Do I need to update OpenPNP?

[jbasia]

Do I need to update OpenPNP?

It worked fine last time when I used it and the version is 2023-08-20_11-22-37.beb77a7

I now have the same assembly job as then, some module. I feed manually from strips. 

Issues I had before: 

Alignment of: SOT-23 and  64 pin TQFP  (not really a big issue)

Is there any point in updating? I am hesitant in fiddling with a working system.

[Jan]

HI Jbasia!
There is never 'need' to update. Sometimes you may feel pressured to
update, hoping that it will eliminate inconveniences. If you think, you
might be 'affected' by this, please consult the change log of the main
branch at https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/main/CHANGES.md or of
the test branch at
https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/test/CHANGES.md. (As stated many
times, the test branch is very stable and used by many for production
purposes.)
Concerning you issues:
- SOT23 is always difficult as it does not fit well in the rectangular
strategy OpenPnP defaults to. Pattern matching likely provides better
results, but OpenPnP does not yet support rotated pattern matching, just
pattern matching without rotation.
- TQFP64 is difficult to make suggests as it might be a vision hardware
issue (FoV not large enough, distorted optics, uneven lighting, bad
background) or a setup problem. It could even be a problem of a bad
nozzle tip or vacuum system that makes the part slip after vision. (You
may inspect the bottom vision debug images to find out if its a vision
or a nozzle issue.) Newer version of OpenPnP support
multi-shot-bottom-vision that capture multiple edges of larger parts.
That might help as well.

Jan

On 15.01.2026 05:13, jbasia wrote:
> Do I need to update OpenPNP?
>
> It worked fine last time when I used it and the version is
> 2023-08-20_11-22-37.beb77a7
>
> I now have the same assembly job as then, some module. I feed manually
> from strips.
>
> Issues I had before:
> Alignment of: SOT-23 and  64 pin TQFP  (not really a big issue)
>
> Is there any point in updating? I am hesitant in fiddling with a working
> system.
>
>

> 4512e7df-e7ab-46dc-976e-4d8a6c801af0.jpg
>
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[Toby Dickenson]

Hi Jbasia,

        There is never 'need' to update. Sometimes you may feel pressured to
update, hoping that it will eliminate inconveniences. If you think, you
might be 'affected' by this, please consult the change log of the main
branch at https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/main/CHANGES.md or of
the test branch at
https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/test/CHANGES.md. (As stated many
times, the test branch is very stable and used by many for production
purposes.)

2023-08 is a long time ago, and openpnp has matured significantly. My experience in that period is that openpnp has changed from a source of frustration to a reliable production tool.

 

        Concerning you issues:
- SOT23 is always difficult as it does not fit well in the rectangular
strategy OpenPnP defaults to. Pattern matching likely provides better
results, but OpenPnP does not yet support rotated pattern matching, just
pattern matching without rotation.

One of the fixes in that period is a reliable solution to sot-23 vision :-)

I have one sot-23 part where its three pads have rounded ends. Under bottom vision it looks like three round dots arranged in an equilateral triangle pattern. Openpnp is trying to fit the smallest rectangle around that shape, and sometimes it guesses the wrong orientation for the triangle.

The fix is:

1. Update your openpnp

2. Take a copy of the stock bottom vision pipeline, specialised for your sot-23 package

3. Edit the vision pipeline, and in the MinAreaRect stage change search-angle from 45° to 20°

A question for other users.... is this a common problem? would it be worth having openpn create this vision pipeline automatically?

Toby

[Luke Bayes]

Semi related side note:

We recently had some minor issues with an asymmetrical footprint (2-pin SMT header) that looks like a fractional SOT-23.

Created a customized vision pipeline with a reference image, limited the valid rotation angles and it worked quite well.

Also wanted to agree and express gratitude to the team that the improvements over the last year or so have really been great.

Thanks!

Luke

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[Jan]

Hi Toby!
I too have issues with SOT23 (3pin) and I was not aware of the
limitation of allowed rotation.
Wouldn't it be a good idea to add the rotation limitation to the
default pipeline as well? I'd consider it of general use even thought
I'm not aware of other footprints that suffer from the same asymmetry issue.

Jan

On 15.01.2026 11:18, Toby Dickenson wrote:
> Hi Jbasia,
>
>         There is never 'need' to update. Sometimes you may feel
> pressured to
> update, hoping that it will eliminate inconveniences. If you think, you
> might be 'affected' by this, please consult the change log of the main
> branch at https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/main/CHANGES.md
> <https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/main/CHANGES.md> or of
> the test branch at

> https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/test/CHANGES.md <https://
> github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/test/CHANGES.md>. (As stated many

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an email to openpnp+u...@googlegroups.com
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> To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/

> CAH35urdsZ-urpaQr1kX_qxqSTc%2BzmLuc342AQotF3K9oJ%3Dcb0A%40mail.gmail.com
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAH35urdsZ-
> urpaQr1kX_qxqSTc%2BzmLuc342AQotF3K9oJ%3Dcb0A%40mail.gmail.com?
> utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.

