Re: Steinway V verdigris epidemic.

[Douglas Gregg]

I have now three Vs with severe verdigris this Spring. I saw these
pianos last year and it was mild. Clearly it was a bad winter but this
is a little weird. One is a player that was redone about 10 years ago
and half the hammers are at half mast in the stroke. Gees. Any ideas
why, and suggestions for a cure. I already re-pinned the hammer
flanges on one V and it is working OK though all the other pins are
somewhat affected.. Ballistol and a heat gun took care of the other
pins. I hate working on these pianos. They are fragile and the double
ended flanges are the worst. Anybody else seeing a sudden increase in
verdigris?

Doug Gregg


On 6/22/14, Geoff Sykes <sintoni...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Everything that you can think of has already been checked and tested, and
> the buzz remains. By process of elimination it is decided that the only
> thing left that might be producing the buzz could be the soundboard. But
> you can't see a crack anywhere. How would you test to see if there is an
> invisible crack in a soundboard? Or, for that matter, how would you test
> for a loose rib that also may be causing the buzz?
>
> Well known brand, piano is six years old and in a protected home
> environment.
>
> This buzz is definitely NOT the result of something in the room vibrating.
>
> I'm posting this question to the other Pianotech group as well.
>
> -- Geoff
>

[Euphonious Thumpe]

Doug, Some player guy in Upstate N.Y. told me years ago that he has gotten rid of verdigris (with apparent long-term success) by soaking the parts in naptha, then blasting the partially dissolved gunk out of the centers with an air-compressor blow gun pointed directly into them from the side. (Then soaking and repeating, I'm guessing, because the gunk would get blown into the flange/birdseye vortex.) This got me to wondering if a big metal tube filled with naptha to soak the whole action in (before drying for a month) might pull the stuff out, enough? Or cleaning-grade lacquer thinner? (Which works GREAT to pull the verdigris out of Standard brand player valve parts, if left in it for a week.) This would likely dissolve the gunk better, but also pull some of the dye out of the felts. (A small price to pay, if it precluded an action replacement - not really feasible on a player, anyhow.) Thumpe Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

---

From: Douglas Gregg <class...@gmail.com>;
To: <pian...@googlegroups.com>;
Subject: [pianotech] Re: Steinway V verdigris epidemic.
Sent: Mon, Jun 23, 2014 2:46:44 PM

[Douglas Gregg]

Thanks Thumpe.
Interesting idea to soak the whole action. Maybe get a body bag for
that. It would take a lot of solvent though. I have tried naptha and
Ballistol. Ballistol with heat seems to work the best and does they
job for most pianos but the V model pianos were resistant as the
hammers would not even return to the rest. I have also tried Kroil
which is great for dissolving corrosion. It was similar to Ballistol
but not better. It is also smelly and has to be aired out for a couple
days.

My local player rebuilder has not returned my calls to work on the V
player. I suspect he does not want the job.

Doug Gregg

Doug Gregg

On 6/23/14, 'Euphonious Thumpe' via pianotech
<pian...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
> Doug,<br/> Some player guy in Upstate N.Y. told me years ago that he has

> gotten rid of verdigris (with apparent long-term success) by soaking the
> parts in naptha, then blasting the partially dissolved gunk out of the
> centers with an air-compressor blow gun pointed directly into them from the
> side. (Then soaking and repeating, I'm guessing, because the gunk would get
> blown into the flange/birdseye vortex.) This got me to wondering if a big
> metal tube filled with naptha to soak the whole action in (before drying for
> a month) might pull the stuff out, enough? Or cleaning-grade lacquer
> thinner? (Which works GREAT to pull the verdigris out of Standard brand
> player valve parts, if left in it for a week.) This would likely dissolve
> the gunk better, but also pull some of the dye out of the felts. (A small
> price to pay, if it precluded an action replacement - not really feasible on

> a player, anyhow.) <br/><br/><br/>Thumpe<a
> href="https://overview.mail.yahoo.com?.src=iOS"><br/><br/>Sent from Yahoo
> Mail for iPad</a>

[Euphonious Thumpe]

Cleaning-grade lacquer thinner is pretty cheap. If the action were left in it for a week, I think you'd be amazed at what oozed out, green-wise. (And then the action would have to be aired-out for a month, I'm guessing.) But a sympathetic customer willing to pay for a new action in case something went haywire would also be a good idea. Thumpe

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

---

From: Douglas Gregg <class...@gmail.com>;
To: <pian...@googlegroups.com>;

Subject: Re: [pianotech] Re: Steinway V verdigris epidemic.
Sent: Tue, Jun 24, 2014 4:54:21 PM

[Al Guecia/Allied PianoCraft]

The problem with cleaning grade lacquer thinner is that it contains much more water than high grade thinner. The best solvent to use is Urethan grade MEK.

