Bungs

[Robert Franklin]

Some in my teak toe rail and in the teak cap under the winches have fallen out.  They were original, so the factory installed them and it appears little or no glue.

I went on line and the first thing that came up was Wooden Boat. I figured that would be good.  Now my head is swimming.  There must be as many different options as there are people trying to fix the problem.

Anyone with a definitive simple answer?

I read everything from shellac, varnish, epoxy, polyurethane glue.  Now thoroughly confused.

Thanks

--

Robert M. Franklin, Esq.
145 Lagrange Street
Chestnut Hill, MA 02467-3047
617 277 5900 Cell
617 277 5901 Fax
email:  robertm...@gmail.com

[Guy Johnson]

Typically I use the finish material to seal the bungs in place, varnish or epoxy. But I do try to keep the head of the fastener clean when installing bungs. 

It's really a friction fit that holds the bung in place, the finish seals it. 

Guy

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Robert Franklin <robertm...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 9:44 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [pearson ] Bungs

 

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[Rob Bibber]

quick search on Google turns up plenty of options.

 

 

 

https://www.amazon.com/SeaTeak-60150-Plugs-4-Inch-Bag/dp/B0042A3948/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1536847102&sr=8-6&keywords=teak+bungs

 

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Franklin
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 9:44 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [pearson ] Bungs

 

Some in my teak toe rail and in the teak cap under the winches have fallen out.  They were original, so the factory installed them and it appears little or no glue.

--

[Richard Usen]

First of all, there is no simple answer. I always dipped mine in varnish and placed them in the holes. The most important thing is to line up the grain in the bung and the parent wood. This is so the expansion of the woods is as close to the same as possible. But, that’s just me. 

You’ll likely find that the new bung is loose in the hole. Then I use Gorilla glue because it reacts w/ the moisture and expands to fill the hole if the the hole is damp. Gorilla glue is urea-formaldehyde and it was designed to build Mosquito bombers during the war. It is not a water based adhesive but a very sophisticated product. 

[Guy Johnson]

Bob;

you may also have to deal with thinning of the original plank resulting in a shallow hole for the bung. liberal amounts of glue might be the only option in that case. 

Guy

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Richard Usen <richar...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 10:16 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Bungs

 

[Dave Cole]

If you use epoxy or gorilla glue you will likely never get them out again.  

 

I'd use varnish, or whatever finish you use.  Or do you use the teak unfinished ? 

 

You can buy bung cutters to make your own bungs.

Easy to do.   Google "bung cutter".

 

Dave

 

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Franklin
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 9:44 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [pearson ] Bungs

--

[George DuBose]

paint a small amount of epoxy in the hole and insert the bung. Let the epoxy cure, then with a sharp chisel, cut off the standing part of the bung and sand away the epoxy on the toerail or coaming cap. If possible, align the grain of the bung with the grain of the toerail or coaming cap.

it wouldn't take a lot of epoxy...

George

-- 
George DuBose
Wiedstrasse 16
Mobile: +49.160.481.1234
Skype: georgedubose or call +1.347.284.6443

Video interview on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcOxW65Xe10&feature=youtu.be

Personal website:
http://www.george-dubose.com

Galleries:
www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose
http://www.modernrocksgallery.com/george-dubose-photographer
http://www.houseofroulx.com/collections/george-dubose

Short video of Skylark's vacation:
https://vimeo.com/133183259
Password: SkylarkNY

S/V Skylark
Compagnieshaven
Enkhuizen, NL 

[George DuBose]

to remove bungs, split them with a screwdriver or chisel. I wouldn't try to reuse them...

[Jeff Griglack]

I use Titebond waterproof wood glue, and I also split them out when I need to remove them.

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack                  "Blithe Spirit" P-30 #182

|                                  "Uffish Thought" P-365 #269
------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
|               —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------

[Robert Franklin]

George,

I had an interesting accident with my P36 involving a rock ledge in Wood Hole. It seemed to affect the crack where the trailing edge of the keel curves into the bottom of the hull. At first the leak increased, but after tightening the shrouds and easing the hydraulic back stay adjuster, although not done with the leak in mind, the leak coincidentally slowed down.

This problem may not be of interest to the other Pearson members so I'll take it up with you later, off the group.  

You did that repair extensively, so I want to get your ideas about a possible short cut. 

I will probably wait until I haul next week so I have a better look at what happened.

Bob Franklin  

p.s.  I am leaning towards Gorilla glue for the bungs.  Too many choices.

On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 10:58 AM George DuBose <bo...@george-dubose.com> wrote:

[Richard Usen]

My problem w/ old bungs is keeping them from falling out. I have a small carving gouge that I use for removal and never have a problem.

[Guy Johnson]

Before using adhesive to secure the bung I suggest coloring the head of the fastener with a crayon or wax to prevent the glue from filling the head of the fastener. 

I drill out the center of old bungs before splitting them out. Some folks drive a small wood screw into the center of the bung to pop it out. 

