Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

[Lance Davis]

Here's your November hatch thread:

Lance

Forwarded conversation
Subject: [pearson_sailboats] Forward hatch fix/replacement
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From: domagami <493...@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 9:42 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

I may incur the wrath of the traditionalists - or the entire group - but I'll roll the dice and see how it goes. I've reached the point where my forward hatch is now dragging down the rest of the boat. I need to fix or... replace.

Early Wanderer, otherwise pretty much stock parts.

I've painted the entire hull, cored and painted the deck, replaced the running rigging, patched up the sails, added new stack pack and UV genoa cover to match the new paint, restored the teak, replaced the portlights tracked down the kids and grandkids of the original owner, and established a pension for the workers who build my Pearson ... (OK, I made that last one up)... but now that all that is done, the original hatch is looking pretty horrid, and holding back the other good work that has been done. I need an upgrade or restoration.

Have seen the Good Old Boat hatch rebuild, interesting but maybe not for me. Am slightly intrigued by cutting a square out of the existing one and replacing with Lexan or ... whatever. Just not sure about that presentation.

I don't see any other ideas from the archived posts here. Are there any suggestions or other sources anyone might suggest?

I like the existing cut-out size and that the cap-like top gives me just enough headroom to stand upright in that space. Therefore I'm slightly partial to something similar to the existing design.

Thoughts?

Thanks to all,

MD

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From: Nick <sail...@optonline.net>
Date: Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 10:47 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

I’ve seen Wanderers with the original hatch planked over in teak. But what’s wrong with the original? The low profile will not catch you jib sheets. Anything more will (even the original does occasionally). Installing a solar ventilator is another idea but they are too noisy to sleep under.  Nick

 

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From: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pearson_...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of domagami
Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2009 9:42 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [pearson_sailboats] Forward hatch fix/replacement

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From: richard usen <Use...@rcn.com>
Date: Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 10:49 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

I'm a traditionalist from way back. That means by all means, if the hatch is
like the Triton, remove it and fabricate a real traditional hatch out of
either teak or mahogany. Get some pictures of some mid 20th century wood
boats and pick a hatch you like.

Dick Usen

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From: Guy Johnson <guy...@hotmail.com>
Date: Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 8:25 AM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

I think Dick has the right idea, build yourself a nice traditional hatch.
 
Guy

> From: 493...@gmail.com
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From: domagami <493...@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 12:15 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

Sorry, I never explained what was so "horrid" about it.

It is solid as a hatch, so I have good bones to work with, but the flat horizontal bit looks just awful. Maybe at one point this was a sort of smoked and/or translucent window? But today it's a dirty green, scratched, crackled, essentially opaque, mess.

I like the added light that comes in through, so I don't want to go full teak, or even too much with strapping or too many other bands. (And yes, I think I can avoid the solar fan too)

So far what I'm hearing is use the original, treat it like a frame, replace the (formerly) transparent bit and maybe trim in teak. Guess I'll go surfing for some photos to steal ideas.

Oh, and not catch the jib sheets??? Are you kidding? Snags them about 50% of the time. I wish I knew the trick to avoid this.

Thanks for the replies!

MD

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From: richard usen <Use...@rcn.com>
Date: Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 12:53 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

Sounds like we're looking at a design contest! Actually, if you keep the
slack out of the lazy sheet, it shouldn't snag too often.

Dick Usen

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From: Guy Johnson <guy...@hotmail.com>
Date: Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 1:45 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

This is how I stopped the sheets from catching under the front hatch on our 10M Puffin.
 
http://dan.pfeiffer.net/10m/006_forward_hatch_eyebrow.htm
 
 
Guy

> From: 493...@gmail.com
> Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2009 17:15:36 +0000

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From: Jeff Griglack <grig...@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 9:20 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

How do you guys catch the sheets?  Do you sail with the hatch open?

