the survey

[Mariette Vanderzon]

Hi,

 

I can't get past page 2 either.  Later I'll download a different browser and try again.  I'm lazy and using whichever version of explorer came on this laptop. 

Mariette

[Al Robertson]

I can't get past the second page either, and I am using Internet Explorer 8 and Windows XP Service Pack 3, with all the latest updates.  That has got to be one of the most (if not the most) common configurations out there, so if it doesn't work with that, they need to fix the survey so it works properly if they expect people to fill it out.  I am certainly not going to download (and then have to subsequently maintain) a whole different browser just so I can fill out a survey.

 

Al

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[Steve Palincsar]

On Sat, 2010-03-13 at 11:29 -0500, Al Robertson wrote:
> I can't get past the second page either, and I am using Internet
> Explorer 8 and Windows XP Service Pack 3, with all the latest updates.
> That has got to be one of the most (if not the most) common
> configurations out there, so if it doesn't work with that, they need
> to fix the survey so it works properly if they expect people to fill
> it out. I am certainly not going to download (and then have to
> subsequently maintain) a whole different browser just so I can fill
> out a survey.

Have you tried what Joan just said?

[Al Robertson]

I tried to go back and do what Joan suggested but I am now locked out and it
gives me a message that I can only do the survey once. Once you do whatever
portion of it it evidently thinks you completed it even though you didn't.

Al
----- Original Message -----

[Rudi Riet]

If it locks you out, delete the cookie from "kwiksurveys.com" -
that'll let you back in.

r.
www.randomduck.com

[Al Robertson]

It works after you delete all of the kwiksurveys cookies - there were
several of them in there. You have to go into the documents and settings
folder on the local hard drive to find the cookies and then wade through the
long list. Better to sort by date if you know when you tried it. Later in
the survey there are other questions that it makes you answer even if
checking nothing would be a viable answer, and there is no option for none
of the above. Not very well designed. So evidently it's not a browser
issue - they make you answer everything, even making you select "0" for how
many tandem and recumbent bikes you own, when most people don't own those.
It should just assume or default to zero if nothing was checked.

BTW, keeping track of who has completed the survey by setting cookies on the
local computer is certainly not a very secure way of keeping people from
doing it more than once. I thought about checking for cookies to get back
in after I had been locked out, but I thought there is no way they'd make it
that easy. But I was wrong. I guess I can now go back and keep filling out
the survey over and over saying I never use the printed Pedal Patter and to
say just keep it all on-line, and reduce the number of pace categories.
Just kidding. :-)

[Steve Palincsar]

On Sat, 2010-03-13 at 12:45 -0500, Al Robertson wrote:
> It works after you delete all of the kwiksurveys cookies - there were
> several of them in there.

Wonderful!

> You have to go into the documents and settings
> folder on the local hard drive to find the cookies and then wade through the
> long list. Better to sort by date if you know when you tried it. Later in
> the survey there are other questions that it makes you answer even if
> checking nothing would be a viable answer, and there is no option for none
> of the above. Not very well designed.

I quite agree.

> So evidently it's not a browser
> issue - they make you answer everything, even making you select "0" for how
> many tandem and recumbent bikes you own, when most people don't own those.

I can understand the reasoning -- zero is exactly the correct number in
that case -- but I quite agree that the design of many of the questions
leaves much to be desired. Another example of poor survey design would
be 3 as a maximum number of road bikes, with no ">3" choice.

>
> It should just assume or default to zero if nothing was checked.

That would be better than what was chosen.

>
> BTW, keeping track of who has completed the survey by setting cookies on the
> local computer is certainly not a very secure way of keeping people from
> doing it more than once. I thought about checking for cookies to get back
> in after I had been locked out, but I thought there is no way they'd make it
> that easy. But I was wrong. I guess I can now go back and keep filling out
> the survey over and over saying I never use the printed Pedal Patter and to
> say just keep it all on-line, and reduce the number of pace categories.

Cue the mad diabolical cackling...

