Who's up for for a hike?

[Thom Kaye]

Now that the leaves are off and the air is crisp I was hoping to hit
the trails for a long hike. I'd like to put a dent in the Tuscarora
Trail. I figured a good place to start would be at its origin in
Shenandoah NP. I figure the TT and AT intersection (Matthews Arm
Campground) would make for a good starting point for a few circuits.
Perhaps a few of us could meet up and head off in different
directions? I'm thinking in a few weeks before Christmas. Who is up
for it?

[Chris Mangold]

Sounds like fun.  I would be up for it.

Chris

--
Chris Mangold
301-471-5758 (c)
301-898-7979 (h)

[Mrzac...@aol.com]

Sounds good, ordinarily I would be all in, but this year I am going to be jammed up 'til after first of the year.

Steve

[Chris Mangold]

Well we have to make this a monthly event then and get you signed up for January.

Chris

[Jim Tomlin]

I will be in Florida Dec. 11-19 but would be interested in hiking any
time after that, icy trails permitting (PATC lost one trail crew
member with a broken hip after slipping on an icy trail a couple years
ago, so any repeat of that during a Club-related activity would be
kind of embarrassing....). Perhaps we can form a PATC GPS Snowshoe
Team and GPS X-C Ski Team!!! I would lead trips for the latter group!

On an only slightly-related subject --- there was a lot of talk at the
ExCom Transition Meeting at Blackburn last weekend about getting more
young people involved in the Club (i.e. college-age). One idea that I
had subsequent to the meeting would be to contact university outdoor
clubs and ask if they would like to form a sub-group to help PATC
scout out trail conditions and do GPSing. The existing PATC Trail
Patrol considers itself an educational group and has never been
effective in helping trail maintainers with the information that they
need. Trail Patrol goes out when they want and where they want, not
where they are needed. My early ideas are to have 2 PATC member
adults of each gender help to put together these groups of young
people and organize productive activities for them, where trail
maintenance supervisors and Maps supervisors do the work assignments
for them. The Club can procure passenger vans for transportation and
use our larger cabins for bases of operations. We would need a catchy
name or names for them...PATC Sentinels? PATC Rangers? Does anyone
else think this is anything other than a completely dumb idea?

Jim T.

On Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 3:31 PM, Thom Kaye <tgk...@comcast.net> wrote:

[Thom Kaye]

Jim-
I think it's safe to say that any opportunity we have to educate
young people is never a dumb idea. Especially when it benefits the
clubs assets.
Now that this project is well underway, I am starting to see more and
more people interested in volunteering. It appears that this type of
volunteer work is rather appealing. I bet if we reached out to the
Geography Club at George Mason University or other Geo clubs in
academia, we would get a sizable response. Of course we would need to

orm a PATC GPS Snowshoe
> Team and GPS X-C Ski Team!!!  I would lead trips for the latter group!
>
> On an only slightly-related subject --- there was a lot of talk at the
> ExCom Transition Meeting at Blackburn last weekend about getting more
> young people involved in the Club (i.e. college-age).  One idea that I
> had subsequent to the meeting would be to contact university outdoor
> clubs and ask if they would like to form a sub-group to help PATC
> scout out trail conditions and do GPSing.  The existing PATC Trail
> Patrol considers itself an educational group and has never been
> effective in helping trail maintainers with the information that they
> need.  Trail Patrol goes out when they want and where they want, not
> where they are needed.  My early ideas are to have 2 PATC member
> adults of each gender help to put together these groups of young
> people and organize productive activities for them, where trail
> maintenance supervisors and Maps supervisors do the work assignments
> for them.  The Club can procure passenger vans for transportation and
> use our larger cabins for bases of operations.  We would need a catchy
> name or names for them...PATC Sentinels?  PATC Rangers?  Does anyone

> else think this is anything other than helping trail maintainers with the information that they

