IDA (Dreambuilders)- Pyramid selling scheme?
Richard Holmes
Hi everyone,
I've been approached at least four times in the last couple of years by
people interested in offering me a "business oportunity" and wanting to
come round for a half-hour presentation.
Name that keeps coming up is I.D.A. - which seems to stand for
"International Dreambuilders A(...)" or "International
Distribution A(...)" depending on the flavour of the month.
Now two really good pals have gotten into it and I'm just wondering if
there's anyone out there who can tell me what this scheme is all about
(I assume it involves selling with a pyramid of middle-men like Amway),
whether it's part of Amway and what the chances are that people do end
up doing well out of it.
Cheers! (And apoloogies if this has been done-to-death in the past)
Richard :)
Annette Heraghty
Richard Holmes <ric...@cps.co.nz> wrote:
snip...
>Name that keeps coming up is I.D.A. -
>(I assume it involves selling with a pyramid of middle-men like Amway),
>whether it's part of Amway and what the chances are that people do end
>up doing well out of it.
It IS Amway...my brother has been involved in it for the last 3
years....he and his wife have just come back from a week's
all-expenses paid trip to Hawaii. It was some sort of world
conference for high achievers within the IDA organisation.
You can do well out of it, but be warned...if you do want to be
successful at it, it will take over your life in every way imaginable.
>Cheers! (And apoloogies if this has been done-to-death in the past)
>Richard :)
_______________________________________________________________
John Bosomworth Part-time Help Desk Support
Waikato University Full-time PhD Student
j...@waikato.ac.nz
_____________________________________________________1973 280CE
Ross Keatinge
Richard Holmes <ric...@cps.co.nz> wrote:
>I've been approached at least four times in the last couple of years by
>people interested in offering me a "business oportunity" and wanting to
>come round for a half-hour presentation.
>
>Name that keeps coming up is I.D.A. - which seems to stand for
>"International Dreambuilders A(...)" or "International
>Distribution A(...)" depending on the flavour of the month.
I believe that is Amway. Someone explained to me that there are
somehow two Amway organisations now for marketing or something...
>Now two really good pals have gotten into it and I'm just wondering if
>there's anyone out there who can tell me what this scheme is all about
>(I assume it involves selling with a pyramid of middle-men like Amway),
>whether it's part of Amway and what the chances are that people do end
>up doing well out of it.
My experience is that MLM (Multilevel marketing) schemes and companies
can range from absolute rouges and ripoffs to quite sensible and
professional. I have not been involved with Amway but I think they
are one of the better ones. A small percentage of people do extremely
well but despite their well rehershed response if you tell them you
don't have the time, you have to eat, sleep, breath it and pester
your friends to distraction to get anywhere worthwhile. Most people
who try these things for a while give up in disappointment.
My layman's understanding of the law is that the difference between a
legal MLM business and an illegal pyramid scheme is whether or not a
genuine product is being sold. The law is clear in extreme cases,
Amway is perfectly legal, and things like the old games of aeroplanes
or chain letters etc are clearly illegal but I've seen some legal MLM
schemes where nobody cares about the product and everyone is simply
rushing around trying to sign more people up, often in a panic to get
their initial investment back. These schemes effectively degenerate
into a pyramid game.
A former partner and I were in one a bit like this about seven years
ago. We left when we heard presentations where people who couldn't
afford it were being encouraged to borrow $5000 on credit cards to get
into the business.
Cheers...
--
Ross Keatinge ro...@iprolink.co.nz
Auckland, New Zealand
Bruce Simpson
ro...@iprolink.co.nz (Ross Keatinge) wrote:
>I believe that is Amway. Someone explained to me that there are
>somehow two Amway organisations now for marketing or something...
Actually I've been approached by several scAMWAY dealers representing
themselves initially as a range of different organisations - one of which
even had the word "internet" in it. I'd say that they're getting so much
resistance to the scAMWAY name that they're having to become somewhat
covert in their promotion. Most people I know (the inteligent ones that
is), simply switch off when they hear the name as they are well aware that
MLM systems in a country with a population the size of NZ's are going to
benefit only a very few due to the fan-out ratio (a pyramid by any other
name would smell so foul).
>My experience is that MLM (Multilevel marketing) schemes and companies
>can range from absolute rouges and ripoffs to quite sensible and
>professional. I have not been involved with Amway but I think they
>are one of the better ones. A small percentage of people do extremely
>well but despite their well rehershed response if you tell them you
>don't have the time, you have to eat, sleep, breath it and pester
>your friends to distraction to get anywhere worthwhile. Most people
>who try these things for a while give up in disappointment.
That's the thing that annoys me. Many (albeit I accept - not all) dealers
prey on those who can least afford to be involved. By this I mean the
unemployed or economically disadvantaged in the community. They sell them
on the goal of becoming a "diamond-level" dealer with a big house, fast
cars and six or seven figure income for the rest of their life; all of
which is of course far less likely than winning lotto - the population here
simply isn't big enough to support more than a handful of diamond-level
dealers. Anyway... these people get stuck in and buy up this vastly
over-priced product with a view to flogging it off to the masses who must
just be waiting to buy. In reality of course... they just make a nusance
of themselves amongst their friends and relatives who (quite sensibly)
aren't interested in buying dishwashing liquid at several times the price
of an equivalent product from the supermarket - and YES, the stuff from the
supermarket is just as good!
Although scAMWAY is supposed to be a true MLM, why is it that all the
dealers who have spoken to me have been trying to sell me on the concept
rather than the products? In fact, they spend so long telling me about how
I can become a diamond-level dealer that the products never got a mention
and when I asked about the products my queries were almost dismissed out of
hand. Whether scAMWAY USA know it or not, there ARE dealers in NZ who
appear to be treating it like an illegal pyramid system here.
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Gloria Witheford
Richard Holmes <ric...@cps.co.nz> writes:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I've been approached at least four times in the last couple of years by
> people interested in offering me a "business oportunity" and wanting to
> come round for a half-hour presentation.
>
> Name that keeps coming up is I.D.A. - which seems to stand for
> "International Dreambuilders A(...)" or "International
> Distribution A(...)" depending on the flavour of the month.
>
> Now two really good pals have gotten into it and I'm just wondering if
> there's anyone out there who can tell me what this scheme is all about
> (I assume it involves selling with a pyramid of middle-men like Amway),
> whether it's part of Amway and what the chances are that people do end
> up doing well out of it.
>
>
> Cheers! (And apoloogies if this has been done-to-death in the past)
>
> Richard :)
IDA is a group which sells Amway products. It is not pyramid selling
(this is illegal in New Zealand).
Alan Brown
In article <4ol552$d...@news.express.co.nz>,
>even had the word "internet" in it. I'd say that they're getting so much
We get regular approaches from scAmway reps - apparently they describe
their marketing method as internetting, so the business name is
magnetic... :( :(
AB
--
"But you can't say they have arrived to classify your nervous lies
What's right, what's not, what may not be. Don't try your tricky tests on me
For I won't live in fear my friend - that every day could be my end"
Kaliana
Here is a network marketing company which won't rip you off and won't
cost heaps to join
...
Rawleighs
The products have been around for over 100 years, so they must be OK.
Please refrain from stupid comments based on my last statement. this
company is not a scam. Email me for more information.
Kaliana Soverley
"The Class Rebel"
Mark Harris
ro...@iprolink.co.nz (Ross Keatinge) wrote:
[some other stuff which I snipped but the point I wanted to
comment on was: ]
>My layman's understanding of the law is that the difference between a
>legal MLM business and an illegal pyramid scheme is whether or not a
>genuine product is being sold. The law is clear in extreme cases,
>Amway is perfectly legal, and things like the old games of aeroplanes
>or chain letters etc are clearly illegal but I've seen some legal MLM
>schemes where nobody cares about the product and everyone is simply
>rushing around trying to sign more people up, often in a panic to get
>their initial investment back. These schemes effectively degenerate
>into a pyramid game.
