Public Administration

[Marv Hartigan]

Hi,

I started off with pubad today and did some basic analysis of the syllabus. There has been a lot of hue n cry over linking Paper1 and Paper2 so that both are used in both the papers upto varying extent. By looking at the topics I have made a tentative list of the topics which can be related/studied together.

 Please see and suggest whether I am wrong anywhere or any more related things I missed out.(especially those who have studied the syllabus)

1. Personnel Administration==Civil Services

2. Financial Administration==Financial Management

3. Administrative Law==Law n Order Administration

4. Development Dynamics == Rural Develpment + Urban Local Govenmant

5. Accountability n Control==Significant Issues in Indian Admin+PSU

Over n above this -- 

1.Organisations from P1 may find place with == StateGovt+PSU+Uniongovt+District Admin

2. Philosophical & Constitutional Framwork may find place in most chapters of paper2.

3. Dvelopmet dynamics alongwith chapter 2 (admin theory).

4. Admin theory substantiates almost all chapters to pack a punch.

CPA and Public Policy and others -- any suggestions?

[Abhijeet Shukla]

Thank u marv ! i was also thinking to start the thread for pub ad. We are in the same boat.. Have u decided which books to refer? I have bought laxmikanths book will start reading.

[Marv Hartigan]

Dude, I have gone through hell lot of blogs over the past 1 year or so. There is no golden booklist as such . What I understand is u have to know what u should know and then know it right. Samjhe...nahi!! main bhi nahi ....lolzzzz.

In hindi -- 1. Pehle aap ko ye pata hona chahie ki kya padhna hai.

2. Jab aapko ye pata chal gaya kya kya padhna hai... fir us cheez ko padhne ke baad aapko vo cheez sahi sahi aati honi chahie.

For ex - New Public Management padhna hai ye to pta chal gaya... ab kitne detail mein padhna hai ye bhi pata chal gaya... Now, jo aapne padha hai vo thik bhi samjha hai ki nai...this is also crucial. Nahi to link nahi kar paaoge. What u will end up with is -- just giving a dry answer without using imagination. 

@All experienced log -- hai na thik bola na....;-) ...(pat my back or twist my ear depending on my answer....lolzzz)

[Marv Hartigan]

Ab baat booklist ki... na hi baat karo to accha. See fundamentally I dont see anything wrong with Laxmikanth and I believe u can go ahead with it.

I bought a lot of factory material when I went to Delhi last month only to realise I wont be able to achieve that level of understanding which I want to.

For the record, I have Class notes of Pawan+Mohanty+Puri(paper2) + Printed notes of Pawan. The intention was...sab ek jagah mil jaega..syllabus khatam. I realise ye shayad itne number na dila paaye. So I also bought 

New Horizons of PubAd - MB

Administrative Theories and Managment thought - Sapru 

Super50 - Shubhra Saxena 

Indian Constitution - DD Basu

Governance In India - Laxmikanth

(I know the above list is vague... n not complete also. But I never said its final. :-) )
People(toppers) suggest Prasad n Prasad,Sharma n Sadana, Fadia n Fadia, Maheshwari, Avasthi n Avasthi , Arora n Goel, Polinaidu etc.

May some of these I will buy as n when I feel the need to. 

Basic idea is -- If I feel I need to do more justice to the topic, I will do everything I can. Doesnt matter what the source is. It just has to be right.

(paani to paani hai... aag bhuja lo ya pyaas.... see kitne pakau joke maarta hun ;-)  )

Cheers. 

On Saturday, December 15, 2012 9:06:16 PM UTC+5:30, Abhijeet Shukla wrote:

[Abhijeet Shukla]

Aapen bahot research ki hain ! I had read the post by mrunal about pub ad. So what is your plant about pub ad? Are u preparing from the coaching notes?

[Swagat N]

Marv, don't link admin law and 'law & order', they don't have anything in common. Not that they can't be read one after the another, but just clarifying that they don't have anything in common unlike the fin chapters or personnel admin and civil services etc.

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[Marv Hartigan]

@Swagat -- Ok, Thanx... mujhe kucch doubtful to lag rahe the...(as the internal topics were very different).. still "kaala akshar bhains barabar". 

Is public policy in any way useful in Significant Issues in Indian administration??

@Abhijeet -- Mrunal's blog is good. I will follow his techniques selectively. Like how to deal with thinkers etc. But it is just that I have a different list. Forgot to mention I have Stephen Robbins also. I will strictly go syllabus wise. Ek jagah se topic khatam karne par maza nai aaya to aage aur karunga nai to bas. What I feel at this point of time is that I will end up reading most of the things from Sapru + Pawan sir printed notes. This is coz Pawan Sir has done nothing but copy paste. I saw the first chapter, it has been taken from Mohit Bhattacharya. So I assume he has taken other chapters also from one or the other book.In his notes all other chapters are fine, but he has jumbled up the thinkers which is risky. Hence I will do it from Sapru. 

Personally, I glanced through both Prasad n Prasad n Sapru for thinkers. Everybody advises to do thinkers from PnP. But I saw it, it was all stuffed up with theory n theory in paragraphs which personally I find difficult to read. Hence , Sapru. Risky, may be. 

Those who have read pubad, may advise.

[Abhijeet Shukla]

from which book to start to get FEEL of the subject? i have also a book from s pollinaidu, any clue?  how r the videos of ignou and cecedusat ? 

[Swagat N]

<replying to all, I sent it to Marv only by mitake>

public policy and indian admin, you should expect tangential Qs like need for pp in Indian Admin, how to use different models, etc. or linking different facets of indian admin with various pp models. There is no direct linkage while reading, because PP is very dry/theorteical capter otherwise, but once you are done reading pp/even as you read, try and see how different aspects/models make sense.

Reading, my advice, since you have time, just start reading any good book from beginning. I'll recommend MB because the book is written lucidly and covers most topics. I know Mrunal's post and many other recommend reading laxmikant and then move to MB/other authors, but I felt Laxmikant deals with some topics in a guide book fashion, making reading very boring, especially if you are just starting. Of course,, there is no hard an fast rule!

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[Game Changer]

public policy maybe be related to 'plans and priorities'.

[Abhijeet Shukla]

Some one uploaded the syllabus in excel sheet. Please find here.

[RIGHT BRAINED MAVERICK]

I hav made a similar one numbering the topics in pub ad,not perfect divided though.

On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 5:50 PM, Abhijeet Shukla <abhij...@gmail.com> wrote:

Some one uploaded the syllabus in excel sheet. Please find here.

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Cheers,
B K S

[Marv Hartigan]

Thnx... I had done a division just like the excel sheet... which was coming out to be 149 topics... and i have decided for 50 days X 3 topics == 150.(some big some small.. so things should average out. Lets see.)

[Game Changer]

that's an ambitious target! all the very best :)

[Marv Hartigan]

aaj thodi PubAd padhi hai... 3 topic karne the..1 hi hua.

Khair ye dekho aur batao-- koi major topic reh gaya??

Topic - Meaning scope n significance of Pubad

What all i did(WAID) -- 

what is administration and its definitions by thnkers. 

Difference bw Administration , Organization n management.

Definitions of public administration.
nature of public admin -- integral vs mangerial

Scope of Pubad -- as an activity

                        -- as a discipline   

                               ..POSDCORB view

                               ..Subject matter view

Public and Private Admin

                        -- distinction (by Simon, by appleby,by Josiah Stamp)

                        -- similarities (by Fayol n some general points)

Importance of Pubad 

                        -- as specialised subject of study (wilson n general things)

                        -- as an activity (a couple of dens here n there)  

[Jason Bourne]

Bahut sahi ja rahe ho...Chapter 1 ke liye ignou notes pakad lena ...kuch nahi chutega.

[Marv Hartigan]

haan yaar... IGNOU notes hi padhe hain abhi tak in topcs ke liye...

ye Wilson's vision of Public Admin kya hai...? IGNOU mein hai?

[Jason Bourne]

Prasad se padh lo wilson.

[Swagat N]

gnou should have a chapter on Wilson, else you can find him covered
in MB, topics of Wilsonian dichotomy between politics and public
administration, distinction between pvt/public admin, need for
separate study of admin, etc are to be covered under this head.

-Swagat

On 12/18/12, Marv Hartigan <marvhart...@gmail.com> wrote:
> haan yaar... IGNOU notes hi padhe hain abhi tak in topcs ke liye...
> ye Wilson's vision of Public Admin kya hai...? IGNOU mein hai?
>
> On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 9:09:34 AM UTC+5:30, Jason Bourne wrote:
>>
>> Bahut sahi ja rahe ho...Chapter 1 ke liye ignou notes pakad lena ...kuch
>> nahi chutega.
>>
>> On Monday, December 17, 2012 11:11:25 AM UTC-8, Marv Hartigan wrote:
>>>
>>> aaj thodi PubAd padhi hai... 3 topic karne the..1 hi hua.
>>> Khair ye dekho aur batao-- koi major topic reh gaya??

>>> *Topic - Meaning scope n significance of Pubad*

> --
>
>
>


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-Swagat

[Abhijeet Shukla]

how is ur pub ad prep marv? I will start from today.  Is ignou good for first topic?

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-Swagat

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[Marv Hartigan]

@Abhijeet -- Prep. ki dhajjia udh gayi hai yaar... till now I have done only the first topic. Today is off, will try to finish atleast 3 more. Yes, for the first topic Ignou notes are very good and complete.  

[Gambit]

I would say start with thinkers, then move to intro.

On Saturday, December 15, 2012 9:01:29 PM UTC+5:30, Marv Hartigan wrote:

[Marv Hartigan]

hmmm...u seem to be right. Thinkers is actually the base for understanding as the first chapters goes a little huge in scope(GG, LPG,Public Choice, NPM)

[Abhijeet Shukla]

from which book? prasad and prasad ?

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[Marv Hartigan]

PnP seems to be the most popular book, and nobody complains about it. Gambit can enlighten you more.

P.S. - i have sapru for thinkers. May be i will do from there.

[Gambit]

Yea, prasad and prasad. But, you can read ignou also. I would say read prasad, then check out ignou in case prasad missed out something, as it did in this year's paper which i later found out.

On Saturday, December 22, 2012 12:49:06 PM UTC+5:30, Abhijeet Shukla wrote:

[Abhijeet Shukla]

@ Marv , like GS can we move forward for making notes for Pub ad ?

@all are all guys accessible to wiki material. Is there need to cover the 2nd ARC summaries, which are already done by wiki members?

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[Gambit]

Dude, notes in pubad, and that to a digital edition, is a colossal task. It is more or less like writing a book, so why not buy a book already written :P Instead we can have question answer practice or doubts.

[Marv Hartigan]

ya exactly... that would be too  huge a task....  instead when we all complete atleast the basic syllabus...we will have extensive answer writing. People can discuss answers then. Eveyone's knowledge would be enhanced.

[Abhijeet Shukla]

ok , right !  we will make plan on weekly basis. @Marv , please give syllabus for the next week?

if @all can suggest material then it will better.t so let us plan for it.

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[RIGHT BRAINED MAVERICK]

READ ANAY DWIVEDIS BLOG...I ALWAYS CONSIDER HIS STRATEGY TO BE THE BEST OF ALL TOPPERS.....HE MAKES IT SIMPLE TO U AND AFTER READING THE BLOG U LL FOR SURE HAVE NO DOUBT OF MAKING IT IN THE LIST.......................

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[RIGHT BRAINED MAVERICK]

http://anaydwivedi.wordpress.com/2010/06/10/public-administration-mains/

On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Abhijeet Shukla <abhij...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Jason Bourne]

No need to prepare a note for PA as stated above. However linking paper 1,2 and current affairs and various chapters together can be done here. As we together as a team can be intellectually more sound than coaching shops. 

@all : Read about mastermind concept of napolean hill. He has covered them in detail in his book "Law of success" and then "Think and grow rich". This is because we are doing the same thing here.

[Marv Hartigan]

ya linking current affairs and different sectons is something which can be done here better.

[RIGHT BRAINED MAVERICK]

JASON THANKS FOR THE BUKS;

HERS THE PDF:

http://s3.amazonaws.com/manybooks_pdf_new/hillnother07think_rich_grow_rich?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAITZP2AAM27ZGISNQ&Expires=1356253989&Signature=3K5q%2FOcEAQdxBH8ZjeU4eG1GhYM%3D

http://ia700209.us.archive.org/18/items/Law_Of_Success_in_16_Lessons/law-of-success-napoleon-hill_text.pdf

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[Jason Bourne]

Yeah the buks are very good and he has really explained that movie dialogue " agar sachhe dil se kisi cheez ko chaho to puri kaynat tumhe usse milane me jud jati hai". (If u truly obsess over something nature ensures that u get it.). U don't need to work that hard. u only need to have an obsession.

[Marv Hartigan]

I am obsessed with Scarlett Johansson !!! (o Lord... help me)

On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 3:02 PM, Jason Bourne <bournej...@gmail.com> wrote:

Yeah the buks are very good and he has really explained that movie dialogue " agar sachhe dil se kisi cheez ko chaho to puri kaynat tumhe usse milane me jud jati hai". (If u truly obsess over something nature ensures that u get it.). U don't need to work that hard. u only need to have an obsession.

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[Jason Bourne]

Note : Obsession should be within your limit :P

[Marv Hartigan]

Ok...dude.. I am obsessed with UPSC  (kya yaar...sapne to dekhne dia karo...lolzzz)

On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 3:08 PM, Jason Bourne <bournej...@gmail.com> wrote:

Note : Obsession should be within your limit :P

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[Marv Hartigan]

@Abhijeet-- u do one thing... read Nature scope n significance of Pubad from Ignou.. after that we will start thinkers(wherever u want to do it from)..

Next sunday, I might not be online(I am shifting my place)... and 31st also.. but may be on 1st Jan.. we will discuss qsns n topics of

1. Wilson

2. Weber

3. Taylor...

 if u happen to do more then inform me ,I will also do the same.(next in line are-- Fayol,Gullick/Irwick,Follet,Mayo and Bernard)

On Sunday, 23 December 2012 15:09:34 UTC+5:30, Marv Hartigan wrote:

Ok...dude.. I am obsessed with UPSC  (kya yaar...sapne to dekhne dia karo...lolzzz)

[Abhijeet Shukla]

OK!  Now i have a plan !!

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[Abhijeet Shukla]

have u completed the topics ? I will do the thinkers tomorrow. 

[Marv Hartigan]

No, Dude.. still only done wilson... and not sure when I get the time.. all I know is Sunday tak I will be able to do 2-3 more.. and after that I will pick up speed next week. Sunday  night ko Wilson,Weber,Fayol and Taylor ka discussion rakhein?

[Abhijeet Shukla]

OK ! Is there any book for topic-wise question papers of last years? 

[Marv Hartigan]

I downloaded from Mrunal.. but they are yearwise.. No idea about book..someone told on Vision Ias site they are topic-wise.. I am yet to take a look.

[Marv Hartigan]

yes they are here..

http://visionias.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/part-i-public-administration-paper-i-questions-trend-analysis-2009-1995.pdf

http://visionias.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/part-iii-public-administration-ias-mains-paper-ii-qusetion-trend-2009-1995.pdf

http://visionias.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/analysis-of-public-administration-questions-paper-2006-2010-vision-ias.pdf

[Abhijeet Shukla]

Thanks bhai !

[Abhijeet Shukla]

@marv , is the syllabus you mentioned enough for this weekend? and also give some book reference

[RIGHT BRAINED MAVERICK]

you can see my old section now....

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Regards,

B K S

[Marv Hartigan]

In my opinion.. the 4 thinkers are enough for the weekend... but if u r full-time at home these days then certainly u can do much more than this... it was just for me.

Whatever more u happen to read... inform me.. but atleast we will do these 4 thinkers well.

Will discuss abt sources n topics in detail tomorrow.. I have read Wilson from Sapru.. will see where to do other thinkers from only after looking at the topics.