OBAMA: Your Obama Assessment
TDNY
edi...@netpath.net
not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
That's a comparison of how much worse off we now are in the Obama
Depression.
http://www.Internet-Gun-Show.com - your source for hard-to-find stuff!
Klaus Schadenfreude
>General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
General Motors is a shitty company making shitty cars and would have
been allowed to sink without a trace during the administration of
President Schadenfreude. Luckily for the workers, Obama stepped in.
WTF does this have to do with guns, moron?
Tim Miller
Don't you know? According to "editor", every GM worker is
going to pick up a copy of "Unintended Consequences", then
buy a gun and revolt against "the Regime(tm)". Unfortunately,
this plan is doomed to failure, because (according to "editor")
Wally-World is *already* out of ammo.
Klaus Schadenfreude
wrote:
Bet he didn't see THAT coming.
Tim Miller
Really. He may have to send out his lil' buddy "TooFewBalls"
to start "confiscating" ammo from people with license plates.
Is Ken Darian
> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
> That's a comparison of how much worse off we now are in the Obama
> Depression.
The more relevant measure is unemployment - we're still better off.
Is Ken Darian
> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>
>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>
> General Motors is a shitty company
No, asshole, they're not.
But you're a worthless ass-licker who should be flushed.
Tim Miller
> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>
>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>
>> General Motors is a shitty company
>
> No, asshole, they're not.
And yet, they were forced into bankruptcy...
Sounds like a shitty company to me.
Klaus Schadenfreude
>Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>
>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>
>> General Motors is a shitty company
>
>No, asshole, they're not.
Yeah, they are. They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
almost everything they make is crap. That's why they're no longer sell
as many cars as they did.
Poor business model. Buick? I mean, WTF? Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile
should have been dumped in the 50's- they're al the same fucking thing
with different labels. Stupid.
Like you.
TDNY
<edi...@netpath.net> wrote in message
news:ad0588f5-72dd-49ef...@k2g2000yql.googlegroups.com...
The bottom line is that GM didn't watch their bottom line.
They kept making cars, that were not selling.
Toyota beat them.
TDNY
"Klaus Schadenfreude" <klausscha...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ngrn25hla5nnfcl0u...@4ax.com...
Klaus Schadenfreude
Canuck57
Yes, but back then it was known as General Motors and not run by debtor
junkies that planned to welch on debt. Back then GM paid their bills.
Rack up one dead GM to debtor and incompetant management who didn't have the
balls to run a company like they should have.
Klaus Schadenfreude
wrote:
>Is Ken Darian wrote:
It's worse than that......
"GM lost $10.6 billion in 2005 -- about what Toyota earned in profits.
Toyota's outstanding shares of stock are now valued at 10 times those
of GM."
and
You might blame GM's woes on poor American workmanship or the cost of
American labor. But Japanese total labor costs are comparable, even
with Detroit's higher health insurance costs. Increasingly, Japanese
cars are being assembled in the USA, and the quality holds up just
fine.
"So what's wrong with GM? The cars. GM is famous for being run by bean
counters and ad men. Toyota is run by engineers."
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2006/12/30/whats_bad_about_gm_the_cars/
http://tinyurl.com/ymjm3y
I say fuck the bankruptcy. Let them die.
TDNY
>> Yeah, they are. They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>> almost everything they make is crap. That's why they're no longer sell
>> as many cars as they did.
>>
>> Poor business model. Buick? I mean, WTF? Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile
>> should have been dumped in the 50's- they're al the same fucking thing
>> with different labels. Stupid.
>>
>> Like you.
>
>
Klaus Schadenfreude
>> "Klaus Schadenfreude" <klausscha...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
>>> Yeah, they are. They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>>> almost everything they make is crap. That's why they're no longer sell
>>> as many cars as they did.
>>>
>>> Poor business model. Buick? I mean, WTF? Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile
>>> should have been dumped in the 50's- they're al the same fucking thing
>>> with different labels. Stupid.
>>>
>>> Like you.
>>
>>
>
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDNYisadumbshit
>
>
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDNYisadumbshit
Tim Miller
You might as well just bozo bin that one. I don't think
he ever posts anything but irrelevant youtube links.
Klaus Schadenfreude
wrote:
>Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
He actually wrote something intelligent a few posts ago, but if
English is a second language for him and he primarily speaks
YouTubish, you may be right.
Tim Miller
> In talk.politics.guns Tim Miller <replyton...@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:
>
>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>> In talk.politics.guns "TDNY" <TD...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> "Klaus Schadenfreude" <klausscha...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> Yeah, they are. They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>>>>>> almost everything they make is crap. That's why they're no longer sell
>>>>>> as many cars as they did.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Poor business model. Buick? I mean, WTF? Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile
>>>>>> should have been dumped in the 50's- they're al the same fucking thing
>>>>>> with different labels. Stupid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Like you.
>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDNYisadumbshit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDNYisadumbshit
>> You might as well just bozo bin that one. I don't think
>> he ever posts anything but irrelevant youtube links.
>
> He actually wrote something intelligent a few posts ago,
If he did, it was something he accidentally cut-n-pasted
from some other site, and he didn't understand it.
TDNY
I voted for Senator John Sydney McCain.
However, thus far, I like Obama.
I think he has had the audacity, to challenge groups,
that have up to now, never been called on the carpet in the USA.
Obama, admitted in his Cairo University speech,
that the USA was involved in the overthrow of a democratically
elected government in Iran, back when he was 8 years of age,
in 1953.
I don't think, I have ever heard a USA president admit that before.
Financially & Politically powerful groups in the USA,
usted to exerting their unchallenged influence over the our
congress and senate are upset with President Barack Hussein Obama.
But Hussein sits in the oval office, like it or not.
Klaus Schadenfreude
>I didn't vote for President Barack Hussein Obama,
>I voted for Senator John Sydney McCain.