--
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| Jeff Griglack                  "Blithe Spirit" P-30 #182
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| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
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From: Nick <sail...@optonline.net>
Date: Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 10:11 PM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

The solution for jib sheets catching on a Wanderer forward hatch is to put a teak or stainless handrail to each side of the hatch. I’ve seen pictures of this  in teak on Pete’s old Wanderer. I think the stainless handrails have an even better curved shape to keep the sheets off the hatch. As far as the hatch itself is concerned, mine has a decent translucent “amber” finish which I like. Maybe the appearance of your could be improved if you prepped and varnished it, maybe even stain it to get a better color.   Nick

 

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From: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pearson_...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Guy Johnson
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 1:45 PM

Subject: RE: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

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From: richard usen <Use...@rcn.com>
Date: Sat, Nov 21, 2009 at 8:05 AM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

I guess that'd do it....

 

 

Dick Usen

Subject: Re: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement [1 Attachment]

This how I stopped the sheets catching on the forward hatch of my P35.  Now I have to figure out how to keep the sheets from catcing on the dinghy.  Actually, it's not a problem.
 

Aloha
Peter Ogilvie
Pa'akai O'o, Pearson 35 #108
Too many Landrovers, some even run.

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From: Jeff Griglack <grig...@gmail.com>Sent: Fri, November 20, 2009 4:20:51 PM
Subject: Re: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

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From: Guy Johnson <guy...@hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 11:03 AM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

The space  between the hatch and the cabinhouse is just the right gap for the sheet to catch in.
The major reason I made the eyebrow was to break the force of green water rushing up the front of the cabinhouse and forcing it's way past the gasket.

From: rov...@yahoo.com
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2009 20:47:54 -0800
Subject: Re: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement [1 Attachment]

[Attachment(s) from Peter Ogilvie included below]

Subject: Re: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

Attachment(s) from Peter Ogilvie

1 of 1 Photo(s)

ebay 027.jpg

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From: Jeff Griglack <grig...@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 12:54 AM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

A PO replaced the front hatch on my boat.  The hatch I have has an aluminum frame and a piece of Lexan/Plexiglass that fits into it and makes up the entire opening portion of the hatch.  There is nothing to catch the sheet (as long as I don't sail with it open).  Any water coming over the deck hits the metal frame.  I don't know what brand it is because I can't find any markings on it.

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From: Guy Johnson <guy...@hotmail.com>
Date: Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 7:18 AM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

The 10M's hatch is moulded as part of the cabinhouse, it has the advantage of a wide snag free opening at the cost of catching sheets and shipping green water. It's the green water part that bugs me the most, the design directs and captures the force of the water againts the foam tape used to seal the hatch.
The teak eyebrow was easy to make and totaly solved the problem.

From: grig...@gmail.com
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:54:13 -0500

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From: richard usen <Use...@rcn.com>
Date: Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 8:08 AM
To: pearson_...@yahoogroups.com

 

My stock hatch (1979) is like that. It might be a Lewmar or Bomar. Someone on this list must know.

 

 

Dick Usen

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[SteveA]

don't know about the other pearsons but i think i found the bits for
the P30 hatch at Bomar and it looks like parts are still available
here ya go
first link is the cast hatch
second are the parts: including gasket!
Yeah!

http://www.pompanette.com/pompweb.nsf/731d6514ff5a8481852567be000745b2/6cc9c9dafb5c190f852567bc0004e54b?OpenDocument

http://www.pompanette.com/pompweb.nsf/731d6514ff5a8481852567be000745b2/a594d67364fe8439852567c5000f8a35?OpenDocument

Steve
P30 #840

[richard usen]

Ye gads, I've bought whole boats for less money.

Dick Usen

-----Original Message-----
From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com]
On Behalf Of SteveA
Sent: Monday, December 21, 2009 10:18 PM
To: pearson-boats
Subject: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch
fix/replacement

http://www.pompanette.com/pompweb.nsf/731d6514ff5a8481852567be000745b2/6cc9c
9dafb5c190f852567bc0004e54b?OpenDocument

http://www.pompanette.com/pompweb.nsf/731d6514ff5a8481852567be000745b2/a594d
67364fe8439852567c5000f8a35?OpenDocument

Steve
P30 #840

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[Guy Johnson]

Who could afford to spend 10% to 20% (or more) of the value of your boat on a hatch. Those prices are even more ridiculous than the price of a small diesel.
 
