[osg-users] Why no games with OSG?
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michael kapelko
Apr 24, 2012, 4:28:25 AM4/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi.
I'm new to OSG. I use OGRE for my game currently, but due to various
issues I would like to switch to OSG.
I coudn't find any info on games made with OSG, no pictures in OSG
Forum -> Album -> Games, no Google results, only some simulations and
other non-game stuff. The only game I found is FlightGear.
I wonder why are there no games on OSG? Or am I missing something?
Thanks.
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I'm new to OSG. I use OGRE for my game currently, but due to various
issues I would like to switch to OSG.
I coudn't find any info on games made with OSG, no pictures in OSG
Forum -> Album -> Games, no Google results, only some simulations and
other non-game stuff. The only game I found is FlightGear.
I wonder why are there no games on OSG? Or am I missing something?
Thanks.
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osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
http://lists.openscenegraph.org/listinfo.cgi/osg-users-openscenegraph.org
Maxim Gammer
Apr 24, 2012, 4:35:07 AM4/24/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Hi. "games for training" examples....
http://www.openscenegraph.org/projects/osg/wiki/Screenshots/RI
http://www.openscenegraph.org/projects/osg/wiki/Screenshots/TSOGU
2012/4/24 michael kapelko <kor...@gmail.com>:
--
Maxim Gammer
michael kapelko
Apr 24, 2012, 4:54:21 AM4/24/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Yes, that's what I meant by "simulations and other non-game stuff".
I mean games like Half-Life, Morrowind, Garsharp, Proun, for end users
to relax, not for any kind of training.
I mean games like Half-Life, Morrowind, Garsharp, Proun, for end users
to relax, not for any kind of training.
Sebastian Messerschmidt
Apr 24, 2012, 7:48:29 AM4/24/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Hi Michael,
I guess that there some reasons we don't see OSG for games so much.
First, OGRE is more than a render kit if I remember correctly and OSG is
not a game engine per se.
As most people starting with games want to see fast progress they often
stick to a game engine where they don't have to care about the details
so much in the beginning.
OSG is first of all a scene graph that brings some really nice add-ons
like event handlers, node-kits and it can read various input formats for
geometry and images.
But it doesn't abstract game objects/physical entities, neither does it
primarily manage the rest of game.
For me this is the reason I never sticked to one of the game engines
around there, as I really need a clean rendering framework, that only
serves as a back end for me.
Also I think that many people simply go with DirectX. There are heaps of
tutorials and game projects based on this which is sort of a
multiplicator for DirectX.
Personally I think of OSG as an extensible framework for rendering. I
perform all the control regarding the objects in the scene in components
that aren't really aware of the rendering part at all.
cheers
Sebastian
I guess that there some reasons we don't see OSG for games so much.
First, OGRE is more than a render kit if I remember correctly and OSG is
not a game engine per se.
As most people starting with games want to see fast progress they often
stick to a game engine where they don't have to care about the details
so much in the beginning.
OSG is first of all a scene graph that brings some really nice add-ons
like event handlers, node-kits and it can read various input formats for
geometry and images.
But it doesn't abstract game objects/physical entities, neither does it
primarily manage the rest of game.
For me this is the reason I never sticked to one of the game engines
around there, as I really need a clean rendering framework, that only
serves as a back end for me.
Also I think that many people simply go with DirectX. There are heaps of
tutorials and game projects based on this which is sort of a
multiplicator for DirectX.
Personally I think of OSG as an extensible framework for rendering. I
perform all the control regarding the objects in the scene in components
that aren't really aware of the rendering part at all.
cheers
Sebastian
Garth D
Apr 24, 2012, 7:56:48 AM4/24/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Hi Michael,
I don't believe you'll find too many games, but you'll find a
respectable number of completed simulations and other projects, along
with a good number of people working professionally with it.
Coming from an OGRE background you'll probably appreciate the number of
included examples, the speed in which you can get started, and the
presence of the osgconv tool, which doesn't really have an OGRE equivalent.
Of course, the best way to determine suitability for your own project is
to experiment with it. There are plenty of included examples that will
guide you in this; I went through a similar process myself.
Cheers,
Garth
Thomas Hogarth
Apr 24, 2012, 10:09:08 AM4/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi Micheal
I've completed a few games with OSG
http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/apptoyz-alien-attack/id412615924?mt=8
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apptoyz-tin-can-alley/id457520117?mt=8
I find no problem using osg for games, if you just treat osg as a wrapper around OpenGL and not a game engine.
There's also the osgbullet lib to handle physics and collisions.
The main difference you'll find is that rather then calling a specific draw fuction to render your model you need to make sure it can be attached to the scene graph in some way,
I tend to have a level class with a osg::MatrixTransform, then all level entities are attached to that etc.
Hope that helps
Tom
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47257#47257
I've completed a few games with OSG
http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/apptoyz-alien-attack/id412615924?mt=8
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apptoyz-tin-can-alley/id457520117?mt=8
I find no problem using osg for games, if you just treat osg as a wrapper around OpenGL and not a game engine.
