Debrett's 2019--Key Baronetage Changes/Additions--Part 2

[bx...@yahoo.com]

THE FOLLOWING IS A LIST  OF(NON-HEIR) "ADDITIONAL" SONS:

Baring-- son/ha Julian has 2nd son Max Francis (2010)

Bowater (1939)-- Bt's 2nd son Lucien has 2nd son Frederick (2012)

Bradford-- HP's son/heir Edward has 2nd son Christopher Wyndham George (2015)

Coates-- Bt's 2nd son Robert has son Matthew Thomas Stephane (2017)

Corry-- Bt's 3rd son Christopher has son Hugh James Porter (2017)

Eardley-Wilmot-- Bt has 2nd son Blue (2015)

Glyn--son/ha Richard has 2nd son Cosmo Xander Lucian (2013)

Hall (1923)-- Bt has 2nd son Glen Anthony Daniel (1973)

Harrison (1961)-- Bt's 2nd son Tristan has son Ellis John (2017)

Henderson-Stewart-- Bt's 2nd son Nicholas has 2 additional sons, James (2012) and Peter (2014). Bt's 3rd son Andre has twin sons Alexander and Nicholas (2014)

Hoare (1786)--son/ha has 2 more sons from 2nd m. Maxwell David (2012)  and Curtis Leon Alain (2013)

Houstoun-Boswall-- Bt has son from 3rd m., Leo Alford (2017)

Johnson (1818)-- Bt's 2nd son Peter has son Preston Eliot (2012)

Macartney-- HP John has son Charlie Alexander (2013).  He is not in remainder.

Maclure--Bt's 3rd son Graham has 2nd son Andrew John (2011)

Mander-- Bt's 2nd son Benedict has 2 sons: Sebastian Piers (2014) and Otto Emiliano (2016)

Moir-- Bt's 2nd son Alexander has son Charlie Ernest (2018)

Neave-- Bt's 2nd son Julian has son James Ashley Wynn (2016)

Ramsden-- HP Colin's son Richard has 2nd son Tiago (2013)

Ruggles-Brise-- Bt's 2nd son Charles has 2nd son Alfred Evelyn (2016)

Shiffner-- HP John's 2nd son Henry has 2 sons who may or may not be in remainder depending on year of parents' marriage.  They are Arlo John (2011) and Fyfe Alexander (2013).

Smith-Marriott-- Bt's 5th son Paul has 2 sons Perry Francis (2014) and Henry Harry (2017)

Vincent-- son/ha has 2nd son Wilfred Alexander Thomas (2017)

Welch-- son/ha has 2nd son Edward Peter Cullum (2017)

Wheler-- son/ha has 2nd son (not in remainder) Jake Charles (2013).  His brother Andrew has 2 sons not in remainder Robert (2016) and Thomas (2018)

Willink-- HP has 3rd son Oisin Ayan Stephen (2015)

NAMES;

Bruce--son/ha Michael and his brother/next heir Robert have changed last name back to Bruce

Bruce-Gardner-- Bt's name is Edmund Thomas Peter

Butler (1922)-- Bt's 2nd and 3rd sons are Andrew Dale and Nicholas David

Glyn-- Heir to son/ha Richard is son Julius Bodhi Richard

Heathcote (1733)-- Bt's name is Simon Robert Mark

Le Marchant-- Bt's 2nd son's name is Alexander Malcolm Matthew

Lyle-- Bt's 4th and 5th sons are Joshua James and Samuel Joseph

Milbank-- Bt's 2nd son is Alexander Constantine Hart

Pollen-- All sons and grandsons of the Bt carry name of Hungerford as last of their given names.

Verney-- son/ha's son is Arthur William

Younger-- son/ha's last name is Younger-Thieriot

BARONET DOES NOT USE TITLE;

Coats

BARONETCY SITUATIONS:

Campbell (1628)-- Line of succession unclear-- headed for dormancy

Currie-- This one was posted earlier by colinp-- Dormant since 2014

Kirkpatrick--Brother/hp Robin died in 2012.  His son Glen Sydney (1973) is new hp.

