Bimini repair / Canvas sewing machine recommendation

[Ian Harrington]

Hi All,

The PO had put a nice bimini on my P35, but in several places the stitching has come undone.

Can anyone recommend a capable sewing machine that can stitch the heavy bimini canvas as well as handle sails as well?  My gf has offered to do the work, provided I supply the needed machinery (i.e. not hand sewn).

Bonus question.  Any thoughts on replacing cleary vinyl sections with either replacement vinyl or acrylic?

Many thanks,

-Ian

[Guy Johnson]

Ian;

I have a pfaff 1222 that I used to sew a new dodger and bimini for Puffin our j10M. 

The important feature in my mind is the walking foot. It's a good machine for Sunbrella and dodgers etc. It's not heavy duty enough for the corners of sails... also the foot only lifts high enough for about 8 layers on Sunbrella. 

the best supported machines are the Sailrite series of machines, they are also somewhat expensive. 

Guy

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From: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Ian Harrington <ian.m.ha...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, February 4, 2022 12:17 PM
To: pearson-boats <pearso...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [pearson ] Bimini repair / Canvas sewing machine recommendation

 

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[Guy Johnson]

Forgot to recommend sailrite videos. 

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From: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Ian Harrington <ian.m.ha...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, February 4, 2022 12:17 PM
To: pearson-boats <pearso...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [pearson ] Bimini repair / Canvas sewing machine recommendation

 

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[Jeff Griglack]

Ian,

I have a Morse walking foot machine that I bought on eBay several years ago for about 1/2 the (then) cost of of a similar SailRite machine.  It is a walking foot machine that looks suspiciously like the SailRite LSZ-1.  Interestingly, it takes parts that SailRite sells for the LSZ-1.  I have gotten new feet for it.  I have added the SailRite Monster Wheel.  SailRite will tell you that their machine is better because all the internals are metal where mine may have some plastic parts, and they may be right.  I have sewn 2 sails, some sunbrella boat cushions, and several other projects with it.

I will mention that I saw another brand of machine that looked exactly the same in a sewing machine shop around the same time I bought mine.  It was priced higher than mine, but lower than the LSZ-1.

Guy is right.  The key is the walking foot.  I tried to sew a sail with a borrowed Singer industrial machine without the walking foot.  This is what spurred me to buy the machine I have.

I like SailRite and feel that they are a great resource.  I continue to buy things from SailRite.

Jeff

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack             "Jabberwocky" P-365 #269

------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
|               —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------

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[Andrew Milkovits]

I will second both the suggestions to visit the Sailrite site (if for nothing else than their instructional videos) and to purchase a walking foot machine or, even better, a compound feed machine (this is where the foot, feed dogs, and needle all move in unison).  

I was in the same boat (sorry) a few months ago after having struggled to make a simple lifesling bag with an off the shelf Singer "heavy duty" machine, and so I began scouring Craigslist for a used walking foot machine before tackling dodger and sailcover repairs and new cockpit cushions.  Within a month or two I had several good options pop up and ended up purchasing a Consew P1206RB, which is identical to the Sailrite Fabricator.  This is a compound feed machine and it is an absolute beast, easily sewing through several layers of leather without missing a stitch.  

If you're looking at older machines I would also be sure to choose ones with a servo motor, which should generally be more beginner-friendly and easier to use than a clutch motor.  

Have fun --- I've been enjoying the machine and have found lots of reasons to use it.  As Don Casey said, of all the boat projects he works on, the sewing ones are his favorite.  You can do them in the comfort of your home and there are no toxic chemicals or itchy fiberglass.  

Best, 

Andrew

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[Michael Cyr]

For years I messed around with old singer industrial machines, none of which had a walking foot.  I had one long-arm machine that could handle leather.  None of those hold a candle to the Sailrite LSZ-1 that I bought used on ebay, complete with monster wheel.  I entertained one of the sailrite knock-offs but I spent some time on youtube and the big difference I noticed was that the knock-offs sounded like they were chewing themselves up internally and the sailrite sounded smooth.  I have no regrets holding out for the sailrite.  I have sewed probably a dozen boat cushions, a bimini cover with solar panel mounts and a sailcover for our P33.  I have also sewed thick winter window shades for the house.  A dodger is next.  I've been using weathermax for the external canvas and I like how it holds up.