There's also the osgbullet lib to handle physics and collisions.
The main difference you'll find is that rather then calling a specific draw fuction to render your model you need to make sure it can be attached to the scene graph in some way,
I tend to have a level class with a osg::MatrixTransform, then all level entities are attached to that etc.
Hope that helps
Tom
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47257#47257
Terry Welsh
Apr 24, 2012, 1:24:49 PM4/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Well, my game is called Retrobooster, but it isn't finished yet. It's
at www.reallyslick.com and it's all for fun; absolutely not for
simulation, training, or education of any kind. Yuck! OSG has been a
good tool for this so far, but I have little experience with game
engines such as Ogre. I can't imagine using plain DirectX or OpenGL.
If you want to have any kind of complexity in the rendering, you
really need higher-level tools than that.
And I recall seeing screenshots for Pirates of the XXI Century, but I
don't know if that game was ever finished. Anyone know what happened
to it?
- Terry
at www.reallyslick.com and it's all for fun; absolutely not for
simulation, training, or education of any kind. Yuck! OSG has been a
good tool for this so far, but I have little experience with game
engines such as Ogre. I can't imagine using plain DirectX or OpenGL.
If you want to have any kind of complexity in the rendering, you
really need higher-level tools than that.
And I recall seeing screenshots for Pirates of the XXI Century, but I
don't know if that game was ever finished. Anyone know what happened
to it?
- Terry
Jason Daly
Apr 24, 2012, 2:42:41 PM4/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
On 04/24/2012 01:24 PM, Terry Welsh wrote:
And I recall seeing screenshots for Pirates of the XXI Century, but I don't know if that game was ever finished. Anyone know what happened to it?
I was going to mention it, but I couldn't find any active links for
it either. I saw it being demoed in nVidia's booth at SIGGRAPH one
year. I don't know if it ever was finished, but it seems that the
developer Diosoft is now out of business.
It was a gorgeous-looking game, though. There are some screenshots here:
http://www.gamershell.com/pc/pirates_of_the_xxi_century/screenshots.html
--"J"
It was a gorgeous-looking game, though. There are some screenshots here:
http://www.gamershell.com/pc/pirates_of_the_xxi_century/screenshots.html
--"J"
Martin Naylor
Apr 24, 2012, 5:05:10 PM4/24/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Nice, lunar lander and thrust, :-), ok I am showing my age!
I assume that will be available on Iphone/Android?
Martin
I assume that will be available on Iphone/Android?
Martin
Shayne Tueller
Apr 24, 2012, 5:34:34 PM4/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi,
As others have pointed out, OSG is not a game engine. It's a scene graph and should be used in this context (no pun intended). There are plenty of rendering technologies that use OSG under the hood. When I went to IITSEC last year, there were a lot of vendors using OSG underneath for rendering.
In terms of gaming, take a look at Delta3D which is an open source gaming engine using OSG technology...
-Shayne
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47274#47274
michael kapelko
Apr 24, 2012, 9:38:04 PM4/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Shayne, yeah, I've found Delta3D, but I saw the same simulations in there.
As for OGRE, it's only rendering engine, it's so only for rendering,
that it uses external library for input which actually gives me most
headaches.
Terry, that's some very nice looking game! Good luck with that! Our
team is currently working on Mahjong:
http://opengamestudio.org/lang/en/ogs-mahjong , but we're thinking of
a scroll shooter too, once we finish Mahjong :)
As for OGRE, it's only rendering engine, it's so only for rendering,
that it uses external library for input which actually gives me most
headaches.
Terry, that's some very nice looking game! Good luck with that! Our
team is currently working on Mahjong:
http://opengamestudio.org/lang/en/ogs-mahjong , but we're thinking of
a scroll shooter too, once we finish Mahjong :)
michael kapelko
Apr 24, 2012, 11:14:21 PM4/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Thomas, great to see games for Apple.
Seeing games that actually exist I wonder why is Games -> Album empty
then. Its emptiness gives false impression of abandonment.
OGRE forums has Showcase forum where people advertise their work. I
see Announcments here, but it's 99% of job postings.
Also, the site posts monthly updates on people work progress which
gives good impression of what one can do with OGRE.
Why not do the same for OSG?
Robert Osfield
Apr 25, 2012, 4:39:15 AM4/25/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Hi Michael,
On 25 April 2012 04:14, michael kapelko <kor...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Seeing games that actually exist I wonder why is Games -> Album empty
> then.
Are you referring to a specific link on openscenegraph.org that is
empty, or just a general comment that Games and OSG aren't well
advertised? If the former could you point to the place where you are
looking.
> Its emptiness gives false impression of abandonment.
Our old Trac wiki is a little under loved.
> OGRE forums has Showcase forum where people advertise their work. I
> see Announcments here, but it's 99% of job postings.
