P26 mast wiring

[Louis St Pierre]

I need to run new wire for my new steaming light that has a deck light.  Does anyone see a problem with the wire not being put into the conduit that is already in the mast for the anchor light and antenna cable?  I can't imagine the wire tangling with the halyards, but I've also learned that anything is possible in a boat.  I just think it will be a nightmare to try to get the wire into the conduit and  come out at the right spot, along with the other wire in the conduit.  I'll need to run 3 wires to accommodate the ground, steaming light and deck floodlight

[Mike Mayer]

Louis,

Is there already wire in the conduit for the steaming/decklight that you will be replacing?

If so - and this worked for me when I replaced mine - pull off the existing steaming/deck light, Attach( tape)  the new wire to the old at the base of the mast and pull the old wire from the deck light wire hole.

I think I taped a foot length of new wire to the old so it wouldn't slip off but don't make it too thick or both wires may not fit through the hole.

Mike M.

P30 #475

S/V Pharon

On Wednesday, March 23, 2016 1:20 PM, Louis St Pierre <lou...@hotmail.com> wrote:

I need to run new wire for my new steaming light that has a deck light.  Does anyone see a problem with the wire not being put into the conduit that is already in the mast for the anchor light and antenna cable?  I can't imagine the wire tangling with the halyards, but I've also learned that anything is possible in a boat.  I just think it will be a nightmare to try to get the wire into the conduit and  come out at the right spot, along with the other wire in the conduit.  I'll need to run 3 wires to accommodate the ground, steaming light and deck floodlight

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "pearson-boats" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to pearson-boat...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to pearso...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/pearson-boats.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Guy Johnson]

or use the existing wire to pull a piece of line though and the line to pull the wires back into the mast. If you already have a steaming light (which you should) then you only need to add 1 new wire, power for the deck light. 

Guy

---

Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 17:36:29 +0000
From: pearso...@googlegroups.com
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] P26 mast wiring

[Dave Cole]

To increase your chances of success, use some wire pulling compound.   It will allow the wire to slide easily through the conduit.    It dries to a harmless powder afterwards.  

Dave

[brian kulas]

Louis -

I'm re-printing my response to a topic last year where I addressed my
experience with this exact issue. I just searched for it, and found
my post was buried in a mostly un-related topic!
-------------
5/20/15

I have just finished the wiring and re-stepping of the mast on my 1978
P26 - Some observations:

1) It is highly likely the wiring you need is already in the mast.
When I unstepped my mast, we disconnected two sets of wires: they were
for the top light, and the steamer. Tracing them back to the panel,
the steamer was connected to "Spare 1", and the top light was
disconnected (!) but the wire was hanging suspiciously near the "Bow"
switch.

2) One big part of my plans was to install an LED spreader light. I
installed this light on the mast, and fished the necessary wiring
through the mast out the bottom, and terminated them with the same
bullet-style connectors that were already being used on the other
lights I mentioned.

At the boat, my plan was to see if I could run my fish tape through
the existing cable way into the cabin, ultimately to the panel, where
I was then going to figure out what switch to use.

Well, as many on this forum could probably tell you, I was sorely
mistaken in thinking that I could run additional wiring in this way.
However, I noticed a funny thing: when I unwrapped the layers of old
electrical tape from the conduit entering the deck through the mast
foot, I found two additional wires that had been chopped off
relatively close to the conduit.

I went back to the panel, and lo and behold, I FINALLY noticed the
switch that said "SPREADER". My battery was installed, so I switched
the power on, and switched (only) the Spreader switch on. Back up
topsides with my multi-meter, and the two short wires were
energized!!!!!

So... I believe that you have THREE sets of wires in your mast that
are already poised for use as you require. Of course, because you
cannot un-step at this time, things get more complicated.

Do you have lighting fixtures in place now for the toplight and
steamer? My P26 came with "gorgeously antiqued" old Perko fixtures, of
which I could salvage only the steamer.

From your initial description, it sure sounds like you don't but that
seems so unlikely.

TL; DR (for my Reddit friends: article is Too Long; Didn't Read summary)

You probably have three wires in your mast now that were designed for
the purposes that you require. Other posters here have the best advice
as to how to access them.

