OER: is open-practice more trouble than it's worth?

[Yishay Mor]

Dave has posted an interesting note here:

http://www.olds.ac.uk/blog/oerisopen-practicemoretroublethanitsworth

Reviewing some of the issues you have raised this week, he end with a question:

Ultimately this is the OER conundrum – is it quicker and easier to make a resource from scratch rather than to risk the time involved in searching, vetting and possibly modifying somebody else’s work? For many this comes down to their personal skills-set. For example, Tiffany was looking for videos which are generally time-consuming to create and require a range of media skills to produce. Is it the case that as soon as we start to search for resources which are ‘beyond’ text such as images and video that OER becomes much more relevant or are the time and credibility risks still too high?

What do you think?

Yishay

[Will Pollard]

I think there is another advantage in OER - links with a wider network - that is just as useful as saving time in production. If you credit the source of something you reuse then the learners can find a wider discussion.

By the way I have added a cloud on Content Marketing as a way to introduce what is happening on the wider web. Generally I think a lot of content is available in different versions. There may be a journal article in final form that is only available through academic passwords. But there may be a late draft somewhere else. You may have to suggest that the audience for any site has to do their own search around the topic. ( Meanwhile I am working on a music show where we just guess how much to borrow from YouTube and hope the bands let us know what they think)

[Sandie Gay]

Having just read Dave's note, I wonder what evidence there is out there of OERs being used in courses, particularly any that have been
edited/adapted?

[Benjamin Stewart]

Licensing can be a big obstacle when searching for OERs, especially the non-commercial vs. commercial type.  I don't know the percentages between non-commercial and commercial OERs, but my feeling is that there are more of the former.  When I search for OERs, I'm only interested in commercial licenses (e.g., CC-BY & CC-BY-SA) which limits my search right out of the gate.  

But even still, I would say for the most part, it's still easier to reuse, remix, etc. an existing OER than to create one from scratch; searches (like CC Search) are becoming more powerful in this regard.  As for vetting, I do very little.  My "vetting" comes from personal reflection after having used the OER in class, then sharing my experiences and opinions with others - something I already do regardless of the resource. Spending a lot of time beforehand analyzing an OER and it's potential is not really practical.  Teaching and learning is an art as much as it is a science and most local contexts are unique enough that generalities related to validity, reliability, and even potential biases won't apply.

-Benjamin 

[Penny Bentley]

As Howard Rheingold suggests, we also need good "crap detection" skills when searching for online resources. What do you make of this?http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html

[Jane Nkosi]

Hi,

While it may require investement in time to search and find OER that can be used almost readily that initial investement is worthwhile if the resource improves learning and teaching. I would agree that reuse or remixing makes the job lighter.

 

Jane

[Dave White]

It's a .org site so it must all be true :)

[Thomas C. Reeves]

Over the years, I have been involved in several Digital Library projects, the largest of which is the National Science Digital Library (http://nsdl.org/ ). According to the FAQ for NSDL (http://nsdl.org/help/faq ): NSDL is an online portal to web-based (digital) open educational resources focused on the sciences, technology, engineering, and mathematics (STEM) disciplines. (Emphasis added by me.)

And yet when I actually go to the resources in NSDL it is very rare to find any sort of Creative Commons license included.
For example, if I search for resources about meteors (a topic of interest in recent days), one of the first of 556 resources is a simple animation of a meteor shower:
http://www.classzone.com/books/earth_science/terc/content/visualizations/es2707/es2707page01.cfm?chapter_no=visualization
But there is no CC license there.

Another is:
http://meteorshowersonline.com/
This resource also does not have a CC license and it includes ads! 

Digital libraries like NSDL have thousands of vetted resources, but can they really be called OERs without the CC indication?

Thomas C. Reeves, Ph.D.
Professor Emeritus of Learning, Design, and Technology
College of Education
The University of Georgia
325C Aderhold Hall
Athens, GA 30602-7144 USA
E-MAIL: tre...@uga.edu
Personal Webpage: http://www.evaluateitnow.com/     

[Dave White]

Personally I like this approach. Discussing the merits of a resource is a valuable process and helps to equip students to critically evaluate what they find online.

[Dave White]

It's not easy to find examples. When we did the OER Impact study for JISC a couple of years ago we found that there was lots of reuse taking place (some of which was CC licensed) but almost no significant editing/adapting. I'm confident that this does take place for text based resources but the skills required to re-edit videos or other visual media are quite rare. 

The study reminded me how personal and in some senses private individual teaching practice is. 

[Dave White]

I'm sceptical that resources that are not CC licensed are used any differently to those that are. A good resource is a good resource. If it's properly cited and not used for blatant commercial purposes I doubt there would be a problem. I'm sure the NSDL want their materials to be used.

[Penny Bentley]

Will it's also benefits the creator of the resource, exposing their work to a wider audience.

