Metcalfe's advice and recognized that 'Wireless is a like a port-a-potty.  Handy as can be when you really need it, but you'd rather use the real thing.'    They just tell everyone put the simh host on a real network and be done with it.   Simply, switches and wires are cheap.

In the case of the PDP-8, it's a little easier since simh does not define a virtual ethernet device for the it, but simh does have DEC ethernet support for the 11, the vax, and the 10 (although if you are going to use it, do read the documents -- there are plenty of dragons to find lurking in the shadows).  So  for the PiDP-8 you can get this to work, but you are likely to have small issues.

Clem

smp

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Aug 2, 2022, 6:42:19 PM8/2/22
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I dug out my long ethernet cable in order to attach by wire as suggested...

I still cannot see any new device coming onto my home network.  I know that you folks cannot help me any further.  If I cannot get the RPi onto my network, there will be no way to connect to it and get into the PDP-8 application.

I'm going to go back to the original memory chip that I had from the beginning and see if I can get the whole thing back working.  Then, maybe I'll be able to try another run at this.

Thank you all *very* much for trying to help, but I fear that I simply do not know enough to play around and get this working by myself, and there appears to be far too much for me to learn and understand.

I'll let you know if I get back to where I originally was.  Then maybe I can figure out another plan.

smp

Michael J. Kupec

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Aug 2, 2022, 6:56:43 PM8/2/22
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FWIW: if you put the original card in and you see it on your network, note the IP and try the newer version again. Once it’s up on newer version, try the IP the old card was using. 
Most home routers tend to reuse the original IP since it’s the MAC address of the Ethernet device that it uses to assign the IP and odds are that MAC is still in its IP database. 

Now of course it sounds like you have been running the old software via wireless. I only say that because you mentioned you had to dig up a network cable just to try the Ethernet with the new version. The new should pick up an IP as that was how I always understood how the PiDP8 worked and how mine works (it’s a 3B+). 

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 2, 2022, at 6:42 PM, smp <stephen.m....@gmail.com> wrote:

I dug out my long ethernet cable in order to attach by wire as suggested...
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Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 3, 2022, 3:50:22 AM8/3/22
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I would suggest that you try to check the network connection from the Raspi :

log into it, and with the ethernet cable plugged in and connected to the switch/router, execute

ifconfig

which will list some details for all network links the Pi has configured. To reduce the clutter you could do

ifconfig | grep "inet "  | egrep -v "127\.0\.0\.1"

to display all the relevant IP4  network addresses associated with the device.

If your LAN has addresses (say) 192.168.0.X , there should be one or two lines with such addresses in the output (one for WiFi if it's working, one for ethernet).

From your Windows PC you can then check the connection via "ping" followed by  one of the addresses, e.g. if you see an address 192.168.1.42 from above command , try 

ping 192.168.1.42

from Windows. If that works => you should be ready to use ssh into the Raspi from Windows with this IP address as well, using Putty or any other SSH client of your choice.

If it doesn't work...we'll have to look at the output from ifconfig to see what's wrong here. And before that you will want to look at the ethernet socket of the PI (yeah it might be difficult to see if it's plugged into the PiDP8 enclosure....) There are tiny LEDs, one green and and one orange on the connector itself, and if both are dark while the Pi is powered and fully booted up and the Ethernet cable is connected, then there is even a physical connection problem ==> the cable connection is not working correctly)

HB
P.S.: I have my PiDP-8 running just fine 24/7 over WiFi on a Raspberry Pi 3 A+ (which doesn't even have an ethernet socket but built-in WiFi), but I agree that ethernet is the easier route to start with.

P.P.S.:
> Most home routers tend to reuse the original IP since it’s the MAC address of the Ethernet device that it uses to assign the IP and odds are that MAC is still in its IP database. 
Sure, but if the old installation was via WiFi, and the new one is now via Ethernet, that won't help, as the Ethernet and WiFi adapters have different MAC addresses so the router will give different IP addresses to the two interfaces

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 9:03:01 AM8/3/22
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Good morning, folks,

When I first started up my PiDP-8, way back in 2016 0r 2017, I performed the need instructions at the time to get the WiFi working.  Quickly, I changed over to use a wired connection to a terminal using two USB-to-TTL cables connected together.  Ever since then, that is how I used my PiDP-8, wired to a terminal.  When I made the change, it was "permanent" and I never used WiFi again.