Good Luck!!
-------------------------

Brian Kulas
P26 - WindWalker
Manitowoc, WI (Beautiful Lake Michigan)

On 3/23/16, Dave Cole <dave...@gmail.com> wrote:
> To increase your chances of success, use some wire pulling compound. It
> will allow the wire to slide easily through the conduit. It dries to a
> harmless powder afterwards.
>
> Dave
>
> On Wed, Mar 23, 2016 at 1:58 PM, Guy Johnson <guy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> or use the existing wire to pull a piece of line though and the line to
>> pull the wires back into the mast. If you already have a steaming light
>> (which you should) then you only need to add 1 new wire, power for the
>> deck
>> light.
>>
>> Guy
>>

>> ------------------------------

>> Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 17:36:29 +0000
>> From: pearso...@googlegroups.com
>> To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: [pearson ] P26 mast wiring
>>
>>
>> Louis,
>> Is there already wire in the conduit for the steaming/decklight that you
>> will be replacing?
>> If so - and this worked for me when I replaced mine - pull off the
>> existing steaming/deck light, Attach( tape) the new wire to the old at
>> the
>> base of the mast and pull the old wire from the deck light wire hole.
>> I think I taped a foot length of new wire to the old so it wouldn't slip
>> off but don't make it too thick or both wires may not fit through the
>> hole.
>>
>>

Thanks,
Brian

[Louis St Pierre]

What I currently have is a missing steaming light fixture and what looks like speaker wire sticking out.  I assume it's a previous owner's work.  What I need to do is to fish a new, 16 gauge 3 conductor cable to replace it.  The cable is about 1/4"wide by about 3/16" thick. I'm well aware that I may be able to use the old wire to pull the new, but what are my chances of pulling a 3 conductor cable through this small conduit successfully?  I don't want to go smaller than 16 gauge, since my books tell me that it is already too small.  I"m going with 14 gauge or bigger in the boat.  I already have the cable clams to bring the new wiring inside rather than try to get it through the mast step.

What I would really like to know is what the hazard would be to leave the 3 conductor cable loose from the steaming light fixture down to the foot of the mast.  I can't imagine how the rope halyards would come to grief with this cable, but stranger things have happened to be sure.

I will be attempting to pull the new through the conduit, but I want to be prepared in the likely event that this will fail.

[Mike Mayer]

You may get some wire slap against the inside of the mast.

Mike M.

--

[Bob Maxwell]

Agree with possibility of wire slap.  If your steaming light is above the spreaders, there's a bolt that goes through the mast at the spreaders.  You could get some chafe there.

Bob

P30 #940

[Dan Pfeiffer]

Replacing the entire mast harness may take less time than trying to snake some new wires from the spreader level?  And if you are using LED lights you can downsize the wire considerably.  Look at this page for some handy info on wire size and voltage drop.  

http://www.bulkwire.com/wireresistance.asp

Voltage drop is less of an issue with modern LED lights.  The circuits are typically made to run at a range of voltages from 9 to 28 or something like that with internal voltage regulation.  So a 10% voltage drop (12v dropped to 10.8) will have no effect on light output.  The LED's run at less than .5A so that means you could run 22ga wire for 100 feet without a problem.  18ga would be good for 500 feet.  You need about 50 feet?  So 18ga would be fine if you use LED.

As to problems running the wires, I would want the wires in a conduit or bundled secured to the internal track to prevent chafe and interference with the halyards and to prevent slapping.  The halyard probably won't come to grief.  The wires could chafe through and cause a short. 

Dan Pfeiffer

[Louis St Pierre]

Dan, are you saying that the whole conduit can come out in a more or less easy way?  I was thinking that this would be the best way to do it.  I was thinking that the whole mast head assembly can come off and I can disconnect the antenna and masthead lights to slip the whole thing out so I can do a proper job of it.

As to LED, my plan is to replace the bulbs eventually, but not this year.  I'm replacing the masthead anchor light with LED this year.

[RICHARD USEN]

I replaced the data cables in my P-30. There were two conduits (PVC) hung in the mast. I had to remove the truck off the mast and then the conduits were accessible. I replaced the VHF and wind instrument cable but not the 12V wiring. The whole job took a few minutes to string the cables and a few hours installing terminals. I taped the data and VHF cables together and used the old wires to pull the new ones in.

