Ancestry of two countesses through illegitimate lines
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Shinjinee
Nov 15, 2012, 3:56:07 AM11/15/12
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Just thought that someone might be interested (certainly Paul Theroff will)
a) Violet, Countess of Stair, grandmother of the present Earl
daughter of Frederick Henry Harford and his wife Florence Parsons (many noble connections there). Frederick Henry Harford was son of
Frederick Paul Harford, himself son of Henry Harford, illegitimate son of the last Lord Baltimore. Frederick Paul's sister Edith Harford was married 2ndly to George Viscount Parker, son of the 6th Earl and father of the 7th Earl of Macclesfield. (no issue from either of her two marriages). So Violet Harford had several noble connections at the time of her marriage to Lord Dalrymple, later 12th Earl of Stair.
b) Margaret Eleanor Wyndham, formerly Countess of St Germans, stepmother at some point of the present Earl
daughter of William Francis George Wyndham, son of Sir (George) Hugh Wyndham, himself son of Charles Wynham MP a yr brother of the 1st Lord Leconfield. Another illegitimate connection there - Charles Wyndham and Leconfield were two of the several children of the 3rd Earl of Egremont who later married their mother Elizabeth Ilive (or Iliffe) but soon parted from her.
3rd Earl -> Charles Wyndham MP -> Sir (George) Hugh Wyndham, diplomat -> William Francis George Wyndham - Margaret Eleanor Wyndham
Incidentally, Margaret's mother and paternal grandmother were also well-connected to the nobility. Her paternal uncle was also a prominent British diplomat.
Margaret married four times - Hugh Wharton Earle, Basil Francis Eyston (whose mother was Maud Earle), the 9th Earl of St Germans, and lastly a Lt Col Walter Medlicott. She died 1967. No issue known (by me). The last marriage is listed in www.thepeerage.com but not in other sources.
Also read up on the amazing marital history of Frances Mary Harford, sister of Henry Harford (mentioned above). Two husbands, one annulment (after two marriages and one elopement), one failed divorce, and last heard of with Lord Wycombe aka Marquess of Lansdowne in 1801. Burke's etc credits her with only one marriage (to the yst brother of the 3rd Earl of Egremont)... descendants survive via her daughter Laura Boultbee and granddaughter who married a Hepburne-Scott. Divorce wasn't as easy those days, as William Wyndham found out in 1801.
For those interested further, please contact me via e-mail.
Shinjinee
a) Violet, Countess of Stair, grandmother of the present Earl
daughter of Frederick Henry Harford and his wife Florence Parsons (many noble connections there). Frederick Henry Harford was son of
Frederick Paul Harford, himself son of Henry Harford, illegitimate son of the last Lord Baltimore. Frederick Paul's sister Edith Harford was married 2ndly to George Viscount Parker, son of the 6th Earl and father of the 7th Earl of Macclesfield. (no issue from either of her two marriages). So Violet Harford had several noble connections at the time of her marriage to Lord Dalrymple, later 12th Earl of Stair.
b) Margaret Eleanor Wyndham, formerly Countess of St Germans, stepmother at some point of the present Earl
daughter of William Francis George Wyndham, son of Sir (George) Hugh Wyndham, himself son of Charles Wynham MP a yr brother of the 1st Lord Leconfield. Another illegitimate connection there - Charles Wyndham and Leconfield were two of the several children of the 3rd Earl of Egremont who later married their mother Elizabeth Ilive (or Iliffe) but soon parted from her.
3rd Earl -> Charles Wyndham MP -> Sir (George) Hugh Wyndham, diplomat -> William Francis George Wyndham - Margaret Eleanor Wyndham
Incidentally, Margaret's mother and paternal grandmother were also well-connected to the nobility. Her paternal uncle was also a prominent British diplomat.
Margaret married four times - Hugh Wharton Earle, Basil Francis Eyston (whose mother was Maud Earle), the 9th Earl of St Germans, and lastly a Lt Col Walter Medlicott. She died 1967. No issue known (by me). The last marriage is listed in www.thepeerage.com but not in other sources.
Also read up on the amazing marital history of Frances Mary Harford, sister of Henry Harford (mentioned above). Two husbands, one annulment (after two marriages and one elopement), one failed divorce, and last heard of with Lord Wycombe aka Marquess of Lansdowne in 1801. Burke's etc credits her with only one marriage (to the yst brother of the 3rd Earl of Egremont)... descendants survive via her daughter Laura Boultbee and granddaughter who married a Hepburne-Scott. Divorce wasn't as easy those days, as William Wyndham found out in 1801.
For those interested further, please contact me via e-mail.
Shinjinee
Paul Theroff
Nov 15, 2012, 8:56:47 AM11/15/12
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This Henry Harford is the one born in 1760, son of the
6th Lord Baltimore by Hester Whelan? I was never able to trace any descendants
of Henry before. Can you say what your sources are and give any more details of
his descendants? Thanks! By the way, I have in my notes that the 6th Lord willed
Maryland to Henry Harford, but that came to nothing, especially since the
revolution occurred.
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Turenne
Nov 15, 2012, 9:19:05 AM11/15/12
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On Thursday, November 15, 2012 1:56:55 PM UTC, PThe...@kc.rr.com wrote:
This Henry Harford is the one born in 1760, son of the 6th Lord Baltimore by Hester Whelan? I was never able to trace any descendants of Henry before. Can you say what your sources are and give any more details of his descendants? Thanks! By the way, I have in my notes that the 6th Lord willed Maryland to Henry Harford, but that came to nothing, especially since the revolution occurred.
Why was Henry given the name 'Harford'?
RL
RL
Harry Merritt
Nov 15, 2012, 9:35:01 AM11/15/12
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Paul Theroff, et al.: Henry Harford descendants include not only earls of Stair, also Baron Langford, Glyn baronets. Older peerage and L.G. books, etc., have bits and pieces of this lineage connecting back to Henry Harford. Harford County in the state of Maryland, USA, is named for Henry.
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Turenne
Nov 15, 2012, 3:16:40 PM11/15/12
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On Thursday, November 15, 2012 2:35:03 PM UTC, Harry wrote:
Paul Theroff, et al.: Henry Harford descendants include not only earls of Stair, also Baron Langford, Glyn baronets. Older peerage and L.G. books, etc., have bits and pieces of this lineage connecting back to Henry Harford. Harford County in the state of Maryland, USA, is named for Henry.
Yes; but why was Henry given the name Harford?
RL
RL
Harry Merritt
Nov 15, 2012, 5:56:50 PM11/15/12
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Good question, and none of my many Maryland history books have an answer. Will explore further.
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Shinjinee
Nov 15, 2012, 11:29:53 PM11/15/12
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Paul Theroff wrote:
This Henry Harford is the one born in 1760, son of the
6th Lord Baltimore by Hester Whelan? I was never able to trace any descendants
of Henry before. Can you say what your sources are and give any more details of
his descendants? Thanks! By the way, I have in my notes that the 6th Lord willed
Maryland to Henry Harford, but that came to nothing, especially since the
revolution occurred.
Unfortunately my stupid browser is showing the post reply for my own message only, so here goes:
1. I have details for Henry Harford's children and descendants compiled from various online sources. There is also an article on the Harford family in Burke's Landed Gentry 1914 edn vol I. I have to finish the genealogy, so will send that to you earlier. I updated some details this morning and sent a draft to Dennis Cunliffe who contacted me by e-mail. (saw that first)
Henry Harford married twice and had issue by both marriages. Violet Harford, Countess of Stair, her aunt Edith Harford, Viscountess Parker (by 2nd marriage, no issue), and another aunt Marion Harford, Mrs Rowley-Conwy (grandmother of the present centenarian Lord Langford) are all descended of the first marriage.
His sister Frances Mary Harford had an interesting marital history; her son by her second (and only legitimate) marriage became 4th Earl of Egremont (nephew of the infamous 3rd Earl of Petworth House, from whom the present Lord Leconfields & Egremont are descended via his illegitimate son), but died childless. A Boultbee granddaughter married into the family of Lord Polwarth.
I'll send the genealogy to you privately once completed.
BTW, did you note the connection of Margaret Eleanor Wyndham (in your Henry VII file as a descendant of the 3rd Earl of Egremont via his third son Charles by Elizabeth Iliffe/Ilive) with her 2nd and 3rd spouses - Basil Francis Eyston and the 9th Earl of St Germans? IIRC both spouses are in your James VI & I files.
Shinjinee
Shinjinee
Paul Theroff
Nov 16, 2012, 9:15:15 AM11/16/12
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Yes, I have added the information now about Margaret
Wyndham. Thanks very much!
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