[PIC] PICKit3 Device Compatibility list?
James Newton
the options, but I'll be darned if I can find a list of the devices
compatible for programming or for debugging with the PICKit 3. Specifically,
I want to find out which uC's are supported for ICD and which require an
adapter.
The ultimate goal is to find a good range of uC that can all be debugged in
circuit with the cheapest possible setup and are pin compatible so one kit
board can be populated with a uC cost and code space appropriate for the
many different jobs the board can support. E.g. a very low end uC can
replace a basic 555 pulse generator for testing stepper motors with switches
for "faster", "slower", "start/stop", and "axis/dir" where a much higher end
uC would be needed with the same switches to support multi-axis,
multi-waypoint, position programming with speed ramping and position change
triggering. In that later case the same buttons would be "axis/dir",
"step/ramp", "save/next", and "prog/run" or more likely, setup from a PC.
The kit board will support a range of activities including whatever you
might imagine could be done with a small LCD panel, switches, low resolution
analog inputs (temp, voltage, high side current, etc...), serial/USB/RF io
to a PC (possible opto-isolation), pulse generation and measurement, stepper
driver breakout, etc... It will replace 3 different PCB's I currently sell
and add a number of new possibilities at the same time.
One of those possibilities is to sell it as an educational kit for use with
the PICKit or other low cost debugger, and for that, I need to know which
chips can be supported by the debugger at the lowest possible cost. And so I
need to know which are supported without an adapter, and that... I can't
seem to find.
---
James Newton
1-970-462-7764
mailto:james...@massmind.org
http://www.massmind.org/member/JMN-EFP-786
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Richard Seriani
James,
While not really a definitive list, do the tables in the Device and Feature
Support section of the user's guide help provide enough info for you to get
started?
http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/PICkit_3_User_Guide_51795A.pdf
Richard
Spehro Pefhany
>I've spent hours now pouring over the Microchip.com site and looking at all
>the options, but I'll be darned if I can find a list of the devices
>compatible for programming or for debugging with the PICKit 3. Specifically,
>I want to find out which uC's are supported for ICD and which require an
>adapter.
Hi, James:-
It's not a list per se, but if you open up MPLAB and go
Configure->Select Device
and then click on the Device drop-down box, you can mouse scroll wheel through
the entire list of products and the "LEDs" will indicate support from each
*programmer* and each *debugger*, including the PICKit 3 in both roles.
There's also a section there for the header requirements.
>Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
sp...@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com
Dwayne Reid
fire up MPLAB and select different PICs - MPLAB will then tell you if
you need a header board to use with the ICD2 (which should be the
same as using the PK3 for debug).
However, I would like to mention that my current crop of PIC proto
boards are based on relatively small PICs - 8 pin, 14 pin, 20
pin. That is: 12f675, 16f676, 16f677. The cool thing about those
chips is that they are (pin-wise) super-sets of each other. In other
words, you can lay your proto board out with the 20-pin footprint,
then drop in any of the above mentioned PICs (and their close
relatives) and Vss, Vdd, Mclr are all correct. However, all of these
chips require a header board for debug.
FWIW - I use the 14 pin header to debug both 8-pin (12f675) and
14-pin (16f675) parts but you can't (shouldn't) use the 20-pin header
to debug 14 pin parts (port RC problems) or 8-pin parts (comparitor
differences on port RA aka GPIO).
Do be careful with moving from the 8 / 14 pin parts to the 20 pin
parts, though. Microchip messed up big time and changed port RC to
be ST input thresholds instead of TTL thresholds on the currently
available 20 pin parts. That is: Port RC on the 16f676 has TTL
thresholds but on the 16f677 has ST thresholds.
There is are 20 pin parts in the works (PIC16F1828/9) that do have
individually selectable ST / TTL thresholds for port RC but I don't
think that they available yet. I made such a big fuss about the
problems I was running into that I was promised engineering samples
as soon as they were available.
dwayne
--
Dwayne Reid <dwa...@planet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice (780) 487-6397 fax
www.trinity-electronics.com
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
Olin Lathrop
> Port RC ...
Huh?
********************************************************************
Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, http://www.embedinc.com/products
(978) 742-9014. Gold level PIC consultants since 2000.
Dwayne Reid
Datasheet DS40039E
page 2
page 5
page 6
Many more
dwayne
At 04:40 PM 3/26/2010, Olin Lathrop wrote:
>Dwayne Reid wrote:
> > Port RC ...
>
>Huh?
--
Dwayne Reid <dwa...@planet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice (780) 487-6397 fax
www.trinity-electronics.com
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
--
Olin Lathrop
> Sigh.
>
> Datasheet DS40039E
>
> page 2
> page 5
> page 6
>
> Many more
Cmon now, you know looking up a datasheet by the DS number is not easy. I
did look at a sample PIC 16F datasheet and didn't see anything called a
"Port RC". There are of course ports A, B, etc and there are pins RC1, RC2,
etc, but nothing that makes sense as Port RC.