> Also, the site posts monthly updates on people work progress which
> gives good impression of what one can do with OGRE.
>
> Why not do the same for OSG?
Good suggestion. Our Screenshots is kinda of showcase, but not a
great one given that it's not really keeping up to date, rather it's
got populated a number of years ago and hasn't been updated much
since.
With the new Joomla website in the works we can work on making the
content easier to use and find information for end users, as well make
it easier for the community to contribute to it, and for it to keep
track of latest news etc.
Feel free to chip in with the discussions on the new site.
--
As a general note about Games and OSG vs Ogre, I suspect it's partly
down the roots of each project and the culture that grew up around it.
OSG grew from the vis-sim world and over the years grew into a
general purpose and highly portable scene graph library, with it's
community coming form the professional simulator, large scale
visualization, VR and scientific markets. Whereas Ogre from the start
was graphics API for Games, it too though can be used for more things
than games but and culturally games looks to have remained it's
heartland.
Perhaps one aspect to our project websites that reflects the cultural
differences might be the professional non games market tends to not
put much effort in advertising results, major projects can roll out
ontop of the OSG and no one in the public ever gets to know about it -
even though they might see it on TV every day! Whereas in the Game
centric communities their is a demo scene sub-culture, great artwork,
effects and dynamic game sequences is what gets your work noticed.
Robert.
On 25 April 2012 04:14, michael kapelko <kor...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Seeing games that actually exist I wonder why is Games -> Album empty
> then.
empty, or just a general comment that Games and OSG aren't well
advertised? If the former could you point to the place where you are
looking.
> Its emptiness gives false impression of abandonment.
> OGRE forums has Showcase forum where people advertise their work. I
> see Announcments here, but it's 99% of job postings.
> Also, the site posts monthly updates on people work progress which
> gives good impression of what one can do with OGRE.
>
> Why not do the same for OSG?
great one given that it's not really keeping up to date, rather it's
got populated a number of years ago and hasn't been updated much
since.
With the new Joomla website in the works we can work on making the
content easier to use and find information for end users, as well make
it easier for the community to contribute to it, and for it to keep
track of latest news etc.
Feel free to chip in with the discussions on the new site.
--
As a general note about Games and OSG vs Ogre, I suspect it's partly
down the roots of each project and the culture that grew up around it.
OSG grew from the vis-sim world and over the years grew into a
general purpose and highly portable scene graph library, with it's
community coming form the professional simulator, large scale
visualization, VR and scientific markets. Whereas Ogre from the start
was graphics API for Games, it too though can be used for more things
than games but and culturally games looks to have remained it's
heartland.
Perhaps one aspect to our project websites that reflects the cultural
differences might be the professional non games market tends to not
put much effort in advertising results, major projects can roll out
ontop of the OSG and no one in the public ever gets to know about it -
even though they might see it on TV every day! Whereas in the Game
centric communities their is a demo scene sub-culture, great artwork,
effects and dynamic game sequences is what gets your work noticed.
Robert.
michael kapelko
Apr 25, 2012, 6:01:19 AM4/25/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Robert, I'm referring to this:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/album_cat.php?cat_id=8
Good to hear of new forum, because old phpBB gives "stone age" impression too :)
Folks at Ogre simply accept news to be featured on the main page
(ogre3d.org) to ne...@ogre3d.org and post a digest once a month or two.
Commercial or big ones even get their own news item featuring youtube
video and such.
As for chipping in to the discussion, how do I locate it?
Thanks.
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/album_cat.php?cat_id=8
Good to hear of new forum, because old phpBB gives "stone age" impression too :)
Folks at Ogre simply accept news to be featured on the main page
(ogre3d.org) to ne...@ogre3d.org and post a digest once a month or two.
Commercial or big ones even get their own news item featuring youtube
video and such.
As for chipping in to the discussion, how do I locate it?
Thanks.
Jordi Torres
Apr 25, 2012, 6:27:53 AM4/25/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Hi Michael,
We are not changing the forum. We are changing our website. The old website is in http://openscenegraph.org and the new one in http://openscenegraph.com . We are in our firsts steps in this change and now we have the chance to redesign all the content in the old wiki. Giving better access to documentation, adding new pictures or video of community members work, etc. Any member of the community can ask for permissions to edit the new web and add new content.
You can read the web discussion in the topic "Building new website, assistance appreciated!" in this list or the forum.
Cheers.
We are not changing the forum. We are changing our website. The old website is in http://openscenegraph.org and the new one in http://openscenegraph.com . We are in our firsts steps in this change and now we have the chance to redesign all the content in the old wiki. Giving better access to documentation, adding new pictures or video of community members work, etc. Any member of the community can ask for permissions to edit the new web and add new content.
You can read the web discussion in the topic "Building new website, assistance appreciated!" in this list or the forum.
Cheers.
