Possible use of NINA's Manual Rotator/Framing Wizard Camera Angle

[MiguelE]

Hello PHD2 developers

Is there a way that PHD2 could use the camera angle from NINA's manual rotator and/or Framing Wizard to "adjust" calibration as it was a physical rotator?

Thank you,

Miguel

[bw_m...@earthlink.net]

Hi Miguel.  Maybe you can explain what the “manual rotator” is, how it works, and how you would envision it being used by PHD2.

 

Bruce

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[Brian Valente]

Bruce

I have used NINA's process. By employing plate solving, NINA can report the correct rotator orientation. 

So if someone manually rotates their camera, they could have NINA solve for the rotation and "automatically inform PHD"(?)

Theoretically if it were exposed as an ascom "rotator" that reports rotation position, i could see how that works, but if someone is rotating it manually i personally don't see the automation value there, and it assumes NINA would expose it as an ascom rotator device

Which leads me to a question - is it possible in PHD to manually enter different rotation and have PHD guide without having to recalibrate?

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Brian 

Brian Valente

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[bw_m...@earthlink.net]

PHD2 supports ASCOM-compliant rotators include the ASCOM rotator simulator.  So if you added that to a profile, you could manually enter the new rotation angle and PHD2 wouldn’t need to recalibrate.  Seems pretty accident-prone to me but it would work.

 

Bruce

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[Brian Valente]

So just to clarify, If someone (Miguel) set up PHD2 to use the rotator simulator, and then plugged in rotation values using nina's tools, that would correctly orient PHD's calibration, and you can guide at multiple rotations without recalibrating

Did i get that right Bruce?

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[bw_m...@earthlink.net]

Yes, that’s right.  But if he forgets to key in the new angle position, his subsequent guiding will be a mess.  This is how we test rotator-related code in PHD2, it’s not like any of us have a real device. 😊

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[MiguelE]

Just to clarify. The manual rotator in NINA that I am talking about is not a simulator. It is actually a feature that works based on plate solving results. 

And I am not interested in manual data inputs in PHD. I envision this as "an automatic talk" between PHD2 and NINA's manual rotator/framing wizard to adjust existing calibration the same way it would do it with an actual ASCOM device.

[Brian Valente]

Yes I think we understand that, we were talking about ways you could do something similar to tht now

The issue is you are manually rotating the camera, and then relying on NINA to plate solve to calculate the rotation, correct?

For PHD2, you need a rotator that reports the position via ASCOM. If NINA or something else can do that, it can be automated. 

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[MiguelE]

No, The main camera rotation is not an issue at all. That is well handled by NINA. The inconvenience (not even an issue) is that if I have to rotate the part of the OAG that holds the guider to find a guide star on the next target as most of the time happens for me, I have to recalibrate. With what I propose (if doable) I can avoid recalibration. 

As for ways around it, yes I do that now but again, it is an inconvenience that I would love to see gone.

I will see if I can communicate with the developers at NINA and I will report back. Are you one of the PHD2 developers? 

[Brian Valente]

MIguel - sorry, i meant to say the guide camera/oag. with automated rotators they go together, but that is my bad

You are rotating this manually, and then plate solving for the new angle. If you want this to be exposed to PHD2 to automate this change in rotation, NINA would have to expose the rotation angle as an ASCOM rotator. Honestly, i doubt this will get much traction with them but you can try.

*for now* you can avoid recalibrating PHD2 by using the rotator simulator and entering that new rotation value (don't get hung up on the term 'simulator', it simply means you type in the angle rather than it reporting something it's reading). It's probably better/easier than having to recalibrate, but as Bruce mentioned you have to be careful and make sure you don't skip updating the rotation angle

Bruce is the developer along with Andy

Brian

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[bw_m...@earthlink.net]

Hi Miguel.  This isn’t something we want to do, it would basically violate some basic design assumptions.  PHD2 is a service-provider to imaging applications, it doesn’t act as a client to them and we don’t want to do one-off implementations for all of the higher level apps out there.

 

Regards,

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[Mauro Sturaro]

I think the right solution is not a change in PHD2, but a new function in NINA: when it use the plate solver to verify the manual adjusted rotation NINA can send the new rotation angle to the ASCOM Rotator simulator, or perhaps a new version of the simulator that can receive a position from third-party software.

The calculated rotation of the plate solver would be precise and no manual input would be necessary.

Regards,

Mauro.

[Mauro Sturaro]

Hi Miguel, I just verified, the ASCOM Rotator simulator is bidirectional!

So in NINA it will be possible to extend the manual rotator and send the correct information to the ASCOM driver, and of course PHD2 will react as expected.
So now we must contact the NINA developers  ;) 

Mauro.

[Brian Valente]

>>>  a new function in NINA: when it use the plate solver to verify the manual adjusted rotation NINA can send the new rotation angle to the ASCOM Rotator simulator,

I agree - that was my original suggestion, although plugging it into the simulator is a nice add

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