********************************************************************
Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, http://www.embedinc.com/products
(978) 742-9014. Gold level PIC consultants since 2000.
James Newton
but doesn't say if you need an adapter or not.
I guess I can assume that all PIC's that needed an adapter on the PICKit 2
will still need one on the PICKit 3? The PICKit 2's list is easy to find and
completely documented:
http://www.microchip.com/stellent/idcplg?IdcService=SS_GET_PAGE&nodeId=1406&
dDocName=en027813
I guess people can program the chip in circuit with just the PICKit
(assuming I bring out a header) and can buy the adapter and debug it if they
want to for an additional $35... er no... $45 since you need the RJ11 thing
as well.
Dwayne, thanks for pointing out that 8, 14 and 20 pin chips can
interchange... I assume some of the 18 pin chips can as well... very
interesting... now if I can just connect the more commonly used components
to the IO pins that will still be there if a smaller PIC is installed...
ahh.. .more complexity in the design, I just love it.
Dwayne, do you sell your proto boards? I couldn't find such a thing at
trinity...
Is ST versus TTL such a big deal? Other than for the adapter board?
Come to think of it, what exactly do you mean by ST? Schmitt Trigger right?
That would only matter if you were doing tricky things with the port pins...
on what sort of things does that make a difference?
And I assume, since I have a half a brain, that by Port RC you mean all the
pins on port C; Not port A or B, but port C, and not just pin RC1, but ALL
the pins in port C... Good to see some things never change and to know that
I no longer have to worry about them.
---
James Newton
1-970-462-7764
mailto:james...@massmind.org
http://www.massmind.org/member/JMN-EFP-786
--
Xiaofan Chen
> I've spent hours now pouring over the Microchip.com site and looking at all
> the options, but I'll be darned if I can find a list of the devices
> compatible for programming or for debugging with the PICKit 3.
Firstly check here (default install).
C:\Program Files\Microchip\MPLAB IDE\Readmes\Device Support.htm
> Specifically, I want to find out which uC's are supported for ICD and which
> require an adapter.
Then check the debug header specification.
ICD 2, PICkit 2 and PICkit 3 are all similar in this aspect.
http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/51292R.pdf
--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com
Dwayne Reid
>Dwayne, thanks for pointing out that 8, 14 and 20 pin chips can
>interchange... I assume some of the 18 pin chips can as well... very
>interesting... now if I can just connect the more commonly used components
>to the IO pins that will still be there if a smaller PIC is installed...
>ahh.. .more complexity in the design, I just love it.
So far as I know, none of the 18 pin PICs are pin-compatible with the
8/14/20 pin parts.
I can send to you a copy of the layout that I use for the 14 pin
parts. Its pretty useful - pins RA0, 1, 2, 4, 5 and all 6 port RC
pins are brought out to a simple but extremely flexible configuration
area. This area allows each pin to be configured as input or output
with a variety of pull-up and pull-down networks.
Pin RA3 is dedicated for power-up reset on these layouts - I rarely
need all of the pins anyway when I'm prototyping. The block includes
a 78L05 or LP2950A TO-92 regulator with input & output bypass caps
and a J175 FET used for power-up reset (usable only if Vunreg is
above 11Vdc). The pull-up on MCLR is a fairly low value so that Vdd
gets completely drained to 0vdc when power is removed.
The input options for each available pin include: pull-up to Vdd or
Vunreg, pull-down to Gnd plus a separately configurable voltage
divider with optional zener clamp or filter capacitor. Obviously,
there can be a series resistor on the pin if desired.
The output options for each available pin include: series resistor,
TO-92 digital NPN (DTC143ES) open-collector output driver (B-C-E
pinout) with optional pull-up resistor to Vunreg, TO-92 digital PNP
open-collector output driver (E-B-C pinout) with optional pull-down
to GND. You can substitute MOSFETs in place of the transistors
mentioned above but you may have to bend the pins around.
Note that the "digital transistors" I mention above are transistors
with an integrated series resistor on the base plus shunt resistor
between B-E and are intended for use in logic circuits. Rohm, NEC,
others make them.
All of that in an area of 1.5" x 1.2". Its intended to use all
through-hole parts but I've been known to glom SMD resistors and
capacitors down in various places when it was convenient to do so.
Its easier to show it than it is to describe.
I've just block-copied that part of the layout from one of my board
layouts but the smallest I've been able to make it is about
75K. I'll send a copy to James and anyone else who asks for it
rather than dump another unwanted 75K file into everybody's mailbox.
dwayne
--
Dwayne Reid <dwa...@planet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice (780) 487-6397 fax
www.trinity-electronics.com
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
--
