Re: Old Town B HOA Google Group
IDD
----- Original Message -----From: Omar ShammaTo: 'Rashmey Seth' ; 'ghassan ullayk' ; e...@emirates.net.ae ; kuth...@emirates.net.ae ; jan...@eim.ae ; vih...@hotmail.com ; fb2...@hotmail.com ; pooneh...@gmail.com ; fba...@gmail.com ; arsh...@gmail.com ; lorinr...@gmail.com ; yazd...@gmail.com ; pars...@hotmail.com ; abev...@yahoo.co.uk ; nas...@hotmail.com ; nashi...@hotmail.com ; chhi...@eim.ae ; mp_m...@yahoo.com ; ke...@miskal.co.uk ; charlie...@gmail.com ; shara...@gmail.com ; ktec...@emirates.net.ae ; br...@ftvproclad.com ; 'John McMenemy' ; silver...@yahoo.co.uk ; 'June Park'Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2011 10:44 PMSubject: RE: Old Town B HOA Google GroupDear Rashmey,
You already are a member of the group. When I set up the group I added all those above as members. You do not need to have a Gmail address to do so. If you go to the group page you can then define how you wish to view the communication from the group with an option for receiving emails.
With regard to your comments about service fees, I fully agree that to-date the fee setting process has not been transparent and appears to be excessive. To state that EMAAR “treats us as cash cows to skim off as much as possible” is quite accusatory language and is subjective. If passed onto EMAAR would not I think get a positive response. I am not saying that your statements may not be true, who can say since he accounts were not transparent. However, history is just that…history. No complaining will change the past. The only way we can effect positive change in the future is to form the HOA and manage things ourselves. Until this point is reached I assure you that I will be VERY assertive towards EMAAR in regard to the service charges. The “music sheet we all need to sing from” MUST be based on facts and only facts, underpinned by regulation and law. At this point we can complain all we want…no one will listen until we have our HOA. Rest assured that we are pressuring EMAAR to disclose the facts…even before the HOA is formed.
To all of you copied on this message…WE NEED TWO MORE INTERIM BOARD MEMBERS!! If you feel strongly about your community and care for its future then join us on the board. Don’t just talk…help us take action!! I would welcome Rashmey or Ghassan or Elena, those who have been very vocal about excessive service charges to JOIN THE BOARD!! The last thing we need is a board that does not fully represent all opinions. The board MUST be viewed by ALL owners as defending their interests, otherwise it will be ineffective and we don’t want the future HOA to be cast in the same light as that of EMAAR. The difference between EMAAR and the HOA is that the HOA is composed of owners and each owner has the opportunity to join and participate.
Kind Regards,
Omar Shamma
Third Eye FZ LLC
P. O. Box 71624
Dubai, U.A.E.
Mbl. +971 50 559 4200
The information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail is PRIVILAGED AND/OR CONFIDENTIAL. It is intended only for the individual or entity designated above. You are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, copying or use of or reliance on the information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail message by or to anyone other than the recipient designated above is unauthorised and is strictly prohibited. If you are not the named recipient of this e-mail message or have otherwise received this e-mail message in error, please delete the message immediately and notify the sender immediately via return e-mail at osh...@third-i.biz or via telephone at +971 50 559 4200. Unauthorised interception or use of this e-mail message or the information contained therein may be a violation of law.
From: Rashmey Seth [mailto:rashm...@yahoo.com]
Sent: 23 March 2011 21:18
To: 'ghassan ullayk'; e...@emirates.net.ae; kuth...@emirates.net.ae; jan...@eim.ae; vih...@hotmail.com; fb2...@hotmail.com; pooneh...@gmail.com; fba...@gmail.com; arsh...@gmail.com; lorinr...@gmail.com; yazd...@gmail.com; pars...@hotmail.com; abev...@yahoo.co.uk; nas...@hotmail.com; nashi...@hotmail.com; chhi...@eim.ae; mp_m...@yahoo.com; ke...@miskal.co.uk; charlie...@gmail.com; shara...@gmail.com; ktec...@emirates.net.ae; br...@ftvproclad.com; 'John McMenemy'; osh...@third-i.biz; silver...@yahoo.co.uk; June Park
Subject: Re: Old Town B HOA Google Group
Omar, this site is not allowing non-gmail email addresses like me to Join the group?