McMahon--Brother/hp Shaun died in 2010.  His son Patrick John Westropp (1988) is new hp.

Maxwell-- Heir is kinsman John Hamilton Maxwell (1945).  His son is Alexander Hamilton (1974).

Moon (1887)-- 7th Bt (Humphrey) (1919) is shown as living.  No heir.

Orr-Ewing (1963)-- Confirm son/ha Archie has son/heir Alfred Charles (1999)

Platt-- son/ha Philip has son Jimmy Charles (1993).  Not in remainder.

Poore-- Bt. succeeded ca 2004

Pringle-- Current Bt. is 10th Bt.

Russell (1812)-- 8th Bt. died 2010.  Son Stephen Charles Russell (1949) is 9th Bt.  HP is half-brother Ian Mervyn (1956)

Thomas (1919)--Brother/hp Stephen (1951) died 2018.  New hp is his son Toby James (1988).

Warren-- This is still shown as an "active" baronetcy in DB even though he died in 2006

SONS NOT SHOWN (and here I ask for everyone's help to please clarify):

Dick-Lauder-- In my file, I had the current baronet as having a son (no name or YOB).  DB does not show any son and has HP as his brother Mark Andrew (1951) with son Martin (1976) next.

Elliott-- In my file, I had the current baronet with a son/ha Tristan H.L. (2016).  DB does not show him.  It has the HP as his brother Nicolas Johann Clive (1980) with his son Cosmin Lionel Moja (2014) next.

Montagu-Pollock-- In my file, I had the current baronet with son/ha Felix (2015).  DB does not show him.  It has HP as Jonathan David (1947).  He has 2 sons Thomas George (1983) and Archer William (1986).  Thomas has a son Wilbur George (2014)

I'm really seeking help with these last 3 situations, so if anyone can explain, I'd appreciate it.

In the meantime, that's it regarding the baronets.  On to the peerage!

Brooke

[Henry W]

Thanks for your comprehensive checking and reporting it to the group - it is a very useful list to work from.

Tristan ELLIOTT (born 2016) is listed on the Kershaw analysis available from the SCB website.

Felix MONTAGU-POLLOCK (born 2015) was born out of wedlock I believe.

I have nothing to offer on the DICK-LAUDER baronetcy I'm afraid

[bx...@yahoo.com]

Thanks, Henry, for that information.

Guess Debrett's missed those two births, although if Felix was born out of wedlock, he wouldn't be in the line of succession anyway.

I haven't examined the Peerage volume yet, but the Baronetage volume seemed pretty comprehensive.

Will post Peerage information when I'm done going through it.

Brooke

[marquess]

Looking forward to seeing the Peerage version, as I won't be able to get my hands on a copy of 2019 until next year.

[Henry W]

From which Baronet is John Hamilton Maxwell descended?

[bx...@yahoo.com]

Henry W, John is a great-great-great-great-grandson of the 4th Bt.

Descent is as follows:

4th Bt--Hamilton (yst son)--Alexander--Alexander--Henry--Alexander--JOHN.

Brooke

[colinp]

MONTAGU- POLLOCK - 2019 Debretts records Felix as son of Bt’s sister Sophie - I think this was picked up by Baronetcy Lady on a post last year

[bx...@yahoo.com]

colinp, you're right.

Thanks for the clarification.