Hence, I do not really care to stay all wrapped around this axle trying to get my RPi connected to my network, because I simply do not need that.  I have been able to get into the latest PiDP-8 from the keyboard connected to my RPi, and I see the PDP-8 on the HDMI screen.  I love it as it is, however, I cannot get everything back into my box like this, nor do I want to operate like this.

Can someone please give me the proper instructions to has the PDP-8 simulation use a USB port to communicate with a single terminal?

I cannot find any of the directories that my old instructions referred to, so I cannot try to make the needed changes:

Instructions from long ago:
- - - - -
Copy the file 'serial-getty@???.service'  from  '/lib/systemd/system'  to  '/etc/systemd/system'
Rename the file so that it points to your terminal, ttyUSB0.  The filename becomes:  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 
You may need to change the first line of the file to be:  ExecStart=-/sbin/agetty ttyUSB0 9600 vt100
Enable the service with:  'sudo systemctl enable  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 
You should see a 'Creating sim link ...' message.  The service will now start on every boot.
- - - - -

Please help, if you can.  Thanks very much, once again, for all your attention and support!

smp

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 11:36:25 AM8/3/22
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I managed to rummage around in the RPi, and I found all the directories to execute the old instructions.
I executed all the old instructions, and all appeared to go well - however, I do not get my serial connection via USB like I used to with the old system software chip.

If anyone has any ideas about how to get this to go, I would appreciate hearing them

TIA

smp

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 11:45:25 AM8/3/22
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Without changing anything else, I removed the new micro-sd chip, and re-installed my old micro-sd chip, and I have successfully gone back to my old PiDP-8 using the USB-to-TTL cables for a serial connection to a terminal.

Many thanks to all who attempted to help me out here.

If anyone can help me with getting the serial interface to work with the latest software loaded, I would greatly appreciate hearing how to do it.  Otherwise, I guess I'll stick with the old stuff that works for me.

smp

Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 3, 2022, 12:38:18 PM8/3/22
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Hi!

It would be useful to know what you actually did , e.g. from the "history" commandline tool.

Anyway, here is what you probably shopuld have done:

1) verify that your USB-serial adapter is recognized by the new installation as ttyUSB0:

The command

ls -1 /dev/tty*  | grep USB

should yield

/dev/ttyUSB0

Fine.

> Copy the file 'serial-getty@???.service'  from  '/lib/systemd/system'  to  '/etc/systemd/system'
> Rename the file so that it points to your terminal, ttyUSB0.  The filename becomes:  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 

should then actually mean here (the ??? seems bogus ):

sudo cp /lib/systemd/syste/serial-getty@.service   /etc/systemd/system/serial...@ttyUSB0.service

> You may need to change the first line of the file to be:  ExecStart=-/sbin/agetty ttyUSB0 9600 vt100

This instruction is a bit misleading. There should already by a line in this file ( talking about /etc/systemd/system/serial...@ttyUSB0.service ) that starts with " ExecStart" but it likely won't be the *first* line in that file.

The instruction should have read:
"
You may need to change the first line of the file  start starts with "ExecStart" (probably the first line  in the [Service] section ) to be:  ExecStart=-/sbin/agetty ttyUSB0 9600 vt100
"
But likely you are already fine without changing the file.

If you need to edit the file, use
sudo nano /etc/systemd/system/serial...@ttyUSB0.service
or some such 

> Enable the service with:  'sudo systemctl enable  'serial...@ttyUSB0.service' 
so here:
sudo systemctl enable  serial...@ttyUSB0.service

After that, the service should start automatically after the next booting. If you want to test without booting, use

sudo systemctl start serial...@ttyUSB0.service

And at that point the serial link should work as before.