However, I went thru your first submission which is rather well written and covers some good perspective - thanks for a great initiative!
But I am afraid I beg to differ with you on your pragmatic approach with Emaar - we all have been very patient and decent thus far paying these Service Fees for the last 6 years with double-digit increase each year without any justification? Emaar has neither increased its expenses nor raised its employees salaries to this extent and nor has it enhanced its services to our communities. Omar, as we also discuused in that meeting we are talking of seriously big bucks here adding up to millions of dirhams of Service Fees. Neither does it treat us Owners with any true respect as Stakeholders with a shared vision? It just treats us as cash cows to skim off as much as possible to line their own coffers without any transparency or open dialogue? After all it is a publicly listed company and should be able to open its books candidly? Why does it not take upon itself as a very successfully managed company to display good governance to its core customers like us owners?
So push-back we must on these Service Fees to resist these year-on-year increases - and agree in a cordial manner but in a collaborative manner with all of us Owners singing from the same sheet of music.
Since you do seem to be in good contact with Emaar, appreciate your taking up this issue of transparency as a good business practice with them - without waiting for these HOA formation?
Regards.......Rashmey
--- On Wed, 23/3/11, Omar Shamma <osh...@third-i.biz> wrote:
From: Omar Shamma <osh...@third-i.biz>
Subject: Old Town B HOA Google Group
To: "'ghassan ullayk'" <gul...@hotmail.com>, e...@emirates.net.ae, kuth...@emirates.net.ae, jan...@eim.ae, vih...@hotmail.com, fb2...@hotmail.com, pooneh...@gmail.com, fba...@gmail.com, arsh...@gmail.com, lorinr...@gmail.com, yazd...@gmail.com, pars...@hotmail.com, abev...@yahoo.co.uk, nas...@hotmail.com, nashi...@hotmail.com, chhi...@eim.ae, mp_m...@yahoo.com, ke...@miskal.co.uk, charlie...@gmail.com, rashm...@yahoo.com, shara...@gmail.com, ktec...@emirates.net.ae, br...@ftvproclad.com, "'John McMenemy"'" <jmc...@oceaneering.com>, osh...@third-i.biz, silver...@yahoo.co.uk, "June Park" <ju...@miskal.co.uk>
Date: Wednesday, 23 March, 2011, 3:04 PMDear All,
I have taken the liberty of creating an Old Town B Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/oldtown-b-hoa.
A Google Group is effectively a bulletin board, where you can have discussions and post your comments/news. I urge you all to join the group. You can send comments/emails to this group at the address oldtow...@googlegroups.com. The email is then received by all group members and additionally can be viewed online via the group web page.
Kind Regards,
Omar Shamma
Third Eye FZ LLC
P. O. Box 71624
Dubai, U.A.E.
Mbl. +971 50 559 4200
The information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail is PRIVILAGED AND/OR CONFIDENTIAL. It is intended only for the individual or entity designated above. You are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, copying or use of or reliance on the information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail message by or to anyone other than the recipient designated above is unauthorised and is strictly prohibited. If you are not the named recipient of this e-mail message or have otherwise received this e-mail message in error, please delete the message immediately and notify the sender immediately via return e-mail at osh...@third-i.biz or via telephone at +971 50 559 4200. Unauthorised interception or use of this e-mail message or the information contained therein may be a violation of law.
ghassan ullayk
Rgrds
Ghassan
From: e...@emirates.net.ae
To: osh...@third-i.biz; rashm...@yahoo.com; gul...@hotmail.com; kuth...@emirates.net.ae; jan...@eim.ae; vih...@hotmail.com; fb2...@hotmail.com; pooneh...@gmail.com; fba...@gmail.com; arsh...@gmail.com; lorinr...@gmail.com; yazd...@gmail.com; pars...@hotmail.com; abev...@yahoo.co.uk; nas...@hotmail.com; nashi...@hotmail.com; chhi...@eim.ae; mp_m...@yahoo.com; ke...@miskal.co.uk; charlie...@gmail.com; shara...@gmail.com; ktec...@emirates.net.ae; br...@ftvproclad.com; jmc...@oceaneering.com; silver...@yahoo.co.uk; ju...@miskal.co.uk
CC: oldtow...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Old Town B HOA Google Group
Omar Shamma
Dear Jaymin,
Please note that Ghassan Ullayk and Elena Carabelli are volunteering to fill the remaining two places on the interim board. Please include them as members.