>
>... Obama.....Obama...... President Barack Hussein Obama.
>....
>But Hussein sits in the oval office, like it or not.
WTF does that have to do with the message you're replying to? Are you
stupid or what?
Tim Miller
He's stupid AND what.
TDNY
Well that is my Obama assessment.
You don't like it, tough.
I post what I want, where I want, whenever I want.
Skip over it if you don't like it.
Otherwise drown in your own bile.
I don't care what you do, or what you think, or what you feel about
anything.
Got that?
Klaus Schadenfreude
Who gives a fuck? If you could read, you could see I was replying
about GM, not Obama.
How stupid are you?
Is Ken Darian
> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>
>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>> No, asshole, they're not.
>
> Yeah, they are.
No, they're not.
> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
> almost everything they make is crap.
They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
Buick regularly sits at the top of the JD Power rankings, the new Malibu
is superb, the Cobalt SS is a rocket sled, the Hybrid Tahoe is genius.
Cadillac has the CTS-V which turned a sub 8 minute lap at the
Nurburgring. You just don;t have a damned clue what you're babbling about!
> That's why they're no longer sell
> as many cars as they did.
No...it's not.
> Poor business model. Buick? I mean, WTF? Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile
> should have been dumped in the 50's- they're al the same fucking thing
> with different labels. Stupid.
Buick is a major seller in China - think that might mean something?
Buick is also among the highest rated cars for reliability.
You don't have a fucking clue what you're ranting about.
Oldsmobile WAS dumped several years ago.
And Pontiac had the brilliant G8 this year, a shame to lose that Holden
import.
> Like you.
Here's the difference sport, I actually KNOW what I'm talking about.
Your "education" continues below, child:
http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/buick/
The doom and gloom surrounding GM in the U.S. feeds on the perception
that the company can�t build desirable cars. In China, however, the
Buick brand has seen a boom in popularity over the past few years, and
it features a number of relatively upscale products.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12801549/
Buick bucks the trend
GM brand is No. 1 car seller in China, thanks to smart marketing
Buick�s sizzling sales have driven General Motors � even as it closes
plants and lays off workers at home � to the top of the pack in China,
the world�s fastest-growing automobile market. GM sold 665,000 cars and
trucks in China last year. For now, only 1 in 100 Chinese own a car,
compared to 9 in 10 in the United States. But the Chinese expect 130
million vehicles to be sold by 2020.
In fact, GM now sells more cars overseas than it does at home.
�They like the image of what America is,� said Michael Dunne, president
of Automotive Resources Asia, a marketing stagy firm based in Thailand.
�America is big, broad and powerful.�
Hitting China�s sweet spot
Nearly 1 in 7 cars sold here is made by GM, just seven years after it
opened its first dealership. The company recently added a second plant
in Shanghai and plans to open 150 new Chevrolet dealerships, expanding
its Chinese workforce to 20,000.
http://money.cnn.com/2007/08/08/autos/jdpa_dependability/index.htm?postversion=2007080909
Buick ties Lexus for No. 1 in car reliability
Survey finds Detroit brands making headway against Japanese competitors.
August 9 2007
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/chevrolet-malibu-review/
The bottom line: the new Chevrolet Malibu backs up its upscale looks
with an upscale feel. Potential customers [theoretically] drawn to
Chevrolet showrooms by the Malibu�s sheetmetal won�t be disappointed by
the rest of the car. GM has finally built it.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4230212.html
GMC Yukon Hybrid and Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid: Automotive Excellence
Awards 2008 (Energy Efficiency)
http://cadillac.gmblogs.com/2008/05/09/2009-cts-v-blisters-nurburgring/
In testing today at Germany�s Nurburgring, Cadillac�s upcoming new 2009
CTS- V completed a lap of the legendary Nordschleife in 7:59.32. This
blistering time appears to be the fastest ever publicly documented for a
production sedan.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=10&article_id=6847
General Motors Vice Chairman Bob Lutz promised the 2009 Cadillac CTS-V
would blow away its competitors, and it looks like he wasn't just
blowing smoke. Cadillac says that with John Heinricy, the director of
vehicle integration (and a darn fine racing driver), behind the wheel, a
production-mimicking CTS-V posted a lap time of 7:59.32 around Germany's
famous Nordschleife.
The car's sub-8-minute lap is believed to be the fastest-ever documented
laps posted by a production sedan running factory-spec street tires.
Other than a harness bar and a 6-point racing harness, along with a fire
suppression unit, Cadillac says the CTS-V didn't have any performance
modifications beyond what is planned for production.
The CTS-V's engine is a supercharged 6.2-liter V-8 with about 550 bhp
(the car is still undergoing final testing). Cadillac says one of its
most important objectives is "to make the CTS-V the world's fastest
production sedan, as a part of the overall goal to make the V-Series
Cadillac's ultimate expression of performance and technology."
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=6692
"This is a helluva lot of car for the money," said Editor-at-Large John
Lamm as he tossed the keys to GM's latest Australia-via-Detroit offering
on my desk, our resident road warrior perhaps a bit weary from the
400-plus miles he logged while on the one-day photo shoot less than 24
hours before.
That "big-bang-for-the-buck" sentiment was echoed throughout the test
car's notebook with every editor who spent a spell behind its
leather-wrapped sport steering wheel:
"Handsome styling, great motor with fine response, excellent 6-speed
automatic transmission and a reasonable price make this a very
entertaining sports sedan � I like it," wrote Editor-in-Chief Thos L.
Bryant.
"At around $30,000, the Pontiac G8 GT is a steal.
TDNY
I'm sorry.
Have a good day.
bye bye.
Tim Miller
Through and through.
Tim Miller
> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>
>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>
>> Yeah, they are.
>
> No, they're not.
Yeah, they are.
Is Ken Darian
No you flaming asshole, they are NOT!
