Osm Tactics Against 5311

[Tisham Candella]

Ispent a few hours today testing out some formations and tactics. Almost any variation using the lower or much lower defensive line team instruction ended up sinking my team to a 5-0 defeat or some similarly disastrous scoreline. I can't see any reason to use this option in the current match engine, at least not against a side of any quality. Defenders can't seem to cope with all of that pressure and opposing attackers and attacking midfielders score goals for fun on long shots or goal crease scrambles.

I know a lot of people complain about the ubiquity of higher defensive line gegenpressing tactics among FM users and posters, but I can see why people adopt that approach when the opposite choice yields such dreadful results.

Defensive line - lower or higher (or whichever) - is just one aspect of a tactic, so it's hard to share any specific view without knowing the whole context (the whole tactic, that is). The fact is that lower lines in general (both of defense and/or engagement) can invite more pressure than your players can possibly handle, but it does not automatically mean that a tactic that uses a lower DL/LOE cannot work by default.

a simple answer - no. but u will need the right players to execute a low block. once u overachieve with the team, u will need to adjust back the tactics becoz the AI will start to adjust their mentality also and ur low block will no longer be effective. my experience with the low block: took a team that is expected to finish 13th to 9th place with the 15th lowest wage budget in the league. defensive wise we conceded the 6th least goals in the league.

My experience is that anything under the standard defensive line coupled with an equivalent or lesser line of engagement makes it hard for opposition to break down. The 'downside' I have found is that it also creates far less possession. My theory is that it is because the opposition is allowed more possession before either the attackers or defenders engage. It's not a bad thing and I have used lower defensive lines successfully along with

Personally, I wouldn't use a lower defensive line without a DM but that's just me and not a hard and fast rule by any means. The reason being that if I am using a lower defensive line I am trying to make it hard for the opposition to get into the box so more players in these situations is always helpful. More players help soak up pressure in an area. As always, you need the right players to implement

if u use some high pressing tactics u will more likely to achieve success in FM like what we have seen in real life. the real reason is not bcz the ME but the principles of football itself. Tactics with low block is passive defending ie the success of your tactic depends largely what the opposition is doing. if the opposition do not want to play into your low block the best result u could usually get is a 0-0 draw not considering set pieces. however if u decide to press the opposition high up the pitch there is very little that the opposition could do except trying to lob long balls behind the defence hence it is a very active form of defending and not necessary take into account how they play. u are more likely to find continous success with these types of tactics in the long run. however there are also cons of playing a high line: players that are very good with the ball can break down ur high pressing, high pressing tactics are more intensive hence ur players are more tired and easily injured.

so what is the value of tactics playing with a low block? i will argue that the only time u want to play a low block tactic is when u are huge underdogs and a 0-0 draw is good result for u. other than that there is very little reason to use a low block tactic as a long time tactic bcz the AI will very quickly adjust to it and make ur defensive tactic useless.

also i found it ironic that people here always complain about the lack of central penetration, wingers not able to cross, strikers not able to score etc but do not agree that low block tactics can work. all of these things favour the use of low block tactic when u think about it. so which is true?

and the art of defensive football is seldom discussed just anywhere in football compared to things like tiki taka and gegenpress where a lot of ppl aldy know how to translate it to FM. hence i have seen a few threads where ppl complained about defensive tactics not working when their whole tactical set up including the roles and instructions do not fit what i know of defensive tactics fully. so there's another problem there ppl are just less informed about defensive tactics. defensive tactics are more than just setting a cautious mentality, setting the defensive line low, use some roles that sounds quite defensive and expect it to work.

I think the problem is as follows: setting up defensive low block tactic is much more complex and needs much more understanding about the game then setting up high block high pressing tactic. It can have something to do with the fact that this forum is full of tactics and explanations about high block attacking tactic then low block defensive tactic. The same thing applies for youtube: the big majority of youtube clips is about high pressing attacking tactics. Rashidi, who is regarded by many as a person with most understanding about the game, is pro high press attacking.

but u cannot deny that an attacking tactic is more successful whether IRL or in game due to reasons i have described above. but defensive tactics still has its value and could work. there are threads that discuss about counter attacking tactics in this forum but is so few when compared to threads that discuss about possession football or gegenpress. u sir right here describe the problem perfectly.

Well, the way I see it, Guardiola is right when he says football is ultimately about which side has the better players. If you have better players you will play a low block more effectively just like you will play a high pressing system more effectively. However, I have certainly noticed in the ME that lower blocks don't tend to work quite as well as mid blocks or higher blocks. I've found success by tweaking my tactics into a mid block and playing on the counter against sides that are far superior to mine, lower blocks invite too much pressure for my liking. In comparison to real football where various sides of differing skill level are very tough to break down, it's really a lot easier to do so in FM (even though sometimes it feels like nothing is going in).

Dropping the defensive line is not a "lose now" tactic, but it is inherintely less successful in the game and real life than high pressing, and that to me is logical because winning games whilst giving your opponent 65% possession and frustrating them into messing up is obviously more difficult than having 65% possession in someone elses half.

I sort of think the same but it really depends on where the opposition has their possession. If my team isn't that crash hot at pressing I feel more stable letting the opposition have a high amount of possession in their half. They have to attack sometime and they will have to take more risks to break down a solid low block.

I'd roughly characterise this as a 6-3-1 when defending. Essentially by dropping the lines I gained two players (from three - half a player each from midfield) to provide bodies for the defence to get around.

Here I have eight players dropped back in defence. it is inviting pressure, sure, but I haven't lost any players upfield by someone getting dribbled around. In fact, there is less room to go around as essentially I have roughly 10 players in the defensive area. In the first pic I have roughly two thirds of the pitch for 2-3 players (assuming a winger got skinned) looking after an area of the pitch. This gives the attacking player time, space and options. In the last pic the same defenders are only looking after one third of the pitch thus reducing the amount of time, space and options available.

The reason we don't see successful low block teams is complex (in my opinion). Top teams don't do it as they have the technical players to ping passes around the pitch and the money to buy the best to play a nice, attacking style. Teams lower on the table (i.e. Burnley) are sort of forced into a lower block as they are constantly on the back foot due to their lesser talented players needing to create a solid block with minimal technical work involved for lesser technical players. Also, what is success? For a top team it's a trophy. For a Burnley it's EPL survival. I'd say by their thoughts they have been successful for the past few years by employing the low block.

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