Labours doing a great job...

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John Bowes

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Oct 6, 2022, 1:05:50 AMOct 6
to
Thank goodness it revolves around own goals :)

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mike-hosking-labour-mastering-the-art-of-the-own-goal/SE7LPNBZVKIC3P5HMVVHH6Q5AE/

OPINION:

As if the Government didn't have enough trouble a year out from the election, they are starting to look like a party set on self-destruction.

The economy all by itself is going to be a massive headache for them next year, before you get to policy ideology like co-governance and Three Waters, not to mention their social insurance scheme and so-called industry-wide fair-pay arrangements.

Connected to some of the more unpopular ideas is the Māori part of the Labour caucus who appear to, 1) wield an undue amount of power, and 2) look like they are keen to wreck the joint.

Last week's Kantar poll once again confirmed what a battle Labour already have, a trend that's been in place pretty much all year, and now you can add three key players who are refining the art of the own goal.

1, Kelvin Davis last week had his Michael Cullen "rich prick" moment. It's the value of the House and question time. When you get under the skin, the truth sometimes comes out. We got to see the real Davis, and it was ugly. In Britain, Rupa Huq displayed similar qualities and got suspended. Jacinda Ardern was never going to suspend Davis, which is part of the problem — she couldn't because of the Māori caucus push back and because she's not actually good at that stuff anyway and would rather hope that her problems go away.

So the same crime, but different outcomes ... depending whose Labour party you're dealing with.

2, Nanaia Mahuta apparently has an astonishingly skilled husband. Never has the public service seen such a genius in arranging meetings.

A skill so heavily in demand it now needs the Public Service Commission's attention. Skills so singular that many a ministry decided that they didn't even need to take their requests to the market. One agency has already looked at its processes, and wouldn't you know it — there were deficiencies.



And then 3, Willie "I know broadcasting" Jackson.

It takes quite a skill to undermine people the way he did last week. Apparently, TVNZ and Radio New Zealand are not to be trusted anymore. And it's only by banging those square pegs into round holes that somehow under the Jackson magic, trust will be restored.

He had to backtrack of course and that is one of Willie's many problems: he is a big mouth.

If you haven't followed it, the vast majority, if not all of the rest of the media, have lined up to tell Jackson his idea is a combination of pointless and expensive.

It might have come as a surprise to Jackson but a lot of us in the industry know what we're talking about, we've been around a while, worked for a fair few people, seen a lot of different models, and know a bad idea when we see one.

Also as part of Jackson's unique view of the broadcasting landscape, he tells TVNZ it's they who have to change their outlook not RNZ, because RNZ "gets it".


We had all assumed it's the other way around, due largely to the fact that TVNZ is sort of successful, as opposed to RNZ whose audiences have slumped badly in recent years.
The point being, no matter what sort of broadcasting you're doing, you need an audience, and TVNZ appears more capable of that than RNZ.

It becomes even more imperative if you're using other people's money. What's the point of hundreds of millions of dollars for something no one hears or watches?

The upshot is the minister has got up the nose of the whole industry, and given his party a headache it doesn't need. It's hard to know what's worse, being active and trouble, like these three, or under the radar like Poto Williams or Tāmati Coffey.

Either way, if the PM has the stomach for it, she might like to tell them to pull their heads in before they bury the whole party.

