picochess 3 with USB DGT e-board

[darryl...@gmail.com]

I've been enjoying version 3 on my DGT Pi with the DGT e-board.  On many occasions, after I make a move or enter the computer's move, the Pi indicates "set pieces," as if I've made an incorrect move.  One time the correction function told me to put a piece on h2, which was definitely incorrect.  Usually it goes away and the game can continue.  I was starting to wonder if my e-board had a flaw.  But, and I don't know if this is a coincidence, I turned off all the coaching functions, and haven't had the problem occur since.  I wonder if there's any connection, as if the coaching voice somehow interferes with the piece detection?

[Randy Reade]

I had an issue with my DGT USB board where I would sometime get pieces detected where there was none. I managed to adjust the sensitivity after contacting DGT support. I would suggest setting the log level to debug in picochess.ini and try to reproduce the issue. Then check the /opt/picochess/logs/picochess.log file to see what picochess thinks is going on in the game. It's a bit of work to understand it but you should be able to follow the moves made on the board. You don't have to complete the game, just set the pieces back to the starting position, shutdown, look at the log and work backwards from the "new game" section.

Or attach it here and we can have a look.

Randy

On Tue., Jun. 29, 2021, 8:02 p.m. darryl...@gmail.com, <darryl...@gmail.com> wrote:

I've been enjoying version 3 on my DGT Pi with the DGT e-board.  On many occasions, after I make a move or enter the computer's move, the Pi indicates "set pieces," as if I've made an incorrect move.  One time the correction function told me to put a piece on h2, which was definitely incorrect.  Usually it goes away and the game can continue.  I was starting to wonder if my e-board had a flaw.  But, and I don't know if this is a coincidence, I turned off all the coaching functions, and haven't had the problem occur since.  I wonder if there's any connection, as if the coaching voice somehow interferes with the piece detection?

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[darryl...@gmail.com]

Randy, thanks for the suggestion.  Actually, I don't know how to do anything with the log on the DGT Pi.  I assume it has to be connected to a PC to do that?  Sorry, I'm not fully aware of Picochess' capabilities in that regard.

[Randy Reade]

The easiest way is to mount the SD card in a Linux pc. Another option is to hook up the DGTPi to your network and use ssh from another pc. You’d need to use some Linux commands to change to the folder that the log is in, then use scp to send the file to your pc to have a look at. Or, hook up an HDMI monitor and USB keyboard to the DGTPi and work on it directly. You would need to have some familiarity with Linux, though.

You can test the board using the Rabbit Plugin in Windows:

http://www.digitalgametechnology.com/index.php/support1/dgt-software/dgt-e-board-chess-8x8

using these instructions:

http://www.digitalgametechnology.com/index.php/support1/repair-manuals/244-adjusting-the-sensitivity-of-individual-squares/file

but the log would let you know (once you understand it) whether it looks like a sensitivity issue.

Note that the ‘set pieces’ could occur if you are perhaps pausing at a square long enough for picochess to think you’ve set the piece down. But that doesn’t appear to be your issue.

Randy

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/picochess/41f2bd33-4465-4b4d-8fb7-52aaeec34662n%40googlegroups.com.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Thanks again.  I'll look into it, but might not be able to do the Linux-related actions.  Also, it's interesting that the "set pieces" messages always only occurs once the computer is out of book.  Strange coincidence?

[Randy Reade]

I haven't looked closely at it in a while, and someone can correct me, but the chess engine isn't actually doing anything until you are out of book, if I recall correctly, unless you are using an engine with its own book (e.g. rodent). As for Linux, it's not as scary as it appears, and is actually very powerful from the command line. And a Google search will show you what commands (and syntax) to use to do something. Well worth learning if using a Raspberry Pi. Good luck.

Randy

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/picochess/e9d64997-c2f6-4f56-9781-1759ee5e6c0fn%40googlegroups.com.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Randy, thanks again for your help.  Unfortunately the DGT documentation is much less helpful.  The user's guide for the rabbit plugin is just about worthless.  I connect the board to a USB port on my Windows 10 laptop, but it doesn't recognize it.  I have no idea what to put for the port name in the connect tab of the driver setup.  COM1 doesn't do anything.  The only option in that pulldown is STOP.  Oh well.