Al -

High Point, NC

[Joseph Garrett]

Orrrr, as long as we're talking about really nasty, obnoxious chemicals, I would suggest Perc cleaning fluid. It is strictly regulated by the EPA and other such bureaucratic entities, but is somewhat available if you have a customer who is a Dry Cleaner.<G> I have a decent supply of it. I have used it to stave off the inevitable parts replacement. I get about 2-3 years before the verdigris rears it's ugly head again. It is best done outdoors, (fumes factor), and in direct sunlight which activates the stuff. Perc is activated by heat. The green gook pours out of those action centers!

Best,

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: Al Guecia/Allied PianoCraft
Sent: Jun 24, 2014 1:13 PM
To: Pianotech Google
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.

The problem with cleaning grade lacquer thinner is that it contains much more water than high grade thinner. The best solvent to use is Urethan grade MEK.

Al -
High Point, NC

On Jun 24, 2014, at 3:41 PM, 'Euphonious Thumpe' via pianotech wrote:

Cleaning-grade lacquer thinner is pretty cheap. If the action were left in it for a week, I think you'd be amazed at what oozed out, green-wise. (And then the action would have to be aired-out for a month, I'm guessing.) But a sympathetic customer willing to pay for a new action in case something went haywire would also be a good idea.

Thumpe

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

From: Douglas Gregg ;
To: ;
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Re: Steinway V verdigris epidemic.
Sent: Tue, Jun 24, 2014 4:54:21 PM

Thanks Thumpe.
Interesting idea to soak the whole action. Maybe get a body bag for
that. It would take a lot of solvent though. I have tried naptha and
Ballistol. Ballistol with heat seems to work the best and does they
job for most pianos but the V model pianos were resistant as the
hammers would not even return to the rest. I have also tried Kroil
which is great for dissolving corrosion. It was similar to Ballistol
but not better. It is also smelly and has to be aired out for a couple
days.

My local player rebuilder has not returned my calls to work on the V
player. I suspect he does not want the job.

Doug Gregg

Doug Gregg

On 6/23/14, 'Euphonious Thumpe' via pianotech

wrote:
> Doug,

Some player guy in Upstate N.Y. told me years ago that he has

> gotten rid of verdigris (with apparent long-term success) by soaking the
> parts in naptha, then blasting the partially dissolved gunk out of the
> centers with an air-compressor blow gun pointed directly into them from the
> side. (Then soaking and repeating, I'm guessing, because the gunk would get
> blown into the flange/birdseye vortex.) This got me to wondering if a big
> metal tube filled with naptha to soak the whole action in (before drying for
> a month) might pull the stuff out, enough? Or cleaning-grade lacquer
> thinner? (Which works GREAT to pull the verdigris out of Standard brand
> player valve parts, if left in it for a week.) This would likely dissolve
> the gunk better, but also pull some of the dye out of the felts. (A small
> price to pay, if it precluded an action replacement - not really feasible on

> a player, anyhow.)

Thumpe> href="https://overview.mail.yahoo.com?.src=iOS">

Sent from Yahoo
> Mail for iPad

Captain of the Tool Police
Squares R I
gpianoworks.com

[Euphonious Thumpe]

Orrrrrrrr bolt that action into the 1' diameter metal tube, fill it halfway with the verdigrisolvent of choice, lay it horizontally on motorized rollers and let it rotate and slosh the stuff around, while "working" the centers for a day or two. Dump out the stuff, rinse again, dump, put a fan in one end and blow air through the tube for a few more days. Take out, lube, install and regulate. (If it worked well enough, you might even do it mail-order for other techs!)

Thumpe Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

---

From: Joseph Garrett <joega...@earthlink.net>;
To: <pian...@googlegroups.com>;

Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.