Tim Miller
Yes, they are. They have been since the 70's. That's why
they're bankrupt.
Oh. And stop fantasizing about my asshole. I'm not like
you in that regard. I prefer women.
TDNY
"Is Ken Darian" <c...@sha.ft> wrote in message
news:792k9lF...@mid.individual.net...
GM=Died.
Klaus Schadenfreude
I know.
Is Ken Darian
> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>> Tim Miller wrote:
>>> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did
>>>>>>>> Chrysler.
>>>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>>>
>>>> No, they're not.
>>>
>>> Yeah, they are.
>>
>> No you flaming asshole, they are NOT!
>
> Yes, they are.
Nope, they have made massive changes the past few years.
> They have been since the 70's.
They were in the 70s and 80s , yes.
> That's why they're bankrupt.
Nope.
They're bankrupt because of the UAW wages, credit crunch, and a global
recession.
Grow a fucking brain.
> Oh. And stop fantasizing about my asshole.
Drop dead, faggot-face.
http://comicstripclub.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/liberal-idiot-award.gif
Tim Miller
> Tim Miller wrote:
>> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>>> Tim Miller wrote:
>>>> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized
>>>>>>>>> before -
>>>>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did
>>>>>>>>> Chrysler.
>>>>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>>>>
>>>>> No, they're not.
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>>
>>> No you flaming asshole, they are NOT!
>>
>> Yes, they are.
>
> Nope,
Yes, they are. They allowed the unions AND management to cut corners
until all they produced was LOT of junk. Which they couldn't sell.
Your ignorant denials don't mean anything.
Look up "shitty company" in the dictionary, and there's GM's picture.
Klaus Schadenfreude
>Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>
>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>
>> Yeah, they are.
>
>No, they're not.
>
>> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>> almost everything they make is crap.
>
>They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
ROFLMAO.
>Buick regularly sits at the top of the JD Power rankings, the new Malibu
>is superb, the Cobalt SS is a rocket sled, the Hybrid Tahoe is genius.
Genius? [chuckle]
>Cadillac has the CTS-V which turned a sub 8 minute lap at the
>Nurburgring. You just don;t have a damned clue what you're babbling about!
I know they lose as much as Toyota makes.
What GM needs to do is lose Buick, Pontiac and Saturn. Quit cloning
cars between divisions. Then start engineering cars instead of
cranking out shit boxes.
>> Poor business model. Buick? I mean, WTF? Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile
>> should have been dumped in the 50's- they're al the same fucking thing
>> with different labels. Stupid.
>
>Buick is a major seller in China
China is the biggest car market in the world.
> think that might mean something?
Chinese are stupid and desperate? In a few years Buick and all things
GM will be gone from China. Forever.
Yet for the world's automakers, all the optimism about China may be
short-lived. As the market takes off, local players are coming on
strong and taking market share from foreign rivals. That marks an
important shift. Foreign automakers have been China's market leaders
ever since the government invited them to form joint ventures with
local partners two decades ago. But in the first quarter of 2009,
Chinese brands boosted their market share to 30%, up from 26% during
the same period in 2008, while foreign automakers' share fell to 70%
from 74%.
http://www.businessweek.com/globalbiz/content/may2009/gb20090518_095449.htm
>Oldsmobile WAS dumped several years ago.
Trouble with reading comprehension? I'll repeat.....
::Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile should have been dumped in the 50's
>And Pontiac had the brilliant G8 this year, a shame to lose that Holden
>import.
>
>> Like you.
>
>Here's the difference sport, I actually KNOW what I'm talking about.
Apparently you don't. But keep sucking up that GM smoke- that's all
they're good at.
Tim Miller
> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>
>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>> Yeah, they are.
>> No, they're not.
>>
>>> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>>> almost everything they make is crap.
>> They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
>
> ROFLMAO.
>
>> Buick regularly sits at the top of the JD Power rankings, the new Malibu
>> is superb, the Cobalt SS is a rocket sled, the Hybrid Tahoe is genius.
>
> Genius? [chuckle]
He's using a completely different meaning of the word
"genius"... kinda like WE do, when we call the Lone Wheezer
a "genius".
>> Cadillac has the CTS-V which turned a sub 8 minute lap at the
>> Nurburgring. You just don;t have a damned clue what you're babbling about!
>
> I know they lose as much as Toyota makes.
By "sub 8", he means "7:59:32"... And a Mitsubish Lancer
ran an 8:11.
I know *I'M* "impressed"... Not. LOL!!
RD (The Sandman)
news:792htmF...@mid.individual.net:
> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>
>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before
>>>>> - not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did
>>>>> Chrysler.
>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>
>> Yeah, they are.
>
> No, they're not.
>
>> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>> almost everything they make is crap.
>
> They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
>
> Buick regularly sits at the top of the JD Power rankings, the new
> Malibu is superb, the Cobalt SS is a rocket sled, the Hybrid Tahoe is
> genius. Cadillac has the CTS-V which turned a sub 8 minute lap at the
> Nurburgring. You just don;t have a damned clue what you're babbling
> about!
Damn, that must be why they are selling so well and making GM the pick of
the litter again. Damn, only $80B and they lose it faster than they can
make it.
>> That's why they're no longer sell
>> as many cars as they did.
>
> No...it's not.
They have gone from 54% of the US market to less than 12%.
--
Sleep well, tonight........
RD (The Sandman)
" All experience is great provided you live through it.
If it kills you, you have gone too far."
Painter Alice Neel, in the New Yorker.
Is Ken Darian
They're the #1 selling vehicle in China, yes.
Right now not much of anything is selling well in the US.
GM had said they needed to sell about 10 million vehicles a year to make
money.
Warren Buffet sees US auto sales this year struggling to reach 9 million
total.
Toyota is feeling it, they lost money for the first time, and their CEO
resigned.