[RandyR]

Darryl, when you run the program, you will need to go to the Connection tab and switch the port until you see the 'green' board displayed. You may have to 're-scan ports' first. then on the Board tab, you should see where it is detecting pieces.

Randy

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Randy, I tried that but it won't recognize the board.  I don't know what to put in the port window - the only option is "STOP".  Rescanning the port does nothing.  Don't worry about it - it's not your job to solve the problem, although I appreciate your efforts.  Thanks again.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

m371, I don't know what you mean by  "Make sure you click on the entry (row) that is displayed by the Rabbit Plug-in. Also, there should be a comport showing up under status."

[Randy Reade]

Hi Darryl,

Maybe you should talk to DGT support. Perhaps that program version and drivers are for an older model of USB board. On my Win 10 laptop, it shows me COM3 and COM4 and detects the board right away.

One other thing, does the issue occur with more than one engine? What about using the Picochess version that comes with the DGTPi (0.9l)? Or maybe a v2.01 image?

Randy

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[darryl...@gmail.com]

I'll look into those things.  It does happen with multiple engines.  I don't recall it happening regularly with the DGT-supplied image, 0.9l.  I did have it happen at one time, but discovered that the board was directly over some metal parts on the table I'm using, but I shifted the board and it went away.  But who knows  - maybe it's that sort of thing again.

[RandyR]

With my DGT board connected, in Device Manager, I can see 'Ports (COM & LPT)' and under that is the port I am connected to, which changes depending on the USB port I am using. If I am not connected, I have to select 'Show Hidden Devices' in the View menu. The settings for the port (Properties/Port Settings) is 9600 baud, 8N1 and Flow Control set to 'None'. Driver provider is FTDI, Driver Date is 2014-08-26 and Version is 2.12.0.0. Maybe you can uninstall/reinstall the driver, then plug in the board and see what you get. I installed both 32- and 64-bit versions of the RabbitPlugin (v2.0.27).

Randy

[darryl...@gmail.com]

I contacted DGT support; we'll see what they say.  Also, I took your advice and uninstalled and installed the RabbitPlugin, both 32 and 64 bit.  I might have found the problem, but have no idea how to fix it.  They installed, but then near the end where it asks what other installations I want, I leave "install FTDI USB driver" selected.  It then displays the message "The requested operation requires elevation."  So I suspect the driver isn't being installed right.  

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Success!  Requiring elevation meant I had to run the installation as administrator, which is odd as I was already logged in as administrator.  So it installed and now the board connects and I can see the board on Rabbit Connect.  I am very indebted to you for your very patient help.  This is a wonderful community of people.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Randy, I did the sensitivity test from DGT that you provided.  It passed that test fine, not seeing any "ghost" pieces.  I don't know if I'll be able to accomplish the Linux testing.  But at any rate, the "set pieces" issue seems to not cause actual problems.  It goes away immediately and the Pi then makes its move.  So whatever it is, it seems to be transitory.  It's possible that since I had the issue of a metal bar in the plastic-surfaced table I'm using, perhaps there's some embedded metal that I can't see.  But again, thanks again for your help.

[RandyR]

It could be interference, but it would be beneficial to compare what the log says to what you believe you are playing during the game. I think if you continue to have the issue, comparing the log will be the only way to confirm what is happening. Also, it should be reproduceable if you play the same moves in the same (board) location. My setup is on a table with 4 iron legs which is OK for me (with a laptop beside it). Linux is easier than you might think. It's definitely worth the effort to learn. Good luck!

Randy

[Dirk]

Hi Darryl,

another thought:

I really think that yes your board might be a little too sensitive for ghost pieces (wghich can be adjusted with the help of the DGT support/tools a little bit I think).

But nevertheless the question is why it more or less also depends on the picochess version or on the running engine or even on a thinking engine or not ("book mode").

I guess that you might have power supply problems with your DGTPI setup.

Do you use the original DGTPI and the original power adapter and does the DGTPI also powers your board via USB?

We had same issues in the german schachcomputerinfo.de forum for people with a PicoChessWeb solution and USB boards (this problem won't occur with Bluetooth boards).

The problem was that the standard power adapter did not provide a voltage high enough for the 7 inch display and the PI and the USB board. After using a power adapter with higher voltage the ghost piece problems went away...