Guy
 
>>
> http://www.pompanette.com/pompweb.nsf/731d6514ff5a8481852567be000745b2/6cc9c9dafb5c190f852567bc0004e54b?OpenDocument
>
> http://www.pompanette.com/pompweb.nsf/731d6514ff5a8481852567be000745b2/a594d67364fe8439852567c5000f8a35?OpenDocument
>

[Peter Ogilvie]

Those prices are scary.  You could buy most of a woodworking shop and the material to make a teak hatch for the price of one of those.

Someone had either a website or a magazine article on rehabbing a fiberglass hatch that I came across a while back.  They used epoxy and refinished the translucent area with excellent results.  I've been trying to find the article but no joy so far.

 

Aloha
Peter Ogilvie
Pa'akai O'o, Pearson 35 #108
Too many Landrovers, some even run.

---

From: Guy Johnson <guy...@hotmail.com>
To: "pearso...@googlegroups.com" <pearso...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Tue, December 22, 2009 3:25:46 AM
Subject: RE: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

[richard usen]

Why not just attach four pieces of teak around the old hatch, using it as a frame, and fasten a piece of Lexan on top? The old hatch will be hidden underneath and used for the hardware anchors. The new teak will go down to the house and prevent the sheet from hanging up. It should look real yar and be affordable. Five coats of Epifanes and it'll be the prettiest thing on the boat.

 

 

Dick Usen

[Guy Johnson]

Epoxy on the translucent area would quickly turn brown from UV exposure. Polyester resin would be a better choice for the translucent area.
 

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Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 08:53:50 -0800
From: rov...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com

[Jeff Griglack]

I was thinking the same thing.

As I mentioned when this thread came up before, the PO replaced the forward hatch on my boat with an aluminum framed hatch where the opening part of the hatch is made entirely of a piece of thick (I'm going to guess ~3/8 - 1/2 inch) plexiglass-like-material.  The plexi is crazed, and I am thinking about replacing it, but it is functional and does not leak, so it way down on the list.  I have never had a problem with sheets catching on this simple design.

If you don't mind the sheets catching on the original one, but want to let in more light, I would consider cutting the center and screwing down a piece of thick lexan.  If you want to keep the sheets from catching, I would build a wooden frame around this, but make sure you make allowances for water to drain.  Another solution is to buy a replacement hatch, like the PO did for my boat.

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack                  "Blithe Spirit" P-30 #182
------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
------------------------------------------------------------------

[SteveA]

Hahaha
I never saw the prices of the new hatch
Wow they are nuts.
I was looking at the pictures to identify the hatch for parts.
I’m certain it is the same on our P30

The threads in the hold open arm are gone
I’ll have a friend tap it out to the next size and get a knurled knob
out of McMaster Carr or somewhere.
And now I know the gasket size.
So I figure for a $10-20 I can have a working hatch
It is otherwise in good condition
(the scratches don’t bother me)
:)

[richard usen]

Go w/ a Helicoil instead of a larger size bolt.

Dick Usen

-----Original Message-----
From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com]

On Behalf Of SteveA
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 12:09 AM
To: pearson-boats
Subject: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch
fix/replacement

--

[PQU...@aol.com]

Dick,

 

The Helicoil is a great answer that few people think of. Those who encounter a stripped thread should remember to consider a Helicoil.

 

Happy Holidays to all my friends on this service.

 

Peter Allen, Sr.

Rochester, New York

[Dan Pfeiffer]

What about the disimilar metal/galvanic corrosion issue in the aluminum hatch frame?  I don't think you would bed a helicoil in tef-gel (though I suppose you could use locktite).  Seems like tapping for a larger fastener might be a good way to go if there is adequate room.  You have to over-drill and tap for the helicoil anyway. 

 

Dan Pfeiffer

 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
From: PQU...@aol.com

Dick,
The Helicoil is a great answer that few people think of. Those who encounter a stripped thread should remember to consider a Helicoil.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

use...@rcn.com writes:
Go w/ a Helicoil instead of a larger size bolt.

 

Dick Usen
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
On Behalf Of SteveA

Hahaha
I never saw the prices of the new hatch
Wow they are nuts.
I was looking at the pictures to identify the hatch for parts. I'm certain
it is the same on our P30

[richard usen]

My guess is that the Helicoil will hold nicely in the Aluminum and prevent any more wear of the female threads between the steel bolt and aluminum.  I hate to have oversize threads in small parts, especially w/ round parts.

