Mr J.M. Bates and Miss R.T.J. de Stacpoole

[Turenne]

Mr J.M. Bates and Miss R.T.J. de Stacpoole

The engagement is announced between Jonathon, younger son of Commander
and Mrs Michael Bates, Milland, West Sussex, and Rosanagh, only
daughter of Mr and Mrs David de Stacpoole, Westgate, Burnham Market,
Norfolk.

I assume that David de Stacpoole is the son of the 6th Duc de
Stackpoole, a Papal title conferred in 1831.

RL

[marquess]

If that is the case Turenne, isn't the younger son even of a papal
duke-- referred to as a count? Never seem to have quite mastered the
courtesy titles for papal titles.

[Richard R]

Rosanagh (b 1983) is the dau of David Henry Oliver DE STACPOOLE (b
1951), 2nd son of the 6th Duke DE STACPOOLE (b 1917) and Dorothy Anne
(b 1925) dau of Richard Edmund Antony DEASE (1897-ka1940), scion of
that Irish gentry family (afterwards BLAND) of co Leix, and Dorothy
Wigley Alex (dau of Col Edward BELL CMG (1866-1937) of Lodge Park,
Northleach, Glos and Dorothy, d of Capt W HARTOPP). D H O de Stacpoole
(bride's father) m 1982 (reg Q3 Bishop Stortford) Venetia Jane M (b
1958 reg September, Marylebone) dau of Michael BRATBY and Vera Joyce
BURDEN.

David de Stacpoole's Times engagement notice (18 May 1982, page 16)
refers to him as 'Capt David de Stacpoole, son of the Duke and
Duchesse [sic] de Stacpoole...', from which it would appear David
doesn't use a courtesy style as the son of a foreign title holder.

> > RL- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Turenne]

On Jan 7, 1:42 pm, Richard R <r_rut...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Rosanagh (b 1983) is the dau of David Henry Oliver DE STACPOOLE (b
> 1951), 2nd son of the 6th Duke DE STACPOOLE (b 1917) and Dorothy Anne
> (b 1925) dau of Richard Edmund Antony DEASE (1897-ka1940), scion of
> that Irish gentry family (afterwards BLAND) of co Leix, and Dorothy
> Wigley Alex (dau of Col Edward BELL CMG (1866-1937) of Lodge Park,
> Northleach, Glos and Dorothy, d of Capt W HARTOPP). D H O de Stacpoole
> (bride's father) m 1982 (reg Q3 Bishop Stortford) Venetia Jane M (b
> 1958 reg September, Marylebone) dau of Michael BRATBY and Vera Joyce
> BURDEN.
>
> David de Stacpoole's Times engagement notice (18 May 1982, page 16)
> refers to him as 'Capt David de Stacpoole, son of the Duke and
> Duchesse [sic] de Stacpoole...', from which it would appear David
> doesn't use a courtesy style as the son of a foreign title holder.

Thanks for the info Richard.

>

>
> > If that is the case Turenne, isn't the younger son even of a papal
> > duke-- referred to as a count? Never seem to have quite mastered the
> > courtesy titles for papal titles.

It's a minefield! The eldest son in the case of the de Stackpooles is
a marquis. Any other sons would probably be able to refer to
themselves as 'count', but frankly Papal titles aren't taken that
seriously, so I doubt whether anyone would bother what they called
themselves!

Papal titles are not recognised in the United Kingdom on the ground
that the Pope not being an independent Sovereign has no power to
confer titles and orders. The current Duc de Stackpoole lives in
Ireland.

RL

[Richard R]

Yes, I've gleaned some of my information from Burke's Irish Family
Records, which, published in 1976, is the latest printed reference to
this old Irish gentry family I can find. I note in that book that none
of the children of the 6th Duke [BIFR spelling, and the spelling used
in the Times 1982 engagement notice, but the latter referring to his
wife as the 'Duchesse']. I imagine the Duke had a chance to correct
his entry in the BIFR and possibly decided not show his children as
bearing courtesy styles.