Dvi-Paksa Advaita Vedanta

[Ashish Dalela]

Dear Ram,

I'm forking this out of the previous thread. Don't mind. Or should I say don't body?

My framework is the the least problematic Dvi-Pakṣa Advaita Vedānta (extended dual-aspect monism), which can answer these questions. I have tried to elaborate it briefly in my previous emails to you.

First of all, there is no such thing as Dvi-Pakṣa Advaita Vedānta because to propose a Vedanta you have write a commentary on Vedanta Sutra, and there are only a few known commentaries. Shankaracharya wrote a commentary proposing Advaita Vedanta, but that is not dvi-paksha. You are taking the dual-aspect monism theory (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-aspect_theory) and calling it Vedanta. Let's not foist any and every idea on Vedanta. 

Second, if you actually try to write a commentary on Vedanta Sutra, we would be interested to understand your explanation of "brahma satyam, jagad mithya" - i.e. Brahman is reality, and the world is false. Since the mind and matter are just two aspects, how can one be real, and the other false? I would like to know how your "Vedanta" resolves this problem.

Third, you say that this is least problematic theory. Let me ask you for a response on the following problem. If things are dual-aspect, then when the body dies, the mind must also be dead. After all, they are simply two aspects of the same thing. So, you cannot have a mind that survives the body. In other words, no reincarnation, no rebirth. Now, you stand in direct contradiction with the most fundamental ideas in Vedanta. What would you say?

Ram: OK. So what are the step-by-step processes as per the persons who witnessed that process of deriving the first living cell and matter (such as stone) from the Super Cognizant Being, so that we all can understand and accept?

Fourth, if you are a dual-aspect monist, then the stone and cell should simply be the body of a universal mind. And they must simply arise due to the mental activity of that mind. So, you are asking how the mind thinks in order to automatically create the bodies? How do you explain the step by step mental activity to explain the production of many bodies?

Fifth, I never understood what happens to the body when the mind goes into deep sleep and is devoid of any activity. By implication, the body must also disappear. What do you think?

Thanks,

Ashish

[Ram Lakhan Pandey Vimal]

Dear Ashish,

 

Thanks for the comments.

 

Ashish: First of all, there is no such thing as Dvi-Pakṣa Advaita Vedānta because to propose a Vedanta you have to write a commentary on Vedanta Sutra, and there are only a few known commentaries. Shankaracharya wrote a commentary proposing Advaita Vedanta, but that is not Dvi-Pakṣa. You are taking the dual-aspect monism theory (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-aspect_theory) and calling it Vedanta. Let's not foist any and every idea on Vedanta. 

 

Ram: My comments on some of the relvant components of Hinduism are briefly elaborated in (Vimal, 2012b) (especially Chapter 4). We do not have to follow traditional method in modern scientific age. Main aim is to improve whatever we have to make our system more viable scientifically. Nothing much research has been done since Achintya-Bheda-Abheda (inconceivable oneness and difference, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, 1486-1534) and I have tried my best to extend further. There are four major metaphysics from both east and west as elaborated in Section 2 of (Vimal, 2013) and Chapter 2 of (Vimal, 2012b).  In my view, it does not matter where knowledge comes from, we should respect all of them and if there is any problem we should comment and find solution.

 

Yes, the eDAM is the extension of dual-aspect monism from west and that of Viśiṣṭādvaita (qualified non-dualism, Ramānujāchārya: 1017–1137) and Kashmir Shaivism. I have given my brief discussion of Dvi-Pakṣa Advaita with Padmabhushan Jagadguru Rambhadracharya ji of Chitrakut in Section 4.4.2 of (Vimal, 2012b). He agreed that Dvi-Pakṣa Advaita is and/or an extension and improvement of Viśiṣṭādvaita. This is because it includes “real” (reproducible and logic based) science. Pseudoscience (logic based) is already present in our system. In this way, I have tried to bring science and Hinduism and other religions closer in (Vimal, 2012b) and (Vimal, 2012a), respectively. If you think, I have missed comments on some relevant topics of Vedānta Sutra, please let me know, I will try to do that and/or you can help me on this goal; it could be joint effort. This is an ongoing research, it is not completed yet; you and other colleagues are most welcome to join me. Constructive comments will certainly improve it and are always most welcome. 

 

Ashish: Second, if you actually try to write a commentary on Vedanta Sutra, we would be interested to understand your explanation of "brahma satyam, jagad mithya" - i.e. Brahman is reality, and the world is false. Since the mind and matter are just two aspects, how can one be real, and the other false? I would like to know how your "Vedanta" resolves this problem.

 

Ram: Excellent question. It is elaborated in Section 6.5 of (Vimal, 2012b). Briefly, it is as follows:

 

Let us consider a view from Advaita (non-dualism, Adi Shankarāchārya: 788-820): Brahma satyaṃ jagat mithyā, jīvo brahmaiva nāparah (Brahman is the only truth, the world is illusion, and there is ultimately no difference between Brahman and individual self).

 

Any entity of our world (jagat) that is born will certainly die today or tomorrow. Therefore, it does not have essence or permanent existence and hence its existence is transitory, i.e., its existence is illusion/mithyā.  In my view, Shankarāchārya never meant that matter-in-itself does not exist, even though it is unknown to us. Of course, we experience only the appearance of matter-in-itself. However, we as physicists try our best in our mind-dependent reality (MDR) to understand what might be in mind-independent reality (MIR). For example, physicists have theorized mass, charge, and spin as intrinsic properties of 17 elementary particles (matter-in-itself) of Standard Model.