Fiat was ready to implode until they got the Chrysler deal.
It's a GLOBAL recession.
> Damn, only $80B and they lose it faster than they can
> make it.
The only 2 manufactures to see sales increase in America this last year
were Hyundai and Subaru.
>>> That's why they're no longer sell
>>> as many cars as they did.
>> No...it's not.
>
> They have gone from 54% of the US market to less than 12%.
Indeed they have, competition from many brands will do that, and Korean
and non-union wages will shift the pricing power too.
Is Ken Darian
> "TDNY" <TD...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote in message
> news:K4ydnekSydyXYbbX...@earthlink.com...
>> "Wayne" <mygarb...@verizon.net> wrote in message
>> news:h0gsqp$diu$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>> "TDNY" <TD...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote in message
>>> news:Md-dnWT42aIb1bbX...@earthlink.com...
>>>> http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jun/07/sonia-sotomayor-mexican-usa-racism
>>> -
>>> The problem is mainly the failure to assimilate. People who come here
>>> illegally should be willing to try to fit in.
>>
>> The Mexicans are just reclaiming what was originally theirs.
>> California, Texas reverting back to Mexico.
>>
>> Don't believe it, take a look for yourself.
>>
>> Mexicans outnumber the USA population, in both states.
>>
>>
> And in what bizarro world does California and Texas belong to Mexico?
>
>
Aztlan?
Is Ken Darian
> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>
>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>> Yeah, they are.
>> No, they're not.
>>
>>> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>>> almost everything they make is crap.
>> They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
>
> ROFLMAO.
Yes, I'm laughing at you.
http://digg.com/business_finance/Largest_Downsizing_in_US_History_GM_Sheds_Quarter_of_Workforce
Largest Downsizing in US History: GM Sheds Quarter of Workforce
msnbc.msn.com � "Rick Wagoner, chief executive, is expected to announce
that about 30,000 workers � more than a quarter of GM's blue-collar US
workforce � have taken up its offer of early retirement and severance
packages."
>> Buick regularly sits at the top of the JD Power rankings, the new Malibu
>> is superb, the Cobalt SS is a rocket sled, the Hybrid Tahoe is genius.
>
> Genius? [chuckle]
A large SUV getting that kind of city mileage, yes, genius.
>> Cadillac has the CTS-V which turned a sub 8 minute lap at the
>> Nurburgring. You just don;t have a damned clue what you're babbling about!
>
> I know they lose as much as Toyota makes.
Toyota took it in the shorts big time with the Tundra roll out and lost
money for the first time in their history.
TOKYO � Toyota Motor Corp., battered by plunging global sales, reported
its worst annual loss since its 1937 founding � and forecast even more
red ink in the year ahead.
The world's largest carmaker said Friday its net loss for the
January-March quarter was 765.8 billion yen ($7.7 billion) � bigger than
General Motors reported for the same period.
> What GM needs to do is lose Buick, Pontiac and Saturn.
It would be idiotic to lose the #1 selling vehicle brand in China.
Pontiac is already gone.
And Saturn is selling it's dealer network to Roger Penske while a
Chinese buyer negotiates for the manufacturing side.
> Quit cloning
> cars between divisions. Then start engineering cars instead of
> cranking out shit boxes.
Old rhetoric.
EVERY manufacturer does platform sharing and engineering.
A Honda Odyssey van = Ridgeline pickup = Pilot SUV.
Chrysler's succesful 300 is basically a US spec C class.
>>> Poor business model. Buick? I mean, WTF? Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile
>>> should have been dumped in the 50's- they're al the same fucking thing
>>> with different labels. Stupid.
>> Buick is a major seller in China
>
> China is the biggest car market in the world.
Yet you say GM should kill off Buick, odd...stupid even...
>> think that might mean something?
>
> Chinese are stupid and desperate?
Or you got your ass kicked and can't debate worth a shit.
> In a few years Buick and all things
> GM will be gone from China. Forever.
As I said, you came in unprepared to debate on facts - it shows.
> Yet for the world's automakers, all the optimism about China may be
> short-lived. As the market takes off, local players are coming on
> strong and taking market share from foreign rivals. That marks an
> important shift. Foreign automakers have been China's market leaders
> ever since the government invited them to form joint ventures with
> local partners two decades ago. But in the first quarter of 2009,
> Chinese brands boosted their market share to 30%, up from 26% during
> the same period in 2008, while foreign automakers' share fell to 70%
> from 74%.
> http://www.businessweek.com/globalbiz/content/may2009/gb20090518_095449.htm
Entirely predictable, so?
You don't just give up, you compete.
>> Oldsmobile WAS dumped several years ago.
>
> Trouble with reading comprehension? I'll repeat.....
That's the stupidest thing you've said yet!
The 1950-60ss were halcyon years for multiple GM brands, in fact that's
why the model continued so long after it was economically viable.
> ::Buick, Pontiac and Oldsmobile should have been dumped in the 50's
When they were generating huge sales numbers?
You don't use much in the way of logic.
>> And Pontiac had the brilliant G8 this year, a shame to lose that Holden
>> import.
>>
>>> Like you.
>> Here's the difference sport, I actually KNOW what I'm talking about.
>
> Apparently you don't.
Apparently I kicked your lame ass, convincingly.
> But keep sucking up that GM smoke- that's all
> they're good at.
Obvious snip on the cites.
I win again.
Is Ken Darian
> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>> Tim Miller wrote:
>>> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>>>> Tim Miller wrote:
>>>>> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized
>>>>>>>>>> before -
>>>>>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did
>>>>>>>>>> Chrysler.
>>>>>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>>>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, they're not.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>>>
>>>> No you flaming asshole, they are NOT!
>>>
>>> Yes, they are.
>>
>> Nope,
>
> Yes, they are.
Nope.
> They allowed the unions AND management
Allowed?
Or were struck and coerced into?