> need.  Trail Patrol goes out when they want and where they want, not
> where they are needed.  My early ideas are to have 2 PATC member
> adults of each gender help to put together these groups of young
> people and organize productive activities for them, where trail
> maintenance supervisors and Maps supervisors do the work assignments
> for them.  The Club can procure passenger vans for transportation and
> use our larger cabins for bases of operations.  We would need a catchy
> name or names for them...PATC Sentinels?  PATC Rangers?  Does anyone
> else think this is anything other than a completely dumb idea?
>
> Jim T.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 3:31 PM, Thom Kaye <tgk...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > Now that the leaves are off and the air is crisp I was hoping to hit
> > the trails for a long hike. I'd like to put a dent in the Tuscarora
> > Trail. I figured a good place to start would be at its origin in
> > Shenandoah NP. I figure the TT and AT intersection (Matthews Arm
> > Campground) would make for a good starting point for a few circuits.
> > Perhaps a few of us could meet up and head off in different
> > directions? I'm thinking in a few weeks before Christmas. Who is up

> > for it?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Mrzac...@aol.com]

VA Tech Outing  Club may be a good source for information about what works with their age group, but I will caution you their's is a different focus than most of us older folks. But commo is important to them and so being wired (actually wireless) seems the key. Facebook, texting, tweeting. And the VA Tech group is more focused on having fun first and AT maintaining further down the list. In some ways not as committed. We discussed youth involvement at VA RPC this Fall and Alison from VARO had some insights as a recent graduate from that demographic. Mostly focused on offer me something, electronic addiction and let me chose without being obligated. If you want I may have contact info for both the above named. 

 

In a message dated 12/6/2010 10:48:29 Eastern Standard Time, jfto...@gmail.com writes:

I will be in Florida Dec. 11-19 but would be interested in hiking any
time after that, icy trails permitting (PATC lost one trail crew
member with a broken hip after slipping on an icy trail a couple years
ago, so any repeat of that during a Club-related activity would be

kind of embarrassing....).  Perhaps we can form a PATC GPS Snowshoe

Team and GPS X-C Ski Team!!!  I would lead trips for the latter group!

On an only slightly-related subject --- there was a lot of talk at the
ExCom Transition Meeting at Blackburn last weekend about getting more
young people involved in the Club (i.e. college-age).  One idea that I
had subsequent to the meeting would be to contact university outdoor
clubs and ask if they would like to form a sub-group to help PATC
scout out trail conditions and do GPSing.  The existing PATC Trail
Patrol considers itself an educational group and has never been
effective in helping trail maintainers with the information that they
need.  Trail Patrol goes out when they want and where they want, not
where they are needed.  My early ideas are to have 2 PATC member
adults of each gender help to put together these groups of young
people and organize productive activities for them, where trail
maintenance supervisors and Maps supervisors do the work assignments
for them.  The Club can procure passenger vans for transportation and
use our larger cabins for bases of operations.  We would need a catchy
name or names for them...PATC Sentinels?  PATC Rangers?  Does anyone

[Mrzac...@aol.com]

I have a relationship with the geography prof at Emory & Henry College and have provided field opportunities along the AT for them in the past. Can approach them if it suits our needs.

Steve

 

In a message dated 12/6/2010 16:23:05 Eastern Standard Time, tgk...@comcast.net writes:

Jim-
   I think it's safe to say that any opportunity we have to educate
young people is never a dumb idea. Especially when it benefits the
clubs assets.
Now that this project is well underway, I am starting to see more and
more people interested in volunteering. It appears that this type of
volunteer work is rather appealing. I bet if we reached out to the
Geography Club at George Mason University or other Geo clubs in
academia, we would get a sizable response. Of course we would need to