Guy

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Richard Usen <richar...@gmail.com>

Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 12:13 PM

To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Bungs

[Guy Johnson]

Bob;

I suggest checking the floors near the aft end of the keel, the may have been cracked or detached by the bump. 

guy

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Robert Franklin <robertm...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:30 AM

To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Bungs

[George DuBose]

I never used Gorilla Glue to set bungs, but I know that one has to wet both bonding surfaces, then the Gorilla Glue bubbles and expands.

I would think that makes more of a mess to deal with than a few drops of West System...

George

[Dan Pfeiffer]

West G flex is great for tiny batches like this. One-to-one mix and you
can do a drop at a time.

However, I think it or gorilla glue are mighty strong for a bung that
you may want to remove in the future. You'll end up going to the next
larger bung each time. I think I would use tight-bond or just the
varnish. Teak is oily and can be hard to glue but in this case that may
be good?

Dan Pfeiffer

>> -------------------------
>> FROM: pearso...@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] ON BEHALF OF Robert Franklin
>> SENT: Thursday, September 13, 2018 9:44 AM
>> TO: pearso...@googlegroups.com
>> SUBJECT: [pearson ] Bungs

>> www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose [1]

> www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose [1]

> http://www.modernrocksgallery.com/george-dubose-photographer
> http://www.houseofroulx.com/collections/george-dubose
>
> Short video of Skylark's vacation:
> https://vimeo.com/133183259
> Password: SkylarkNY
>
> S/V Skylark
> Compagnieshaven
> Enkhuizen, NL
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "pearson-boats" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an email to pearson-boat...@googlegroups.com.
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> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
>

> Links:
> ------
> [1] http://www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose

[Richard Usen]

The beauty of Gorilla Glue is that you dampen the hole w/ water and the bung w/ GG and the glue expands as it sets. It’s a one part glue so there is no mixing other than some water for wetting. You don’t want any glue in the bottom of the hole or it’ll blow the bung out .

[Peter Ogilvie]

I just used gorilla glue on something else and it doesn’t create a big mess because of the need to wet the surface it’s being applied to.  The instructions say only one of the surfaces needs to be wetted.  The excess is way easier to sand off than epoxy.  Still like epoxy for gap filling but it’s not a no mess glue.

[Peter Ogilvie]

I just used gorilla glue on something else and it doesn’t create a big mess because in the need to wet the surface it is supposed to glue.  Instructions say one side only needs to be wetted and it's water after all.  It does bubble up but way easier to sand off than epoxy.  Still prefer epoxy to fill sloppy joints but it's not a

[Richard Usen]

I’ve been using, and removing bungs for most of my life (so far) and never gave them a thought. I used to put a few drops of Varnish on the cap and move them about in it before instilling them. Then I’d chisel off most of the excess and hit them w/ sandpaper. The dust mixed w/ any vanish remaining to hide the crack around the bung. I removed them by chisleing  hole in the center of the old bung and enlarging the hole to clean out the bung hole. Some guys drive a small screw into the bung and jack it out of the hole. Remove a bunch and it becomes second nature.   

[Michael Graham]

Everyone may know this trick, but as I was working with a wooden boat shipwright two weeks ago, he took a #10 woodscrew, cut off the head with a pair of snips, smoothed the cut with a grinder, and then put the screw/now drill bit in a cordless drill and began screwing down into the center of a bung.  when the screw/now drill bit hit the screw head underneath the bung, it popped the bung out beautifully.  Was pretty neat. 

[mailto:pearson-boats@googlegroups.com] ON BEHALF OF Robert Franklin

SENT: Thursday, September 13, 2018 9:44 AM
TO: pearso...@googlegroups.com
SUBJECT: [pearson ] Bungs
Some in my teak toe rail and in the teak cap under the winches have
fallen out.  They were original, so the factory installed them and
it appears little or no glue.
I went on line and the first thing that came up was Wooden Boat. I
figured that would be good.  Now my head is swimming.  There must be
as many different options as there are people trying to fix the
problem.
Anyone with a definitive simple answer?
I read everything from shellac, varnish, epoxy, polyurethane glue.
Now thoroughly confused.
Thanks
--
Robert M. Franklin, Esq.
145 Lagrange Street
Chestnut Hill, MA 02467-3047
617 277 5900 Cell
617 277 5901 Fax
email:  robertm...@gmail.com --
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145 Lagrange Street
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617 277 5900 Cell
617 277 5901 Fax
email:  robertm...@gmail.com --
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Links:
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[1] http://www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose

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[Guy Johnson]

I think the only reason you moisten the bonding surface is to supply the water that polyurethane adhesives need to cure. 

After all unused gorilla glue will cure in the bottle. 

I use a very small spray bottle to lightly mist the parts. 

Guy

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Michael Graham <mgr...@thegrahamlawfirm.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 3:03 PM

To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Bungs

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to pearson-boat...@googlegroups.com.

[Dave Cole]

Unless you live in the desert, or in some other area of low humidity, gorilla glue will suck the moisture right out of the air.

 

I've never had a problem getting it to cure.    The problem I have had is preventing it from curing in the package as you mentioned.