Mike in Maine

[Dave Cole]

The Sailrite machines are ok, but don't hold a candle to a real industrial walking foot machine.

Sailrite is a good company.   I drive by their place every other week or so in Indiana.  I've bought hundreds of dollars of stuff from them.

But the Sailrite machines are far from cheap in price.   If money isn't an issue... you have your choice.  

For industrial machines that are relatively cheap and standard with easily obtainable parts:

The Singer 111W155 and 153 are walking foot machines that often go for less than $200. But it doesn't have reverse.    

Which for a newbie might seem like a big deal, but if you look at Upholstery masters like Cechaflo on Youtube, you will quickly realize that reverse is not needed.

He uses a Pfaff 1245 walking foot most of the time and it has a reverse, but he usually doesn't use it!   

The Singer 211W155 machines are the next generation walking foot machines and they are friendlier since they do have reverse.

You can do a lot of things with a heavier standard non-walking foot machine, but using the right tool for the job makes everything easier.  

There are a number of other really fine walking foot machines made by Pfaff, Juki, Adler, etc that work very well also.  Pfaff and Adler parts tend to be more expensive, but the machines are of very high quality.   The newest machines are mostly made in China with a few still made in Japan.   Be careful what you buy.  

The problem with industrial machines is that they are not very portable.   A standard industrial table is 4 ft wide by 28 inches deep or so.   The sewing heads are sometimes 70-90 lbs without the table and motor.  If you get an industrial, you will find people recommending servo motors.   Servo motors can be a lot easier to control.

Sailrite also sells Industrial machines as well.   But if you want an industrial, there are better machines for about the same price.    That said, Sailrite has excellent service. 

A lot of industrial machines are sold on Ebay, Facebook Marketplace and Craigslist.  

One thing that is not obvious:    If you buy an industrial machine you may be wondering, how do I transport it?   

It all comes apart.   Remove the head, and now you have a table with a motor and legs.  Remove the motor, remove the legs.

Now the biggest part is the solid table which is 4 ft x 28 inches or so.   Everything can easily fit everything in my car trunk.

If you want to replace the windows in your dodger or canvas, you need to think through the process.   The small Sailrite machines can do that if the assembly doesn't get too thick, but keep in mind that the best quality plastic window material cannot be folded on top of itself without screwing it up.   It can be folded/rolled in one direction only.   So if you want to replace an existing window, you may need to take apart the assembly so you can fit things through the sewing machine arm.    The short arm on the small Sailrite machines may be an issue.    It all depends on what you want to do.  

Dave

10M #26

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[Jeff Griglack]

Dave,

Yes, shorter arm can be a problem.  I have always found a way around it.  When sewing a mainsail, I was able to roll everything up so it fit through.

On a side note, the other day I was sewing the new luff tape on the older genoa that came with my boat.  All of a sudden, I heard a crunch, but I looked and the needle had not broken, so I, slowly, kept sewing.  Then I realized that the bottom stitch wasn't happening.  After I verified that there the bobbin wasn't empty, I looked inside and found a piece of metal.  I searched and found where it was from, but I didn't know what to call the broken part.

I went to SailRite's website and downloaded the Ultrafeed Schematic PDF (remember, I have a Morse machine).  I found the part in an exploded diagram.  The new oscillating shaft will be arriving tomorrow, from SailRite.  If my machine wasn't so similar to SailRite's, I suspect I would have had to bring it to a repair shop, I would be waiting a lot longer, and it would cost a lot more.

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack             "Jabberwocky" P-365 #269

------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
|               —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAD5jJo3MF1G1EbqtYifK6OP2O8g%2B5yV3h04_McaJjtcKzBpU-g%40mail.gmail.com.