Good Luck

HB

Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 3, 2022, 12:44:52 PM8/3/22
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darn, every instance of

s e r i a l - g e t t y @ t t y U S B 0 . s e r v i c e

was turned into
s e r i a l . . .  @ t t y U S B 0 . s e r v i c e

by the mailing list frontend ... but you get the idea...

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 1:47:29 PM8/3/22
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Thanks for your response, HB.

>>> sudo cp /lib/systemd/system/serial-getty@.service   /etc/systemd/system/serial...@ttyUSB0.service

Yes, I did that.

I then changed the first line  in the [Service] section of that file to be:  ExecStart=-/sbin/agetty ttyUSB0 9600 vt100

Finally, I enabled the service with:  sudo systemctl enable  serial...@ttyUSB0.service

Having done all that, I unplugged the keyboard and HDMI monitor, and plugged the USB cable between my PiDP-8 and the terminal.  When I booted up the PiDP-8, I got nothing on the terminal at all.

After powering off, I then replaced the new micro-SD chip with the old micro-SD chip, and my old PiDP-8 is running just the same as it was before.

So from your advice above, the only thing I can see is that I changed the line in the file, and perhaps I shouldn't have.  I commented out the line that had been there, so I could bring it back and try again.  I'll let you know what happens.

smp

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 2:09:10 PM8/3/22
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OK.  I changed the ExecStart line of the serial-getty... file back to what it was prior to me mucking around.

Now when I power up the PiDP-8 with a terminal attached, I get:

Raspbian GNU/Linux 10 raspberrypi ttyUSB0

raspberrypi login: 

I can type pidp8i and see it on the screen, but when I hit return, nothing happens and everything appears to be frozen.  After a few more carriage returns that do nothing, I can hit ctrl-c three or four times and get the whole sign-on message and login prompt again.

Trying to type in pidp8i again results in the same freeze-up again.

So, some progress here, but something remains amiss.  Any more ideas?  Thanks in advance!

smp

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 2:28:32 PM8/3/22
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Here's a bit more info:

After I get the sign-on message and the login prompt, if I hit carriage return, I get another login prompt, as I should.  The login freezes if I type any username, and then hit carriage return.

When in that frozen state, it takes four ctrl-c's and then I'll get a new sign-on message and login prompt.

smp

Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 3, 2022, 3:16:22 PM8/3/22
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Could have something to do with the type of terminal emulation so maybe after all you do have to edit the line that starts with ExecStart .. it is probably now using something like "xterm" terminal and I guess you still have vt100 configured on the Windows side...could that be a problem? Others here will know more about this I guess.

E.g. see https://forums.raspberrypi.com/viewtopic.php?t=147370  for reference: you can select the baud rate and the terminal emulation explicitly in the line that starts with ExecStart .

Cheers
HB

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 3:39:31 PM8/3/22
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Thanks, HB.

Yes, that's what I had before:  ExecStart=-/sbin/agetty ttyUSB0 9600 vt100

This is getting tedious.  Thanks anyway for all your attempts to help.

smp

smp

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Aug 3, 2022, 4:38:53 PM8/3/22
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All, here's something new.  I went back onto the keyboard and HDMI monitor and tried again to edit the serial-getty file, and I found that my USB keyboard is now outputting 'c' when I hit the 'e' key, so I was not able to get the editing done.  I'm going to give up on this for now.  I am having a hard time discriminating 'c' from 'e' on the 15 inch HDMI monitor with the tiny writing that the RPi puts up on it.  If my USB keyboard is flakey, that may part of why I'm having a hard time, and I certainly could have had mistakes in my previous editing that caused the serial I/O not to operate properly.  I don't know if I have another USB keyboard, but if not, I'm probably done with this.  I'm not going to start buying more bits to try and make this go.

BAH!!!

Many thanks to you all who have tried to help me out.

smp

Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 4, 2022, 10:20:03 AM8/4/22
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It's all so much easier via SSH and Ethernet network compared to USB<->serial<->USB .