 

 

Dick Usen

-----Original Message-----
From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Dan Pfeiffer
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 8:38 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com

[Guy Johnson]

I frequently use blue loctite on the boat. I keep both loctite and anti-seize onboard.
In my experience loctite does a good job isolating metals and preventing corrosion.
 
Guy
 

---

From: d...@pfeiffer.net
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 2009 08:38:15 -0500

[Martin Rosenberg]

Wow, I had never heard of the Helicoil and it sounds terrific. Of course now that I’ve started to research it I found that it’s a bit too expensive for the occasional stripped thread. Also, what is the minimum depth it needs to be useful? I’m guessing it wouldn’t be helpful for stripped holes in an aluminum spar.

Martin Rosenberg

 

---

[Dan LeBlond]

Helicoils are a very good solution for stripped tapped thread, especially when your best option is to reuse a specialized fastener. Use the blue locktite if you feel the helicoil will ever need removal, the red locktite has a stronger bond and requires heating for renoval. Blue locktite will allow you to remove the helicoil with an easy-out and a little tap.

[Jeff Griglack]

If you have a stripped hole in a spar, or you have a thin piece of aluminum and want to have a threaded hole into it, you can use a rivnut (google "rivnuts" and you will find places to buy them).  They are installed with a tool similar to a pop rivet gun.

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack                  "Blithe Spirit" P-30 #182
------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
------------------------------------------------------------------

[Peter Ogilvie]

I have heard, no personal experience, of problems with Rivnuts in a marine environment.  The material used for the Rivnuts is prone to corrosion freeze up with stainless fasteners.  You have to be extremely careful to use TuffGel or Blue lockTite and even that may not be enough.  If the fastener freezes in the RivNut and you force the fastener, the RivNut will break loose and turn, not the fastener.  You then have an even bigger problem than you started with.
 

Aloha
Peter Ogilvie
Pa'akai O'o, Pearson 35 #108
Too many Landrovers, some even run.

---

From: Jeff Griglack <grig...@gmail.com>
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thu, December 24, 2009 1:04:16 PM

Subject: Re: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

If you have a stripped hole in a spar, or you have a thin piece of aluminum and want to have a threaded hole into it, you can use a rivnut (google "rivnuts" and you will find places to buy them).  They are installed with a tool similar to a pop rivet gun.
------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack                  "Blithe Spirit" P-30 #182
------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
------------------------------------------------------------------

On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 5:30 PM, Martin Rosenberg <martinlr...@gmail.com> wrote:

Wow, I had never heard of the Helicoil and it sounds terrific. Of course now that I’ve started to research it I found that it’s a bit too expensive for the occasional stripped thread. Also, what is the minimum depth it needs to be useful? I’m guessing it wouldn’t be helpful for stripped holes in an aluminum spar.

Martin Rosenberg

 

---

From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of richard usen
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 9:47 AM

To: pearso...@googlegroups.com

Subject: RE: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

 

My guess is that the Helicoil will hold nicely in the Aluminum and prevent any more wear of the female threads between the steel bolt and aluminum.  I hate to have oversize threads in small parts, especially w/ round parts.

 

 

Dick Usen

-----Original Message-----
From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Dan Pfeiffer
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 8:38 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Re: Fwd: [pearson_sailboats] Re: Forward hatch fix/replacement

What about the disimilar metal/galvanic corrosion issue in the aluminum hatch frame?  I don't think you would bed a helicoil in tef-gel (though I suppose you could use locktite).  Seems like tapping for a larger fastener might be a good way to go if there is adequate room.  You have to over-drill and tap for the helicoil anyway.. 

[Micheal LeVine]

We used to use these all the time at work to make stainless steel machine screws act as fasteners for aluminum castings. 

THe first hit I got on google showed me a repair kit with 6 heli-coils and the tools you need to tap the hole and insert the HCs -- for about $10

http://www.restockit.com/Thread-Repair-Kit-1-2-13-(HEL5521-8).html?source=froogle&utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=comparsionshopping&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=HEL5521-8

In Boat Bucks, that is about as expensive as a slice of pizza

Micheal

S/V Tachyon

[Jeff Griglack]

They make stainless steel rivnuts too.