Rich80105

unread,
Oct 6, 2022, 3:36:41 AMOct 6
to
On Wed, 5 Oct 2022 22:05:49 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Thank goodness it revolves around own goals :)
>
>https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mike-hosking-labour-mastering-the-art-of-the-own-goal/SE7LPNBZVKIC3P5HMVVHH6Q5AE/
>
>OPINION:
>
>As if the Government didn't have enough trouble a year out from the election, they are starting to look like a party set on self-destruction.
>
>The economy all by itself is going to be a massive headache for them next year, before you get to policy ideology like co-governance and Three Waters, not to mention their social insurance scheme and so-called industry-wide fair-pay arrangements.
>
>Connected to some of the more unpopular ideas is the M?ori part of the Labour caucus who appear to, 1) wield an undue amount of power, and 2) look like they are keen to wreck the joint.
>
>Last week's Kantar poll once again confirmed what a battle Labour already have, a trend that's been in place pretty much all year, and now you can add three key players who are refining the art of the own goal.
Interesting that they do not publicise the percentage that are
undecided - I suspect you will find it is larger than the difference
between the two major groups. ACT support is going up and down too - I
guess they have a battle too - and the same is tru eof the Green
Party. Do National have a battle ahead of them as well?

>
>1, Kelvin Davis last week had his Michael Cullen "rich prick" moment. It's the value of the House and question time. When you get under the skin, the truth sometimes comes out. We got to see the real Davis, and it was ugly. In Britain, Rupa Huq displayed similar qualities and got suspended. Jacinda Ardern was never going to suspend Davis, which is part of the problem — she couldn't because of the M?ori caucus push back and because she's not actually good at that stuff anyway and would rather hope that her problems go away.
>
>So the same crime, but different outcomes ... depending whose Labour party you're dealing with.
>
>2, Nanaia Mahuta apparently has an astonishingly skilled husband. Never has the public service seen such a genius in arranging meetings.
Of course they have - Wira Gardiner was widely used by more than one
government, including while his wife Hekia Parata was an MP. How soon
some forget

>
>A skill so heavily in demand it now needs the Public Service Commission's attention. Skills so singular that many a ministry decided that they didn't even need to take their requests to the market. One agency has already looked at its processes, and wouldn't you know it — there were deficiencies.

Wait and see what the report says. Mind you, people said that about
Uffindell and not even National MPS who "voted" on keeping him an MP
got to see that!

>
>And then 3, Willie "I know broadcasting" Jackson.
>
>It takes quite a skill to undermine people the way he did last week. Apparently, TVNZ and Radio New Zealand are not to be trusted anymore. And it's only by banging those square pegs into round holes that somehow under the Jackson magic, trust will be restored.
>
>He had to backtrack of course and that is one of Willie's many problems: he is a big mouth.
>
>If you haven't followed it, the vast majority, if not all of the rest of the media, have lined up to tell Jackson his idea is a combination of pointless and expensive.
>
>It might have come as a surprise to Jackson but a lot of us in the industry know what we're talking about, we've been around a while, worked for a fair few people, seen a lot of different models, and know a bad idea when we see one.
>
>Also as part of Jackson's unique view of the broadcasting landscape, he tells TVNZ it's they who have to change their outlook not RNZ, because RNZ "gets it".
>
>
>We had all assumed it's the other way around, due largely to the fact that TVNZ is sort of successful, as opposed to RNZ whose audiences have slumped badly in recent years.
>The point being, no matter what sort of broadcasting you're doing, you need an audience, and TVNZ appears more capable of that than RNZ.
>
>It becomes even more imperative if you're using other people's money. What's the point of hundreds of millions of dollars for something no one hears or watches?
>
>The upshot is the minister has got up the nose of the whole industry, and given his party a headache it doesn't need. It's hard to know what's worse, being active and trouble, like these three, or under the radar like Poto Williams or T?mati Coffey.

John Bowes

unread,
Oct 6, 2022, 3:52:46 AMOct 6
to
On Thursday, October 6, 2022 at 8:36:41 PM UTC+13, Rich80105 wrote:
> On Wed, 5 Oct 2022 22:05:49 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
> <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Thank goodness it revolves around own goals :)
> >
> >https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mike-hosking-labour-mastering-the-art-of-the-own-goal/SE7LPNBZVKIC3P5HMVVHH6Q5AE/
> >
> >OPINION:
> >
> >As if the Government didn't have enough trouble a year out from the election, they are starting to look like a party set on self-destruction.
> >
> >The economy all by itself is going to be a massive headache for them next year, before you get to policy ideology like co-governance and Three Waters, not to mention their social insurance scheme and so-called industry-wide fair-pay arrangements.
> >
> >Connected to some of the more unpopular ideas is the M?ori part of the Labour caucus who appear to, 1) wield an undue amount of power, and 2) look like they are keen to wreck the joint.
> >
> >Last week's Kantar poll once again confirmed what a battle Labour already have, a trend that's been in place pretty much all year, and now you can add three key players who are refining the art of the own goal.
> Interesting that they do not publicise the percentage that are
> undecided - I suspect you will find it is larger than the difference
> between the two major groups. ACT support is going up and down too - I
> guess they have a battle too - and the same is tru eof the Green
> Party. Do National have a battle ahead of them as well?

Not as big a one as Labours Rich :)

>
> >
> >1, Kelvin Davis last week had his Michael Cullen "rich prick" moment. It's the value of the House and question time. When you get under the skin, the truth sometimes comes out. We got to see the real Davis, and it was ugly. In Britain, Rupa Huq displayed similar qualities and got suspended. Jacinda Ardern was never going to suspend Davis, which is part of the problem — she couldn't because of the M?ori caucus push back and because she's not actually good at that stuff anyway and would rather hope that her problems go away.
> >
> >So the same crime, but different outcomes ... depending whose Labour party you're dealing with.
> >
> >2, Nanaia Mahuta apparently has an astonishingly skilled husband. Never has the public service seen such a genius in arranging meetings.
> Of course they have - Wira Gardiner was widely used by more than one
> government, including while his wife Hekia Parata was an MP. How soon
> some forget

What are you on about Rich? Did he get the various positions he held because of his wife or because he had a record of being a capable public servant? Seems you're up to your apple and oranges tricks again. No surprises there when your inglorious Labour party is having real dirty washing aired :)

> >
> >A skill so heavily in demand it now needs the Public Service Commission's attention. Skills so singular that many a ministry decided that they didn't even need to take their requests to the market. One agency has already looked at its processes, and wouldn't you know it — there were deficiencies.
> Wait and see what the report says. Mind you, people said that about
> Uffindell and not even National MPS who "voted" on keeping him an MP
> got to see that!

Why? Are you saying the report is dodgy? Or just trying another distraction from the disaster your inglorious Labour party has become under your inglorious misleader Ardern!

Crash

unread,
Oct 6, 2022, 4:33:06 PMOct 6
to
On Thu, 06 Oct 2022 20:35:28 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>On Wed, 5 Oct 2022 22:05:49 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
><bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Thank goodness it revolves around own goals :)
>>
>>https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mike-hosking-labour-mastering-the-art-of-the-own-goal/SE7LPNBZVKIC3P5HMVVHH6Q5AE/
>>
>>OPINION:
>>
>>As if the Government didn't have enough trouble a year out from the election, they are starting to look like a party set on self-destruction.
>>
>>The economy all by itself is going to be a massive headache for them next year, before you get to policy ideology like co-governance and Three Waters, not to mention their social insurance scheme and so-called industry-wide fair-pay arrangements.
>>
>>Connected to some of the more unpopular ideas is the M?ori part of the Labour caucus who appear to, 1) wield an undue amount of power, and 2) look like they are keen to wreck the joint.
>>
>>Last week's Kantar poll once again confirmed what a battle Labour already have, a trend that's been in place pretty much all year, and now you can add three key players who are refining the art of the own goal.
>Interesting that they do not publicise the percentage that are
>undecided - I suspect you will find it is larger than the difference
>between the two major groups. ACT support is going up and down too - I
>guess they have a battle too - and the same is tru eof the Green
>Party. Do National have a battle ahead of them as well?
>
Of course National has a battle on their hands - to convince those
voters who do not want to support the current parties in Government to
party-vote for them (first) and to vote for their local National
electorate candidate. Its a very different battle but it is there.
>>
>>1, Kelvin Davis last week had his Michael Cullen "rich prick" moment. It's the value of the House and question time. When you get under the skin, the truth sometimes comes out. We got to see the real Davis, and it was ugly. In Britain, Rupa Huq displayed similar qualities and got suspended. Jacinda Ardern was never going to suspend Davis, which is part of the problem — she couldn't because of the M?ori caucus push back and because she's not actually good at that stuff anyway and would rather hope that her problems go away.
>>
>>So the same crime, but different outcomes ... depending whose Labour party you're dealing with.
>>
>>2, Nanaia Mahuta apparently has an astonishingly skilled husband. Never has the public service seen such a genius in arranging meetings.
>Of course they have - Wira Gardiner was widely used by more than one
>government, including while his wife Hekia Parata was an MP. How soon
>some forget
>
Can you produce any evidence that there was ever any allegations of
wrongdoing with Gardiner/Parata as there is with Ormsby/Mahuta?

>>
>>A skill so heavily in demand it now needs the Public Service Commission's attention. Skills so singular that many a ministry decided that they didn't even need to take their requests to the market. One agency has already looked at its processes, and wouldn't you know it — there were deficiencies.
>
>Wait and see what the report says. Mind you, people said that about
>Uffindell and not even National MPS who "voted" on keeping him an MP
>got to see that!
>
You are truly desperate to deflect, Rich. The Uffindell issue has no
relevance with anything in Hoskings article.
>>
>>And then 3, Willie "I know broadcasting" Jackson.
>>
>>It takes quite a skill to undermine people the way he did last week. Apparently, TVNZ and Radio New Zealand are not to be trusted anymore. And it's only by banging those square pegs into round holes that somehow under the Jackson magic, trust will be restored.
>>
>>He had to backtrack of course and that is one of Willie's many problems: he is a big mouth.
>>
>>If you haven't followed it, the vast majority, if not all of the rest of the media, have lined up to tell Jackson his idea is a combination of pointless and expensive.
>>
>>It might have come as a surprise to Jackson but a lot of us in the industry know what we're talking about, we've been around a while, worked for a fair few people, seen a lot of different models, and know a bad idea when we see one.
>>
>>Also as part of Jackson's unique view of the broadcasting landscape, he tells TVNZ it's they who have to change their outlook not RNZ, because RNZ "gets it".
>>
>>
>>We had all assumed it's the other way around, due largely to the fact that TVNZ is sort of successful, as opposed to RNZ whose audiences have slumped badly in recent years.
>>The point being, no matter what sort of broadcasting you're doing, you need an audience, and TVNZ appears more capable of that than RNZ.
>>
>>It becomes even more imperative if you're using other people's money. What's the point of hundreds of millions of dollars for something no one hears or watches?
>>
>>The upshot is the minister has got up the nose of the whole industry, and given his party a headache it doesn't need. It's hard to know what's worse, being active and trouble, like these three, or under the radar like Poto Williams or T?mati Coffey.
>>
>>Either way, if the PM has the stomach for it, she might like to tell them to pull their heads in before they bury the whole party.


--
Crash McBash

Rich80105

unread,
Oct 6, 2022, 8:21:38 PMOct 6
to
On Thu, 6 Oct 2022 00:52:44 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
Luxon Open and Honest? Yeah ... Naah. Are you claiming it is not
dodgy, JOhn Bowes?

Rich80105

unread,
Oct 6, 2022, 9:01:18 PMOct 6
to
On Fri, 07 Oct 2022 09:33:04 +1300, Crash <nog...@dontbother.invalid>
wrote:

>On Thu, 06 Oct 2022 20:35:28 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 5 Oct 2022 22:05:49 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
>><bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Thank goodness it revolves around own goals :)
>>>
>>>https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mike-hosking-labour-mastering-the-art-of-the-own-goal/SE7LPNBZVKIC3P5HMVVHH6Q5AE/
>>>
>>>OPINION:
>>>
>>>As if the Government didn't have enough trouble a year out from the election, they are starting to look like a party set on self-destruction.
>>>
>>>The economy all by itself is going to be a massive headache for them next year, before you get to policy ideology like co-governance and Three Waters, not to mention their social insurance scheme and so-called industry-wide fair-pay arrangements.
>>>
>>>Connected to some of the more unpopular ideas is the M?ori part of the Labour caucus who appear to, 1) wield an undue amount of power, and 2) look like they are keen to wreck the joint.
>>>
>>>Last week's Kantar poll once again confirmed what a battle Labour already have, a trend that's been in place pretty much all year, and now you can add three key players who are refining the art of the own goal.
>>Interesting that they do not publicise the percentage that are
>>undecided - I suspect you will find it is larger than the difference
>>between the two major groups. ACT support is going up and down too - I
>>guess they have a battle too - and the same is tru eof the Green
>>Party. Do National have a battle ahead of them as well?
>>
>Of course National has a battle on their hands - to convince those
>voters who do not want to support the current parties in Government to
>party-vote for them (first) and to vote for their local National
>electorate candidate. Its a very different battle but it is there.

I agree with your assessment; thank you. Just as Labour have been
attacked as needing the Green Party to govern (although that did not
happen this term, it islikely from the next election), National is now
looking to need support from ACT, who have I think done well to keep a
single focus through Seymour - undoubtedly with assistance from The
"Taxpayers Union" and David Farrar who used to be regarded as solidly
National. Thre is a long way to go, and as I have said before it is
reprehensible that some of the polls do not publish the percentage of
those surveyed that are "undecided" - I suspect it is fairly high
currently.

Crash

unread,
Oct 6, 2022, 9:54:35 PMOct 6
to
On Fri, 07 Oct 2022 14:00:06 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com>
'Attacked' is nonsense. Every MMP election except that in 2020 saw
either National or Labour leading a government with various forms of
minor-party support.

> National is now
>looking to need support from ACT,

Again you portray this an a new development. Every National-lead
government under MMP has needed ACT support. Current polling shows
this will continue, with the same situation in respect of Labour and
the Greens.

> who have I think done well to keep a
>single focus through Seymour - undoubtedly with assistance from The
>"Taxpayers Union" and David Farrar who used to be regarded as solidly
>National. Thre is a long way to go, and as I have said before it is
>reprehensible that some of the polls do not publish the percentage of
>those surveyed that are "undecided" - I suspect it is fairly high
>currently.
>
I just had a look at the Roy Morgan website on their latest poll and
the 'undecided' percentage is there. Can you name a poll where this
is not published or is hard to find?
--
Crash McBash

John Bowes

unread,
Oct 7, 2022, 12:53:00 AMOct 7
to
Another unanswered question from Rich the compulsive liar in defence of the liars he blindly supports. Guess this was just another fake distraction from the devious, mendacious little imp Rich :)
> >> >
> >> >A skill so heavily in demand it now needs the Public Service Commission's attention. Skills so singular that many a ministry decided that they didn't even need to take their requests to the market. One agency has already looked at its processes, and wouldn't you know it — there were deficiencies.
> >> Wait and see what the report says. Mind you, people said that about
> >> Uffindell and not even National MPS who "voted" on keeping him an MP
> >> got to see that!
> >
> >Why? Are you saying the report is dodgy? Or just trying another distraction from the disaster your inglorious Labour party has become under your inglorious misleader Ardern!
> Luxon Open and Honest? Yeah ... Naah. Are you claiming it is not
> dodgy, JOhn Bowes?

For once in your useless and pointless life answer the question Rich! I'm not claiming a fucking thing!
I'm looking foreword to an answer from you with supporting evidence or is that to much to expect from a fucking imbecile like you Rich?
When it comes to open and honest I'd bet Luxon is more so in those than the liar you blindly support Rich :)
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