Same thing happened to Ford and Chrysler.
Tim Miller
Yes. Allowed.
> Same thing happened to Ford and Chrysler.
Chrysler is an even SHITTIER company. They should have
been "allowed" to go bankrupt LAST time.
Ford, hmm. THEY'RE still in business and didn't TAKE
any bailout money...
So, as usual, you demonstrate your COMPLETE ignorance.
You've GOT to be a union member... Admit it, loser.
Klaus Schadenfreude
>Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>
>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>> No, they're not.
>>>
>>>> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>>>> almost everything they make is crap.
>>> They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
>>
>> ROFLMAO.
>
>Yes, I'm laughing at you.
And the GM dealer is closing his office here while the Toyota dealer
is building a NEWER BIGGER building.
[chuckle]
Keep reading your magazines and telling me how much you "know," loser.
Is Ken Darian
Allowed implies they had a choice, they didn't.
>> Same thing happened to Ford and Chrysler.
>
> Chrysler is an even SHITTIER company. They should have
> been "allowed" to go bankrupt LAST time.
Except they prospered, paid back the loan, flourished.
> Ford, hmm. THEY'RE still in business and didn't TAKE
> any bailout money...
Know why?
Ford family wealth and they refi'd the entire company just over a year
before the credit crunch - otherwise they'd be done.
> So, as usual, you demonstrate your COMPLETE ignorance.
I like whacking morons like you around - smells like...victory...
> You've GOT to be a union member... Admit it, loser.
Really bad guess, shitbird.
Tim Miller
Heh heh... You may be the SECOND most ignorant pinhead
on the planet. Right after Fritz Henderson.
>>> Same thing happened to Ford and Chrysler.
>>
>> Chrysler is an even SHITTIER company. They should have
>> been "allowed" to go bankrupt LAST time.
>
> Except they prospered, paid back the loan, flourished.
If by "flourished" you mean "they're bankrupt AGAIN".
Christ you're an idiot.
>> Ford, hmm. THEY'RE still in business and didn't TAKE
>> any bailout money...
>
> Know why?
>
Yeah. They're NOT complete fucking idiots.
>> So, as usual, you demonstrate your COMPLETE ignorance.
>
> I like whacking morons like you around
If it ever happens, you get back to us, you ignorant,
union loser.
ROFLMAO@U!!
Is Ken Darian
> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>
>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>>> No, they're not.
>>>>
>>>>> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>>>>> almost everything they make is crap.
>>>> They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
>>> ROFLMAO.
>> Yes, I'm laughing at you.
>
> And the GM dealer is closing his office here while the Toyota dealer
> is building a NEWER BIGGER building.
And you continue to snip and compress the thread after being decimated
with topical cites.
> [chuckle]
>
> Keep reading your magazines and telling me how much you "know," loser.
Keep denying the facts and running from them like the luser you are.
Klaus Schadenfreude
>Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>
>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns Is Ken Darian <c...@sha.ft> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>>>>>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>>>>>>>>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>>>>>>>> General Motors is a shitty company
>>>>>>> No, asshole, they're not.
>>>>>> Yeah, they are.
>>>>> No, they're not.
>>>>>
>>>>>> They're big and bloated and aside from the Corvette
>>>>>> almost everything they make is crap.
>>>>> They were downsizing and are now much smaller.
>>>> ROFLMAO.
>>> Yes, I'm laughing at you.
>>
>> And the GM dealer is closing his office here while the Toyota dealer
>> is building a NEWER BIGGER building.
>
>And you continue to snip and compress the thread after being decimated
>with topical cites.
And GM's "success" is why they're closing dealerships while Toyota
builds bigger ones. [chuckle]
edi...@netpath.net
wrote:
> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>
> >General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
> >not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>
> been allowed to sink without a trace during the administration of
> President Schadenfreude. Luckily for the workers, Obama stepped in.
Bullshit - ALL of it. Try driving - and living with - a full-size
Buick for a year, and you'd agree it's a hell of a lot better than the
rice burner Toyota you used to have.
Better for the workers? What about all of them getting downsized?
What about all of them losing their health benefits. ALL thanks to
the Black Daley.
http://www.Internet-Gun-Show.com - your source for hard-to-find stuff!
edi...@netpath.net
wrote:
> Don't you know? According to "editor", every GM worker is
> going to pick up a copy of "Unintended Consequences", then
> buy a gun and revolt against "the Regime(tm)". Unfortunately,
> this plan is doomed to failure, because (according to "editor")
> Wally-World is *already* out of ammo.
Wake up. Those who sparkplug the revolt - in its early stages - will
be those who bought up and stored PLENTY of ammo before the Black
Daley even got nominated, and there really are PLENTY of those people
who bought ammo at every gun show they went to even back when the
Klintons were copresident. Those who will be the crucial second stage
will be those smart enough to realize that a single .22 rimfire
cartridge instantly becomes a beautiful new M-4 and ammo for it. JUST
LIKE IN IRAQ - where Wally World's not selling ammo at all.
Tim Miller
> On Jun 7, 9:29 am, Tim Miller <replytonewsgr...@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:
>> Don't you know? According to "editor", every GM worker is
>> going to pick up a copy of "Unintended Consequences", then
>> buy a gun and revolt against "the Regime(tm)". Unfortunately,
>> this plan is doomed to failure, because (according to "editor")
>> Wally-World is *already* out of ammo.
>
> Wake up. Those who sparkplug the revolt
There isn't going to BE any "revolt", coward. There will never
be more than a couple of you internet loudmouths hiding behind
your keyboards, pretending to be "tough guys".
Klaus Schadenfreude
>On Jun 7, 9:14�am, Klaus Schadenfreude <klausschadenfre...@yahoo.com>
>wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>
>> >General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>> >not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. �Neither did Chrysler.