Sent: Tue, Jun 24, 2014 8:55:23 PM

[Joseph Garrett]

Wellllllll, my process takes 1/2 day and doesn't need extra days to "fumigate" that sucker. Your choice. Oh, forgot to mention, while dousing with Perc it works better to "work" all of the action parts while the sun shines on the action. I usually douse it while working the action centers, (15 total). Leave to bake in the sun for an hour. Repeat once or twice more or....whatever it takes to realize a free action. No special equipment needed.

Best,

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Euphonious Thumpe' via pianotech
Sent: Jun 24, 2014 3:49 PM
To: "pian...@googlegroups.com"
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.

Orrrrrrrr bolt that action into the 1' diameter metal tube, fill it halfway with the verdigrisolvent of choice, lay it horizontally on motorized rollers and let it rotate and slosh the stuff around, while "working" the centers for a day or two. Dump out the stuff, rinse again, dump, put a fan in one end and blow air through the tube for a few more days. Take out, lube, install and regulate. (If it worked well enough, you might even do it mail-order for other techs!)

Thumpe

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

Captain of the Tool Police
Squares R I
gpianoworks.com

[Euphonious Thumpe]

Buuuuuuuuutttttttttt....... if you twirled it the centers would "work" themselves, AND the agitation for 2 days would help get ALL of the whatever out that caused the verdigris in the first place ...................... methinks. (Plus, it wouldn't be right under our faces: making us old and grumpy.)

Thumpe Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

---

From: Joseph Garrett <joega...@earthlink.net>;

To: <pian...@googlegroups.com>;
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.

Sent: Tue, Jun 24, 2014 11:29:21 PM

[Joseph Garrett]

Thumper,

Nope on all counts.<G> What most do not understand is the gunk that causes verdigris is in the wood as well as the felt. That is why it keeps coming back. Many have claimed that they could get rid of verdigris. I've not seen the evidence to prove it, yet.<G>

Best,

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Euphonious Thumpe' via pianotech
Sent: Jun 24, 2014 4:38 PM
To: "pian...@googlegroups.com"
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.

Buuuuuuuuutttttttttt....... if you twirled it the centers would "work" themselves, AND the agitation for 2 days would help get ALL of the whatever out that caused the verdigris in the first place ...................... methinks. (Plus, it wouldn't be right under our faces: making us old and grumpy.)

Thumpe

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

Captain of the Tool Police
Squares R I
gpianoworks.com

[Douglas Gregg]

Nice ideas. The rotisserie sounds like a lot of work though, Thumpe.
Perc sounds interesting. Nasty stuff though. I will talk to my
friendly dry cleaner owner.
Thanks Joe.



On 6/24/14, 'Euphonious Thumpe' via pianotech

<pian...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
> Buuuuuuuuutttttttttt....... if you twirled it the centers would "work"
> themselves, AND the agitation for 2 days would help get ALL of the whatever
> out that caused the verdigris in the first place ......................
> methinks. (Plus, it wouldn't be right under our faces: making us old and

> grumpy.)<br/><br/>Thumpe <a
> href="https://overview.mail.yahoo.com?.src=iOS"><br/><br/>Sent from Yahoo
> Mail for iPad</a>

[Joseph Garrett]

Doug,
Exercise extreme caution and discretion. Most Dry Cleaners are really paranoid about the EPA, because they get unexpected inspections and have more than likely been ticketed at least once for letting that stuff loose in their establishment and/or the atmosphere. It's like Silicone, it goes everywhere!<G> At least that's been my experience. A gallon will be sufficient for several years of gunk washing. Store it in your fire proof Paint Locker. (Of course every technician has such a thing.<G>) Use a first rate Fumes Mask, etc.

Best,
Joe


-----Original Message-----
>From: Douglas Gregg <class...@gmail.com>
>Sent: Jun 24, 2014 5:52 PM
>To: pian...@googlegroups.com
>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.
>

[Douglas Gregg]

Joe,
I agree it is in the wood. My brother-in-law who worked in the
Steinway factory said the problem was caused by the great idea to soak
the action parts in mineral oil to exclude moisture and make them more
stable during changes in humidity. Good idea but the mineral oil was
not highly purified and had some sulfur residue that eventually gets
into the felt and corrodes the nickel bronze pins. So the idea of
soaking the whole action is a good one as it extracts the mineral oil.
Joe, how long do you soak the centers with Perc. Is it by just
dripping it on in the sunlight just over the centers or spraying all
of the wood too and for how long?