orm a PATC GPS Snowshoe
> Team and GPS X-C Ski Team!!!  I would lead trips for the latter group!
>
> On an only slightly-related subject --- there was a lot of talk at the
> ExCom Transition Meeting at Blackburn last weekend about getting more
> young people involved in the Club (i.e. college-age).  One idea that I
> had subsequent to the meeting would be to contact university outdoor
> clubs and ask if they would like to form a sub-group to help PATC
> scout out trail conditions and do GPSing.  The existing PATC Trail
> Patrol considers itself an educational group and has never been
> effective in helping trail maintainers with the information that they
> need.  Trail Patrol goes out when they want and where they want, not
> where they are needed.  My early ideas are to have 2 PATC member
> adults of each gender help to put together these groups of young
> people and organize productive activities for them, where trail
> maintenance supervisors and Maps supervisors do the work assignments
> for them.  The Club can procure passenger vans for transportation and
> use our larger cabins for bases of operations.  We would need a catchy
> name or names for them...PATC Sentinels?  PATC Rangers?  Does anyone

> else think this is anything other than helping trail maintainers with the information that they

> need.  Trail Patrol goes out when they want and where they want, not
> where they are needed.  My early ideas are to have 2 PATC member
> adults of each gender help to put together these groups of young
> people and organize productive activities for them, where trail
> maintenance supervisors and Maps supervisors do the work assignments
> for them.  The Club can procure passenger vans for transportation and
> use our larger cabins for bases of operations.  We would need a catchy
> name or names for them...PATC Sentinels?  PATC Rangers?  Does anyone
> else think this is anything other than a completely dumb idea?
>
> Jim T.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 3:31 PM, Thom Kaye <tgk...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > Now that the leaves are off and the air is crisp I was hoping to hit
> > the trails for a long hike. I'd like to put a dent in the Tuscarora
> > Trail. I figured a good place to start would be at its origin in
> > Shenandoah NP. I figure the TT and AT intersection (Matthews Arm
> > Campground) would make for a good starting point for a few circuits.
> > Perhaps a few of us could meet up and head off in different
> > directions? I'm thinking in a few weeks before Christmas. Who is up

[Jim Tomlin]

There used to be an outdoor club at the U of Maryland where I went
from '73 to '86 for various degrees. They were very active. I'll see
if they still exist.

PATC ExCom was under the misguided impression that we can recruit
young people to work just like us old geezers in the Club. I tried to
inform them that students' entire suite of motivations are completely
different; they are not going to be driving their reliable new car all
by themselves out into the woods and work on a segment of trail for
years and years. They want fun and interesting experiences, social in
nature, with friends, accomplishing reasonable challenges, using
modern technology. I told ExCom that what we want them for is not to
replace us today, but to replace us in 30-40 years.

Jim T.

[Mrzac...@aol.com]

From old reliable, responsible guy perspective, from what I have heard and seen, you stated it well, as a generality, they want to do what they want, when they want, mostly fun, fun being variably defined and changeable on a peer's whim, and no or limited responsibility. I can tell horror stories of handing serious work to college students and neophytes. BUT we can and must meet their challenge in order to secure a future. A tough sell, that. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. My recent college student experiences returned little useful data but did expose 30 or more students to the theretofore unknown AT.

[Jim Tomlin]

PATC trail crews have had very wide-ranging experience with college
students as volunteers. The failures tend to have occurred when group
sizes were large, group composition was diverse, and the students and
their college adult chaperones were expected to independently take
responsibility. The successes tend to occur when the project is
well-defined, group size is kept small, members of the group are
already familiar with each other, a PATC volunteer with experience
leading young people directs the show and provides continual
oversight. We have a few college professor and military training
volunteers that work very well with students and have accomplished
some darn good projects.

I am not thinking that these groups would be essential for the GPS
trail data collection project; we can certainly do it without them.
Where I think there would be a win-win situation would be for them to
learn about using modern technology to best scout out a system of
trails in one area for purposes of identifying issues for trail
maintainers. This would include GPSing, so we may as well have them
follow the data collection protocols this project is using. I am
thinking they would enjoy learning the navigation skills, data
collection skills, communication skills, organization skills, and
learn about trails and what to look for when scouting a trail. And
eventually some of them may become the trail leaders of 2040 and
beyond.

Jim T.