 

True single part Polyurethane paint works the same way.   You can't keep the lid off the can for long or the paint will setup right in the can. 

It also tends to bubble and foam, just like gorilla glue.  Crazy stuff. 

 

Dave

 

 

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Guy Johnson
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 3:45 PM

[Robert Franklin]

Fascinated by the individualization of preferences and techniques.

[mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] ON BEHALF OF Robert Franklin

SENT: Thursday, September 13, 2018 9:44 AM
TO: pearso...@googlegroups.com
SUBJECT: [pearson ] Bungs
Some in my teak toe rail and in the teak cap under the winches have
fallen out.  They were original, so the factory installed them and
it appears little or no glue.
I went on line and the first thing that came up was Wooden Boat. I
figured that would be good.  Now my head is swimming.  There must be
as many different options as there are people trying to fix the
problem.
Anyone with a definitive simple answer?
I read everything from shellac, varnish, epoxy, polyurethane glue.
Now thoroughly confused.
Thanks
--
Robert M. Franklin, Esq.
145 Lagrange Street
Chestnut Hill, MA 02467-3047
617 277 5900 Cell
617 277 5901 Fax
email:  robertm...@gmail.com --
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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--
George DuBose
Wiedstrasse 16
Mobile: +49.160.481.1234
Skype: georgedubose or call +1.347.284.6443
Video interview on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcOxW65Xe10&feature=youtu.be
Personal website:
http://www.george-dubose.com
Galleries:
www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose [1]
http://www.modernrocksgallery.com/george-dubose-photographer
http://www.houseofroulx.com/collections/george-dubose
Short video of Skylark's vacation:
https://vimeo.com/133183259
Password: SkylarkNY
S/V Skylark
Compagnieshaven
Enkhuizen, NL
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Robert M. Franklin, Esq.
145 Lagrange Street
Chestnut Hill, MA 02467-3047
617 277 5900 Cell
617 277 5901 Fax
email:  robertm...@gmail.com --
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--
George DuBose
Wiedstrasse 16
Mobile: +49.160.481.1234
Skype: georgedubose or call +1.347.284.6443
Video interview on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcOxW65Xe10&feature=youtu.be
Personal website:
http://www.george-dubose.com
Galleries:
www.rockpaperphoto.com/george-dubose [1]
http://www.modernrocksgallery.com/george-dubose-photographer
http://www.houseofroulx.com/collections/george-dubose
Short video of Skylark's vacation:
https://vimeo.com/133183259
Password: SkylarkNY
S/V Skylark
Compagnieshaven
Enkhuizen, NL
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[Peter Ogilvie]

Thought I’d posted this before but it doesn’t seem to have gotten through

I use a 1/4” hex head screw, a bit to fit the hex head and my 12v Milwaukee battery powered screw driver.  Put the screw in the center of the plug and screw it in.  If the plug is not thoroughly stuck in place it will draw the plug out as the screw goes in.  If it doesn’t, usually a portion of the plug will come out and you have a starting place to chisel out the remainder.

[Peter Ogilvie]

Thought I’d posted this before but it doesn’t seem to have gotten through

I use a 1/4” hex head screw, a bit to fit the hex head and my 12v Milwaukee battery powered screw driver.  Put the screw in the center of the plug and screw it in.  If the plug is not thoroughly stuck in place it will often draw the plug out as the screw goes in.  If it doesn’t, usually a portion of the plug will come out and you have a place to chisel out the remainder.

[Bill Robart]

One thing that nobody has mentioned is the problem of keeping thin bungs in place. The bungs in both my toe rail and the hand rails had to be less thick than their diameter. To hold the in long term (more than a month or so) I had to use Gorilla Glue. I’d assume that many Pearson’s have the same problem and using varnish or the like may not work for long.

Bill

--

[Richard Usen]

That’s why I suggested Gorilla Glue. Otherwise remove the screw and deepen the hole and reinstall the screw and bung.. 

[Bill Robart]

Dick 

I did deepen the screw holes on a couple of handrail places but the idea of doing that on the toe rails didn't "excite" me at all. Too much work for too little benefit. I even trid putting a dimple on the bottom of a couple of bungs hoping that would hold without using gorilla Glue. No joy! 

My procedure was to wait until the original bungs fell out before doing anything. The toe rail didn't leak and I felt that messing with the good bungs was asking for trouble.  The original toe rail was fine but the original handrails were crap from the day they were installed at the factory. 3/4" stock with custom dimensioned loops. Stupid!  I know of no other maker using such crappy handrails. Had the boat survived "Sandy" I would likely have made some Stainless Steel handrails. Exterior Teak is constant maintenance headache.

Bill

[Richard Usen]

Just be thankful you don’t have a deck full  of loose screws!! The problem w/ GG is that you need the sliver of bung to be glued to the screwhead and GG will expand and eject the sliver. Can’t win for losing. I once built a new mahogany house and deck w/o any screws on a  Luhrs using Airolite (urea formaldehyte and I consider myself pretty experienced. The boat turned out great w/ no glue failures.