*ALL* MLM schemes are pyramid schemes, in a rational analysis.
Just some are classed as legal because there's a 'product
involved. Nobody gets rich selling Amway soap powder. The
'diamond dealers' get that high because they sell the true
product, which is the system. As others have noted, there isn't
room for many of them in a population of 3.5 million (unless you
can persuade sheep to buy soap!) This was the first point I
raised to an Amway rep when he tried to sell me on the scheme
around 8 years ago: 'How long will it take before we're all
trying to sell to each other?" "Ummmmmm...let's look at something
else here."
And it took an hour and eight or nine direct questions "Is this
Amway or not?" before he would admit it was. But the clincher on
the night was from Phil sitting next to me. After the rep had
expounded on how rich you could get, Phil asked him: "What sort
of car do you drive?" As we had all seen this guy get out of a 10
year old Holden stationwagon which looked a little worse for
wear, he really had no answer.
Cheers
Mark Harris Ph 644 3827014
Technology Research & Consultancy Services
email: mht...@tracs.co.nz
Abortion! C'mon, Clinton. Extradite me now!
Damian Wright
br...@faxmail.co.nz (Bruce Simpson) wrote:
>ro...@iprolink.co.nz (Ross Keatinge) wrote:
>>I believe that is Amway. Someone explained to me that there are
>>somehow two Amway organisations now for marketing or something...
>Although scAMWAY is supposed to be a true MLM, why is it that all the
>dealers who have spoken to me have been trying to sell me on the concept
>rather than the products? In fact, they spend so long telling me about how
>I can become a diamond-level dealer that the products never got a mention
>and when I asked about the products my queries were almost dismissed out of
>hand. Whether scAMWAY USA know it or not, there ARE dealers in NZ who
>appear to be treating it like an illegal pyramid system here.
This pisses me off, so I'll say right now that this is my own opinion,
and in no way representative of anybody elses or any organisations
opinions; if they happen to coincide, well, that's life.
Let me ask you this...
Assuming whatever business you're seeing is legal (a coffee shop), it
is proven (good location and business) and sells a good product
(decent coffee), is for sale at a price you can afford.
Would you put in the 14 hour days x 6 or 7 days a week for just the
money, or would you rather have a reason for doing all that work, say
like being able to afford a better lifestyle one day, or get a really
flash car + other bits and pieces, or build the business up to make a
profit when you sell it - basically whatever it is that turns you on
enough that you have the strength to work such long hours for a couple
or few years, in other words?
If you only want to know about the product and then proceed to shoot
it down saying that you can get just as good a product from the
supermarket and make it at home, or the hours are too long, or that
you'll have to make too large an investment for capital for an even
larger reward, or that you can't be stuffed, that's your pigeon, don't
even pretend to make an effort that could well get you out of
mediocrity and into your own idea of truly happy and at peace with
yourself.
If you have an idea that doing this could be your ticket to freedom
(big thing with me, substitute your own idea where I say freedom),
given sufficient time, effort, and sheer bloody (chosen by choice)
inability to give up on doing your best, then the coffee shop probably
will work for you and work well, and you'll do what it takes to make
the best shot of it you can - and in the end you will succeed, though
it won't necessarily be the coffee shop that you first started with
that brings that success. It's being driven by a dream that lets you
do the slog that'll bring freedom, the slog that ordinary people just
will not do.