>>
>> General Motors is a shitty company making shitty cars and would have
>> been allowed to sink without a trace during the administration of
>> President Schadenfreude. Luckily for the workers, Obama stepped in.
>
>Bullshit - ALL of it. Try driving - and living with - a full-size
>Buick for a year, and you'd agree it's a hell of a lot better than the
>rice burner Toyota you used to have.
You haven't ridden in a Toyota since 1973, have you? [chuckle]
>Better for the workers? What about all of them getting downsized?
Fuck 'em. They can get jobs at the Toyota plant when it ramps up to
increase production, or they can move to China and work at the GM
plant there, all the time thanking their G.M. masters for running
their company into the ground.
>What about all of them losing their health benefits. ALL thanks to
>the Black Daley.
It's got nothing to do with Obama you racist whacko.
ob...@real.com
The people getting crushed are out there right now, commiting
suicide and burning their cars for insurance. I don't see any anger
at the system growing, just people trying to make the best of their
own private situations. Yeah, they're hoping for change, but they
don't have any faith that things will change, or that they can make
any changes. So all the distruction is turning inwards upon
themselves. Eventually this will have an incredible and
unpredictable impact on our society. We're not configured
to handle "third world" norms. And the excessive gross
violations to the rule of law, don't portend well for it remaining
credible. Meaning things may soon devolve to "every man for
himself", and "the means justifies the end". If so, we're no longer
going to be living in such a pretty orderly society. (Shudder).
ob...@real.com
>edi...@netpath.net wrote:
>> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
>> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
>> That's a comparison of how much worse off we now are in the Obama
>> Depression.
>
You mean the Bush Depression! This is the depression he kept
saying wasn't going to happen, called it a "soft patch" and spent
eight years trying to "stimulate" his way out of! Each time his
"stimulus" efforts failed, things got worse and he spun harder!
NOPE, this is THE BUSH DEPRESSION!!! Bush created it and
Bush couldn't conceal it, no matter how hard he tried!
RD (The Sandman)
GM was in deep doodoo prior to the collapse of the economy. They had
lots tons of market share already by last fall. The economy just didn't
let them off.
> Warren Buffet sees US auto sales this year struggling to reach 9
> million total.
And Ford is certainly seeking its share. Amount of government
handout....Zero.
> Toyota is feeling it, they lost money for the first time, and their
> CEO resigned.
However, they are still selling much better than GM.
> Fiat was ready to implode until they got the Chrysler deal.
>
> It's a GLOBAL recession.
Yep, but that isn't the only reason GM is in trouble.
>> Damn, only $80B and they lose it faster than they can
>> make it.
>
> The only 2 manufactures to see sales increase in America this last
> year were Hyundai and Subaru.
And the only two to need a government bailout (which didn't work in
either case) were GM and Chrysler. What's your point?
>>>> That's why they're no longer sell
>>>> as many cars as they did.
>>> No...it's not.
>>
>> They have gone from 54% of the US market to less than 12%.
>
> Indeed they have, competition from many brands will do that, and
> Korean and non-union wages will shift the pricing power too.
Then you are starting to realize some of the problems that GM faced
before the economy fell apart. GM's stock was 86.06 in May of 2000. It
is currently 0.88 and is no longer on the NYSE. It is OTC Pink.
TDNY
Aggie A.
> General Motors never filed bankruptcy nor got nationalized before -
> not even during the 1930s "Great" Depression. Neither did Chrysler.
> Depression.
Obama and Clinton are to blame for everything.
Why can't Bush come back and save the day?
Klaus Schadenfreude
>http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22786.htm
China loves GM because up to a few years ago they were all riding
bicycles and literally shitting in the streets. What toothless peasant
WOULDN'T like a Buick?
So GM is going to put some money into factories which will all be
useless when China starts making its own cars in a about fifteen
minutes from now.
Fuck GM. If it can't make it on its own, it needs to die.
10x
>http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22786.htm
China has enough hard U.S currency to purchase General Motors
complete.
Or maybe they are going to pick up the assests after the bankrupsy and
manufacture cars in the U.S.?
It is only the cashs side of GM that will disapear. The factories and
workers will still be there. So someone can purchase the factories
and start manufacturing cars without all of the bagage of debt....
10x
<klausscha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>In talk.politics.guns "TDNY" <TD...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
>
>>http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22786.htm
>
>China loves GM because up to a few years ago they were all riding
>bicycles and literally shitting in the streets. What toothless peasant
>WOULDN'T like a Buick?
There are more folks with automobiles in China than there are in the
U.S. There is a bigger market for everything in China.
>So GM is going to put some money into factories which will all be
>useless when China starts making its own cars in a about fifteen
>minutes from now.
GM has factories in China...
>Fuck GM. If it can't make it on its own, it needs to die.
You miss the point. It is the owners of GM that are being saved. The
infrastructure- factories, sklls, and people would still be there and
ready to produce automoibiles if the current owners were turfed.
The U.S. is preserving the status quo at GM.
It isn't a reinvention - it is a new start for preferred investors
bailed out by tax dollars.
Klaus Schadenfreude
>On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 05:10:08 -0700, Klaus Schadenfreude
><klausscha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>In talk.politics.guns "TDNY" <TD...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
>>
>>>http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22786.htm
>>
>>China loves GM because up to a few years ago they were all riding
>>bicycles and literally shitting in the streets. What toothless peasant
>>WOULDN'T like a Buick?
>
>There are more folks with automobiles in China than there are in the
>U.S. There is a bigger market for everything in China.
Yep. Billions of 'em over there.
>>So GM is going to put some money into factories which will all be
>>useless when China starts making its own cars in a about fifteen
>>minutes from now.
>
>GM has factories in China...
Yep. They're building Chinese Buicks right now.
>>Fuck GM. If it can't make it on its own, it needs to die.
>
>You miss the point. It is the owners of GM that are being saved.
