P30 quarterberth bulkhead
kris.s...@gmail.com
Robert Franklin
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "pearson-boats" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to pearson-boat...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/99d4b81f-710c-4c60-b811-634010cc7e35n%40googlegroups.com.
145 Lagrange Street
Chestnut Hill, MA 02467-3047
617 277 5900 Cell
email: robertm...@gmail.com
Michael Denny
Bob,
What is the UMA rebuild? Do you have a link?
Thanks, Mike
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAODnOUbZq3YxA6cBfq3fgKVvR6Y2K7s%2Bm7PdpxrfxfsmUgqK3A%40mail.gmail.com.
George DuBose
look for SailingUma on YouTube. I am in Olbia and got to visit them in the boatyard where they are rebuilding Uma the way Pearsons shoul have been built to begin with.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/000601db021a%248abeb1c0%24a03c1540%24%40com.
-- George DuBose Wiedstrasse 16 D-50859 Cologne, Germany Mobile: +49.160.481.1234 Skype: georgedubose or call +1.347.284.6443 Video interview on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcOxW65Xe10&feature=youtu.be Personal website: http://www.george-dubose.com Galleries: https://www.rockpaperphoto.com/browse-by-photographer/george-dubose http://www.modernrocksgallery.com/george-dubose-photographer http://www.houseofroulx.com/collections/george-dubose http://loeildelaphotographie.com/en/2016/04/30/article/159902316/george-dubose/ Short video of Skylark's vacation: https://vimeo.com/133183259 Password: SkylarkNY S/V Skylark Compagnieshaven Enkhuizen, NL
Jeff Griglack
| Jeff Griglack "Jabberwocky" P-365 #269
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
| - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
| —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------
--
kris.s...@gmail.com
As well panel between the quarterberth and the engine. Mine is currently plywood and functions if wedged in properly. Not very soundproof though.
George DuBose
I have visited with Uma several times over the past years. Last week both our P36s are in Olbia, Sardinia and I got a chance to visit them again and see where they are with their extensive interior redesign
While they have thrown away some items that might interest another P36 owner (bronze "P" strut), I think their bulkheads were removed in pieces.
From my experience with Skylark, I am discovering that NONE of the plywood used for bulkheads, berths, etc. is NOT waterproof plywood. I have had to relaminate, sister or otherwise reinforce the plywood in several places.
So...I wouldn't be lusting for their bulkheads.
George/Skylark
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/815f8498-0138-4c35-b3a6-d465fb4d892cn%40googlegroups.com.
kris.s...@gmail.com
Dave Cole
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/e52ed0fa-3404-49e8-8c26-d224f49d2ddcn%40googlegroups.com.
George DuBose
Buy a different boat? What kind of heresy is that? ;>)
For those who are blind, P36-1s have some of the most beautiful lines of any modern sailboats. They are strong and fast.
Uma's crew has made the best decision to do a complete makeover of Uma. If you watch their latest series of episodes, they did consider letting Uma go, but as their owners, Dan and Kika have one of the highest earning YouTube channels, this latest effort on their part is giving them a year or more of material to record and present to us.
They are rebuilding the hull and redesigning the interior. The hull strengthening is perhaps the way Pearson should have built the boat to begin with.
My son is apprenticing with a master cabinetmaker and I told him to do the same to Skylark when I am gone.
Buy a different boat? Hah! They won't find a better one when they are finished.
George/Skylark 1973 P36-1
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAD5jJo0cUPT%2Bu8pUbcz1mzDiVDYdWquWYpzGy7fNd2XfMaVrLg%40mail.gmail.com.
Robert Franklin
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/c18d438c-c7f9-3b4c-276e-14e4d313c955%40george-dubose.com.
Jeff Griglack
| Jeff Griglack "Jabberwocky" P-365 #269
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
| - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
| —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAODnOUZTa0Vj7dFesQQ8XZv0i3Pc8byde-uuBWVFCmJjOh9h2g%40mail.gmail.com.
Guy Johnson
Sent from
Outlook
Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2024 8:40 AM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Thoughts on the P36 (was Re: [pearson ] P30 quarterberth bulkhead)
Dave Cole
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/LV3P220MB1540E76C3E9240862863188DBC642%40LV3P220MB1540.NAMP220.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM.
Huck Mansmann
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAJj5SXKnkx8LAOZNqMX96buukmJTon3KMsCysKZZ4Dk-rOw2%3DQ%40mail.gmail.com.
Tim Smith
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAJmfK97RbT4G4UVtxd%3DDi_v27p0TYBuUdGCsQ7U1eWsbQ0y0WQ%40mail.gmail.com.
Robert Franklin
Now, Bob, a few thoughts on selling your P36:
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CACXvQDyW2%2BfFHcZY%3DDuriKgFxODu4Zu%3DjVQvBNFarof9TADZKA%40mail.gmail.com.
