[EE] Desoldering Station
David Duffy (AVD)
I'm looking for recommendations on desoldering stations. I've used hand
held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem to
work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
The intended purpose is replacing through-hole components (ICs, LEDs and
passives) on mainly double sided boards. Our work load is increasing in
this area (fixing other people's boards), so the current solder wick
method is getting old (and expensive) real fast.
I'm quite willing to spend up to $2000 on a unit, but only if it works
well, has a decent lifespan and parts availability. Comments on what's
worked for you as well as what to avoid is welcomed. Thank you.
David...
--
___________________________________________
David Duffy Audio Visual Devices P/L
Unit 8, 10 Hook St, Capalaba 4157 Australia
Ph: +61 7 38235717 Fax: +61 7 38234717
Our Web Site: www.audiovisualdevices.com.au
___________________________________________
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----- Original Message -----
From: "David Duffy (AVD)" <da...@audiovisualdevices.com.au>
To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." <pic...@mit.edu>
Sent: Friday, June 18, 2010 6:42 PM
Subject: [EE] Desoldering Station
> My apologies is this has been discussed recently (I don't recall seeing it).
>
> I'm looking for recommendations on desoldering stations. I've used hand
> held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem to
> work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
>
> The intended purpose is replacing through-hole components (ICs, LEDs and
> passives) on mainly double sided boards. Our work load is increasing in
> this area (fixing other people's boards), so the current solder wick
> method is getting old (and expensive) real fast.
>
> I'm quite willing to spend up to $2000 on a unit, but only if it works
> well, has a decent lifespan and parts availability. Comments on what's
> worked for you as well as what to avoid is welcomed. Thank you.
> David...
I use a Hakko 808 desoldering tool, and have never been happier with any desoldering
tool for through-hole. And they're quite inexpensive.
http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-Desoldering-Kit-808-Gun/dp/B000ARPULW
Regards,
Bruce
te...@rentron.com.
Dwayne Reid
>My apologies is this has been discussed recently (I don't recall seeing it).
>
>I'm looking for recommendations on desoldering stations. I've used hand
>held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem to
>work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
We mostly use two types of de-soldering station here: homemade units
based on Weller DS100 parts and Metcal MX-500DS.
The homemade Weller units are OLD - I built them back in the
'80s. They each use a small Thomas 2-cylinder diaphragm vacuum pump
with timer and are packaged to be portable - the whole unit fits in a
metal box about 10" x 12" x 6". Although I built them with the
Weller DS100 iron holder (which holds both the de-soldering iron as
well a Weller soldering iron, the Weller soldering irons don't get
used much these days. We use Metcal stations for most of our soldering.
But the Weller de-soldering irons work REALLY well. Most of that is
because of the excellent vacuum generated by the Thomas pump and the
solenoid valve in the station body.
In use, one steps on the foot-switch momentarily to start the pump,
which remains running for about 30 seconds after the last step on the
switch. Then let go of the switch and put the iron tip over the lead
to be de-soldered. Move the iron around in a circle while
maintaining VERY little pressure on the board. You don't want to
damage the PCB pad and trace. When you see / feel that the component
lead is now free (the solder is molten all the way through the
plated-through hole), step on the foot-switch again. The pump has
been running all this time but now the solenoid in the base of the
iron-holder snaps opens and the solder is removed from the joint.
I have found that these homemade units work much better than the
original Weller DS100 station, which use a Venturi-style vacuum
generator. I attribute their excellent performance to the very good
vacuum generated by the Thomas pump and the really-quick vacuum
rise-time that the solenoid gives to the system. Its FAST - from
zero to about 25" Hg in a few (very few) milliseconds. The solder is
completely removed before it has a chance to cool from the air-flow.
We also use Metcal MX-500DS units. I have real mixed feelings about
these units. One one hand, the heater in the Metcal de-soldering tip
is the best I've ever seen. They will melt the solder on multi-layer
PC boards with solid planes - stuff the Weller iron can't ever hope
to touch. But: they use a Venturi-type vacuum generator that pretty
close to being useless. The Venturi system is a pain to keep clean
and even when its working its best, its not very good.
I've got 3 of the Metcal systems and I think that I'm going to
convert them to use a central vacuum system. I suspect that I will
then have the best of both worlds.
I hope to try using the Metcal de-soldering guns with a central
vacuum system sometime over the next couple of months. I suspect
that it will work REALLY well. The mods are easy: just plug the
exhaust port in the Venturi generator (silicone sealant). Then
connect the air-supply hose to your constant vacuum source. I have a
1/2HP 2-cylinder air compressor that was originally designed to be
used for solder-fume extraction. Its designed to run 24/7 for YEARS
with very little maintenance and has really good suction and
flow. Its also fairly quiet (its housed in a relatively sound-proof
metal box that has "Weller" silk-screened in very large letters on
most sides. Yeah - it was designed to be a solder-fume extraction system.