I assume that especially Picochess V3 causes these problems in your case because the tutor and coach engines run in addition to the standard chess engine (evtl. using multiple cores) and especially after the last book move the main engine begins to "think" and uses probably more power.

So maybe the power voltage is unsteady in these cases which might leadsto ghost pieces...

Just an idea...

Dirk

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Dirk, Randy, perhaps I'll look into the Linux log path when I get a chance.  Also, Dirk, this is an original DGT Pi and original power adapter, and the Pi powers the board through USB.  I 'll bet you're on to something there.  Thanks!

[Randy Reade]

Another reason to learn some basic Linux. You can check the Linux logs to see if you are having power issues, specifically "Under-voltage detected!" entries in syslog. I had to replace my DGTPi power supply for this very issue. Good point, Dirk.

Randy

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/picochess/3f837c7a-ab01-4b38-a3b0-25dfe7eb09d0n%40googlegroups.com.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Randy, would it be possible to let me know the specifications for your replacement power supply for the DGT Pi?  I think this sounds like a very plausible explanation for the issue.  (I didn't mention another issue, which is that some of the v3 engines appear to lock up the Pi after leaving the book, which sounds like it would fit the power supply hypothesis as well.)  My original power supply for the DGT Pi is model # SYS1561-1005, Input 100-240v, 1.0 amps max, 50-60 Hz, Output +5v, 2A, Output power 10W max.  Is it more output or output power that's recommended, or simply the same specs but more reliable and stable?  Thanks again to you and Dirk!

[Dirk]

Darryl,

can’t you check the ghost pieces issue now by using a separate power supply for the board?

Dirk

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[Randy Reade]

Darryl,

I purchased the official Raspberry Pi 3b+ 3b Power Supply. Here are the specs:

• Official Raspberry Pi 3 Model B power supply, providing stable power even at full loads
• Specifically designed for the Raspberry Pi 3 -- 5.1V / 2.5A power with Micro USB cable, and built-in noise filter
• Input: 100-240V AC 50/60Hz, Wall mount plug with Canada / USA head
• Output: 5.1V, 2.5A (2500 mA), 1.5m black cable, Micro USB
• Short-circuit, over-current and over-voltage protection

It doesn't have an ON/OFF button so I just unplug it after the RPi shuts down.

Randy

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/picochess/fe4e9334-9fd1-4823-8d5b-a80fe49bca70n%40googlegroups.com.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Thanks - I will look into obtaining that and trying it.  I'll bet that resolves the issues.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

I believe the DGT Pi uses a Raspberry Pi 3, if I'm not mistaken.  On Amazon I see several power supplies for that model.  I'll get one as close to your specs as I can.  I should have it in a few days and will give it a try!  Thanks again.

[Randy Reade]

Yes, it's a Raspberry Pi 3b, at least in mine. I would go with the official one.

Randy

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/picochess/2d43e461-09bf-4f44-b9a3-0c2486f13fcbn%40googlegroups.com.

[darryl...@gmail.com]

Randy, Dirk - I received a new power supply today - 5v and 2.5 amps output, and after one game it's looking good.  No occurrences of "set pieces."  The game was with StockfishNN, 10 sec/move, so surely it was pulling some power.  Thanks to you both once again!

[Randy Reade]

Good to hear, Darryl. Fingers crossed that the issue is solved. 🤞

Randy

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/picochess/98c7d2b7-57da-4a0d-a5d0-683013db29edn%40googlegroups.com.

[kalias]

Hey guys, I have my 3b+ pi arriving on Monday. Do we have an updated set of install instructions for picochess 3?

Kalias

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[RandyR]

Kalias, it's best to start a new thread if not on-topic.

Here is a link to pre-made images of Dirk's PicoChess v3 if you want to get up and running quickly. Read the text file(s) within the .7z archives for more info.

If you are adventurous and want to create your own from scratch using the latest RPiOS image (or a different OS) you can use info from Dirk's Github site and the original manual install instructions, but probably easiest to install the required dependencies (Linux and Python ones) and just copy over the /opt/picochess folder from my image to your /opt folder.

Randy

[kalias]

Sorry, my mistake. Thank you for the information, I will give it a try.

Kalias

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