[Apostolos Koutropoulos]

I think it depends :)

Some OER resources are not that closely aligned with what you want to do, so a major rework is required. In these cases it might be easier to start from scratch. In other cases, only minor tweaking is required, and so it may be faster to adapt the OER.  One thing is for sure: nothing will work right out of the box. I think educators, whether they want to use OER or not, need to plan time for designing and implementing such materials. OER isn't the panacea that we (might) hope for in that materials are ready to use at the push of a button.  OER or no OER, time and effort will be required :)

2013/2/18 Yishay Mor <yis...@gmail.com>

Yishay

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[Apostolos Koutropoulos]

You know, I've been curious about this as well :)

It would be great if there were a ping-back mechanism (like some blogs do) to show who's linked to the content :)

2013/2/18 Sandie Gay <sandi...@gmail.com>

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[Apostolos Koutropoulos]

hahahaha :)

Time for me to go register misinformation.org then ;-)

2013/2/18 Dave White <daveo...@gmail.com>

It's a .org site so it must all be true :)

On Monday, February 18, 2013 12:22:27 PM UTC, Penny Bentley wrote:

As Howard Rheingold suggests, we also need good "crap detection" skills when searching for online resources. What do you make of this?http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html

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[Apostolos Koutropoulos]

You make a good point.  Teaching can be very personal and private.  In an open networked world, I can still see the personal aspect, but not the private aspect.  I am wondering what the learning curve is to edit some OERs.  I haven't searched a ton, but some OERs don't seem to come with the "source" (i.e. if you have a PDF of some OER, you can have the PDF, and recreate and remix it, but you don't necessarily have the word/pages/indesign file to make it easier).

2013/2/18 Dave White <daveo...@gmail.com>

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[Dave White]

I suspect that most people don't post OER with the expectation it will be heavily adapted. Plus it can be a bit of a hassle. For example, I wouldn't post all of the raw footage I'd used to make a video, that would simply take too long. I'd be happy for people to edit out a clip from my finished edit though. 

[Dave White]

But does that require an open licence? 

[Briar Jamieson]

I must admit, when it comes to any kind of licensing, copyright issues, my eyes usually glaze over with boredom. I am reluctantly being drawn out of ignorant bliss because of the implications of 'ownership' and 'use' of materials produced in my corner of the not-for-profit world. There is some talk (there needs to be more) around sharing materials developed with publicly funded dollars. Now, because of OLDSMOOC_W6, I have even more questions for my funders and colleagues around copyright and licensing. (Wonderful)  I think we have a long way to go when it comes to working out some of these issues here anyway, and definitely in bringing teachers up to speed on CC.

I am wondering, are all educators here able to license their work under CC?  Do you? How do you know you can?  Do your organizations put any restrictions on you?

Briar

[Dave White]

IMHO licencing is not all that relevant at the level of personal practice. The push on licencing have come via government with a view to institutions sharing and reusing content. What I can get enthusiastic about is the principle of open practice. Blogging, open access publishing, sharing materials in general. The positive aspect of open practice do often get bogged down in legal matters which are out of step with the way the web is used. 

[Will Pollard]

The governments and other funders have concerns about journal publishing, the significant costs, and the blocks on public access to the results of research. Maybe this is another topic but well worth discussing some time.

By the way, I found that Design Approaches in Technology-Enhanced Learning by Yishay Mor and Niall Winters is not available free online, but I went to the St Lukes campus in Exeter and they printed out a copy "for individual use". So some of these things are flexible.

[Yishay Mor]

Hi Will,

It's available here:

http://telearn.archives-ouvertes.fr/index.php?halsid=uc4kr7oubfnt3bvfm0mc9bcec0&view_this_doc=hal-00190279&version=1

the OU are very strict about respecting publishers' terms, but I don't know why they didn't put a "request copy" link on http://oro.open.ac.uk/30354/

Yishay

[Yishay Mor]

Brair,

I usually put "all project outputs will be made available to the public under a CC BY NC SA licence" into the project contract. Funders like it, and it binds my employer. The situation is not so simple for course materials, which most universities consider core IP and are reluctant to release. I try to claim that what we give students is a well designed, well supported, learning experience. The content is just an aid. But that doesn't always convince institutions.

Yishay

[Briar Jamieson]

Merci beaucoup, Yishay,

I will gently start testing the waters with your CC suggestion; similarly, I believe there are some things that will be easier to put this CC licence than others.  IP of course materials gets pretty dusty, pretty quickly now doesn't it? 

Also thank you for the open link to the Design Approaches in TEL, not a quick read by any means, but instructive.  A few years ago I was able to get some funding to customize a part of our LMS; I wish I had this language to describe/guide/inform our process then; however, coming to it now, it is fascinating, were we designing in the wild or just wild, LOL, regardless, our next iteration will be even better because of your work.  (I am using a Force Map in my next presentation :) 

Briar

[Marion Manton]

HI Briar
some employers own the copyright of work you produce in their employment - that is the case with Oxford, so they have to decide you can release it, so you are quite right that can be an issue.