No, that IS my point. They should NOT be saved. None of them.
stan
> I didn't vote for President Barack Hussein Obama,
> I voted for Senator John Sydney McCain.
>
> However, thus far, I like Obama.
>
> I think he has had the audacity, to challenge groups,
> that have up to now, never been called on the carpet in the USA.
>
> Obama, admitted in his Cairo University speech,
> that the USA was involved in the overthrow of a democratically
> elected government in Iran, back when he was 8 years of age,
> in 1953.
>
> I don't think, I have ever heard a USA president admit that before.
>
> Financially & Politically powerful groups in the USA,
> usted to exerting their unchallenged influence over the our
> congress and senate are upset with President Barack Hussein Obama.
>
> But Hussein sits in the oval office, like it or not.
Stop dwelling on names! For example.
One of the most famous (And later US President) most successful
generals during WWII was Eisenhower, SHAEF (Supreme Head Allied
Expeditionary Force).
An American with a German based name!
Quote; The name Eisenhower comes from German words meaning a craftsman
who fashions small images out of iron. The president's father, David
Eisenhower, was descended from German immigrants in
Pennsylvania .......
Is Ken Darian
> In talk.politics.guns 10x <10x@telu�s.net> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 05:10:08 -0700, Klaus Schadenfreude
>> <klausscha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In talk.politics.guns "TDNY" <TD...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
>>>
>>>> http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22786.htm
>>> China loves GM because up to a few years ago they were all riding
>>> bicycles and literally shitting in the streets. What toothless peasant
>>> WOULDN'T like a Buick?
>> There are more folks with automobiles in China than there are in the
>> U.S. There is a bigger market for everything in China.
>
> Yep. Billions of 'em over there.
>
>
>>> So GM is going to put some money into factories which will all be
>>> useless when China starts making its own cars in a about fifteen
>>> minutes from now.
>> GM has factories in China...
>
> Yep. They're building Chinese Buicks right now.
With the profits coming back to US GM...
>>> Fuck GM. If it can't make it on its own, it needs to die.
>> You miss the point. It is the owners of GM that are being saved.
>
> No, that IS my point. They should NOT be saved. None of them.
So screw all the bondholders, right?
You're a rotten wet fart in an elevator.
SamIAm
Exactly .... Why would you expect me to pay for your poor investment?
>
> You're a rotten wet fart in an elevator.
Exactly
JMcVie
GM already screwed them, AND the stock holders, you moron.
At less then a dollar a share now, from a high of 90.00 in 1998...
A company run my idiots since 1958!
Stupid leaders provide stump stupid products, regardless of how
wonderful the engineers might be that they hired are.
GM refused to learn after several decades of failures, while others
perfected the method of making a DECENT PRODUCT that the US people want
and can afford.
The Unions that were forced to evolve, sure didn't help matters much
either.
They caused over paid lazy rat bastards that refused to work and produce
a piece of crap, while the executives get paid billions and live
lavishly while they sing: "Crap is good! Fa la laa la la! Let's send it
overseas ...la la"
Your TV?
Not made in America!
Is Ken Darian
And the suppliers, they can fuck off too?
And the workers, them too?
And the tax revenues to local communities, fuck that too?
DROP DEAD!
>>
>> You're a rotten wet fart in an elevator.
>
> Exactly
Glad you admit it, shithead.
Is Ken Darian
Oh I'm sorry did GM engineer the terms of their bankruptcy, or did the
Gubmint?
> At less then a dollar a share now, from a high of 90.00 in 1998...
> A company run my idiots since 1958!
A company well on its way to a turnaround under Wagoner and Lutz until
the credit crunch hit.
> Stupid leaders provide stump stupid products, regardless of how
> wonderful the engineers might be that they hired are.
Funny, their products aren't all that stupid, in fact they sold pretty
well until the credit crunch and commodity bubble.
> GM refused to learn after several decades of failures, while others
> perfected the method of making a DECENT PRODUCT that the US people want
> and can afford.
GM did learn as evidenced by the stunning reliability ratings at Buick.
> The Unions that were forced to evolve, sure didn't help matters much
> either.
The UAW is the MAJOR CAUSE of GM's inability to compete with foreign
product, you oaf!
> They caused over paid lazy rat bastards that refused to work and produce
> a piece of crap, while the executives get paid billions and live
> lavishly while they sing: "Crap is good! Fa la laa la la! Let's send it
> overseas ...la la"
Interestingly enough Buick is the number 1 seller in China and Europe's
GM presence is not felt in exports from the US but rather quality
products produced by Opel
> Your TV?
>
> Not made in America!
You're right - it was labor-costed out to China and Taiwan and Korea.
SamIAm
What don't you understand about business. People run a business to make
a profit. They take risks. When they go broke, the workers are hurt,
the suppliers are hurt, everyone associated with them is hurt.
Is Ken Darian
What don't you comprehend about economic multiplier effects?
> People run a business to make
> a profit. They take risks. When they go broke, the workers are hurt,
> the suppliers are hurt, everyone associated with them is hurt.
And if the economy is already in recession, just let it spread?
Brilliant.
JMcVie
> JMcVie wrote:
>
>> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>>> So screw all the bondholders, right?
>> GM already screwed them, AND the stock holders, you moron.
> Oh I'm sorry did GM engineer the terms of their bankruptcy, or did the
> Gubmint?
GM, you moron!
The Government didn't design there idiocy, THEY DID!
GM NEEDS HELP!
GM now wants YOU to pay for their bankruptcy!
Were you born stupid... or did you become that way after decades of bad
brain cells gone bad?
>> At less then a dollar a share now, from a high of 90.00 in 1998...
>> A company run my idiots since 1958!
>
>
> A company well on its way to a turnaround under Wagoner and Lutz until
> the credit crunch hit.
BWAAAAAHAHAHAAAAAA!
GM made their bed, and sleep with others!