------------------------------------------------------------------
| Jeff Griglack                  "Blithe Spirit" P-30 #182
------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
|                   - Walt Kelly
------------------------------------------------------------------

[richard usen]

They're not expensive at all. The kit is under $20 and the inserts around $0.50 or so each if you need more than the 8 or so that come w/ the kit. Like all bolt threads, you need one diameter to get full strength. The mast may be too thin, maybe not. They're easy to install. You run the supplied tap into the hole and then screw in the insert and then break off a small piece for the installing tool to grab.  

[richard usen]

Yup. I have some soft "rivnuts" that never grabbed properly and then spun. The real Rivnuts are more precision looking and should be a better alloy.

[Mike Mayer]

I've used them to fix a spark plug hole.  Worked great.

Mike M.

---

From: richard usen <use...@rcn.com>
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thu, December 24, 2009 10:31:06 PM

[Peter Kafer]

I am going to install a new depth sounder on our P323.  I'd be interested in where everyone has located the transducer in their boat.  I saw on the Pearson 323 site that Richard Rollins on Libations Too had installed his transducer under the salon starboard settee.

Thanks
Peter
P323 Now or Never!

[dugout]

Peter;

 

That is as good a place as any. Its out of the way but accessable. You want a clear wire run to your instrument.

As far as the hydro-accuostics, center line, forward of the keel is "the best place" but this isn't a perfect world and we must balance form,function, and the trade-offs.

 

Ed
P33-1, S/V "Moriah"
Maryland's Famous Eastern Shore

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Peter Kafer

To: pearso...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 8:42 AM

Subject: [pearson ] Transducer

I am going to install a new depth sounder on our P323.  I'd be interested in where everyone has located the transducer in their boat.  I saw on the Pearson 323 site that Richard Rollins on Libations Too had installed his transducer under the salon starboard sette.

Thanks
Peter
P323 Now or Never!

[jimmcmurray]

Thats where mine is.
___________________
Jim McMurray
WE2I
S/V Shadow Dancer
1980 P323 #265

Fact does not require fiction for balance.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Dan LeBlond]

The original transducer on my 323 is located forward of the V berth / head bulkhead. It is to port of centerline. when I replaced the depth sounder with a Standard Horizon unit, the new transducer needed more space to clear the floor board in that area. I used a piece of 1.5" x 5.5" teak to form a hull extension faired into a teardrop shape to gain 1.5" extra clearance for the transducer. Appears to be little or no performance sacrificed. Still outrunning the same boats we used to before the switch. Forward of the keel and normal to vertical at rest appears to be the rule.

[steve_hayes_maine]

I replaced the transducer on my P323 two years ago, and locating it
was one of the most challenging mental issues.

There is a narrow (3") space between the forward water tank and the
bulkhead immediately aft of it; the water from the tank drains to port
of center, and just to starboard of center I located my transducer.
The transducer is actually mounted in a faring that is contoured to
the hull. It created another hole in my hull (which needed to be re-
sealed last Spring), but the location works well and gives me a clean
image of the water immediately below the bow. The original (?)
transducer was located under the nav station, which was certainly more
accessible than the present spot, but it was shadowed by the keel and
seemed less than ideal. An alternative spot would have been under the
port-side locker below the V-berth. This would have been a bit more
accessible, but slightly more off-center.

Good luck.

Steve Hayes
P323 #63
Readfield & Rockland, Maine

[Dan LeBlond]

Careful not to go too far forward, the transducer can easily come out
of the water and become useless in a heavy seaway. Nothing worse than
all dashes then some nonsense number alternating on the display. A
P323 can pitch quite a bit when the waves are close together. A
relative had a 26' Paceship with this problem, his transducer was
located under the V berth.

[richard usen]

There seems to be a similarity between my P-30 and the 323. My boat has two
x-ducers, an internal under the stbd berth about a foot forward of the
galley sink and an external forward of the water tank dead center of the
keel. This one is nicely recessed in the keel and must have weakened the
structure. Every other year or so I have to fight w/ the yard monkeys to not
put a stand under it. They both seem to be in good locations
electronics-wise. Over the years I've installed my 'ducers a foot or two
wide of the keel and built up a fairing out of glass filled Bondo to
streamline the installation. I haven't found any problems no matter where
I've installed them. I aim for an area where it doesn't take too much effort
to mold the fairing. And, I always used to be very careful to not paint the
face, wash it down w/ dish soap before launch etc, etc. Then I discovered
that my internal 'ducer never got this attention.

My advice: pick a convenient spot and go for it. You'll probably be lucky.
It ain't rocket science in the real world.

Dick Usen

-----Original Message-----
From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com]
On Behalf Of Dan LeBlond
Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 8:12 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com

[dugout]

The need/desire to build or use a hull fairing has been greatly reduced by the new tilted element transducers which commonly come in 12 or 20 degree. This said, there is still the need to build a good flat backing inside the hull, hence my priority of easy access. As Dick rightly states, the digital sounder is not that sensitive to keel shadowing, or anything else, and far less finicky than a fishfinder.

Fore, aft, whatever, it doesn't mater. It takes at least 2 seconds for any machine to display a depth change, and some take a lot longer to react. Having it forward really doesn't provide a measurable or significant early warning benefit.

 

Ed
P33-1, S/V "Moriah"
Maryland's Famous Eastern Shore

[richard usen]

Yup, the real issue is does it leak water. And, is there turbulence underwater. A 30 knot powerboat installation is much different than a 5 knot sailboat.

[Joel Bondy]

A 323 can outrun another boat? Or do you mean you're not being outrun anymore than you are used to?
 
 ;^)

Joel
Pokey III
'78 P323 #101
Bayside, NY



 

---

From: dleb...@maine.rr.com
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [pearson ] Transducer
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 16:42:41 -0500

---

Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign up now.

[steve_hayes_maine]

My 323 passes boats all the time. They are all coming from the other
direction.

I'd also note that when it hits 25-30 knots, I can keep sailing along
at 6.5 knots when others have run for shelter.

[Dan LeBlond]

Yes a 323 properly trimmed without much junk stowed aboard, (All the just in case extras ), Sails quite nicely with a new larger main and a clean crisp 135 jib. Not saying her upwind performance is stellar but when she's trimmed right and the crew knows where to be when necessary tasks are done, she's not a bad performer. Remember 323's have 27 ft. waterline, better'n most 32ft. cruisers.

[Peter Kafer]

I passed a boat once!  She had all her sail out and was heeled way over.  We had a 150 jenny and a reefed main.  The secret for the 323 is to reef the main early.

Peter
P323 Now or Never!

---

group at http://groups.google.com/group/pearson-boats?hl=en.

[richard usen]

I passed a 323 once w/ my P-30. I was so proud of my boat until you guys started this discussion...... How disillusioning... 

 

 

Dick Usen

-----Original Message-----
From: pearso...@googlegroups.com [mailto:pearso...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Peter Kafer
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2010 6:43 PM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com

[Bill Robart]

Back in the old days when I installed my first sounder the manufacturer (Seafarer - a british company) specified that the transducer be placed at the aft end of the first 1/3 of the waterline and as close to the centerline as possible and yet not close enough to the leading edge of the keel that the keel would/could be "seen" by the sounder.  They explained that this was the optimum place as the water passing there would have shed any accumulation of air bubbles forced into the water by the bow and yet still be far enough forward to give some minimum warning of a forthcoming grounding. 

I had an Ericson 25 at the time and the sounder worked fine,  installed as instructed.  That said, I've seen sounders that worked just fine with the transducer located in many other locations much further aft and off to one side.  Never saw one much closer to the bow than a foot or so forward of the keel.

 

I've always mounted my transducers in a "waterbox" so the transducer had to shoot thru the hull.  They work fine that way but you have to test the location first to assure the location will work.  I use modeling clay to build a dam to test the locations.

 

Bill

[Peter Kafer]

Thanks for all the input.  I finally located the transducer beneath the starboard settee, a foot or so from the mast step.  It was definitely easier to install in that location than other places I considered.  It is an in-hull type of transducer that interfaces with my chart plotter.  It seems to work well there, although I haven't tried it while the boat is in motion yet.  A plus is that it doesn't seem to interfere with the operation of the existing depth sounder which is located aft of the keel on the port side of the engine compartment.  thanks again.