[Denise Cohen]

You guys,   This survey was designed by a couple of your friends, volunteers who may lack the training to design expert surveys, but nevertheless have the best of intentions and designed a survey with you in mind.  Cut them some slack this time.  They'll gather up the data, learn from their mistakes, and next year, offer up a better survey.  In the meantime, they'll take what feedback they've gathered and use it to make improvements here and there.   Muddle through and take the survey.  You're not riding today, right?  Folks out there care what you think, or they wouldn't have bothered to assemble and post the survey.   Denise   --- On Sat, 3/13/10, Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com> wrote:

From: Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com> Subject: Re: [pedalers] the survey To: "Al Robertson" <al....@verizon.net> Cc: "Pedalers pedalers@googlegroups_com" <peda...@googlegroups.com>

[brinl...@comcast.net]

I refuse to ever fill out surveys of any kind - phew!

[Steve Palincsar]

On Sat, 2010-03-13 at 18:46 +0000, brinl...@comcast.net wrote:
> I refuse to ever fill out surveys of any kind - phew!

I do hope you fill out the one you'll be getting shortly from the Census
Bureau.

[brinl...@comcast.net]

I almost put that in my message that I would however be filling out the census : )

 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Palincsar" <pali...@his.com>
To: brinl...@comcast.net
Cc: "Al Robertson" <al....@verizon.net>, "Pedalers pedalers@googlegroups_com" <peda...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 1:51:39 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [pedalers] the survey

[Carol Linden]

Thank you Denise.  Let me also point out that the survey software itself drives some of these quirks - i.e., requiring that all fields have a response, even if it is zero.  The survey design/questions and its implementation in a particular piece of survey software are two entirely separate issues.  If anyone has constructive suggestions for the survey questions themselves, I'll be happy to track them and try to incorporate in future surveys.  If there are issues with the survey software, as there appear to be, I think we'll just have to muddle through those for now and possibly look at improvements to this software, which by the way was free, or to other software in the future.  Carol
 

---

Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 10:09:57 -0800
From: biker...@yahoo.com

Subject: Re: [pedalers] the survey

To: al....@verizon.net; pali...@his.com
CC: peda...@googlegroups.com

---

Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. Sign up now.

[Mariette Vanderzon]

If you clear your cookies you can start over.

Sent from my iPhone

[Bill Brown]

That sounds vaguely Freudian.

[Mariette Vanderzon]

I confess a to grin as I typed. 

[Neal Molloy]

OK, managed to get all the way thru the survey after clearing cookies and explicitly entering zero for all the bike types I do not own.

Thanks everyone.

- NM

[Mike and Joan Divine]

All this talk of cookies is making me hungry

 

Mike

[Mike and Joan Divine]

I hate them also, but I filled this one out and think it is worth the time.  Feedback in this huge club is needed for the Excom and others to make decisions to make PPTC better and without this, it can’t change.

[Mike and Joan Divine]

The Surgeon General issued a statement that we should vigorously clear our cookies every day.

----- Original Message -----

From: Mariette Vanderzon

To: Al Robertson

Cc: Pedalers pedalers@googlegroups_com

[Deborah Reynolds]

As one of the coordinators, I feel the need to make a plug here as well.  Without ride leaders some of the needed changes can't occur.  Ride leaders are of utmost importance to the club.  We really need to remember this.  For April I was only able to list 3 weekend rides for the VA B list.  That is not good.  As new members consider the club, they look at the ride list.  They don't have established friends to call or e-mail as we all do.  Thankfully other ride classes have rides and typically new members don't start off as B's, although some do.  Please remember that without volunteers, ride leaders specifically, there is no club.
Thanks!
Deb

 

---

From: mikeandj...@erols.com
To: brinl...@comcast.net; al....@verizon.net
CC: peda...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: [pedalers] the survey

Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 12:18:19 -0400

---

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[Mike and Joan Divine]

I agree with that.  I try to lead two rides per month and wish more would take that attitude.  I think many people believe that leading a ride is complicated and has a great deal of responsibility.  While there is some work, I find it relatively easy once you start.  You can be that really hands-on leader (check out the route before the ride, sweep, etc.) or you can just pass out the cues, sign-up sheet, and give a short talk at the start.  How hard can it be, especially for higher class rides (cc and above)?

[Mariette Vanderzon]

Live ride schedule. Live ride schedule ---  um, did I mention a live ride schedule?  

 

Seriously, I have no idea what I am going to be doing the last weekend in April.  I can't even get a handle on this week yet.