2012/4/25 michael kapelko <kor...@gmail.com>
--
Jordi Torres Fabra
gvSIG 3D blog
http://gvsig3d.blogspot.com
Instituto de Automática e Informática Industrial
http://www.ai2.upv.es
Robert Osfield
Apr 25, 2012, 6:48:40 AM4/25/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Hi Michael,
On 25 April 2012 11:01, michael kapelko <kor...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Robert, I'm referring to this:
> http://forum.openscenegraph.org/album_cat.php?cat_id=8
Thanks for the pointer, I'm not a forum user directly, simply using
the osg-users mailing list which gets mirrored on the forum. This
means I don't track the contents of the forum, I'd guess that this
entry was put up in the hope that it'd get populated, but most of the
community probably never new about it... A problem with having
information spread too thinly.
> Good to hear of new forum, because old phpBB gives "stone age" impression too :)
> Folks at Ogre simply accept news to be featured on the main page
> (ogre3d.org) to ne...@ogre3d.org and post a digest once a month or two.
> Commercial or big ones even get their own news item featuring youtube
> video and such.
As Jordi mentions right now we are just looking at the website, not
the forum itself which is working fine. If we did change the forum it
would have to remain something that one that can mirror the mailing
list as some users prefer mailing lists and some prefer forums but by
keeping them in sync we can avoid much of the potential bifurcation of
the community.
> As for chipping in to the discussion, how do I locate it?
Just post a discussion on the mailing list or forum.
Robert.
On 25 April 2012 11:01, michael kapelko <kor...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Robert, I'm referring to this:
> http://forum.openscenegraph.org/album_cat.php?cat_id=8
the osg-users mailing list which gets mirrored on the forum. This
means I don't track the contents of the forum, I'd guess that this
entry was put up in the hope that it'd get populated, but most of the
community probably never new about it... A problem with having
information spread too thinly.
> Good to hear of new forum, because old phpBB gives "stone age" impression too :)
> Folks at Ogre simply accept news to be featured on the main page
> (ogre3d.org) to ne...@ogre3d.org and post a digest once a month or two.
> Commercial or big ones even get their own news item featuring youtube
> video and such.
the forum itself which is working fine. If we did change the forum it
would have to remain something that one that can mirror the mailing
list as some users prefer mailing lists and some prefer forums but by
keeping them in sync we can avoid much of the potential bifurcation of
the community.
> As for chipping in to the discussion, how do I locate it?
Robert.
Terry Welsh
Apr 25, 2012, 1:13:14 PM4/25/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
> Nice, lunar lander and thrust, :-), ok I am showing my age!
> I assume that will be available on Iphone/Android?
>
> Martin
>
I'm more of an Oids man. I guess I'm showing my age too. So far no
> I assume that will be available on Iphone/Android?
>
> Martin
>
plans for iPhone/Android. It's just on Windows and Linux. It would
be cool to have it on tablets, but it requires really precision
controls which might be big problem. Hopefully I'll get to try it on
a tablet someday and find out I don't know what I'm talking about.
> Terry, that's some very nice looking game! Good luck with that! Our
> team is currently working on Mahjong:
> http://opengamestudio.org/lang/en/ogs-mahjong , but we're thinking of
> a scroll shooter too, once we finish Mahjong :)
>
--
Terry Welsh
mogumbo 'at' gmail.com
www.reallyslick.com
Maia Randria
Apr 26, 2012, 12:08:37 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
S2LR wrote:
> Hi,
>
> As others have pointed out, OSG is not a game engine. It's a scene graph and should be used in this context (no pun intended). There are plenty of rendering technologies that use OSG under the hood. When I went to IITSEC last year, there were a lot of vendors using OSG underneath for rendering.
>
> In terms of gaming, take a look at Delta3D which is an open source gaming engine using OSG technology...
>
> http://www.delta3d.org/
>
> -Shayne
Hi,
Being new to OSG, I might miss something but I can’t see the difference between OSG and Delta3D.
OSG can have several tools (VRPN as does delta3D), audio (osgAudio vs. openAL for delta3D), physics (osgODE vs. ODE for delta3D), GUI (osgQt), animation (osgCal & osgAnimation vs. cal3D for Delta3D).
By adding these stuffs, if I am not wrong, is OSG becoming like a full game engine (equivalent to delta3D)?
I found even some old discussions between people on the forum (pro-delta3D) not agreeing, for example, to add audio to osg since this is scenegraph, etc.
What is the difference between these two opensource (I mean, once these tools added) ? What would be your advice for a newbie to delta3D/OSG ?
Thank you,
Maia
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47324#47324
Chris Hanson
Apr 26, 2012, 1:49:49 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
> As others have pointed out, OSG is not a game engine. It's a scene graph and should be used in this context (no pun intended). There are plenty of rendering technologies that use OSG under the hood. When I went to IITSEC last year, there were a lot of vendors using OSG underneath for rendering.
Being new to OSG, I might miss something but I can’t see the difference between OSG and Delta3D.
