pat stuck in transmit

[MJ Inabnit]

Hello again,

I installed latest version of pat tonight hoping to cure the locked
transmit issue. No joy. I start ardop & pat, all is normal. Once I
select a station to connect to and click connect, my radio transmits one
burst then remains in transmit. Nothing else is transmitted. Ardop log
says PTT TRUE.

I'm stumped. I can't seem to find a solution to get ardop & pat working
again.

Here's what I have installed on this Mint laptop:

ii pat 0.14.1 amd64 A portable Winlink client for amateur radio email.

ii libhamlib-utils 4.5.5-1 amd64 Utilities to support the hamlib radio
control library

ii libhamlib4:amd64 4.5.5-1 amd64 Run-time library to control radio
transceivers and receivers

Linux 5.15.0-71-generic #78-Ubuntu SMP Tue Apr 18 09:00:29 UTC 2023
x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

Linux Mint 21.1 Vera

startup commands:
./ardopc_64 8515 plughw:1,0 plughw:1,0 (using terminal one)
rigctld -m 2037 -r /dev/ttyUSB2 -s 115200 & pat http (using a second
terminal)

Hopefully someone knows the secret.

Tnx & 73
Jaye ke6sls

--

wishing you well
Jaye, ke6sls--via the toshiba w/thunderchicken

[Martin Hebnes Pedersen]

Hi Jaye,

AFAIK this is a known issue with ARDOPc and some kernel versions.

Are you running the latest build of ARDOPc? Not sure if it helps, or if you need to upgrade/downgrade to another kernel. Hopefully someone with more details knowledge will join in on this thread to help you out :)

-- 

73 de LA5NTA / Martin

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[MJ Inabnit]

Tnx for replay Martin,

How could I know if I have latest ARDOPc? I don't know how to discern
its version/date.

Tnx & 73
Jaye

On 5/3/23 7:08 AM, Martin Hebnes Pedersen wrote:
> Hi Jaye,
>
> AFAIK this is a known issue with ARDOPc and some kernel versions.
>
> Are you running the latest build of ARDOPc? Not sure if it helps, or if
> you need to upgrade/downgrade to another kernel. Hopefully someone with
> more details knowledge will join in on this thread to help you out :)
>
> -- 
> 73 de LA5NTA / Martin
>
> ons. 3. mai 2023, 07:15 skrev MJ Inabnit <ke6...@arrl.net

> <mailto:ke6...@arrl.net>>:

> <mailto:pat-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com>.

> To view this discussion on the web, visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pat-users/1f5ef514-dd2d-66f4-de27-32151409906b%40arrl.net.
>

[MJ Inabnit]

I had ardopc_64 installed. Went to:
http://www.cantab.net/users/john.wiseman/Downloads/Beta/

Found ardopc64 with build date 2022-04-09 .. So I've installed and
started it. Now I don't have a problem with PTT locking, but the modem
won't decode a single packet.

While trying to connect to a node, killed ardopc64 and started ardopc_64
which then copied every single packet :|

I hope someone can offer some assistance to restore pat/ardop here.

tnx agn, 73

Jaye ke6sls

On 5/3/23 7:08 AM, Martin Hebnes Pedersen wrote:

> Hi Jaye,
>
> AFAIK this is a known issue with ARDOPc and some kernel versions.
>
> Are you running the latest build of ARDOPc? Not sure if it helps, or if
> you need to upgrade/downgrade to another kernel. Hopefully someone with
> more details knowledge will join in on this thread to help you out :)
>
> -- 
> 73 de LA5NTA / Martin
>
> ons. 3. mai 2023, 07:15 skrev MJ Inabnit <ke6...@arrl.net

> <mailto:ke6...@arrl.net>>:

> <mailto:pat-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com>.

> To view this discussion on the web, visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pat-users/1f5ef514-dd2d-66f4-de27-32151409906b%40arrl.net.
>

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> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pat-users/CAAUuLGkaEbVsF0VMn52b96KMkpVLN9ReB4ZczaLWA3esupQvrw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.