But the homemade Weller DS100 type units are going to stay
operational until I can't get parts anymore - they work so incredibly
well that just I can't justify retiring them. And - Weller parts are
really easy to get hold of.
I've also used de-soldering systems made by Pace, Hakko and
Den-on. The early Pace stuff is just so much rubbish but their more
recent gear is useable. I found that I didn't like the Hakko system
at all but no longer remember why. We've also got a couple of small
hand-held des-oldering units made by the Den-on Instruments
Corp. These actually work quite well but both are currently
broken. FWIW: the guys in the shop call these units DIC suckers <grin>.
I've got an old rework system made by OK International (SMT-2000 ??)
- before they wised up and purchased Metcal. It seems to use mostly
Hakko components and it, too, doesn't work very well. But - I keep
it operational just because we never seem to have enough re-work
stations here. I've been using Hakko parts (tips, heaters) to keep it going.
I have another old (very old) unit called a "Solder Gobbler". I
*think* that its made by Air-Vac. It, too, uses a Venturi vacuum
generator. But: this unit actually works quite well. I don't use it
much, though. Its not very ergonomic and there are a LOT of exposed
surfaces that are melted-solder hot.
Bottom line: the Metcal heating system used in their soldering and
de-soldering irons is second to none. Best I've ever used. But the
Venturi-style vacuum generator in the de-soldering gun isn't very good.
A new MX-500 system with soldering iron and de-soldering gun will
most likely set you back about US $1000 but you can purchase quality
used systems off eBay for about 1/3 of that. Note that you need
compressed air to power the Venturi vacuum generator.
dwayne
--
Dwayne Reid <dwa...@planet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice (780) 487-6397 fax
www.trinity-electronics.com
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
David Duffy (AVD)
> At 06:42 PM 6/18/2010, David Duffy (AVD) wrote:
>
>> My apologies is this has been discussed recently (I don't recall seeing it).
>>
>> I'm looking for recommendations on desoldering stations. I've used hand
>> held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem to
>> work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
>>
>
> We mostly use two types of de-soldering station here: homemade units
> based on Weller DS100 parts and Metcal MX-500DS.
>
Thanks for the detailed info Dwayne.
I did try a hand held Den-on unit and a no-name version some years ago,
but recall they clogged easily and were awkward to use.
One of my guys is into all things mechanical, so could probably come up
with a hybrid solution like you outlined.
David...
--
___________________________________________
David Duffy Audio Visual Devices P/L
Unit 8, 10 Hook St, Capalaba 4157 Australia
Ph: +61 7 38235717 Fax: +61 7 38234717
Our Web Site: www.audiovisualdevices.com.au
___________________________________________
--
RussellMc
> held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem to
> work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
I have a friend who does extensive desoldering of through hole (and
some SMD) parts in a base & mobile maintenance role.
He's had a Denon portable desolderer for about 15 years that has had
extensive use but it finally got to the irrepairable stage.
After looking at what was available he bought the latest version of
the same device - a Denon SC7000Z.
He said that if price had been no object he would probably have still
bought this.
He says that for through hole components it's superb but that for more
than simple SMD parts there are better tools BUT he didn't know about
the "must have" SMD kit until I showed him the attached review. Parts
supply has been good.
The review referenced below likes the TH performance but says it also
works well for SMD so may be the must-have kit is a must-have.
With many boards parts just "fall out" as per the attached user
review. He says that with some modern multilayer boards you need so
much heat that board preheat may be needed BUT feels that most if not
all desolderer's would have the same requirement. [Either way you have
to heat the board with or without using the desolderer.].[An example
would be the main filter capacitors in a PC power supply].
This review
http://www.howardelectronics.com/den-on/cq.html
is highly complimentary. Source discussed there - $395 US plus $42 SMD
tool which the review says is indispensable.
Russell McMahon
Xiaofan Chen
<da...@audiovisualdevices.com.au> wrote:
> I'm looking for recommendations on desoldering stations. I've used hand
> held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem to
> work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
I have only used Hakko 850/851 hot air station. They are quite good.
Hakko has a full range of desoldering/rework station.
http://www.hakko.com/english/products/desoldering.html
Hakko is the Weller in this part of the world.
--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com
David Duffy (AVD)
>> I'm looking for recommendations on desoldering stations. I've used hand
>> held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem to
>> work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
>>
>
> I have a friend who does extensive desoldering of through hole (and
> some SMD) parts in a base & mobile maintenance role.