OSG can have several tools (VRPN as does delta3D), audio (osgAudio vs. openAL for delta3D), physics (osgODE vs. ODE for delta3D), GUI (osgQt), animation (osgCal & osgAnimation vs. cal3D for Delta3D).
By adding these stuffs, if I am not wrong, is OSG becoming like a full game engine (equivalent to delta3D)?
Well, many of those projects you cite are not "part of" OSG, rather they are add-ons to OSG.
yes, they overlap some capability of D3D, but D3D sort of delivers them as an integrated whole, with a number of additional features as well.
I found even some old discussions between people on the forum (pro-delta3D) not agreeing, for example, to add audio to osg since this is scenegraph, etc.
Welcome to Open Source!
What is the difference between these two opensource (I mean, once these tools added) ? What would be your advice for a newbie to delta3D/OSG ?
If you're writing a simulation game, Delta3D (or FlightGear) offer many helpful features.
However, many people prefer to work closer to the metal so to speak, and if they don't find the lack of those features to be an issue for their particular type of game, then they go with plain OSG (and sometimes re-invent some of those features themselves, possibly because they prefer to do it "their way" instead of D3D's way).
--
Chris 'Xenon' Hanson, omo sanza lettere. Xe...@AlphaPixel.com http://www.alphapixel.com/
Training • Consulting • Contracting
3D • Scene Graphs (Open Scene Graph/OSG) • OpenGL 2 • OpenGL 3 • OpenGL 4 • GLSL • OpenGL ES 1 • OpenGL ES 2 • OpenCL
Digital Imaging • GIS • GPS • Telemetry • Cryptography • Digital Audio • LIDAR • Kinect • Embedded • Mobile • iPhone/iPad/iOS • Android
Maia Randria
Apr 26, 2012, 2:17:05 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi Chris,
Thanks for your quick response.
Yes, I understood that these are add-ons but once added, OSG seems to be "quite" similar to Delta3 ? This could be confusing, at least for me.
For our applications, we intend to interact with several human characters (with audio, then lipsynch, etc.): what would be your advice ? I read somewhere in this forum that osgAnimation can only use one character (compared to many in Delta3D) ? Am I right ?
Cheers,
Maia
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47328#47328
Thanks for your quick response.
Yes, I understood that these are add-ons but once added, OSG seems to be "quite" similar to Delta3 ? This could be confusing, at least for me.
For our applications, we intend to interact with several human characters (with audio, then lipsynch, etc.): what would be your advice ? I read somewhere in this forum that osgAnimation can only use one character (compared to many in Delta3D) ? Am I right ?
Cheers,
Maia
------------------
Read this topic online here:
Chris Hanson
Apr 26, 2012, 3:49:34 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:17 PM, Maia Randria <veneree.ran...@crulrg.ulaval.ca> wrote:
Hi Chris,
Thanks for your quick response.
Yes, I understood that these are add-ons but once added, OSG seems to be "quite" similar to Delta3 ? This could be confusing, at least for me.
There is not rule saying things can't be similar. Don't worry about it. They are what they are.
For our applications, we intend to interact with several human characters (with audio, then lipsynch, etc.): what would be your advice ? I read somewhere in this forum that osgAnimation can only use one character (compared to many in Delta3D) ? Am I right ?
The little that you describe doesn't really require the "game engine" aspects of either, so it's hard to say.
I don't know if osgAnimation can only handle one character, but I've never heard that myself. I don't think Delta3D especially offers anything to do with lip sync anyway.
Depending on your character needs, you might consider looking at DI-GUY, I don't know if it would help you at all.
Cheers,
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47328#47328
Maia
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Maia Randria
Apr 26, 2012, 4:08:39 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi,
Thank you for replying and for redirecting me to DI-GUY: very interesting product !
Our application should work within a CAVE and we plan to use VR Juggler + OSG for that, I don't know if DI-GUY is working for a CAVE and how flexible it is, I will contact them.
Cheers,
Maia
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47331#47331
Thank you for replying and for redirecting me to DI-GUY: very interesting product !
Our application should work within a CAVE and we plan to use VR Juggler + OSG for that, I don't know if DI-GUY is working for a CAVE and how flexible it is, I will contact them.
Cheers,
Maia
------------------
Read this topic online here:
Chris Hanson
Apr 26, 2012, 4:24:30 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 2:08 PM, Maia Randria <veneree.ran...@crulrg.ulaval.ca> wrote:
Hi,
Thank you for replying and for redirecting me to DI-GUY: very interesting product !
Our application should work within a CAVE and we plan to use VR Juggler + OSG for that, I don't know if DI-GUY is working for a CAVE and how flexible it is, I will contact them.
Check into VE-Suite http://www.vesuite.org/
It's an OSG+VRJuggler environment intended for use in a CAVE.
I don't think it uses DI-Guy, but it could be a useful starting point for you for OSG+VRJ integration.
