SEAGRIM Mrs Christopher MBE (Jean Esme nee SINCLAIR) 1929-2022

[Richard R]

From the Telegraph of 26 Nov 2022: SEAGRIM Jean Esme (nee Sinclair) died peacefully on 14th Novermber 2022, aged 93, at St Richard’s Hospital, Chichester. Beloved wife of the late Christopher Seagrim, adored mother of Victoria and John and grandmother to Kit, and to Ochre, Ned, Freya and Rufus. Funeral 2pm on Monday 12th December at St Mary’s Church, Pulborough. Donations to Puborough & District Community Care Assoc…..

She was d of Maj-Gen Sir John Alexander SINCLAIR KCMG CB OBE 1897-1977 scion of the THURSO viscounts and Esme Beatrice SOPWITH 1906-83. She m 1961 Christopher Bruce SEAGRIM 1930-2017 sometime head of that gentry family, and had a son and a dau as above.

[dpth...@gmail.com]

This is a good example of why I dislike the misleading way the word "scion" is used here, where it is used to mean nothing more than that the person appears in Burke's Peerage in the article of that name. She is only distantly related to any Viscounts Thurso, being a third cousin to the 1st Viscount Thurso. She was, however, descended from the 1st Sinclair of Ulbster Baronet, who was himself an agnatic descendant, through an illegitimate line, of the 4th Earl of Caithness.

Just my opinion :)


George Sinclair, of Ulbster, d.31 Aug 1770; m. Hon. Janet Sutherland (d.9 Jun 1795), sister of 17th Earl of Sutherland; George descended from an illegitimate son of Hon. William Sinclair, himself son of 4th Earl of Caithness
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Sir John, of Ulbster (10 May 1754-21 Dec 1835), cr Baronet 1786, with remainder, failing his issue male, to the issue male of his daughters by 1st m.; he m.1st 26 Mar 1776 Sarah Maitland (d.15 May 1785); m.2nd 6 Mar 1788 Hon. Diana Jane Elizabeth Macdonald (28 Sep 1769-22 Apr 1845)
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Rev. William (4 Sep 1804-8 Jul 1878); m.1st 28 Dec 1837 Helen Ellice (d.Oct 1842); m.2nd 15 Apr 1846 Sophia Mary Georgiana Tripp (d.22 Jul 1885)
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Ven. John Stewart (15 May 1853-30 Apr 1919); m.9 Aug 1893 Clara Sophia Birchall (d.16 May 1948)
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Sir John Alexander (29 May 1897-22 Mar 1977); m.6 Jul 1927 Esmé Beatrice Sopwith (d.1983)
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Jean Esme (8 Apr 1929-14 Nov 2022); m.6 May 1961 Christopher Bruce Seagrim

[Netty Leistra]

You know I don't fully agree with you. I prefer however that both are mentioned. Many people have Burke's genealogies, so mentioning the article saves a lot of time searching, especially when family names are very common.

[dpth...@gmail.com]

Yes, thanks, Netty. We have of course had this discussion before on the Nobiliana Forum, where people sometimes go even further and say that a person is "Desc." [Descended from] a certain title when they are no such thing. To me, if the information you want to convey is that certain information can be found in a particular article of Burke's Peerage, it just seems simple enough to say "they are included in the Burke's Peerage article on ___".

[Henry W]

This was discussed here in 2020 - https://groups.google.com/g/peerage-news/c/WblL-JpG8ME/m/0V71hqoXBQAJ

As I said then, I usually aim to make clear that a line of descent isn't a direct one if they are more distantly related. Increasingly for any scion, I try to state the holder of the title they most recently descend from. 

Understandably Richard often relies on previous postings of a family as a starting point for the notes he provides.  Older summaries probably aren't as clear as more recent postings about things like this, and we can definitely forgive Richard for occasionally not being super-clear about the status of the scion's descent.