Please also note that communication to the interim board can be addressed to oldtow...@gmail.com (if confidential only to board members) and oldtow...@googlegroups.com for general information and messages to the owners/community at large.
From my side I welcome both Ghassan and Elena as members and hope that ALL owners feel that the board membership encompasses the full spectrum of opinions and viewpoints such that it represents a fair and balanced position in promoting the rights and interests of the owners as we move forward in the formation of the HOA.
Kind Regards,
Omar Shamma
Third Eye FZ LLC
P. O. Box 71624
Dubai, U.A.E.
Mbl. +971 50 559 4200
The information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail is PRIVILAGED AND/OR CONFIDENTIAL. It is intended only for the individual or entity designated above. You are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, copying or use of or reliance on the information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail message by or to anyone other than the recipient designated above is unauthorised and is strictly prohibited. If you are not the named recipient of this e-mail message or have otherwise received this e-mail message in error, please delete the message immediately and notify the sender immediately via return e-mail at osh...@third-i.biz or via telephone at +971 50 559 4200. Unauthorised interception or use of this e-mail message or the information contained therein may be a violation of law.
IDD
Dear Omar,
what I would like do with all the other board member and as per request of the majority of the Old Town B owners, is to understand and have a clear break down of scope of work and how till today all our money has been spend.
I do not believe past is past, because we should learn from the past and to be able to work correctly for the future we have to have a CLEAR picture of the scope of work and single cost that up to now have been spend (as per RERA regulation Emaar should provide all the details).
It is clear that think has not been done correctly and with the right transparency of Emaar original vision.
If we want to continuous working with Emaar and continuous with their services, how do you think can be done if we cannot control scope of work and break down of price (to be tender correctly or to revise the cost and bring it down to a reasonable level).
Since the economic break down all the salary and rent has been reduce to half but our service fee did not have any revision.
We need to pressure Emaar to guaranty us a revision and reduction of service charges.
If we do not start now in this way we will loose more time and we will not be able as board member to start controlling new service fee correctly or with the right understanding. We need all the information to start with, and we need to work in reducing the service charges to a resonable level and with a complete trasparency for all the owners.
Thanks
Elena Carabelli
----- Original Message -----
Omar Shamma
Dear Elena,
It’s great that you are now on the interim board. I propose that the task of reviewing the detailed historical accounts of the management of the community be assigned to you. You have my full support to push and get the information. No one is holding you back.
Kind Regards,
Omar Shamma
Third Eye FZ LLC
P. O. Box 71624
Dubai, U.A.E.
Mbl. +971 50 559 4200
The information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail is PRIVILAGED AND/OR CONFIDENTIAL. It is intended only for the individual or entity designated above. You are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, copying or use of or reliance on the information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail message by or to anyone other than the recipient designated above is unauthorised and is strictly prohibited. If you are not the named recipient of this e-mail message or have otherwise received this e-mail message in error, please delete the message immediately and notify the sender immediately via return e-mail at osh...@third-i.biz or via telephone at +971 50 559 4200. Unauthorised interception or use of this e-mail message or the information contained therein may be a violation of law.
IDD
----- Original Message -----From: Omar Shamma
Cc: oldtow...@googlegroups.com ; 'ghassan ullayk' ; e...@emirates.net.ae ; rashm...@yahoo.com ; kuth...@emirates.net.ae ; jan...@eim.ae ; vih...@hotmail.com ; fb2...@hotmail.com ; pooneh...@gmail.com ; fba...@gmail.com ; arsh...@gmail.com ; lorinr...@gmail.com ; yazd...@gmail.com ; pars...@hotmail.com ; abev...@yahoo.co.uk ; nas...@hotmail.com ; nashi...@hotmail.com ; chhi...@eim.ae ; mp_m...@yahoo.com ; ke...@miskal.co.uk ; charlie...@gmail.com ; shara...@gmail.com ; ktec...@emirates.net.ae ; br...@ftvproclad.com ; jmc...@oceaneering.com ; silver...@yahoo.co.ukSent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 10:50 AM
IDD
Omar Shamma
Dear Elena,
No problem from my side I will continue to use your email address. The google groups email is very simple, just ensure that you place oldtow...@googlegroups.com in the address and the message will be received by all concerned.