--
Maia Randria
Apr 26, 2012, 4:35:32 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Ok, thank you, I will have a look.
Maia
Maia
Chris Hanson wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 2:08 PM, Maia Randria < ()> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> > Thank you for replying and for redirecting me to DI-GUY: very interesting product !
> > Our application should work within a CAVE and we plan to use VR Juggler + OSG for that, I don't know if DI-GUY is working for a CAVE and how flexible it is, I will contact them.
> >
>
>
> Check into VE-Suite http://www.vesuite.org/ (http://www.vesuite.org/)
>
>
> It's an OSG+VRJuggler environment intended for use in a CAVE.
>
>
> I don't think it uses DI-Guy, but it could be a useful starting point for you for OSG+VRJ integration.
> --
>
> Chris 'Xenon' Hanson, omo sanza lettere. http://www.alphapixel.com/ (http://www.alphapixel.com/)
> Training • Consulting • Contracting
> 3D • Scene Graphs (Open Scene Graph/OSG) • OpenGL 2 • OpenGL 3 • OpenGL 4 • GLSL • OpenGL ES 1 • OpenGL ES 2 • OpenCL
> Digital Imaging • GIS • GPS • Telemetry • Cryptography • Digital Audio • LIDAR • Kinect • Embedded • Mobile • iPhone/iPad/iOS • Android
>
> ------------------
> Post generated by Mail2Forum
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47334#47334
Maia Randria
Apr 26, 2012, 4:47:39 PM4/26/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi Chirs,
VE-Suite seems to be very simulation oriented: not sure it is suitable to our needs.
I would like to try DeltaJug (Delta3D +VR Juggler) or (OSG + VR Juggler): I like OSG (I bought the two books of Wang Rui), it seems very clean and the community seems to be larger than for Delta3D.
Maia
Chris Hanson wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 2:08 PM, Maia Randria < ()> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> > Thank you for replying and for redirecting me to DI-GUY: very interesting product !
> > Our application should work within a CAVE and we plan to use VR Juggler + OSG for that, I don't know if DI-GUY is working for a CAVE and how flexible it is, I will contact them.
> >
>
>
> Check into VE-Suite http://www.vesuite.org/ (http://www.vesuite.org/)
>
>
> It's an OSG+VRJuggler environment intended for use in a CAVE.
>
>
> I don't think it uses DI-Guy, but it could be a useful starting point for you for OSG+VRJ integration.
> --
>
> Chris 'Xenon' Hanson, omo sanza lettere. http://www.alphapixel.com/ (http://www.alphapixel.com/)
> Training • Consulting • Contracting
> 3D • Scene Graphs (Open Scene Graph/OSG) • OpenGL 2 • OpenGL 3 • OpenGL 4 • GLSL • OpenGL ES 1 • OpenGL ES 2 • OpenCL
> Digital Imaging • GIS • GPS • Telemetry • Cryptography • Digital Audio • LIDAR • Kinect • Embedded • Mobile • iPhone/iPad/iOS • Android
>
> ------------------
> Post generated by Mail2Forum
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47335#47335
Martin Scheffler
Apr 27, 2012, 12:19:51 AM4/27/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi Maia,
maybe the stuff I am working on is interesting for you:
http://code.google.com/p/dtentity/
DtEntity is similar to Delta3D in its functionality (it started as a Delta3D module), but it is more lightweight and less intrusive.
DtEntity is a game and simulation system for OSG. It has basic support for OSGAnimation and Cal3D (osgCal3d wrapper not included, please ask if you are interested in that). It offers a component-based entity system for handling simulation objects, XML map loading, sound support, heads up displays and lots of other stuff.
It is very easy to integrate dtEntity with other OSG libraries like VESuite, OSGOcean, OSGEarth and so on, simply because dtEntity is only a thin layer on top of OSG.
Cheers,
Martin
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47338#47338
maybe the stuff I am working on is interesting for you:
http://code.google.com/p/dtentity/
DtEntity is similar to Delta3D in its functionality (it started as a Delta3D module), but it is more lightweight and less intrusive.
DtEntity is a game and simulation system for OSG. It has basic support for OSGAnimation and Cal3D (osgCal3d wrapper not included, please ask if you are interested in that). It offers a component-based entity system for handling simulation objects, XML map loading, sound support, heads up displays and lots of other stuff.
It is very easy to integrate dtEntity with other OSG libraries like VESuite, OSGOcean, OSGEarth and so on, simply because dtEntity is only a thin layer on top of OSG.
Cheers,
Martin
------------------
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Sergey Kurdakov
Apr 27, 2012, 2:25:23 AM4/27/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi,
btw
btw
I would highly recommend dtEntity for game development, because it can simplify communication
( how things are done and could be connected ) between artists and programmers, would allow relatively simple reconfiguration of game internals, if needed. Knowing several big 'simulation' games from inside, I see how this approach is beneficial ( besides simulation domain of cause ). If I ever program 'big game' again, I will use this for sure.