 

Dick Usen

T-33 #100

Hopscotch

Boston

--

[George DuBose]

I was wondering how anyone was "removing the conduit" from a mast. My
P26 has no conduit and my P36's conduit is aluminum and welded to the
inside of the mast. Ain't no removin' that...

George DuBose
Paul-Niessen-Strasse 14
D-50969 Cologne, Germany
Mobile: +49.160.481.1234
Skype: georgedubose or call +1.347.284.6443

Video interview on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcOxW65Xe10&feature=youtu.be

Personal website:
http://www.george-dubose.com

Galleries:
www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose
http://www.modernrocksgallery.com/george-dubose-photographer
http://www.houseofroulx.com/collections/george-dubose

Short video of Skylark's vacation:
https://vimeo.com/133183259
Password: SkylarkNY

S/V Skylark
Compagnieshaven
Enkhuizen, NL

[Dan Pfeiffer]

I am saying that fussing with threading a new cable into an existing harness may take as long or longer than pulling and rebuilding the entire thing.  There is not that much to it.  I don't know the nature of your conduit.  They were not standard items on the P26.  If you have one it was done by some previous owner.  No telling how.  The P26 had at least two different masts over the production run.  The later Metalmast spar had a a track inside that would take slugs to secure a wiring harness.  Pearson didn't bother with that and just stuffed some foam in to keep things from slapping.  They also didn't do internal halyards.  Making any of these changes takes some modifications.  All easy enough. 

If I were planning on changing bulbs to LED later I would just do all that now so the harness could be made to accommodate that.  Retrofitting peace meal seems like a lot of extra time and effort.  If you do it all now you can re-build the harness with 18 or 16 ga wire to handle the LED's in place of the 14 or 12 that conventional bulbs would take.    I used 10ga when I did mine 15 years ago.  I had a good supply of it.  I wouldn't bother with that now.  Low power for all the lighting and smaller gauge wiring.   I used a mix of stuff on the P26 when I did it 20 years ago.

http://dan.pfeiffer.net/p26/mastwire.htm

Did internal halyard conversion too:

http://dan.pfeiffer.net/p26/halyards.htm

Pretty easy on the P26 with the MetalMast spar.  Not sure about the older one and not sure what you have on yours. 

Dan Pfeiffer

[Louis St Pierre]

Interesting..... so the conduit inside was done by a PO.  It's rather small, but I did manage to pull through the coax replacing the TV coax that the PO put in..... all very interesting.

The assembly at the top of the mast is held on with a couple of screws on mine. I should only have to disconnect the antenna and anchor light wires to fit through the holes.   Looks like the way to go, and I may do the smaller wiring after all.  My new mast head LED anchor light only draws 0.08 amps!

[Louis St Pierre]

[Louis St Pierre]

Here are pictures of the foot of my mast, and the masthead taken the spring that I bought her.  The bird's nest is no longer there.......

On Wednesday, March 23, 2016 at 1:20:51 PM UTC-4, Louis St Pierre wrote:

[Mike Mayer]

I like the birds nest.

Mike M.

--

[Howell Primary]

the biggest challenge is not tangling as much as chafing from the halyards running up and down and potentially against the wiring.  As noted earlier, light wiring can be used, but that also means light insulation and potential to chafe, rub raw, short and or cut the wiring.

Your call.

Good luck.

Alan

[Bill Robart]

[Bill Robart]

When I bought my Pearson in 1985 the previous owner had already run both the main and jib halyards inside the mast. When the boat was destroyed in hurricane Sandy the mast lights and VHF wires were still going strong. There was nothing separating them from the halyards. Steaming light, Anchor light and VHF wires and the wire halyards had been rubbing together for at least 25 years with no problems.  I do not consider that proof that a conduit is not needed as a conduit would be ideal, BUT, lets be practical, how much money/effort do you spend on a boat that's 40 years old to make things perfect.

If you plan to own the boat for ever then by all means do thing perfectly, but few of us will own a boat that long. As far as I'm concerned the real problem with mast wires is not longevity but how noisy the can be when trying to sleep when the boat is gently rocking. My solution to that problem is not to add a conduit but to install wire ties every few feet with long tails to center the wire in the middle of the mast so they cannot touch the walls of the mast.  That method also makes running wires for mid point appliances much easier and you don't have to worry about installing a conduit and fishing wires now or in the future.

Bill

On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 8:19 PM, Howell Primary <thehow...@gmail.com> wrote: