Planing Indian Rosewood - What a pain in the back side (put intendend).

[Peter Kendall]

Is Indian Rosewood known to be difficult to plane?  Planing Spanish Cedar was fun and I get some awesome shavings.  I had the hardest time planing my sides so I used my scraper for the most part.  I don't mind spending more time or the hard work, but it beats up my thumbs.  I also ordered some practice sides before I bend my good ones and they arrived between .090-.095 and they wouldn't bend so I need to thinkness these too.  I was hoping these would come ready to bend.  Nope, but then again I never have done that either.  I have the LMI bending iron and set it between 6-max without success. I'm thinking I'll use my scraper and maybe an orbital sander with 120 grit to spare my thumbs a bit then try bending again.  

To be safe I sharpened my 05 Jackplane and block plane and it was still gouging and still really tough to push.  

Planing my spruce top was ok, but not nearly as easy as the cedar.  It felt like Russian Roulette waiting for a snag at any moment.  

Maybe my set up and technique is off, but I surely get great shavings on the cedar, but maybe that's not saying much. 

I'm not looking forward to thicknessing my back if it acts at all like the sides.   

[JohnParchem]

First off it is hard, that is why I switched to a drum sander. When planing the direction matters. It is hard to feel the runout on rosewood, but it is there. So if you are catching  a snag plane the other way.  Also maybe go with a higher plane angle. You can change the angle of the bevel.

[Stephen Foss]

Thus the invention of the Wagner Saf-T-Plane.

The original Wagner Saf-T-Planer is no longer available, but there are two sources for this type of tool that I know of: Stew-Mac and one from one of Robbie's acquaintances in Brazil. Reportedly, the one from Brazil is better with 6 instead of 3 cutters; it's also slightly more expensive and more difficult to get. I have one of the original Wagners and it does the trick for me.

A really sharp plane blade and a well set up plane *can* get the job done. So can a drum sander. Knowing which direction the run-out is for the back/side wood gives one a leg up on thicknessing without tear-out using a plane.

Steve

[【千】Sen Goh]

Actually relatively straight grain Indian RW should be quite easy to plane when compare to harder rosewoods like Honduran or Cambodian or Amazon RW.

You can try planing at right angles across the grain.

It should minimise any tearouts and finish the surface with scraper.

Or get a high angle plane (60 degrees) or a scraper plane or a toothed plane iron.

Alternatively sharpen a round camber to the plane iron.

Normally I use a scrub plane at an angle to remove bulk of the waste then smoothen with my (high angle or normal) smoothing plane and scraper.

[Paul Micheletti]

Indian Rosewood can be difficult.  I invested in a drum sander to remove the uncertainty.  I use only 80 grit on the drum sander to do very rough sanding as rosewood also wants to carmelize and burn resins at finer grits.  Cleaning up all the rough sanding marks takes a few minutes with a card scraper, but leaves a good surface without holes to fill from plane tearout.

I accidentally forgot to thin Indian Rosewood sides once, and bent them at a full 1/8" (0.125"), and they bent just fine.  Indian Rosewood is very forgiving to bend.  I also made a 1/8" wide rosette ring for a tiny harp guitar box arm soundhole.  Bent that little sucker into a 2" diameter circle.  Very forgiving wood to bend.

Paul M.

On Monday, February 15, 2021 at 8:24:45 AM UTC-8 peterk...@gmail.com wrote:

[Robert Erdman]

I sand & scrape it.  Bends great.    

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 15, 2021, at 12:49 PM, Paul Micheletti <pemich...@gmail.com> wrote:

Indian Rosewood can be difficult.  I invested in a drum sander to remove the uncertainty.  I use only 80 grit on the drum sander to do very rough sanding as rosewood also wants to carmelize and burn resins at finer grits.  Cleaning up all the rough sanding marks takes a few minutes with a card scraper, but leaves a good surface without holes to fill from plane tearout.

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[Dave Schramm]

Last time I planed a back and side was 30 years ago!  I've used the Gilbert thickness sanding disc on my drill press for the past 380+ guitars that I've built. It is fast and accurate to within 0.0005" . One of my favorite and most used tools in my shop. 

World renown luthier John Gilbert used to use the Saf-T-Planer in the 1970's but switched to his 5" drill press sanding disc. I learned how to use it in his shop and have developed my own techniques and applications for using it.  John didn't like the poor inaccurate job the not so Saf-T-Planer did on the materials. If you like to control your thicknesses to within 0.001" +/- , the Gilbert drill press thickness sanding disk is great.  I'm addicted to it. Good to have three of them, one for 36 grits, 80 grit (main work horse) , and 120 grit. 220 pretty much polishes the work piece and I don't use it.

John once showed me how to make your own straight edges using the machinist trick of use three  edges. Accurate to 0.0005"!!!.  Way more accurate than Stew Mac and LMII which have always been off by 0.003" or more when I check them on my granite surface plates. John was a machinist during WWII and had all kinds of tricks up his sleeve that he applied to lutherie. 

[Eric Thompson]

David,  I had  one of those made working in a machine shop years ago and yes it works better than anything I have used.  

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[Peter Kendall]

Is the Gilbert disc different than other discs such as:  https://www.amazon.com/HIFROM-Backing-Adapter-Sandpaper-Assortment/dp/B07P5BS1L7/ref=sr_1_28_sspa?dchild=1&keywords=drill%2Bsanding%2Battachment%2Bdrill%2Bpress&qid=1613499921&sr=8-28-spons&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExUTBEMzZPVUdWNFRMJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwNDgwNTA4ODVPTFo4TDY5UllUJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA4MjkwMDEyS1hKQVI2RzI1QUU4JndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfbXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ&th=1 

I don't have a drill press yet, but as I build more guitars and seeing how thickness is rosewood is tough for me, this seems like a good option.   BTW wearing gloves while using my scraper last night helped a lot.  I took some pressure off the thumbs and also helped with the heat build up too.  Still, it takes forever to knock down 1 mm.  

[Peter Kendall]

BTW.  I bent my first practice side last night and was awesome to see it in the form.  I couldn't stop looking at it thinking that I just did that with a hot pipe iron by hand.  Wasn't that hard once I got it down to about 2mm.  I hope to get to my good sides tonight.  

[California Chris]

I finally just hand planed and scraped a set of rosewood sides.  I bent them yesterday morning and I had the same reaction...WOW, what fun.!!!!  I tried Robbie's Saf-T-Planer technique, but I have a WEN drill press and it doesn't have any way of fine adjustment for lowering the cutter.  I can see that it would work, and eventually, when I can spare the money, I will get a better drill press.  In the meantime, I will stick to plane, scraper, and bending iron.  For what it's worth, I found a low angle plane, used at an oblique angle, to work very well.  Planing straight on will get the chip out. Also, LMI will sand your rosewood back down to .100" for $13.50.  That seems well worth the money.   Anyway, here is my first rosewood side  bend on the bending iron.  I feel like a proud papa.  Putting on the blocks and reverse kerning tonight{:-))  Thanks for the great lessons, Robbie!!

[California Chris]

Kerfing, that is{:-))

[Peter Kendall]

Great tips California Girls.  I was considering a WEN drill press too, but now I'll be sure to look for one that has great adjustment capabilities.  Also, I like the idea of LMI thicknessing it down to .100 as well.  Your sides look great to me.  Good fit.  

[California Chris]

Thanks! I just checked the LMI site and for $25 they will thickness your sides down to .09" and the back down to 0.10".  With the limited space in my shop, I just can't justify a drum sander, and this alternative really makes taking the pieces down the rest of way a breeze.  

[jrivard157]

I have the WEN also and just used the safety planer on a set of Myrtle wood sides. On the Wen you must adjust the table up to the cutter. Don't lower the table to find your thickness; find your thickness by raising the table up to the cutter. Cut a sample and raise the table to fine tune it. If you put your thumb against the crank before releasing the table lock mechanism you can feel any movement. Push the crank a little with your thumb and you can feel the small gain. Tighten the table lock and try again. I had pretty good luck using this technique. 

[Stephen Foss]

For those drill presses that don't have a crank to raise/lower, I've used a small, automotive hydraulic bottle jack under the table. You can be pretty precise while raising the table.