[Martin Hebnes Pedersen]

Hi again Jaye,

I had the same issues with the ardopc64 binary hosted on John's website. I think it might be outdated.

What I ended up doing was to build from source (a zip file located in the same Beta/ folder). That seems to work ok, but be aware that ARDOPc also has problems on newer kernels when it comes to decoding. Setting --leaderlength 200 seems to help, but I think running an older kernel is the better option right now :/

I have my fingers crossed and hoping that we'll see improvements in ARDOPc soon :)

-- 

73 de LA5NTA / Martin

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[Cal Brabandt]

I don't think this is the kernel incompatibility issue (unless PTT is cycling looking for an ACK over and over, perhaps), Jaye, but I'll reply to this thread with some info that might help you get ardopc running after you get PTT working.

On Tuesday, May 2, 2023 at 10:15:39 PM UTC-7 ke6...@arrl.net wrote:

<SNIP>

I installed latest version of pat tonight hoping to cure the locked
transmit issue. No joy. I start ardop & pat, all is normal. Once I
select a station to connect to and click connect, my radio transmits one
burst then remains in transmit. Nothing else is transmitted. Ardop log
says PTT TRUE.

[Cal Brabandt]

To obtain your ardopc version, use:

ardopc --help | grep Version

ardopc Version 1.0.4.1qBPQ is the version I most recently built. You'll need a fairly recent version that supports the --leaderlength command line option. If you get a libc6 "glibc" error with a downloaded binary, you'll need to do your own (simple) build of ardopc from source.

"Red" (PE1RRR) posted a great summary on the groups.io board recently:

https://ardop.groups.io/g/users/topics

I also use a custom .asoundrc file, that I wrote with elements from Red's, John's (G8PBQ), and other contributor's works. Red's dsnoop and dmix .asoundrc elements and John's --leaderlength are the key elements needed to work around the new(ish) kernel issue.

I launch four terminal tabs (xterm, terminator, whatever) with <ctl+sh+T> and, for my setup, I use the following commands, one in each tab so I can kill the aps separately and easily with <ctl+C>. You'll have to adjust the command lines for your setup:

1. rigctld -m 3073 -r /dev/ttyUSB0 -s 19200

2. ardopc --leaderlength 200

My .asoundrc supports the ardopc defaults (ARDOP ARDOP and port 8515). So only --leaderlength. 200 is necessary on the CLI and 200 is almost always the optimum leaderlength value for my systems, but others have used up to 320, I think. It took me hours of trials on several x86/amd64 and arm64 systems to prove to myself that 200 was the magic number, but I've never been able to get my Pinebook Pro working, regardless. Sometimes ya' just have to give up and move on to find something that works and I have many other computers that work.

3. alsamixer -c1

Only alsamixer works with ardopc while it's running, in my experience. Other volume controls (GUI) usually crash ardopc or block it. Don't use other volume controls at the same time. Again--just my experience.

4. pat http

Next I launch a browser, connect and do email! :)

alsamixer and ardopc sometimes fail to work properly the first time, until after tha alsa state file gets worked out, I think. Rebooting usually fixes it forever. I have some notes in my .asoundrc file about that. I use alsamixer to adjust both capture (input) and modulation (output) levels. John recommends shooting for capture levels  of ~ +/- 20,000, but it's not critical. Output for modulation will depend on your rig. Like most digital modes, most users probably endeavor to avoid higher levels that activate their rig's ALC. The alsamixer component of my setup has nothing to do with the kernel issue. I just mention it here because I think it improves performance.

I have no commercial interest in Inovato but I donated a package of HF and packet pat files files to the Inovato Quadra ham version project (all open source). The Quadra ham setup is mostly as I've described here but launches everything with a script and I, personally, prefer rigctld over flrig and terminal tabs with CLI over a script. I use command history a lot! I used pat-gensio for the Quadra ham version as well (which I need to update with a new build).