Peter McGowan
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAODnOUb1Pxvb1W4ks8OOkwd2OUE0iEJY9NJbgcr-wuHAp0reiQ%40mail.gmail.com.
john getz
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAJF6WACd6LasZ65cVDbTXKTCrFw1keK%2B9z-0sQETToWG3Dcjzw%40mail.gmail.com.
Robert Franklin
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAFsJ%3DNCWb%2B0Y9fzMFDdfo_O4jjtrFTdaA%3DYhEn9ZDpiG%2Bc8vyQ%40mail.gmail.com.
Robert Franklin
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAFsJ%3DNCWb%2B0Y9fzMFDdfo_O4jjtrFTdaA%3DYhEn9ZDpiG%2Bc8vyQ%40mail.gmail.com.
Dan Pfeiffer
There's nothing like ambiguity? The favorite of Bill Shaw P36 Tim was referencing (below) would the the P36-2 of the mid 80's. A wholly different boat from P36 at question here (1970's). And I recall a discussion long ago (perhaps from the old NPYOA?) that mentions the P35 as the Bill S. favorite. And another referencing the P39 (1970's version) as the favorite. Can we all claim our model was Bill Shaw's favorite at least in some context, for what it's worth?
And going back to George's comment that the P36 (1970's) is fast and strong and perhaps the best boat ever?
Fast? I suppose compared to it's contemporaries. By modern standards? Reasonably so but not exceptional.
Strong? I would say Uma has answered that. They pushed the boat to it's limits and it failed. Basically fell apart or started to come un-done. Lots of secondary bonding failures. We now know the limits of the P36 and by proxy any Pearson of that era with the same construction standards. And that limit is not quite so far as Uma took it. Nice that they are re-building it but it will never be as strong as a boat actually built for the rigors of ocean passage (e.g. Contessa?) that would have integrated primary bonding of ALL structural components as the boat was built. It just wont. It will come out very strong indeed and probably fully adequate to the task they intend, but it's all based on secondary bonding and as good as that may be done in this case (Uma) it is still not as good as primary at the time the hull is layed up.
Sorry to rain reality on this parade. Uma will be excellent when they are done. Much improved in strength and certainly up to much more than it was from the factory (though it will still have a bolt-on external keel that will be quite vulnerable to impact damage at sea.... so think about that). But remember, a P36 was never meant for that hard a life and probably never meant to last this long? There may be some Pearson models where more care was taken in the bonding of structural elements. Maybe the 365 series? I don't know about that. If so those would have been much more costly for Pearson to build and I don't know if they priced that way? My guess is they have the same build standards as all the boats of the same era.
So don't fool yourself about the strength and capacity of these boats . They are good, even above average, when used within the limits of their design. That design was never meant to be blue water. It just wasn't. It was coastal cruising. Doesn't mean you can't be successful doing that. But don't mistake luck for validation.
Dan Pfeiffer
On 2024-09-16 4:13 pm, Robert Franklin wrote:
...
Huck: Too bad Shaw Jr. could not stick around longer to explain what he meant by his "favorite boat". Maybe it's just a family sales pitch. When I was on the dock in Newport, RI in 1982 for the annual Pearson Rendezvous, Bill Shaw stopped by (rather brusque in tone and greeting I have to say), but he did glance at my P36 for a minute followed by "MY FAVORITE DESIGN".[Who knows? George DuBose will be glad to hear that story. It is his favorite design, as well. Whether the same applies to Dan and Kika with UMA, it is hard to say since there may be a host of other motivations for their "million dollar" rebuild, but the time, energy and money they are devoting to rebuilding their Pearson 36 is not because they are disappointed with the boat.I make not secret of my love for the P36, not do I hold onto any secret about my motivation to move it along to someone who will appreciate it and enjoy it. At 77 I am more aware than ever of time passing fast and that is another part of my motivation. It's known as "wrapping things up" before someone else has to.Bob Franklin
On Mon, Sep 16, 2024 at 10:10 AM Tim Smith <tbsm...@gmail.com> wrote:
Huck,One issue I have seen and been introduced to this summer is legacy furlers being loaded with larger, more modern cut genoas/materials producing swivel loads that compromise older systems with case and bearings being damaged or internal surfaces being dimpled.Aparrently understanding swivel loads and your sail makers view of top of headstay sail load ranges can help you make informed decision about system maintenance or replacement . I have helped replace several old systems for this reason. Wrap failures, bearing failures, foil twisting. Been an educational summer.You luff length presents other problems with unanticipated loads and interference with travel pathways. As well as wrapping concerns.Best wishes.Tim