Doug Gregg

[Joseph Garrett]

I use a plastic oiler, (like #191A, 4 oz., in the Schaff Catalogue, page 47-new catalogue), with a spout and just douse everything. Start at one end and work your way down. By the time you get to the other end it's time to douse everything again. I may do that 3-4-5 times and then let it "bake" in the sun. Come back an hour or so later and repeat. After the first dousing you will notice freer action than at first pass. It just gets to a point where everything seems to work just fine. I douse it one more time just to be sure. Let it set over night and check in the morning. Usually that will be all it takes. However, if the action is really locked up, (and I think this is due to total inactivity of the piano.), I some times have had to do it for a second day of dousing. There have been times where it just didn't do the job. At that point I've just told the client it's time to bite the bullet. Because it's a "Steinway", (said with reverence and awe.<G>), it is cost effective imo. (Unless the piano is a basket case and should be taken out back and blown up with some C4.<G>
Best,
Joe
P.S.
Make sure you have a good weather report! DAMHIK!<G>

-----Original Message-----
>From: Douglas Gregg <class...@gmail.com>

[AMari...@aol.com]

once upon a time, I watched in awe,, as a tech at Duffy Player Piano in Palisades Park worked on the damper action of a Steinway DuoArt grand,

The levers were barely moving.

 

He took a Benz-O-Matic torch,, moved the flame over the flanges and as if by magic, the verdigris just oozed out.  Dont know how long it lasted, but it freed it enough to finish the piano and install the player.  Very cool!

 

Arthur

[Joseph Garrett]

Yikes! More guts than brains on that one, imo. I can imagine what that did to the wood as well. Also, doubt that it was permanent.

 I still marvel at people's thought that verdigris is some kind of "bug" that can be exterminated and then it's miraculously gone forever! Sheesh! It's just not how it works. It's wood contamination that migrates, (forever!), into the felt which has a chemical reaction with the center pin. Nothing more, nothing less.

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: AMarino711 via pianotech
Sent: Jun 25, 2014 9:24 AM
To: pian...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.

once upon a time, I watched in awe,, as a tech at Duffy Player Piano in
Palisades Park worked on the damper action of a Steinway DuoArt grand,
The levers were barely moving.

He took a Benz-O-Matic torch,, moved the flame over the flanges and as if
by magic, the verdigris just oozed out. Dont know how long it lasted, but
it freed it enough to finish the piano and install the player. Very cool!

Arthur


In a message dated 6/24/2014 9:27:17 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
joega...@earthlink.net writes:

I use a plastic oiler, (like #191A, 4 oz., in the Schaff Catalogue, page
47-new catalogue), with a spout and just douse everything. Start at one end
and work your way down. By the time you get to the other end it's time to
douse everything again. I may do that 3-4-5 times and then let it "bake" in
the sun. Come back an hour or so later and repeat. After the first dousing
you will notice freer action than at first pass. It just gets to a point
where everything seems to work just fine. I douse it one more time just to be
sure. Let it set over night and check in the morning. Usually that will be
all it takes. However, if the action is really locked up, (and I think
this is due to total inactivity of the piano.), I some times have had to do it
for a second day of dousing. There have been times where it just didn't do
the job. At that point I've just told the client it's time to bite the

bullet. Because it's a "Steinway", (said with reverence and awe.), it is

cost effective imo. (Unless the piano is a basket case and should be taken
out back and blown up with some C4.

Best,
Joe
P.S.
Make sure you have a good weather report! DAMHIK!