I've posted my .asoundrc file over on groups.io. Others .asoundrc files will work too. I've made a few relatively inconsequential changes to it, including changing a sample rate typo from 44000 to 48000 but 44000 probably falls back to a default value and 44100, and 48000 have all worked for me. Do to my changes, I'll post my latest .asoundrc file here now but, again, there are other files that work or fulfill other needs that users have published on groups.io.

I hope this post helps. I use ardopc with Pat a few times a week here in rural Idaho for "Winlink Wednesday" (no 2m packet here) and I'm an open source kind of guy. With an eye on attachment size (I set a limit for my account at Winlink.org) ardopc is fast enough for my needs.

My .asoundrc (I'm not an ALSA expert, but who is? ;)). There could be some line wrap errors pasting here.

73,

Cal -- AD8Q

=======================================================

# ~/.asoundrc
# Try starting ardopc with
# "ardopc --leaderlength 200 8515 ARDOP ARDOP"
#
# Two independent PCM alsamixer volume controls should be present--
# one control for playback and one control for capture.
#
# If "vestigial" controls from past ALSA configurations appear in
# alsamixer, then the ALSA state may need to be reset:
#
# After editing /var/lib/alsa/asound.state, run:
# $ alsactl restore
# Which will read that file. Also need to "close" the soundcard, which means:
# $ cat /proc/asound/card0/pcm0p/sub0/hw_params
# closed
# See https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=172940 for the above simple
# method or search the web for other more complex soutions, if necessary.
#
pcm.dsnooped0 {
   type dsnoop
   ipc_key 50000
   ipc_key_add_uid false   # let multiple users share
   ipc_perm 0666           # IPC permissions for multi-user sharing (octal, default 0600)
   slave {
       pcm "hw:1,0"
       channels 1
   }
}

pcm.dmix0 {
   type dmix
   ipc_key 60000
   ipc_key_add_uid false   # let multiple users share
   ipc_perm 0666           # IPC permissions for multi-user sharing (octal, default 0600)
   slave {
       pcm "hw:1,0"
       rate 48000
   }
}

pcm.preARDOP2IN {type rate slave {pcm "plug:dsnooped0" rate 48000}}
pcm.ARDOP2OUT {type rate slave {pcm "plug:dmix0" rate 48000}}

# this is the rate adjustment suggested by John Wiseman
# Point ARDOP to ARDOP2IN and ARDOP2OUT for rate conversion
pcm.ARDOP {type rate slave {pcm "split_vol" rate 48000}}

# this creates a split volume control, with control on just the input to ARDOPC
pcm.split_vol {
     type asym
       playback.pcm {type plug slave.pcm  "ARDOP2OUT"}
       capture.pcm {type plug slave.pcm   "capture_mixer"}
     }

# this is the actual mixer control
pcm.capture_mixer {
     type softvol
       slave.pcm "preARDOP2IN" control {name "PCM Capture Volume"}
       min_dB -20.0
       max_dB  30.0

On Wednesday, May 3, 2023 at 10:05:58 AM UTC-7 ke6...@arrl.net wrote:

<SNIP>

How could I know if I have latest ARDOPc? I don't know how to discern
its version/date.

<SNIP>

[Cal Brabandt]

One more possible option to deal with the post-5.10 kernel ardopc problem under x86-64:

Current MX Linux and its cousin, antiX, distros still support 4.x and 5.10 kernel options. I've used 4.19. After installing the OS, they are available using the "MX Package Installer" utility. I run them from USB sticks when I don't want to bother testing with --leaderlength but changing the kernel on a "live" USB stick (with persistence) requires another step or two beyond simply running a single utility from a "normal" installed-to-disk-drive OS.

I noticed a suggestion to fallback to an older kernel here in this thread and this might be another option for some users.

-Cal (AD8Q)

[Cal Brabandt]

I hope you're making progress, Jaye.

I've written a few more notes and thoughts, in no particular order, here. I vaguely remember having PTT stick on my Icom 7100 or 7300, but I can't remember the circumstances. It might not have even happened while using Pat.

I use a slower rigctld baud rate (-s 19200). Maybe try that or even slower with your Kenwood. (-m 2037 means you are using a TS-590SG, right?)