Brooke

On Saturday, January 19, 2019 at 2:32:04 PM UTC-5, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[colinp]

I think it's also worth pointing out that in respect of the GLADSTONE baronetcy (1846) the present 8th baronet's brother (Robert Nicolas) and sister (Victoria Frances) and now stated as having being adopted (by the 7th Baronet) - this is not indicated in the previous edition and obviously affects the succession

On Saturday, 19 January 2019 19:32:04 UTC, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[Jelena JS]

2019 m. vasaris 25 d., pirmadienis 23:29:40 UTC+2, colinp rašė:

I think it's also worth pointing out that in respect of the GLADSTONE baronetcy (1846) the present 8th baronet's brother (Robert Nicolas) and sister (Victoria Frances) and now stated as having being adopted (by the 7th Baronet) - this is not indicated in the previous edition and obviously affects the succession

maybe it's a mistake 

[Baronetcy Lady]

Apparently, the Times obit for Sir William (16 Apr 2018) states that they were adopted.  I can't confirm this as I don't have a Times account.  My colleague (who does) is away from the office so can't confirm with him!

[colinp]

Thanks - yes, the Times obit does refer to Robert (Rob) and Victoria (Vicky) as being adopted

On Saturday, 19 January 2019 19:32:04 UTC, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[colinp]

HALL (1923) Baronets - I observe that the present Baronet's second son Glen Anthony Hall b 1973 (who has appeared in the 2019 edition) is unmarried so the prospects for the survival of this baronetcy are not greatly improved.

On Saturday, 19 January 2019 19:32:04 UTC, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[colinp]

IMBERT-TERRY - given he and his elder brother are the only heirs to this baronetcy it is worth mentioning that the baronet's younger son Jack is now married c 2011 to Nadia R Jones

On Saturday, 19 January 2019 19:32:04 UTC, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[colinp]

Baronetcy Situations

Russell (1812) - the 8th Baronet died 3 March 2010 according to probate registry search - listed as Mervyn Arthur Russell

On Saturday, 19 January 2019 19:32:04 UTC, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[Henry W]

The future situation for this baronetcy is a little unclear to me.  The Kershaw analysis lists this title as A 1956 (to dormancy).

There is a clear heir presumptive: the half brother of the current baronet - Ian Mervyn Russell (born 1956), he appears unm. in the sources I have access to (any change in DB 2019?).  The next heir is clear to me as Christopher Russell (born 1937), half-uncle of the current baronet, m. twice but no issue.

After this is where I think there is a break in the undisputed line. There appear to be plenty of collaterals who are descendants of the third and fourth sons of the 1st Baronet, some (many) of whom are resident in Australia/New Zealand. The most senior of these lines would appear to be headed by Whitworth Athol RUSSELL (born 1918), or if he has died, his eldest son Anthony Whitworth RUSSELL (born 1951), m. with 1 son (born 1979) and 2 daus.   The fact that Kershaw breaks at 1956 suggests that there may be a problem with the details of this branch, because otherwise 1979 would be the listed date (at worst)

[David Gabriel]

Whitworth Athol RUSSELL b. 1918 died in 2015.https://m.legacy.com/obituaries/nzherald-nz/obituary.aspx?n=whitworth-athol-russell&pid=176410027&referrer=0&preview=True

[colinp]

RUSSELL (1812) - Henry, Debretts 2019 lists Ian Mervyn Russell, the hp, as unmarried.  As you say, there are plenty of known descendants of the 4th and 5th sons of the 1st Baronet.  There may however be (unknown) descendants of the 3rd son Francis Whitworth Russell.  His great-grandson, also Francis Whitworth (b 1888 m 1919 Elizabeth Frances Shelton) is stated to have been "last heard of in Canada".  So any descendants of the 4th son, in order to succeed, would have to show the male line of the 3rd son had become extinct.

On Saturday, 19 January 2019 19:32:04 UTC, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[colinp]

SHIFFNER - does anyone have a date of the marriage between Henry Charles Alexander Shiffner b 1975 and Gemma Jane Pritchett?

On Saturday, 19 January 2019 19:32:04 UTC, bx...@yahoo.com wrote:

[colinp]

IMBERT-TERRY Baronets

From post 23 March 2019 above -

IMBERT-TERRY - given he and his elder brother are the only heirs to this baronetcy it is worth mentioning that the baronet's younger son Jack is now married c 2011 to Nadia R Jones

It appears they have a dau Mya L b regd Q3/2014 Swindon