Duration of program
30 views
Skip to first unread message
Judah
Sep 10, 2010, 6:37:49 AM9/10/10
to NIH Oxford Cambridge Scholars Program Current Student Discussion Forum
Hi,
I am wondering if people are having problems with sorting out exactly
how long they have, in total, to complete and submit their dphil at
Oxford? I understand the program informed us that we should try to
finish in 3 years when I was accepted into the program but, as a
subcomponent of the GPP program at the NIH, we were told we have up to
5 years of funding to complete the training. Is anyone aware of
department specific deadlines for submitting at Oxford? (e.g. 4 years
in microbiology versus 3 years in chemistry, or something?)
Thanks
I am wondering if people are having problems with sorting out exactly
how long they have, in total, to complete and submit their dphil at
Oxford? I understand the program informed us that we should try to
finish in 3 years when I was accepted into the program but, as a
subcomponent of the GPP program at the NIH, we were told we have up to
5 years of funding to complete the training. Is anyone aware of
department specific deadlines for submitting at Oxford? (e.g. 4 years
in microbiology versus 3 years in chemistry, or something?)
Thanks
Molly Bright
Sep 10, 2010, 4:20:25 PM9/10/10
to NIH Oxford Cambridge Scholars Program Current Student Discussion Forum
Hi Judah,
As someone nearing the end of my degree, I've been encountering the
"official" stance on this issue and can at least offer my own
experience. Pretty much all sciencey-Oxbridge DPhil students are on a
3-3.5 year funding scheme. However, most students need slightly more
time than this to finish up and submit their thesis, and end up
funding themselves for the last few months of writing up (many people
disappear to a parent's house, or look for other funding).
Oxford's official expectation is that DPhil students will submit their
thesis before their 13th term as an enrolled student. For most people
matriculating during Michaelmas term, this means that the thesis must
be submitted the day before the start of Michaelmas term four years
later (this year, this is October 8th for Oxford). If you want to
continue on as a student after this point, you must apply for an
extension or your status will "lapse" and you will have to spend lots
of cash to become an active student later on in order to finally
submit your thesis.
There is some pressure to complete within this four year/12 term
window: many funding bodies use the statistic of "what percentage of
students complete in four years" to judge PIs and universities. You
should talk with your Oxbridge supervisor to determine how they feel
about this. The paperwork isn't very complicated: you just need to
say how long you want an extension and why. Then you need to get your
supervisor to agree, which may be the key step, and your college and
department will usually follow suit. From the NIH perspective, I get
the sense that most people don't care about a few extra terms here or
there. Again, this will vary depending on how much money your lab
has, etc. There *is a cap of 5 years as a fellow at NIH, but I think
we've seen some people (Andy Johnson, maybe?) find a workaround for
this rule.
I'm surprised that you were told this was a 3 year program: the rough
average seems to me to be hovering at 4+ years, although we should get
some program alumni stats to validate that. I was under the
impression that the 50-50 time split between the two sites was more
emphatically pressed than a precise overall duration. Who was
suggesting the 3 year limit? Also, just keep in mind that we are not
in a GPP framework since the NIH OxCam program split off and is based
in NIAID rather than OITE.
I hope this helps, and people should definitely weigh in if they are
aware of things I am not!
Cheers,
Molly (Oxford, Dept. of Clinical Neurology, Medical Sciences Division,
applying for a 1 term extension so I can apply during my 13th term,
aka Michaelmas Term, 2010).
As someone nearing the end of my degree, I've been encountering the
"official" stance on this issue and can at least offer my own
experience. Pretty much all sciencey-Oxbridge DPhil students are on a
3-3.5 year funding scheme. However, most students need slightly more
time than this to finish up and submit their thesis, and end up
funding themselves for the last few months of writing up (many people
disappear to a parent's house, or look for other funding).
Oxford's official expectation is that DPhil students will submit their
thesis before their 13th term as an enrolled student. For most people
matriculating during Michaelmas term, this means that the thesis must
be submitted the day before the start of Michaelmas term four years
later (this year, this is October 8th for Oxford). If you want to
continue on as a student after this point, you must apply for an
extension or your status will "lapse" and you will have to spend lots
of cash to become an active student later on in order to finally
submit your thesis.
There is some pressure to complete within this four year/12 term
window: many funding bodies use the statistic of "what percentage of
students complete in four years" to judge PIs and universities. You
should talk with your Oxbridge supervisor to determine how they feel
about this. The paperwork isn't very complicated: you just need to
say how long you want an extension and why. Then you need to get your
supervisor to agree, which may be the key step, and your college and
department will usually follow suit. From the NIH perspective, I get
the sense that most people don't care about a few extra terms here or
there. Again, this will vary depending on how much money your lab
has, etc. There *is a cap of 5 years as a fellow at NIH, but I think
we've seen some people (Andy Johnson, maybe?) find a workaround for
this rule.
I'm surprised that you were told this was a 3 year program: the rough
average seems to me to be hovering at 4+ years, although we should get
some program alumni stats to validate that. I was under the
impression that the 50-50 time split between the two sites was more
emphatically pressed than a precise overall duration. Who was
suggesting the 3 year limit? Also, just keep in mind that we are not
in a GPP framework since the NIH OxCam program split off and is based
in NIAID rather than OITE.
I hope this helps, and people should definitely weigh in if they are
aware of things I am not!
Cheers,
Molly (Oxford, Dept. of Clinical Neurology, Medical Sciences Division,
applying for a 1 term extension so I can apply during my 13th term,
aka Michaelmas Term, 2010).
richard Siegel
Sep 10, 2010, 5:09:04 PM9/10/10
to oxcams...@googlegroups.com
Molly,
Your impression is correct in that there are negative consequences for Oxford and Cambridge for going past 4 years -right now the average time to completion of Ph.D. is 4.2 years for OxCam Ph.D. students and 3.9 Years for OxCam MD/PHD students. Only about 20% of students are finishing in 3 years (mostly those who had previous experience in their Ph.D. labs as post-bacs or HHMI students". We (the NIH oxcam program) will support a student up to 5 years under NIH-wide IRTA guidelines, and about 30% of the students are currently taking more than 4 years.
Judah, as a 2007 entering student you should be aiming to finish in 2011 - we will be sending out a survey to all MD/PHD students soon about meeting with me or Craig Blackstone to discuss finishing up. Feel free additionally to give me a call anytime to discuss
Richard
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "NIH Oxford Cambridge Scholars Program Current Student Discussion Forum" group.
To post to this group, send email to oxcams...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to oxcamstudent...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/oxcamstudents?hl=en.
Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages