TRUST data

[Karol Kulesza]

Hey all,

I've already found a lot of helpful advice through existing threads so thank you for all that, as well as for the Github repositories without which I wouldn't be able to connect with my limited knowledge.

With that being said, I'm interested in exploring the TRUST and RTPPM feeds and I have a question for someone with more experience with them, mostly TRUST at the moment. 

Even though the wikipedia is useful, there's some vagueness that is difficult for me to work through. My main objective right now is to be able to identify a specific service.

Let's say I wanted to understand more about a hypothetical 10am train from Sheffield to Manchester Piccadilly on its way up and then upon its return to Sheffield where it terminates. How easy is this with the TRUST messages? Are trains identified in a way that makes it possible to track a specific train and its daily movements?

I don't expect any of you to do any work for me, but if you could point me in the right direction, I'd be very grateful!

[Peter Hicks]

Hi Karol

If you want to look at reports for a specific train, you'll need to know its schedule UID for the day in question, look for the TRUST Activation message and follow all other messages with the same 10-character train ID.

That's the robust way to do it - you can also do it casually by finding out the time it departs its origin and looking for movement reports, or by looking for an activation for a train with the right headcode (four-character train identity) with the right toc_id at the correct departure time.

 

Peter

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[Igor Maslennikov]

Hi Peter,

Thanks for the great summary.

I am trying to archive the similar result, but with Darwin Push Port feed, not TRUST (I need trains arrival data to be shown to users waiting for the train).

Would would be the best way to locate the train I have bookings for, based on the info that is sent within TS object?

As far as I can see uid or rid cannot be used without TRUST messages?

Thank you in advance.

субота, 23 березня 2024 р. о 23:50:48 UTC+1 Peter Hicks пише:

[Peter Hicks]

Hi Igor

On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 at 09:53, Igor Maslennikov <igor.masl...@gmail.com> wrote:

 

I am trying to archive the similar result, but with Darwin Push Port feed, not TRUST (I need trains arrival data to be shown to users waiting for the train).

Would would be the best way to locate the train I have bookings for, based on the info that is sent within TS object?

As far as I can see uid or rid cannot be used without TRUST messages?

If the booking includes a specific train, I'm hoping you'll have something like the retail service ID (RSID) which is included in version 18 of the Push Port along with the UID and RID in TS elements.  That'll be a really quick way to link a reservation to a particular RID.  But if you're relying on a user saying "I want to take the 1800 train from X to Y", you might be able to get away with looking up the origin and destination CRS code TIPLOCs and looking for a train which departs the origin at the given time, then arrives at the destination at a given time.

Darwin contains the UID and date at origin - which would be yesterday's date if you're catching a train over midnight.  It's only the TRUST train identity which isn't readily mappable to a UID without processing activation messages.

Remember that the Darwin timetable is ever-changing, and you'll need both the 0200 timetable file and a processed stream of messages to keep schedules up-to-date.

Peter 

[Igor Maslennikov]

Hi Peter,

Many thanks for a quick response, really appretiate it.

I have bookings that are made using Evolvi's API and quick check of their response shows that they do provide RetailServiceId (e.gTrainNumber="TP803600" RetailServiceId="TP803600"), so that sounds like a plan to try to match it by this id.

Backup solution would be to stick to departure \ destination \ dep time \ way to link, but would love to try this Id based option first.

You've mentioned version 18, however my account's access details has just 16th version topic details (like darwin.pushport-v16). Do I need to have another set of creds to be able to connect to version 18?

Thanks, Igor

пʼятниця, 3 січня 2025 р. о 11:21:17 UTC+1 Peter Hicks пише:

[Peter Hicks (Poggs)]

Hi Igor

On 3 Jan 2025, at 13:31, Igor Maslennikov <igor.masl...@gmail.com> wrote:

I have bookings that are made using Evolvi's API and quick check of their response shows that they do provide RetailServiceId (e.gTrainNumber="TP803600" RetailServiceId="TP803600"), so that sounds like a plan to try to match it by this id.

Backup solution would be to stick to departure \ destination \ dep time \ way to link, but would love to try this Id based option first. 

The advantage of using the RSID is that, should a revised timetable be in force and the operator populates the revised timetable with the right RSID and that retimed schedule departs a few minutes later, you’ll not have a confused user.

You've mentioned version 18, however my account's access details has just 16th version topic details (like darwin.pushport-v16). Do I need to have another set of creds to be able to connect to version 18?

RDM has, I think, v18 - the opendata.nationalrail.co.uk platform has v16 but aside from a few other data fields, there isn’t a great deal of difference between the two.  I’m using v18 internally, but for your use case, v16 is probably sufficient for now.

Peter