HB

smp

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Aug 4, 2022, 2:32:39 PM8/4/22
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I'm sure that you are right.

When I have the old original software chip installed, the system appears on my wireless network as 'pidp8'.  I can still SSH into that system (I tried it yesterday) and I can communicate between the system and the terminal via USB cable.

When I have the new software chip installed, I cannot see the system on my network.  Not via wireless, nor via plugging in an ethernet cable from the system to the wireless router.

What should I do now?

smp

smp

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Aug 4, 2022, 3:11:31 PM8/4/22
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I did the suggested 'ifconfig' on the RPi.  Here's a transcription of what was reported (as best as I can):

eth0:   flags=  ...
            ether  b8:27:eb:7b:54:2e  ...
            RX packets 0  ...
            RX errors 0  ...
            TX packets 0  ...
            TX errors 0  ...
Io:        flags=  ...
            inet 127.0.0.1 net mask 255.0.0.0
            inet 6  ...
            loop  ...
            RX packets 0  ...
            RX errors 0  ...
            TX packets 0  ...
            TX errors 0  ...
wlan0: flags=  ...
             ether  00:13:cf:63:01:91  ...
            RX packets 0  ...
            RX errors 0  ...
            TX packets 0  ...
            TX errors 0  ...

I am looking for any advice on where to go and what edits to make to get something going here.

TIA

smp

Clem Cole

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Aug 4, 2022, 3:31:33 PM8/4/22
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On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 2:32 PM smp <stephen.m....@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm sure that you are right.

When I have the old original software chip installed, the system appears on my wireless network as 'pidp8'.  I can still SSH into that system (I tried it yesterday) and I can communicate between the system and the terminal via USB cable.

When I have the new software chip installed, I cannot see the system on my network.  Not via wireless, nor via plugging in an ethernet cable from the system to the wireless router.

What should I do now?
1.) Plug in the ethernet cable from the rtr to the RPI and make sure yoiu see the LED's on the ethernet showing that the cable is correct,
2.) At a shell command prompt type: hostname  ; ifconfig -a

You should get something like:
ccc-pidp11
eth0: flags=4163<UP,BROADCAST,RUNNING,MULTICAST>  mtu 1500
        inet 192.168.50.122  netmask 255.255.255.0  broadcast 192.168.50.255
        inet6 fe80::5ccb:3826:2b1e:6739  prefixlen 64  scopeid 0x20<link>
        ether b8:27:eb:48:e3:1f  txqueuelen 1000  (Ethernet)
        RX packets 80134700  bytes 21265089598 (19.8 GiB)
        RX errors 0  dropped 0  overruns 0  frame 0
        TX packets 409495  bytes 94811087 (90.4 MiB)
        TX errors 0  dropped 0 overruns 0  carrier 0  collisions 0

lo: flags=73<UP,LOOPBACK,RUNNING>  mtu 65536
        inet 127.0.0.1  netmask 255.0.0.0
        inet6 ::1  prefixlen 128  scopeid 0x10<host>
        loop  txqueuelen 1000  (Local Loopback)
        RX packets 12966752200  bytes 1292143010007 (1.1 TiB)
        RX errors 0  dropped 0  overruns 0  frame 0
        TX packets 12966752200  bytes 1292143010007 (1.1 TiB)
        TX errors 0  dropped 0 overruns 0  carrier 0  collisions 0
What is in red will be for your system.
From your PC try: ping XXXX-YOUR-RPI-HOSTNAME.local and then:  ping YOUR-RPI-IPADDRESS

Replacing the red part with you got back.
At that point, you should be able to type: ssh -l pi XXXX-YOUR-RPI-HOSTNAME.local

however, if you do not see the two inet lines, it means you do not have DHCP turned on so type:

cat /etc/network/interfaces

Look for the lines like this, they are either missing are commented out.

auto eth0
allow-hotplug eth0
iface eth0 inet dhcp

smp

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Aug 4, 2022, 3:32:30 PM8/4/22
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I then wet ahead and plugged in the ethernet cable from the RPi to the Wireless router.
Another 'ifconfig' command now shows:

eth0:   flags=  ...
            inet  10.0.1.41
            inet 6  ...some long address...
            ether  b8:27:eb:7b:54:2e  ...
            RX packets  ...some number ...
            RX errors 0  ...
            TX packets  ...some number ...
            TX errors 0  ...