Kind Regards,
Omar Shamma
Third Eye FZ LLC
P. O. Box 71624
Dubai, U.A.E.
Mbl. +971 50 559 4200
The information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail is PRIVILAGED AND/OR CONFIDENTIAL. It is intended only for the individual or entity designated above. You are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, copying or use of or reliance on the information contained in and transmitted with this e-mail message by or to anyone other than the recipient designated above is unauthorised and is strictly prohibited. If you are not the named recipient of this e-mail message or have otherwise received this e-mail message in error, please delete the message immediately and notify the sender immediately via return e-mail at osh...@third-i.biz or via telephone at +971 50 559 4200. Unauthorised interception or use of this e-mail message or the information contained therein may be a violation of law.
Rashmey Seth
Dist,
Hope you all have also read the news item in the Business Section page 32 of Gulf News today - yet another expense coming to fall on us Owners' account of Home Insurance where HOA will be required to take out an Insurance Policy for
- the Joint-Property areas as well as
- another one for our individual units owned by us
Therefore, we need to protect the 'net value' of our investments in these properties by making sure that we control/manage better the increase in all these related costs?
Regards......Rashmey |
Omar Shamma
Dear Elena,
MY contact in EMAAR is Mr. Jaymin Patel, who to-date I have found to be very cooperative and helpful. His email address is jay...@emaar.ae.
I attach the presentation made by EMAAR to the interim committee last week (before you and Ghassan joined) on the District Cooling costs. We still await the minutes to the meeting from EMAAR.
From this presentation I challenged EMAAR on the following issues:
1. The district cooling company is an EMAAR subsidiary (I recall it was called EMAAR ENERGY?). Now this operation is basically a privately “run for profit” monopoly. We cannot switch to someone else. My question is what government regulation limits what district cooling companies can charge, since individually in the area of their operation they are basically a monopoly? I asked this question knowing the answer. We can only look at EMAAR ENERGY in the same way we look at DEWA. We have no influence in what the government charges for electricity and water. EMAAR is a semi-government company and as such its policy in terms of what it can or cannot charge for its services (like DEWA) is dictated by the government. The best we can do is complain IF the rates per tonnage refrigeration are above the average in the market.
2. I made it clear that in our opinion we need more details on the charges (i.e. more details to pages 9, 10 and 11 in the presentation).
3. IF properly managed district cooling is more efficient and environmentally friendly compared with individual cooling. However, this efficiency only comes when the individual user can vary his individual usage to economise on the cooling (i.e. the ability to lower the cooling independently in each property/unit). IF this is done savings in total costs of up to 32% are possible (see page 7 of the presentation). However, as the usage of the cooling is not metered individually, there is no incentive by any user to economise with their cooling…they keep it on all the time, since the logic is “if I am charged for it anyway I will use it!”. As a result the cooling charges for my 4,099 sq ft Meadows villa is some 25% cheaper than the charge for cooling my 1,200 sq ft Old Town apartment. For the sake of the environment EMAAR should implement INDIVIDUAL METERING in each unit!!
4. Whether individual metering is implemented or not I proposed that the billing for the cooling be charged on a monthly basis and that the responsibility for payment be the tenant, as is the case with electricity and water. I do not see why this utility is billed any differently to other utilities. This will not make any difference to the resident owner, however it will reduce the cost to the investor owner (the majority) who is leasing out the property and it will remove the whole issue of district cooling from the responsibility of the HOA. It will be the same as DEWA.
As you can see the issues of cost revolve around fundamental approaches to the management of district cooling and MUST include government regulation and policy. This is wider than the Old Town B HOA. We can provide our opinions, but in the end it is the government that will dictate.
Again, if you disagree with my approach or logic then by all means take up the issue further, you have my support.