>
> He's had a Denon portable desolderer for about 15 years that has had
> extensive use but it finally got to the irrepairable stage.
>
> After looking at what was available he bought the latest version of
> the same device - a Denon SC7000Z.
> He said that if price had been no object he would probably have still
> bought this.
>
Thanks for that Russell. The SC7000Z does seem good in that review.
They mention removing caps from multi layer boards, which is one job
that is always a pain. If it can do that, it'll win me over!
I'll have to dig around to see if we still have the original Denon
unit. It was taken out of service quite a few years ago, so I don't
recall if it was due to a fault or if it just never worked well.
Locally, the SC7000Z seems to go for about AUD $719 (incl GST) when you
include the stand and SMD kit. That's well within my budget.
David...
--
___________________________________________
David Duffy Audio Visual Devices P/L
Unit 8, 10 Hook St, Capalaba 4157 Australia
Ph: +61 7 38235717 Fax: +61 7 38234717
Our Web Site: www.audiovisualdevices.com.au
___________________________________________
--
cdb
:: The SC7000Z does seem good in that review
:: I don't recall if it was due to a fault or if it just never worked well.
I'm never sure whether the desoldering tools like the SC7000Z are rip offs
of the Hako design or the Hako under secondary labels.
Be that as it may, the one big fault with this particular model is that it
often manages to suck small solder splashes past the filters, then with a
loud bang, a nice blue green flash out of the grip enclosure and a yelp of
surprise by it's handler, it shorts out the dodgy looking control board.
They don't sell the control board and switch kits for no reason.
Don't bother asking me how I know :)
Personally I like Antex (expensive importing into Australia) and the hot
air/desoldering tool from Hakko FR803B - though the little plastic dongle
is very annoying IMO.
Colin
--
cdb, co...@btech-online.co.uk on 20/06/2010
Web presence: www.btech-online.co.uk
Hosted by: www.1and1.co.uk/?k_id=7988359
Jonathan Hallameyer
I use a WR3000M station at work, along with a dual channel soldering iron
station to have 2 irons, hot tweezers, hot air, and a desoldering
iron ready. I like the 80w irons, the gullwing/horseshoe/drag soldering
tip works well on 0402 components and Ive used it even on up to 10 awg wire
in solder cups. Cant compare it to other stations, but the only thing I'd
change about it is quicker to change tips. Have to unscrew the handle of the
iron to take off a retaining piece, swap tips and screw it back on, not just
pull out, push in like the oki irons, but I guess thats the cost of having
the 80w iron, and its not like you have to unscrew a hot tip so its not that
bad.
--
Jonathan Hallameyer
John Chung
John
--- On Sun, 6/20/10, cdb <co...@btech-online.co.uk> wrote:
> From: cdb <co...@btech-online.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [EE] Desoldering Station
> To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." <pic...@mit.edu>
alan.b...@stfc.ac.uk
> >My apologies is this has been discussed recently (I don't recall
seeing
> it).
> >
> >I'm looking for recommendations on desoldering stations. I've used
> hand
> >held units & an old Weller station before, but they just never seem
to
> >work very well. (poor suction, easily clogged, etc)
>
>
> But the Weller de-soldering irons work REALLY well. Most of that is
> because of the excellent vacuum generated by the Thomas pump and the
> solenoid valve in the station body.
The biggest problem with the Weller units is they must be kept clean.
Allowing the solder to build up in the head unit is fatal, and the
operator must be able to regularly dismantle and clean it. When this is
done they work extremely well.
--
Scanned by iCritical.
Dwayne Reid
> >
> > But the Weller de-soldering irons work REALLY well. Most of that is
> > because of the excellent vacuum generated by the Thomas pump and the
> > solenoid valve in the station body.
>
>The biggest problem with the Weller units is they must be kept clean.
>Allowing the solder to build up in the head unit is fatal, and the
>operator must be able to regularly dismantle and clean it. When this is
>done they work extremely well.
Yeah - I guess . . .
The reason for my reticence is that I've found that ALL of the
de-soldering systems that I've used must be kept clean for them to
work well. This is not limited to just the Weller stations.
But I'm glad that you bring this up - its really important! A dirty
/ clogged de-soldering head or filter isn't going to work well at all.
I keep pounding that into the guys / gals at our shop and they mostly
'get it' by now. Mostly <grin>.
The station at my bench (Weller de-soldering, Metcal soldering)
ALWAYS works well. Part of that is because I'm careful to keep it clean.
dwayne
--
Dwayne Reid <dwa...@planet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice (780) 487-6397 fax
www.trinity-electronics.com
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
--