Earl of Arundel

[Turenne]

Do the dukes of Norfolk bear the title Earl of Arundel so long as they own Arundel Castle? What happens if the castle is sold? What, if anything, happens to the baronies of FitzAlan, Clun and Oswaldestre?

Richard L

[Pat]

Given the number of misleading sites that offer titles for sale it is easy for those who don`t understand how the system works to confuse hereditary peerages with feudal titles. Hereditary peerages such as the dukedom of Norfolk and the earldom of Arundel are passed through a family, usually but not exclusively from one male to another. They cannot be sold and they do not depend on the holder of the title owning a particular piece of property. So any hereditary titles the duke of Norfolk holds, including baronies, will pass on his death to son the earl of Arundel.. Feudal titles can be sold but many of the sites where they can be brought mislead the purchaser about what they may or may not call themselves. For instance if say a Peter Smith brought the lordship of the manor of Leyton the correct form of address wouldn`t be Lord Smith of Leyton or Lord Leyton but Mr. Peter Smith, Lord of the Manor of Leyton.

[Turenne]

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 11:09:27 PM UTC+1, Pat wrote:

Given the number of misleading sites that offer titles for sale it is easy for those who don`t understand how the system works to confuse hereditary peerages with feudal titles. Hereditary peerages such as the dukedom of Norfolk and the earldom of Arundel are passed through a family, usually but not exclusively from one male to another. They cannot be sold and they do not depend on the holder of the title owning a particular piece of property. So any hereditary titles the duke of Norfolk holds, including baronies, will pass on his death to son the earl of Arundel.. Feudal titles can be sold but many of the sites where they can be brought mislead the purchaser about what they may or may not call themselves. For instance if say a Peter Smith brought the lordship of the manor of Leyton the correct form of address wouldn`t be Lord Smith of Leyton or Lord Leyton but Mr. Peter Smith, Lord of the Manor of Leyton.

 

I've written a considerable amount over the years on the subject of the peerage and the purchase of fake titles and Lordships of the Manor, and am well aware of all of the correct forms of address. That wasn't my question.

The matter seems to have been tidied up after 1627:

Thomas [Howard], 4th Duke of Norfolk, lost by his attainder in 1572;  by a subsequent Act of Parliament 1627 the barony of Maltravers, with the baronies of FitzAlan, Clun and Oswaldestre, were permanently annexed to the title, dignity, and honour of Earl of Arundel;  the Earldom and estates were settled on himself and the heirs male of his body, with remainder to the heirs of his body, then to his younger half-uncle Lord William Howard and his issue (male and general) in like manner, and finally to "the said Earl and his heirs for ever" (this Act effectively transformed the hitherto Feudal Lordship of Clun and Oswaldestre into a peerage).

RL

[marquess]

Also I believe that this 'regrant' excluded the earls of Effingham from remainder to the dukedom.

[Duke of Earl]

Is there some danger of Arundel Castle being sold?

 

Surely not!

 

Charles

[marquess]

I don't think that it can be sold I heard something once about an act of parliament perhaps someone can elucidate further.

On Friday, October 12, 2012 4:01:58 AM UTC+7, Turenne wrote:

[Hovite]

The Executors of the 16th Duke of Norfolk gave the castle to a charitable trust in July 1976. Therefore the castle does not belong to the Duke of Norfolk or Earl of Arundel. The owner is Arundel Castle Trustees Limited. The Chairman of Arundel Castle Trustees Limited is The Duke of Norfolk. However, the castle is not listed as an asset in the published balance sheet of the company because reliable cost information is not available.