IDD
Omar Shamma
Dear Rashmey,
If you read the details of the sales contract on any EMAAR property it requires the home owner to take out insurance on that property. Whilst the property may have been purchased from an existing owner, legally it is sold back to EMAAR and then repurchased by the new owner from EMAAR, with an EMAAR contract of sale. This article, clearly titled to dramatize the situation, is merely stating what already exists in most cases and is normal practice around the world. Common areas and general building insurance has and will continue to be taken out by the developer (now the HOA) and insurance for the individual apartments has and will continue to be taken out by the respective owners. All that has happened here is that the HOAs are being advised that they must insure the practice of taking out insurance continues. There is no new “added” cost here.
What is true in this article is the statement “For the individual property owner, the transition from landlord to owners' associations represents a world of difference”. For those who have never previously experienced owning a “joint property” that is managed by a HOA, I am sure there will be more surprises for them to come.
This link may be useful to understand the role, benefits and criticisms of HOAs.
ghassan ullayk
Schedule 1
(Code of Conduct for Board Members)
2. A Board member must act honestly and fairly in performing their duties and must not unfairly or unreasonably disclose information held by the Owners Association, including information about the Owner or Occupier of a Unit, unless authorized or required by law to do so.
3. A Board member must act in the best interests of all Owners. All Board members should not approve contracts with any entity providing goods and services to the property which the Board member owns, partly owns or is employed by.
4. A Board member must not –
(a) cause a nuisance on the Common Areas; or
(b) otherwise behave in any way that unreasonably affects a person’s lawful use and enjoyment of a Unit or the Common Areas.
(b) abide by the decision of the Board as to whether they are to be permitted to participate in any debate or vote in respect of the matter.
Schedule 2
(Code of Conduct for Association Managers)
1. An Association Manager must have a sound working knowledge of and must comply with the Law, this Constitution and the Regulations, Directions and instructions under the Law.2. An Association Manager must –
(a) act honestly, fairly and professionally; and
(b) exercise reasonable skill, care and diligence,
in performing their functions.
3. An Association Manager must not unfairly or unreasonably disclose information held by the Owners Association, including information about the Owner or Occupier of a Unit, unless authorized or required by law to do so.
4. Unless it is unlawful to do so, an Association Manager must at all times act in the best interests of the Owners Association and, without limitation, must not favour the interests of a developer or contractor over the interests of the Owners Association.
5. An Association Manager must not engage in:
(a) fraudulent or misleading conduct; or
(b) unconscionable conduct,
In performing their functions.
6. An Association Manager must not do anything that would have the effect of placing their interests in conflict with the interests of the Owners Association.
7. An Association Manager must disclose all relationships in writing to the Owners Association regarding any actual, potential or perceived conflict of interest between the Association Manager and any other supplier of goods or services to the Owners Association. The Association Manager shall take all necessary steps to avoid any favoritism or impropriety during the selection process and negotiation of any contracts with suppliers.
8. An Association Manager must not disclose any confidential information (such as Owners’ details, Property’s details, matters regarding the Owners’ Association) to a third party, without the consent and written approval from the Owners’ Association, with exception of any requirement by Law.
9. An Association Manager must take reasonable steps to ensure that goods and services procured by an Owners Association are procured at the most competitive prices reasonably obtainable.
10. An Association Manager must take reasonable steps to ensure that his employees observe this Code of Conduct.
From: osh...@third-i.biz
To: rashm...@yahoo.com; e...@emirates.net.ae; jay...@emaar.ae; ju...@miskal.co.uk
CC: oldtow...@googlegroups.com; gul...@hotmail.com; kuth...@emirates.net.ae; jan...@eim.ae; vih...@hotmail.com; fb2...@hotmail.com; pooneh...@gmail.com; fba...@gmail.com; arsh...@gmail.com; lorinr...@gmail.com; yazd...@gmail.com; pars...@hotmail.com; abev...@yahoo.co.uk; nas...@hotmail.com; nashi...@hotmail.com; chhi...@eim.ae; mp_m...@yahoo.com; ke...@miskal.co.uk; charlie...@gmail.com; shara...@gmail.com; ktec...@emirates.net.ae; br...@ftvproclad.com; jmc...@oceaneering.com; silver...@yahoo.co.uk
Subject: RE: Old Town B HOA Google Group