-----Original Message-----
>From: Douglas Gregg
>Sent: Jun 24, 2014 6:00 PM
>To: pian...@googlegroups.com
>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.
>
>Joe,
>I agree it is in the wood. My brother-in-law who worked in the
>Steinway factory said the problem was caused by the great idea to soak
>the action parts in mineral oil to exclude moisture and make them more
>stable during changes in humidity. Good idea but the mineral oil was
>not highly purified and had some sulfur residue that eventually gets
>into the felt and corrodes the nickel bronze pins. So the idea of
>soaking the whole action is a good one as it extracts the mineral oil.
>Joe, how long do you soak the centers with Perc. Is it by just
>dripping it on in the sunlight just over the centers or spraying all
>of the wood too and for how long?
>
>Doug Gregg
>

>On 6/24/14, Joseph Garrett wrote:
>> Thumper,
>>

>> Nope on all counts. What most do not understand is the gunk that

causes
>> verdigris is in the wood as well as the felt. That is why it keeps
coming
>> back. Many have claimed that they could get rid of verdigris. I've not
seen
>> the evidence to prove it, yet.
>>

>> Best,
>>
>> Joe
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: 'Euphonious Thumpe' via pianotech
>>> Sent: Jun 24, 2014 4:38 PM
>>> To: "pian...@googlegroups.com"
>>> Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.
>>>
>>> Buuuuuuuuutttttttttt....... if you twirled it the centers would "work"
>>> themselves, AND the agitation for 2 days would help get ALL of the
>>> whatever out that caused the verdigris in the first place
>>> ...................... methinks. (Plus, it wouldn't be right under our
>>> faces: making us old and grumpy.)
>>>
>>> Thumpe
>>>
>>> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad
>>
>>
>> Captain of the Tool Police
>> Squares R I
>> gpianoworks.com


Captain of the Tool Police
Squares R I
gpianoworks.com

[Douglas Gregg]

Thanks Joe,
Good description. When do you get two days of sunshine? That must be rare. :-)
For what it is worth, you can buy Perc on e-bay for $30 per liter.

Here is an idea:
Put the action in an action bracket holder and put it in a pig roaster
on low for a day. What do you think. Safer than a propane torch.

I do use a heat gun and see stuff ooze out of the wood as it heats. It
is not just moisture. When I spray it with ballistol first and then
use the heat gun, it cures all but the worst cases. When the hammers
are completely stiff, I change the pins. Put the same size in and it
suddenly works fine. I am not sure for how long. 10 years, 20 perhaps.
But is an ANTIQUE Steinway from the GOLDEN era. got to save it.

[Joseph Garrett]

Doug,
The problem's origin is a vegetable/animal oil added to the felt and possibly even the entire piece of wood. Ballistol, although good for a few things, I do not consider it a viable product for piano actions because it is vegetable based. Both the vegetable and the animal based lubricants degrade considerably, (can you say gummy?), and at a rather rapid rate. When you put the same sort of substance on the pin/bushing/whatever you are simply re constituting it somewhat. Probably enough for the part to now work.
Since I've tried all of that stuff, I know it just comes back with a vengeance in a short time. Where as the Perc is a cleaning solvent, (very strong), that is flushing a goodly amount of the original contaminant out of the part(s).
Whoever is selling Perc on the internet, better hope the EPA doesn't get a whiff, (pun intended<G>), else they'll get some serious fines. Not to mention how are they shipping it? Because it is in an "Explosive Liquid" category, The USPS or UPS or FedX or whatever, all have very strict regulations regarding that.
I'd say you better stock up on the stuff fast before the roof caves in.<G>
Heat alone will only be a very short term fix. I've tried that too.<G> The best you can do is to attempt to flush as much of the contaminate out of the parts. BTW, Pickering, which another, similar cleaning fluid, doesn't work. Nor, do any of the hardware store varieties of "cleaning fluid" work.
As far as longevity, if you can 5-6 years, consider yourself lucky, imo.

[Ron Nossaman]

Consider that before all the juices of gooses, silicone, and Protek
action lubrication options, the trade used mineral oil. To my knowledge
there has never been an instance in which tech applied mineral oil has
cause verdigris, so I very seriously doubt that this is the cause of
verdigris in Steinway actions. More likely (simpler) is tallow or lard,
contaminated with salt, as would also be likely and would account for
both the thick greasy/waxy stuff, and the green corrosion of the brass
pin. Or maybe it's Dapper Dan pomade, Wild Root, or Vitalis.

Ballistol is essentially mineral oil, and has been used in piano actions
around the world for many years successfully, but it's not anything
magic or supernatural. It's mineral oil, Oleic acid, alcohols, and
perfume oils. I've never needed to try it, but it might be delicious,
and is considered to be pretty good stuff by folks that have tried it.

Everybody and his Aunt Marvin has at some time or other been SURE he had
a cure for verdigris. He didn't, and doesn't.