A ping from my computer to 10.0.1.41 shows a continuous stream of 5.xxx or 6.xxx or 7.xxx milliseconds.

An SSH to 10.0.1.41 gets me to the raspberry pi login prompt (after a bunch of complaining from my computer about an unknown host).  And, I am able to login!  I am currently logged into my RPi, and I'm going to try the 'pidp8i" command  ...  success!

OK, folks, now that I am able to connect to my RPi system via SSH when it is plugged into my network with an ethernet cable, what do I need to do to get the wireless working, so I can clean up this mess I have all over my room here?

Again, many thanks for all your attention and support!

smp

Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 4, 2022, 4:50:54 PM8/4/22
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Congratulations. I'm glad all this didn't end in total failure to get something going.

Now for WiFi:

You know, if you happen to have a USB card reader , you could actually put your old SD card "chip" into that, connect it via USB to the Rasp, and then we could tell you how to directly copy the wifi configuration from your old SD-card to the current card. That would reduce the risk of doing something wrong manually. Windows cannot read the filesystem on the SD-card for the Raspi.

Anyway, probably the easiest way is this:

* Take a note of your WiFI "SSID", the identifier of your network. It will be displayed on any device that can log into your network via WiFi like a smart phone etc. You may have picked that name yourself or it's still the default for your router
* Take a note of your WiFI's network password. That's the password you have to specify when you connect devices like smart phones, tablets, etc to your WiFi.
 
* log into the raspi  via SSH
* execute
   sudo raspi-config

you'll see al little ASCII GUI, you can select menu entries with the up and down and left and right cursor keys and enter a menu with RETURN key

* select "System Option" => RETURN
* on the next menu level, select Wireless LAN ==> RETURN
* you are now asked to enter the wireless network identifier that you wrote down at the beginning , then press RETURN
* you are then asked to specify your existing password the WiFi net , then press return
* It might take a few seconds before the GUI is showing the main menu again, be patient.
* go to the "Localisation Options" menu item (press cursor down a few times), then RETURN
* move to the "WLAN country item" , then press RETURN
* Select the country you are in , so for "US" you need to move down almost to the end of the list to mark that item, then press RETURN
* The GUI will display your choice, you press RETURN once more to confirm
* you should be back in the main menu
* press the cursor-*right* or the TAB key twice to highlight the <FINISH> menu item, and press RETURN
* You are asked whether you want to reboot now. Eventually you need to reboot so why not now.

Done!

Give the Raspi some time to re-boot, then you can try to connect via WiFi, but I suggest that you connect again via the ethernet address.

Then you can again do
ifconfig
and it should show you the WiFi adapters IP address on your Raspi under the "wlan0" entry in the list that is displayed by ifconfig.

Next time you log into the Raspi, you can try ssh with this WiFi address.

Does it work?

If not, you can check the configuration data that you gave for typos, it's all stored on teh Raspi in the file

/etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf

sudo nano /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf

can be used to edit the file if you made a mistake and need to change the network name or password. Do ***not*** share the content of that file here because it contains your password.

Cheers
HB


If ythis didn't work, you can still connect via 

smp

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Aug 4, 2022, 5:54:09 PM8/4/22
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Thanks a million, HB!
I can now SSH into 10.0.1.41 on the hardwire Ethernet connection, OR 10.0.1.44 on the WiFi connection.

This officially gets me up and running on the v1021.02.14 software for my PiDP-8, and I can SSH in on either Ethernet or WiFi.

Many thanks go out to all who posted here trying to assist me!  Thanks so much for your perseverance and urging me to keep at it.

smp

Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein

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Aug 5, 2022, 8:36:37 AM8/5/22