[jbasia]

Of course I am positive about trying the new software, but....  Today I installed the latest version in a different folder (openpnp > openpnp2)  - however now the older version doesn't open with this error:

Anyway, this wasn't my working notebook. However, I probably need to switch to a desktop. The notebook makes constant vision troubles (losing USB connection, well, Notebook > 2 USB > 1 cam to USB > rest one powered USB hub - I probably switch to an old win 10 desktop...) On this topic: The desktop in mind has no OpenPNP. What files I need to transfer? just those 7 or so machine.xml ?

[Jan]

.openpnp2 is the default folder for configuration files for OpenPnP v2.
OpenPnP takes backups somewhere in that folder. You can just revert to
an older version when downgrading.
When transferring OpenPnP to a new computer, you need to take the .xml
files from .openpnp2 with you. You might also take scripts with you, if
you have any. Log files, backups and debug images are not needed but
sometimes handy to have.

Jan

On 17.01.2026 11:06, jbasia wrote:
>
> Of course I am positive about trying the new software, but....  Today I
> installed the latest version in a different folder (openpnp > openpnp2)
> - however now the older version doesn't open with this error:
>

> github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/test/CHANGES.md> <https://
> > github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/test/CHANGES.md <http://

> openpnp/ <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/>
> > CAH35urdsZ-
> urpaQr1kX_qxqSTc%2BzmLuc342AQotF3K9oJ%3Dcb0A%40mail.gmail.com
> <http://40mail.gmail.com>
> > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAH35urdsZ- <https://
> groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAH35urdsZ->
> > urpaQr1kX_qxqSTc%2BzmLuc342AQotF3K9oJ%3Dcb0A%40mail.gmail.com
> <http://40mail.gmail.com>?
> > utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.

>
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> a0ce-6abc58ad10c9n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.

[jbasia]

Thank you. What I did in the meantime: 

Setup and Windows 10 Desktop (more USB ports > less trouble)

That desktop had an even older version of OpenPNP, but was never connected to the PNP machine. I installed 2.4 (latest) and moved the various XML over. At least I can start the software and load a project. 

Vision works also better without the USB hub.

I ran into one issue: I can't set the nozzle tips. I did go to: Machine Setup > Heads > RefHead H1 > Nozzles> N1 + N2

I did the offset wizzard to get the values. But in Nozzle Tips > Move to tip - they are like 5-10mm off

When I change the value manually in Heads Nozzles I can get N2 somehow correct, but not N1

Also, when I change N1 N2 location changes too. That is strange. 

How to center the 2 tips? Wasn't there a manual way to center the N tips?

Seems the PNP doesn't lose steps. 

[jbasia]

A sequence of silly errors..... 

I am again on the notebook and the 2023 OpenPNP version, with a 2023 machine backup. Cameras are working pretty well with 640 x 480 30fps MJPG (960 x 720 7fps MJPG or YUY2) is not working.

Somehow this change also made the nozzle problems go away. 

Seems I am good to go..... I will do some boards for a while (need to work on the backlog), then try version 2.4 (safely from the desktop first)

[Dave Thomas]

A question for other users.... is this a common problem? would it be worth having openpn create this vision pipeline automatically?

I have lots of SOT23 packages some with 180 degree rotation to others.   Can you elaborate on the issue/limitation and work-arounds?

Will "dummy" parts with different placement orientations and have separate trays for each orientation work?

[Toby Dickenson]

I have lots of SOT23 packages some with 180 degree rotation to others.   Can you elaborate on the issue/limitation and work-arounds?

 

The problem is that single-shot openpnp vision works by fitting a rectangle around the pads. The algorithm works by finding a rectangle of minimum area. On a sot-23 the pads are arranged in a triangle, which makes the algorithm unstable. It should find the green rectangle below, but sometimes the best-fit rectangle is the orange.



The green rectangle is oriented 5° from horizontal, and the orange is 25° from horizontal. The solution described below (using "search-angle") prevents openpnp from considering any rectangles where that angle is between 20° and 45°. The consequence is that it always finds the green rectangle, and everything works as expected.

Will "dummy" parts with different placement orientations and have separate trays for each orientation work?

No, that will not be a problem. Vision orientation is completely independent from placement and feeder orientation.

[Dave Thomas]

Thanks, that makes it crystal clear.

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