This is why those guys in scAmway aren't worried about the marketing
or products or whatever. They're searching for those people who
dream, and will do what it takes to turn those dreams into goals and
achieve them. They don't really want to associate with people who
don't care. That, I suggest, is why they talk about these Diamond
people... to see who lights up. I've heard of people getting into
Amway and being happy with just the good quality products that can't
be got elsewhere, or the service given by their suppliers, or the fact
that they get enough money from it from selling some stuff to their
mates regularly to be able to afford to shout them at the pub
occasionally... the people buying get to win with good quality
products (which is all Amway sell if they can help it - the best or in
the top 5% or so of the market in terms of quality of product), and
the guy selling got to win, cause he was achieving his dream - a
little extra money to make life a little easier, and to be able to
shout his mates occasionally. Not every body needs to become a
leader, not every body needs to become a Diamond.
I've said more than enough I think. YMwillV, on all this. I've only
given you my own view on this subject.
Ciao, may you succeed in whatever chosen field of endeavour you choose
to succeed in.
Dan
chickyb...@yahoo.com.au
Little jimmy alive after he tipped a bucket of house paint over himself. Jimmys dad reached for the bottle of turpentine whereas mum reached for the LOC. within minutes mum had the house paint removed from jimmys face and he was able to breathe again without inhaling any turpentine that his father was intending on using. We were a one income family with four kids and dad slogging it with two jobs (7days a week) just to keep bread in the table. Mums friend gave her a bottle of loc when she was at home trying to remove black boot polish from the sleeves of one of daddy's "Sunday's best " clothes that he wore to church. With the successful outcome of a clean white shirt saving it from literally being thrown in the trash can with mums frustration of getting it clean, mum joined amway just to get a discount on the cost of the products. I remember mum being in the amway business for many years. Not only achieving the profits of discounted price for (members) she also sold the products to family and friends and made enough money from it for her to get the products that she wanted to use for FREE.
Some years later. My husband and I joined amway. For the same reason. Just to make like a little more comfortable. We got to know and use the "new products" and promoted those items to family and friends. If you came across a product that you used and it worked good for you, wouldn't you want to tell your family and friends about it. Giving them the benefits of a great product and also at a great price with a fantastic money back guarantee. Why would you hide this from those that you love. Well that's all we done. We shared our experience of the outcome of the products we used with family and friends and let them make their own minds up. "TRY BEFORE YOU BUY". Who actually does that these days. Sure! Hubby and I made buckets loads (paying cash for a brand new car) WHO GETS TO DO THAT THESE DAYS????? well we did.
I left amway when my husband passed away and with three small children I found it (hard to cope). Hubby was only 34yrs old when he died.
Today. My oldest son now is in AMWAY. My middle aged son also is in AMWAY.
My oldest son. Now in his 30's came to me and said. MUM GUESS WHAT? I'm in AMWAY.
SO just a few weeks weeks ago. I too rejoined AMWAY. already knowing the products from when I was a kid.
I am now 48years old. Have 5 children. I have a spinal disability and I HAD a DREAM.
MY DREAM HAD COME TRUE. both my parents are deceased. My oldest sons father is deceased. But I AM ALIVE. I KNOW THAT MY OLDEST SON HAS A PURPOSE WITH HIS DECISION TO JOIN AMWAY. his dreams are different to mine. But I can rest assured that with AMWAY he also now has FAMILY That love him just as much as I do.
Amway today gave me the decision to continue to do what I am currently doing now (but now I'm getting paid to do it). With my disability shopping online is so much easier and they are paying me to do it. WHO ELSE DOES THAT????
Give it a go!!!!
geopelia
wrote in message
news:eff132ea-58f2-465e...@googlegroups.com...
I did the same with Rawleighs for years, in the days when they were mainly
medicines and food products. I did it more as a service to the neighbourhood
than to make money, though it did pay for running the car. I left soon after
they changed things and brought in the party plan.
I enjoyed door to door selling. But these days I doubt if it would be very
safe. And today of course few people are home, now most women have to work.
Most of the old medicines have gone now. Very sad. I'd like to see them sold
through the chemists, now Rawleigh doesn't have them.
I used them myself and they were so good!
I think in those days Amway had just started.