On Tuesday, February 19, 2013 4:42:31 AM UTC, Briar Jamieson wrote:

[Yishay Mor]

The ORO page for "Design Approaches in Technology-Enhanced" is fixed now: http://oro.open.ac.uk/30354/ has a link to request a copy.

Yishay

On Tuesday, 19 February 2013 11:04:15 UTC, Will Pollard wrote:

[Kelly Edmonds]

Very interesting discussion and one that echos my sentiments about OERs. It is hard to find the exact learning object/resource you want and when found it needs reworking due to brevity, poor quality, generality, etc. It becomes a toss up whether to use with lots of padding around it (i.e. describing how learners should use it), or defend making it and get the necessary funds and time.

I find all this sharing quite generous and still scratch my head on how it is happening. For instance, clients pay me good money to make courses, interactive tutorials, etc. and I don't see the motivation for them to share. Why would they and more important, why are large institutions sharing so openly? Instructional development is expensive. So, on the other hand I appreciate their generosity.

I think taking a couple of relaxing hours, along with a nice glass of Merlot, to search the many sites might make it less frustrating finding suitable resources.

[pmi...@liv.ac.uk]

Why would large institutions share? Well, my guess is that some of it comes down to altruistic mission (an extension of existing culture and practice, especially where it doesn't affect the bottom line) and some to self-interest (first-mover status/opportunities, external funding, marketing/differentiation). While it seems as though there's potential for a win-win situation in institutions with a foot in both camps, my guess is that it's sometimes hard to align those polar opposites. Compared to MOOC delivery (where the same poles exist), my guess is that the impact of OER delivery has been limited. That's not to say that I'm hostile to the concept. Indeed, as someone who develops on an open platform, the opportunity to work openly with collaborators would be a significant win and hence my interest in LdShake.

[Bob Ridge-Stearn]

Here's an interesting article about OERs from today's Educause Review -

 

http://tinyurl.com/b3hhjj5

Bob Ridge-Stearn

 

 

[pmi...@liv.ac.uk]

Interesting that my response to Bob's message got queued and then deleted. Guess I must have triggered some spam filter?

[pmi...@liv.ac.uk]

What I was saying was that I didn't support the mega-CMS model but I could see why the author might. Only in more words.

[Will Pollard]

I still think the MOOC as marketing is part of this.

I started a cloud but not much in it as yet. Please add links as they turn up

http://cloudworks.ac.uk/cloud/view/8074

The Educause Review mentions the MIT Open Courseware. It had to be good content to launch the idea. Same for OER.

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[pmi...@liv.ac.uk]

"It had to be good content to launch the idea"

I suspect it had to come from an institution with a significant reputation that offered critical mass -- I know of discipline areas that were running the equivalent of MOOCs certainly in the very early days of the web and possibly before. That doesn't necessarily mean that all MIT content is/was beyond reproach (maybe it is, I don't know), nor that smaller institutions can't make valuable contributions. On the other hand it does imply (as others have said) that a lot of patient evaluation is required and that's where commercial products tend to win at introductory levels. They do a "good enough" job that teachers can build on and they are in a competitive market which means there are relatively few to evaluate but they are generally of "good enough" quality and presented in a consistent unbranded format.

It will be interesting to see how publishers relate to MOOCs. Several of the Coursera ones have recommended texts, sometimes written by the main presenter. A reasonably priced eBook written by someone whose course you enjoyed may be a more useful adjunct if you can afford it than access to multiple hours of video. Pearson, of course, has contracted to run proctored exams for both edX and Udacity.

[Bob Ridge-Stearn]

On Wednesday, February 27, 2013 1:49:33 PM UTC, pmi...@liv.ac.uk wrote:

Interesting that my response to Bob's message got queued and then deleted. Guess I must have triggered some spam filter?

It must be my name.  I've lost a number of messages that i posted to this forum ;-)

On the subject of this forum, it's a disaster IMHO. The messages are not ordered chronologically because some people have pinned theirs to the top and you cannot order messages by author, date, subject matter.  I'm very surprised by this as it's a Google product. Also, in the email alert you receive when someone replies to one of your messages there is no link back to the original message, so finding this one to reply to was a bit of a chore.  It may be that Google Groups is not the best tool to use for an online forum.  Maybe the Groups aspect of it is good but the forum part a little lightweight.

Moaning as usual.

Bob R-S

 

 

[pmi...@liv.ac.uk]

It's a Google product sans adverts so, like Sites and Reader, I wonder whether it gets the same level of attention post-G+. OK, it just got an upgrade so it's demise isn't imminent. Not a great experience on a N7 tablet though.

[Apostolos Koutropoulos]

As far as Google Groups goes, I always approach it as a "Mailing list++" type of product.  I don't see it as a forum, although it does have forum qualities :) It works well enough ;-)

2013/2/28 <pmi...@liv.ac.uk>

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