Regards
Sergey
( how things are done and could be connected ) between artists and programmers, would allow relatively simple reconfiguration of game internals, if needed. Knowing several big 'simulation' games from inside, I see how this approach is beneficial ( besides simulation domain of cause ). If I ever program 'big game' again, I will use this for sure.
Regards
Sergey
Jan Ciger
Apr 27, 2012, 4:24:38 AM4/27/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 6:19 AM, Martin Scheffler <osgf...@tevs.eu> wrote:
Hi Maia,
maybe the stuff I am working on is interesting for you:
http://code.google.com/p/dtentity/
That looks interesting, I will also have a look. However, I would suggest using Bullet instead of PhysX - being dependent on a library that works only on a GPU from a single vendor and is not open source is probably not the best idea.
Jan
Jan
Martin Scheffler
Apr 27, 2012, 4:35:21 AM4/27/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Actually the physx binding is no longer part of dtEntity, as I did not ever use it and it never really reached the point where it would be useful.
I agree that Bullet would be a good choice for a physics engine, it should be possible to use osgBullet together with dtEntity.
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47343#47343
I agree that Bullet would be a good choice for a physics engine, it should be possible to use osgBullet together with dtEntity.
------------------
Read this topic online here:
Maia Randria
Apr 27, 2012, 9:52:35 AM4/27/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Martin Scheffler wrote:
> Hi Maia,
>
> maybe the stuff I am working on is interesting for you:
> http://code.google.com/p/dtentity/
>
> DtEntity is similar to Delta3D in its functionality (it started as a Delta3D module), but it is more lightweight and less intrusive.
> DtEntity is a game and simulation system for OSG. It has basic support for OSGAnimation and Cal3D (osgCal3d wrapper not included, please ask if you are interested in that). It offers a component-based entity system for handling simulation objects, XML map loading, sound support, heads up displays and lots of other stuff.
>
> It is very easy to integrate dtEntity with other OSG libraries like VESuite, OSGOcean, OSGEarth and so on, simply because dtEntity is only a thin layer on top of OSG.
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
Hi Martin,
> DtEntity is a game and simulation system for OSG. It has basic support for OSGAnimation and Cal3D (osgCal3d wrapper not included, please ask if you are interested in that). It offers a component-based entity system for handling simulation objects, XML map loading, sound support, heads up displays and lots of other stuff.
>
> It is very easy to integrate dtEntity with other OSG libraries like VESuite, OSGOcean, OSGEarth and so on, simply because dtEntity is only a thin layer on top of OSG.
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
Thank you for the suggestion. Yes, I had already looked at dtEntity, but after reading some posts about it on delta3D forum, I have some concerns (eg: less intuitive for OO programmers; don't over-use ref ptrs; an entity is simply an ID with no data attached). Also, I am not sure if it is working with VR Juggler (for CAVE configuration, etc.), allows devices integration through VRPN, networking. Could you tell if it does ?
But I will give it a try for sure, and I am interested to have osgCal3d.
Thank you,
Maia
------------------
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Martin Scheffler
Apr 27, 2012, 4:11:39 PM4/27/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi Maia,
to answer your questions:
> less intuitive for OO programmers
Entity systems do not use inheritance (well, dtEntity does, components can form an inheritance structure) and do less encapsulation than traditional object systems. But once you understand the basic idea it is very nice to have all functionality of one sort bundled away in an entity system. For example look at the sound system: All sound related stuff is in the SoundSystem object and the components it holds. You can easily and efficiently iterate over all sound components because they are held in a central data structure. No other part of the system needs to know about sounds. You can unload or start the sound system during run time, no restart or recompile needed. I think all this flexibility makes it worth to move away from inheritance based systems or traditional object-stored component systems.
About using less ref_ptrs: Objects referenced by ref_ptrs must be created with new() on the heap and can not be held by memory managers like boost::pool. So not using them makes the system more flexible. You can do your own memory management for components, which can be important for speed-critical parts.
> Also, I am not sure if it is working with VR Juggler (for CAVE configuration, etc.), allows devices integration through VRPN, networking. Could you tell if it does ?
If OSG can do it then dtEntity can do it. dtEntity is simply a framework for controlling the OSG scene graph. While there is some setup code for getting an osgViewer started and registering to keyboard/mouse events, you can choose to not use that code and do your individual setup that maybe only uses parts of dtEntity.
About osgCal3: I have written a simple entity system that currently only allows starting and stopping animations from JavaScript or C++, also attaching mesh nodes to animation bones. I will commit it to the dtEntity trunk when I return to work on wednesday, ok?
Cheers,
Martin
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47361#47361
to answer your questions:
> less intuitive for OO programmers
About using less ref_ptrs: Objects referenced by ref_ptrs must be created with new() on the heap and can not be held by memory managers like boost::pool. So not using them makes the system more flexible. You can do your own memory management for components, which can be important for speed-critical parts.