On Mon, Sep 16, 2024, 9:54 AM Huck Mansmann <hman...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello,I am the owner of a 1986 Pearson 36-2CB since 2013, which we keep at the Harlem Yacht Club in City Island. I just want to describe an encounter I had with the son of Bill Shaw(the Pearson designer). We were sailing by the Herreshoffs at Oakcliff in Oyster Bay when the skipper of one turned, pointed at us, and said "my father built your boat". He added that "the 36 is my favorite Pearson and the one I owned". I asked if he was a Pearson, but we had sailed too far away to hear his complete answer. Now I know he must have been William Harold Shaw, Jr. since the architect and builder in 1986 was Bill Shaw.On a more pragmatic note, my original Hood Sea Furl 2 recently jammed badly with 3 feet of sail unfurled and a rigger climbed the mast to free it up. The rigger found that my 2017 new 150% genoa is over a foot too long in the luff and the upper swivel has been rubbing against the mast and making the furler difficult to turn. Because of its age and stiffnes, he is recommending considering replacing it with a new furler and forestay of 5/16 inches vs. the existing 3/8", since he says 36 foot boats and larger normally only need 5/16" stays and would save thousands. I am hesitant to reduce the standing rigging from Bill Shaw's design. I also have no way of knowing if the forestay or furler bearings were replaced by 2 previous owners. Although no parts for the Sea Furl 2 are available from Pompanette, the WD40 their support recommended has greatly improved the furler operation with the original 100% jib.Any thoughts
Herbert C. Mansmann III
Cell: +1-610-715-3716
Dan Pfeiffer
I downsized my headstay on my 10M from 3/8 to 5/16 and used a Harken MK4 unit 1.5 furler. Saved a lot over the unit 2 I would need for the 3/8. That was 23 years ago. The margins are a bit larger for the 10M than for the P36 but I suspect you would have a similar result looking at the design safety factor for the stays.
Rigging is designed with a safety factor. You calculate the max expected load and build the rig to take some factor over that. Typically I think that's 2.5 to 3? Not sure. But that would mean if the max load is 10,000 lbs and the factor is 3 you use rigging components capable of 30,000 lb loads. On the 10M I reverse engineered those values and found the safety factor was 4.9 with the 3/8 stays and 3.5 with 5/16. There's more to this when you add in consideration of stretch and required tension. There is a book by David Gerr called "Boat Strength" that goes through a lot of this.
Some other options to consider with your rigger might be using Dyform wire (is that still around?) or rod for the headstay. Wire strength is based on cross section area of all the strands added up. Rod rigging of the same size will be stronger than stranded wire-rope because it has more cross section. So a smaller rod can be the same strength as a larger wire. Same for Dyform which has shaped wire elements rather than round so it has more cross section.
But I suspect the 5/16 wire will be fine and still have a safety factor well above typical standards.
I attached two spreadsheet pages with some details and references. I have not tinkered with this stuff in a long time so it's not real fresh in my mind. I can tell you what kind of ice cream treat I had today but recalling details about these numbers will take more time. But I can try if there are questions.
Dan Pfeiffer
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CACXvQDyW2%2BfFHcZY%3DDuriKgFxODu4Zu%3DjVQvBNFarof9TADZKA%40mail.gmail.com.
Tim Smith
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/2b28fefd65d8162c0ef5a3b0c899fec0%40pfeiffer.net.
Guy Johnson
Sent from
Outlook
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2024 8:40 PM
To: pearso...@googlegroups.com <pearso...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Thoughts on the P36 (was Re: [pearson ] P30 quarterberth bulkhead)
Dave Cole
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/LV3P220MB154003804B1C00FBF084215EBC612%40LV3P220MB1540.NAMP220.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM.
Jeff Griglack
| Jeff Griglack "Jabberwocky" P-365 #269
| "Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent"
| - Walt Kelly
| 'Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this
| world, Elwood, you must be" – she always called me Elwood –
| "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant."
| Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me.'
| —James Stewart as Elwood P. Dowd
------------------------------------------------------------------
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/LV3P220MB154003804B1C00FBF084215EBC612%40LV3P220MB1540.NAMP220.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM.
pau...@perhapscoaching.com
Dave,
Re Uman’s refit, to enable them to earn it’s worth it for them to do the refit as an ‘entertainment’ portal.
Their net worth at Jan 2024 is estimated at $1.5million; annual - $240K. The estimates regarding the advertising revenue suggest that they’re earning an immense amount from their YouTube career. In addition to that, they are earning from sponsorships and brand endorsements. Sailing Uma brings in an estimate of $28.5k a month or $342.4k annually from Patreon account.
Worth doing the refit to keep this going? Their skills are increasing both in sailing, refitting and video filming and editing. When they are no longer sailing the opportunities for other careers are endless – or a very comfortable retirement!!!
Good job huh????
Pauleen
Pauleen Ward Brown
31.2 P hull #20
Sailing out of Breezy Point NY
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pearson-boats/CAD5jJo3kgLxWxULJT70j5Z3QZ50noE1pxxZrb3TwiTGy704UVA%40mail.gmail.com.