 

It should be noted that aspects are inseparable; this is called the doctrine of inseparability of aspects. It is easier to understand physical aspect, but whatever is going on in physical aspect is faithfully and immediately translated in mental/qualitative aspect at appropriate level and vice versa. For example, over 10 billion years after Big Bang whatever manifestations of Brahman (such as galaxies, stars and so on: see Section 5.3 of (Vimal, 2012b)) were realized were reflected in qualitative sub-aspect (forms and patterns) of mental/qyalitative aspect, but mental aspect sub-aspect remained latent. When the living systems appeared, the mental aspect started manifesting. Today, in us, in conscious state, the degrees of manifestations of both physical and mental/qualitative aspects are high. In samādhi state, the degrees of manifestations of aspects (especially mental aspect) from the unmanifested state of Brahman are presumably highest; therefore, it can be called Godly state as we acquire godly virtues (such as humility, compassion and so on) at this state.

 

Brahma satyaṃ = Brahman (primal entity) is permanent; it has various manifestations in various entities of our world before and after their death. However, Brahman has no birth and no death; after Big Crunch (assuming this hypothesis is correct), Brahman will return back to its unmanifested state; when Big Bang happens again, it starts manifesting again (cyclic model).

 

Ashish: Third, you say that this is least problematic theory. Let me ask you for a response on the following problem. If things are dual-aspect, then when the body dies, the mind must also be dead. After all, they are simply two aspects of the same thing. So, you cannot have a mind that survives the body. In other words, there is no reincarnation and no rebirth. Now, you stand in direct contradiction with the most fundamental ideas in Vedanta. What would you say?

 

Ram: Excellent question again. This is addressed in  (Vimal, 2012b). Briefly, the degree of manifestation of aspects (from the dual-aspect unmanifested state of Brahman) varies with entity. If soul exists after death (there is no ‘real’ scientific evidence!), then the degree of manifestation of its mental aspect is very high, but its physical aspect is latent; this is consistent with the hypothesis that soul acquires subtle body (sukshm sarir). This is comes under theist version of Dvi-Pakṣa Advaita. Thus, if reincarnation/rebirth and other paranormal phenomena are true, they can be explained.

 

 

Ashish: Fourth, if you are a dual-aspect monist, then the stone and cell should simply be the body of a universal mind. And they must simply arise due to the mental activity of that mind. So, you are asking how the mind thinks in order to automatically create the bodies? How do you explain the step by step mental activity to explain the production of many bodies?

 

Ram: Sorry, you have misconstrued the eDAM. As elaborated above, the degree of manifestation of physical aspect of a state of inert entity (such as stone) is high and the degree of manifestation of its inseparable mental aspect is latent. 

 

My definition of life is the same as defined in Wikipedia: Briefly, “life is a process […] Life is considered a characteristic of something that exhibits all or most of the following traits: Homeostasis … Organization … Metabolism … Growth … Adaptation … Response to stimuli … Reproduction […] living things function on negative entropy … life is a self-sustained chemical system … living things are self-organizing and autopoietic (self-producing)”.

 

In the eDAM framework, a state of life is a dual-aspect entity: its mental aspect contains consciousness and its physical aspect contains material entities with the above traits.

 

Therefore, a state of a living cell is dual-aspect entity. The degree of manifestation of its physical aspect is high and that of its mental aspect varies with its state. If the cell is in conscious state, then the degree of manifestation of its mental aspect is high; in sleep state it is low. The mental (or physical) aspect evolved from the mental (or physical) aspect of unmanifested state of Brahman. Thus, the eDAM does not make category mistake, whereas materialism and idealism both make category mistake. The phrase, “matter comes from life” needs unpacking: the physical aspect of a state of matter (such as stone) evolved from the physical aspect of unmanifested state of Brahman; its mental aspect is still latent; it has qualitative aspect (which is part of qualitative/mental aspect), such as form and pattern; see (Vimal, 2015a), (Vimal, 2015e), and (Pereira Jr. et al., 2016). In other words, deriving the physical aspect of matter from the mental aspect of life (or vice-versa) makes a category mistake. Cross-causality is forbidden; otherwise category mistake is made; see (Feigl, 1967).

 

Ashish: Fifth, I never understood what happens to the body when the mind goes into deep sleep and is devoid of any activity. By implication, the body must also disappear. What do you think?

 

Ram: This is elaborated in Section 2.5 of (Vimal, 2015b). The degree of manifestation of mental aspect is low, whereas that of its physical aspect is high during sleep. The degree of manifestations of the mental/qualitative aspect depends on the level of consciousness of a mind-brain system. For example, mostly from Fig II-1a-c on page xlviii of (Northoff, 2014).Vol2, the degree of manifestation of mental aspect at coma-state < deep-sleep-NREM state < REM-dream state < vegetative state (VS) < minimally conscious (MCS) < wakeful conscious state.

 

Note: I have included our conversation in the Section 6.5.4 updated version of Section  (Vimal, 2012b) for the benefit of readers. [I hope that this is okay with you; otherwise, let me know, I will delete your texts.] Please feel free to edit your texts to make them more precise (if you feel necessary) and ask further questions if anything is unclear. To make Vedanta more viable scientifically and precise, we all need to make constructive effort.

 

Cheers!

 

Regards,

Ram

4/5/16

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Rām Lakhan Pāndey Vimal, M.S., Ph.D.

Amarāvati-Hīrāmaṇi Professor (Research)

Vision Research Institute, Neuroscience & Consciousness Research Dept.

25 Rita Street, Lowell, MA 01854 USA

Ph: +1 978 263 5028; eFAX: +1 440 388 7907

rlpv...@yahoo.co.in; http://sites.google.com/site/rlpvimal/Home

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Ram_Lakhan_Pandey_Vimal

Researched at University of Chicago and Harvard Medical Schools

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