> Also, I am not sure if it is working with VR Juggler (for CAVE configuration, etc.), allows devices integration through VRPN, networking. Could you tell if it does ?
About osgCal3: I have written a simple entity system that currently only allows starting and stopping animations from JavaScript or C++, also attaching mesh nodes to animation bones. I will commit it to the dtEntity trunk when I return to work on wednesday, ok?
Cheers,
Martin
------------------
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Maia Randria
Apr 30, 2012, 9:12:24 AM4/30/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi Martin,
Thank you for all explanations.
I will try dtEntity, but surely I need to master OSG before ;-)
Maia
------------------
Read this topic online here:
http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47421#47421
Thank you for all explanations.
I will try dtEntity, but surely I need to master OSG before ;-)
Maia
------------------
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michael kapelko
May 23, 2012, 10:45:16 PM5/23/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
Hi, Thomas.
I was thinking about iOS recently and decided to ask you, if you coded
those apps in C++ or Obj-C? I heard you need to write Obj-C on iOS?
2012/4/24 Thomas Hogarth <thomas....@gmail.com>:
> Hi Micheal
>
> I've completed a few games with OSG
>
> http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/apptoyz-alien-attack/id412615924?mt=8
>
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apptoyz-tin-can-alley/id457520117?mt=8
>
> I find no problem using osg for games, if you just treat osg as a wrapper around OpenGL and not a game engine.
>
> There's also the osgbullet lib to handle physics and collisions.
>
> The main difference you'll find is that rather then calling a specific draw fuction to render your model you need to make sure it can be attached to the scene graph in some way,
>
> I tend to have a level class with a osg::MatrixTransform, then all level entities are attached to that etc.
>
> Hope that helps
> Tom
I was thinking about iOS recently and decided to ask you, if you coded
those apps in C++ or Obj-C? I heard you need to write Obj-C on iOS?
2012/4/24 Thomas Hogarth <thomas....@gmail.com>:
> Hi Micheal
>
> I've completed a few games with OSG
>
> http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/apptoyz-alien-attack/id412615924?mt=8
>
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apptoyz-tin-can-alley/id457520117?mt=8
>
> I find no problem using osg for games, if you just treat osg as a wrapper around OpenGL and not a game engine.
>
> There's also the osgbullet lib to handle physics and collisions.
>
> The main difference you'll find is that rather then calling a specific draw fuction to render your model you need to make sure it can be attached to the scene graph in some way,
>
> I tend to have a level class with a osg::MatrixTransform, then all level entities are attached to that etc.
>
> Hope that helps
> Tom
>
> ------------------
> Read this topic online here:
> http://forum.openscenegraph.org/viewtopic.php?p=47257#47257
> ------------------
> Read this topic online here:
Ulrich Hertlein
May 24, 2012, 12:26:07 AM5/24/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
Hi Michael,
On 24/05/12 12:45 , michael kapelko wrote:
> I was thinking about iOS recently and decided to ask you, if you coded
> those apps in C++ or Obj-C? I heard you need to write Obj-C on iOS?
You can mix C, C++ and ObjC on iOS. So the meat of your app could be in C++ talking to
OSG and the UIKit stuff can be in ObjC.
Cheers,
/ulrich
On 24/05/12 12:45 , michael kapelko wrote:
> I was thinking about iOS recently and decided to ask you, if you coded
> those apps in C++ or Obj-C? I heard you need to write Obj-C on iOS?
OSG and the UIKit stuff can be in ObjC.
Cheers,
/ulrich
Ryan Pavlik
May 24, 2012, 11:51:52 AM5/24/12
to osg-...@lists.openscenegraph.org
<shameless_plug>If you're using VR Juggler and OpenSceneGraph, worth looking at VR JuggLua:
https://github.com/vancegroup/vr-jugglua - Makes working with VR Juggler even easier, and lets you even get interactive code execution (add more code while running - a "REPL" ) </shameless_plug>--
Ryan Pavlik
HCI Graduate Student
Virtual Reality Applications Center
Iowa State University
rpa...@iastate.edu
http://academic.cleardefinition.com
Ryan Pavlik
HCI Graduate Student
Virtual Reality Applications Center
Iowa State University
rpa...@iastate.edu
http://academic.cleardefinition.com
Ryan Pavlik
May 24, 2012, 11:53:03 AM5/24/12
to OpenSceneGraph Users
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 2:49 PM, Chris Hanson <xe...@alphapixel.com> wrote:
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:17 PM, Maia Randria <veneree.ran...@crulrg.ulaval.ca> wrote:
Hi Chris,
Thanks for your quick response.
Yes, I understood that these are add-ons but once added, OSG seems to be "quite" similar to Delta3 ? This could be confusing, at least for me.There is not rule saying things can't be similar. Don't worry about it. They are what they are.
Actually Delta3D uses OSG for rendering which could be why they seem similar: Delta3D is a distributed game engine built on top of OSG.
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