Velocities very high

[Norberto Vera]

Hello all

I'm trying to simulate a fluid flow and heat transport using one of the state equations that relates density to temperature "ro (T)", using option 4 in the file (NNN.mfp) according to the tutorial "OpenGeoSys Tutorial Basics of Heat Transport Processes in Geothermal Systems "page 110, using the values (ro_0, betha_T, T_0) = (0.013000e + 000, 0.04, 200). First, the value of the reference density is not correct and second, the velocity values are very high. Can someone help me explain what my mistake is?

 

Thank you

 

I'm using OGS 5.

[Norihiro Watanabe]

Hi,

 

Maybe you should write

$DENSITY

  4 0.013000e+000 200 0.04

 

instead of

$DENSITY

  4 0.013000e+000 0.04 200

 

best,

Nori

 

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[Norberto Vera]

Thank you very much for your help.

I have used the option you recommend me.

The result it is the following.

Files I'm using are the follow.

What's my mistake?

Norberto C. Vera Guzmán

Instituto de Geofísica, UNAM

[Norberto Vera]

Excuse me, the results are as follows

Saludos Cordiales

Norberto C. Vera Guzmán

Instituto de Geofísica, UNAM

[Norihiro Watanabe]

Hi,

 

Please check the storage and the permeability values in the MMP file.

 

$STORAGE

  1  2.000000e-001

$PERMEABILITY_TENSOR

  ISOTROPIC  2.50000e-005

 

The storage value S is defined as

S = porosity/(fluid bulk modulus) + (1- porosity)/(solid bulk modulus)

without considering the Biot parameter, and is typically 1e-10 ~ 1e-11 [1/Pa].

 

The permeability parameter for LIQUID_FLOW process is the intrinsic permeability, and its value could be e.g. 1e-12 m2 for high conductive materials.

 

 

Regards,

Nori

 

--

Norihiro WATANABE

[Mohammad Islam]

Please also check .mfp file

 $HEAT_CONDUCTIVITY

  1

In addition to Nori, please also check attachment, Page 18 (Equation 1.42). I am not sure how the storage term is defined in the source code.

One more issue, for same input files, I found some problems (e.g. LIQUID_FLOW &  HEAT_TRANSPORT) are running well in ogs5.3.4 but they are not running in ogs5.7. In one of my case, (H2M & heterogeneous medium with fracture), the H2 response is good but displacement vectors are very high, even though I used $NEGLECT_H_INI_EFFECT =2.

Regards,

Mohammad

[Norberto Vera]

Thanks again. I have changed the values of the parameters

$ STORAGE 1 2.000000e-001 and

$ PERMEABILITY_TENSOR ISOTROPIC 2.50000e-005

to

$ STORAGE 1 2.000000e-010 and

$ PERMEABILITY_TENSOR ISOTROPIC 2.50000e-012

and the results are effectively consistent.

I only have one question, the density of the fluid should not be lower in regions where the temperature is higher?

regards

Norberto C. Vera Guzmán

Instituto de Geofísica, UNAM

[Norihiro Watanabe]

Hi,

> I only have one question, the density of the fluid should not be lower in regions where the temperature is higher?

Please change the MFP file as

$DENSITY
4 0.013000e+000 200 -0.04

Here, you need to add a negative sign to the last parameter (fluid thermal expansion coefficient) to get the density decrease with increased temperature, because the OGS implements the density model 4 as

rho(T) = rho0*(1+alpha*(T-T0))

The last parameter in $DENSITY corresponds to "alpha".

Best,
Nori

--
渡邉教弘 / Norihiro Watanabe
norihiro...@aist.go.jp

________________________________________
差出人: ogs-...@googlegroups.com <ogs-...@googlegroups.com> が Norberto Vera <nrb...@gmail.com> の代理で送信
送信日時: 2019年2月14日 1:02:00
宛先: ogs-group
件名: Re: [ogs-users] Velocities very high

Thanks again. I have changed the values of the parameters
$ STORAGE 1 2.000000e-001 and
$ PERMEABILITY_TENSOR ISOTROPIC 2.50000e-005
to
$ STORAGE 1 2.000000e-010 and
$ PERMEABILITY_TENSOR ISOTROPIC 2.50000e-012
and the results are effectively consistent.

I only have one question, the density of the fluid should not be lower in regions where the temperature is higher?

regards


Norberto C. Vera Guzmán
Instituto de Geofísica, UNAM

El mar., 12 feb. 2019 a las 6:00, Norihiro Watanabe (<norihiro...@aist.go.jp<mailto:norihiro...@aist.go.jp>>) escribió:
Hi,

Please check the storage and the permeability values in the MMP file.

$STORAGE
1 2.000000e-001
$PERMEABILITY_TENSOR
ISOTROPIC 2.50000e-005

The storage value S is defined as
S = porosity/(fluid bulk modulus) + (1- porosity)/(solid bulk modulus)
without considering the Biot parameter, and is typically 1e-10 ~ 1e-11 [1/Pa].

The permeability parameter for LIQUID_FLOW process is the intrinsic permeability, and its value could be e.g. 1e-12 m2 for high conductive materials.


Regards,
Nori

--
Norihiro WATANABE

From: ogs-...@googlegroups.com<mailto:ogs-...@googlegroups.com> <ogs-...@googlegroups.com<mailto:ogs-...@googlegroups.com>> On Behalf Of Norberto Vera
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 2:44 AM
To: ogs-group <ogs-...@googlegroups.com<mailto:ogs-...@googlegroups.com>>
Subject: Re: [ogs-users] Velocities very high

Excuse me, the results are as follows


Saludos Cordiales

Norberto C. Vera Guzmán
Instituto de Geofísica, UNAM

El lun., 11 feb. 2019 a las 11:39, Norberto Vera (<nrb...@gmail.com<mailto:nrb...@gmail.com>>) escribió:
Thank you very much for your help.
I have used the option you recommend me.
The result it is the following.
Files I'm using are the follow.
What's my mistake?

Norberto C. Vera Guzmán
Instituto de Geofísica, UNAM

El mié., 6 feb. 2019 a las 17:04, Norihiro Watanabe (<norihiro...@aist.go.jp<mailto:norihiro...@aist.go.jp>>) escribió:
Hi,

Maybe you should write
$DENSITY
4 0.013000e+000 200 0.04

instead of
$DENSITY
4 0.013000e+000 0.04 200

best,
Nori

From: ogs-...@googlegroups.com<mailto:ogs-...@googlegroups.com> <ogs-...@googlegroups.com<mailto:ogs-...@googlegroups.com>> On Behalf Of Norberto Vera
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 1:34 AM
To: ogs-users <ogs-...@googlegroups.com<mailto:ogs-...@googlegroups.com>>
Subject: [ogs-users] Velocities very high

Hello all
I'm trying to simulate a fluid flow and heat transport using one of the state equations that relates density to temperature "ro (T)", using option 4 in the file (NNN.mfp) according to the tutorial "OpenGeoSys Tutorial Basics of Heat Transport Processes in Geothermal Systems "page 110, using the values (ro_0, betha_T, T_0) = (0.013000e + 000, 0.04, 200). First, the value of the reference density is not correct and second, the velocity values are very high. Can someone help me explain what my mistake is?

Thank you

I'm using OGS 5.
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[Norberto Vera]

Hello Nori, following your suggestions I changed the parameters to calculate density and the results are consistent.

Thanks for your advice

Norberto C. Vera Guzmán

Instituto de Geofísica, UNAM

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