Maybe try ferrite beads (or more ferrite beads) on the USB cable. I've had some problems without them but, again, I don't recall the exact problems I've experienced.

It's unlikely to make a difference, but you could launch rigctld but don't launch Pat in your 2nd terminal. After launching rigctld, launch Pat in a third terminal. I assume that when Pat launches it is happy with the rigctl connection (no errors) and that's why I think this is unlikely to help but it's easy to try.

What happens when you try to control PTT directly with rigctl? You can read the man page "man rigctl" but the following PTT control method works with my Icom 7300 and 7100 radios and you can change the command line for your radio.

First, create a simple "ptt_cmd.txt" file that contains the following lines or something similar:

pause 2
set_ptt 1
pause 2
set_ptt 0
pause 2
set_ptt 1
pause 2
set_ptt 0

Then run:

rigctl -m 3073 -r /dev/ttyUSB0 -s 19200 - < ptt_cmd.txt

(Notice the dash before the input symbol and filename in the above command line.)

The rigctl man page says:

       T, set_ptt 'PTT'
              Set 'PTT'.

              PTT is a value: ‘0’ (RX), ‘1’ (TX), ‘2’ (TX mic), or ‘3’ (TX data).

So a '1' seems to be a general xmit command, but there's '2' and '3' to try as well. I've never used anything but '1' and '0'.

WRT Pat, here's my rig section:

"hamlib_rigs": {
  "My-Rig": {"address": "127.0.0.1:4532", "network": "tcp"}
  },

My ardop section: 

"ardop": {
    "addr": "127.0.0.1:8515",
    "arq_bandwidth": {
      "Forced": false,
      "Max": 500
    },
    "rig": "My-Rig",
    "ptt_ctrl": true,
    "beacon_interval": 0,
    "cwid_enabled": true
  },

Can you boot your x86_64 laptop from a microSD card (in an adapter, if necessary) or a USB stick? Worst case, I could send either flash memory formats with an MX-Linux or antiX live OS installed that has everything working on my HP laptops and my Icom radios, Then you could view the command history in a terminal and just change your commands and a few files to use it, including my .aroundrc file, which isn't part of your problem but I'd include it anyway.

Also, FWIW, I don't think I've ever used an ardopc binary that I've not built myself. I could certainly try both the posted binary and my binary before sending a live boot system to you and include them both.

From https://www.kenwood.com/usa/com/amateur/ts-590sg/control.html

■PC control through USB connectivity

PC control of the transceiver and transceiver audio transmission have been made possible through a USB cable with the inclusion of a dedicated PC-control USB connection terminal.

*Delays may occur when using USB audio. We recommend using USB audio in situations where time lag is not an issue.

It speaks of only of audio delays rather than control / PTT delays and I don't know when "time lag is not an issue" or what to think of the warning but do you know of other operators who are using your rig with Pat and ardopc? Is there a Kenwood forum or group? Do you have another external sound card to try? Of course then you'll need cabling, which is usually a hassle if you don't have it on hand.

Well--that's all I can come up with for now. Maybe I'll remember something else or think of something new and I'll post again. If you don't solve it, let me know if you'd like to try a USB live OS boot. My older HP laptop can boot from its SD card slot but my newer HP only boots from USB 2 and 3. I assume your laptop can boot from USB 2 or 3.

73,

Cal (AD8Q)

On Tuesday, May 2, 2023 at 10:15:39 PM UTC-7 ke6...@arrl.net wrote:

[C. Matthew Curtin]

I can confirm that I have the same behavior with ardopc in kernels AFTER 5.15.0. The last time I got a good build of ardopc was with 5.15.0 and Kali, which is also the last kernel that I can run and have ardopc run properly. (5.15.0-kali2-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 5.15.5-2kali2 (2021-12-22) x86_64 GNU/Linux).

Since that time, I've had a few different issues but the last few revs of the kernel, it starts transmit and just doesn't let go of PTT. I can use rigctl to get it to quit transmitting but that's obviously no solution. I haven't had time to dig into it further.

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