It's amazing to me that no amount of time, trouble, expense, and
repeat trips is prohibitive in trying to save old trash parts. Get a
taxidermist to stuff the thing and display it for eternal adoration in a
glass case in the foyer, like Lenin, and put new and working parts in
the piano. Maybe it will actually produce music then instead of smoke
and stench. I have this vague lingering impression that music was
presumed to be the point of all this. No ivory keys though, sorry.

Ron N

[Joseph Garrett]

When I was a Newbie I was using Mineral Oil and Naphtha for C.P. lube. I ran into a couple of those applications where the mineral oil had become gummy. I quit using it for that reason. It most likely does not cause verdigris. I think you are correct in that regard.
This all started with a tech in N.Y. with a bunches of these pianers with the same symptoms. If I lived that close to the factory and knowing how puffed up NewYawkas get when the S&S name is mentioned, I'd be selling new parts and DRIVING to the factory to get them!<G>
I agree with your other comments as well. Especially the "Lenin" thing.<G>
Joe

-----Original Message-----
>From: Ron Nossaman <rnos...@cox.net>
>Sent: Jun 25, 2014 4:12 PM
>To: pian...@googlegroups.com
>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Steinway V verdigris epidemic.
>
>

[Ron Nossaman]

On 6/25/2014 7:50 PM, Joseph Garrett wrote:
> I agree with your other comments as well. Especially the "Lenin" thing.<G>

Everyone ought to have a preserved body of some sort in the house, as a
conversation piece for guests and to scare Jehovah's Witnesses off the
porch.
Ron N

[Paul McCloud]

The reason they kept Lenin on display was to assure the people that he was, indeed, dead.
These infected parts should be similarly viewed as rigor morticed, irrevocably destined for the scrap heap, in case anybody should even think of trying to revive them. The attempt of revival should be reserved only for those divinely empowered, not for us mere mortals.
I agree, they should be behind glass, or encased in plastic, for all future technicians' inspiration of what not to do.
RIP
Paul McCloud
San Diego

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Garrett" <joega...@earthlink.net>
To: pian...@googlegroups.com

[B Hebert]

30 years ago I worked for a dealer in Hollywood who has a long series of Steinways with verdegris problems.  We repeatedly soaked the actions in quarts of cigarette lighter fluid (naptha) and baked them in the sun endlessly, but in the end the verdegris still gummed everything up. 

The acids (probably natural fatty acids from tallow or vegetable oils) constantly break down into acid and corrodes the brass pins as long as the oils remain in the wood parts.  The only solution I know of, after 40 + years of studying the issue is replacing the parts.

(Oh, if anyone knows who Charlie Crenshaw is they would understand)

Blaine Hebert

[Douglas Gregg]

Joe,
Ballistol is made from some kind of distillate of coal. the process is
not revealed. It is not vegetable. It does not gum up, ever, or the
the guys who use on their guns would not be using it for the last 100
years. That is how long it has been around.

Doug Gregg

On 6/26/14, B Hebert <brhe...@verizon.net> wrote:
> 30 years ago I worked for a dealer in Hollywood who has a long series of
> Steinways with verdegris problems. We repeatedly soaked the actions in
> quarts of cigarette lighter fluid (naptha) and baked them in the sun
> endlessly, but in the end the verdegris still gummed everything up.
>
> The acids (probably natural fatty acids from tallow or vegetable oils)
> constantly break down into acid and corrodes the brass pins as long as the
> oils remain in the wood parts. The only solution I know of, after 40 +
> years of studying the issue is replacing the parts.
>
> (Oh, if anyone knows who Charlie Crenshaw is they would understand)
>
> Blaine Hebert
>
>
> On Wednesday, June 25, 2014 9:24:45 AM UTC-7, Arthur M wrote:
>>
>> once upon a time, I watched in awe,, as a tech at Duffy Player Piano in
>> Palisades Park worked on the damper action of a Steinway DuoArt grand,
>> The levers were barely moving.
>>
>> He took a Benz-O-Matic torch,, moved the flame over the flanges and as if
>>
>> by magic, the verdigris just oozed out. Dont know how long it lasted, but
>>
>> it freed it enough to finish the piano and install the player. Very
>> cool!
>>
>> Arthur
>>
>> In a message dated 6/24/2014 9:27:17 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,