[Michael Cyr]

in New York

https://buffalo.craigslist.org/art/d/north-tonawanda-industrial-sewing/7430610284.html

[Dave Cole]

That's pretty expensive for 111W machine.  As I said, I've seen them sell for less than $200 with a table and an old clutch motor.

Still, if that's all you can find in the neighborhood and it runs....   I would ask him to put it back in the table and run it.

They need to be oiled if they haven't been run for a while.

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[Peter Ogilvie]

I inherited a Reads Sewing Machine.  When I got into cruising it was the go to DIY sewing machine for sailors.  Haven’t taken out of it’s box and know little about it.  Anyone experience with this British made and could tell me its capabilities.  

Would make someone a deal on it but shipping would probably a killer from Kona, HI

Peter O.

Sabre 28-2

Pearson 35

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[Dave Cole]

Jeff,

You probably broke the hook.   As the needle and top thread rise up from the needle's lowest position, it forms a loop in the thread just above the eye of the needle (while it's below the needle plate).  The hook rotates and catches the thread and pulls it around the bobbin which floats in the bobbin case (this crosses the top and bottom threads).   Then the take up lever arm on the front of the machine rises, and it pulls the excess thread out and forms the tight stitch which doesn't pull through the material, since it was looped with the bottom thread.  

If you are sewing through heavy material the needle will tend to deflect due to the stress of behind shoved through heavy material.  When that happens the needle often bends slightly due to the load, and the hook point may hit the needle and things can break.   If the machine is moving quickly it can also break the shaft that drives the hook, or bust off the tip of the hook, and or break the needle off.   

Many industrial machines made for sewing heavy material have a clutch under the machine that will release if the hook gets jammed up, thus protecting the hook from damage.

If you are replacing the hook or shaft, you will probably need to retime the machine.   Sailrite probably has a video on how to do that with that machine.    

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[Jeff Griglack]

Dave,

Thanks for the suggestion, but, no, I broke the Oscillating Shaft.  As I said, it was pretty obvious when I found a broken chunk of metal under the machine and matched it up with the fork on the shaft.  The new part arrived Monday, and, after about 45 minutes, I was up and running again.  I didn't have to re-time the machine, but maybe I was just lucky with that.

The Oscillating Shaft is part of the mechanism that spins the Hook.  Once I realized that the hook was intact, but was not spinning, I looked farther down the chain.  That's when I saw the chunk of metal that turned out to be one of the arms on the Oscillating Shaft.

Monday, after I fixed the machine (and treated myself to a takeout Valentine's dinner), I was able to sew the rest of the new luff tape onto my old sail.  Since I didn't have a lot of room, I would put on about 4 feet of the tape (holding it on with staples), sew that 6 feet, and then staple on the next 4 feet, etc.

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack             "Jabberwocky" P-365 #269

------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
|               —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAD5jJo3iUmf2d3pLRBYc0F1wx9o6s4g%3DdEAStrhY3XFputV8EQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[Dave Cole]

It's surprising that it broke there.   Usually the hook tip breaks of.  Good thing it's so similar to the Sailrite machines!  

I'm glad you got it running quickly again.

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[Jeff Griglack]

Dave,

I agree that it's not the place I would have expected it to break.  the Oscillating Shaft is not a small, frail part.  There must have been a flaw in the old one.  I would post a picture, but it looks like I resisted my normal urges and threw it out already (all too often I hang onto these things I don't need until I find it long after I remember what it is and why I kept it).

I told this story mainly to illustrate how close this Morse machine is to the SailRite LSZ-1.  This was the first time I had to replace an internal part.  Previously, I had simply added things on (like the Monster wheel and other things).  It is nice to know that I can simply order parts from SR and fix it myself rather than having to find a local repair shop and bring it in for a week or two.

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack             "Jabberwocky" P-365 #269

------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
|               —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAD5jJo1jM-_GtmJPEJ-zxsEr7%3DVLDVXZu7OT%2B7y93zKxWEZ8cA%40mail.gmail.com.