They have NOT made a car that was ever "recomended" for selling by
Comumer Reports, except for one model of Buick!
If they are "on it's way", then why are they filing for bankruptcy?
I worked on those rust farms for over 25 years.
The only thing worse is Mercedes and Fiats with their wind up cable
windows and shims to time the cams!
>> Stupid leaders provide stump stupid products, regardless of how
>> wonderful the engineers might be that they hired are.
> Funny, their products aren't all that stupid, in fact they sold pretty
> well until the credit crunch and commodity bubble.
Besides the one on yer head, your point?
Idiots have always been known to buy crap.
I'll even admit that I once bought a "GATEWAY" computer. (shame on me)
But, I was smart enough to make them take it back after 15 days!
Explain how GM is going tails up IF they make a product or run a company
that is decent?
Oldmobile?
Deleted! Once a GREAT car Company!
Pontiac?
Deleted! Once a great car Company!
Hummer?
Deleted! Now sold to the Chinese, as GM is a bunch of IDIOTS that
can't even make a decent toaster!
Etc!
>
>> GM refused to learn after several decades of failures, while others
>> perfected the method of making a DECENT PRODUCT that the US people
>> want and can afford.
>
>
> GM did learn as evidenced by the stunning reliability ratings at Buick.
One model that comes off the same assembly line as all others?
Hmmmm.. make me wonder what kinda retard you want to be percieved as.
>> The Unions that were forced to evolve, sure didn't help matters much
>> either.
> The UAW is the MAJOR CAUSE of GM's inability to compete with foreign
> product, you oaf!
Yet, you don't see Ford or Toyota "suffering", as they are being built
here in the USA?
Damn, yer dumber then a used cork!
>
>> They caused over paid lazy rat bastards that refused to work and
>> produce a piece of crap, while the executives get paid billions and
>> live lavishly while they sing: "Crap is good! Fa la laa la la! Let's
>> send it overseas ...la la"
>
>
> Interestingly enough Buick is the number 1 seller in China and Europe's
> GM presence is not felt in exports from the US but rather quality
> products produced by Opel
>
>> Your TV?
>>
>> Not made in America!
>
>
> You're right - it was labor-costed out to China and Taiwan and Korea.
Now you MIGHT be close to a possible understanding.
GM is run by idiots!
They should "Get Smart" or die.
"Sorry about that boss."
But if well made cars are to be made for us in the US, then either let
our people move to the countries that make them, or make them here!
I bet that make's yer little head spin wondering how easy that could be
done, eh?
JMcVie
> JMcVie wrote:
>> Your TV?
>>
>> Not made in America!
> You're right - it was labor-costed out to China and Taiwan and Korea.
And yet your happy as a clam, intead of doing(demanding!) a damned thing
about it!
Now you know why GM MUST DIE, as they are doing the same damned thing
with their CRAP!
YOU want to save a company that can only outsourse and make a product
that the Chinese and other countries make cheaper, instead of what WE
(the US people) desire, and purchase.. from overseas!
Yer fucked in the head!
Is Ken Darian
> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>> JMcVie wrote:
>>
>>> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>
>>>> So screw all the bondholders, right?
>
>>> GM already screwed them, AND the stock holders, you moron.
>
>> Oh I'm sorry did GM engineer the terms of their bankruptcy, or did the
>> Gubmint?
>
>
> GM, you moron!
Really?
I was under the impression they took their marching orders from Obama.
I think Wagoner was too..
> The Government didn't design there idiocy, THEY DID!
That wasn't what I asked, was it shitbird?
> GM NEEDS HELP!
Yes...
> GM now wants YOU to pay for their bankruptcy!
Yes...
> Were you born stupid... or did you become that way after decades of bad
> brain cells gone bad?
Were your born to lose arguments or is it an acquired skill?
>>> At less then a dollar a share now, from a high of 90.00 in 1998...
>>> A company run my idiots since 1958!
>>
>>
>> A company well on its way to a turnaround under Wagoner and Lutz until
>> the credit crunch hit.
>
> BWAAAAAHAHAHAAAAAA!
Another of your articulate rejoinders I see...
> GM made their bed, and sleep with others!
A great grammarian you're not.
> They have NOT made a car that was ever "recomended" for selling by
> Comumer Reports, except for one model of Buick!
Oh how delicious!
You see I just happen to have the April 2009 suto issue of Consumer
Reports right here in front of me...
pg.7
Top Picks:
Pickup Truck - Chevy Avalanche
Recommended Cars
pg.29
Family Sedans - Chevy Malibu, Saturn Aura
pg. 30
Upscale sedans - Buick Lucerne
pg. 31
Luxury Sedans - Cadillac DTS
pg. 37
Full size pickups - Chevy Avalanche, Silverado 1500 and GMC Sierra
Heavy Duty Turbodiesel Pickups - Chevy Silverado 2500
And while we're at it we can toss in the Saab 9-5 - GM owned.
> If they are "on it's way", then why are they filing for bankruptcy?
Because they did not turn the company quickly enough to survive the
credit crunch and vastly depressed global auto sales market.
GM estimated they could be profitable with 10.5 million US sales.
The US market, by Warren Buffet's estimate, will be 9 million vehicles
sold TOTAL!
Game over.
> I worked on those rust farms for over 25 years.
> The only thing worse is Mercedes and Fiats with their wind up cable
> windows and shims to time the cams!
I'll give you no argument about Fiat, the shotgun wedding partner Obama
saddled Chrysler with.
>>> Stupid leaders provide stump stupid products, regardless of how
>>> wonderful the engineers might be that they hired are.
>
>> Funny, their products aren't all that stupid, in fact they sold pretty
>> well until the credit crunch and commodity bubble.
>
> Besides the one on yer head, your point?
> Idiots have always been known to buy crap.
> I'll even admit that I once bought a "GATEWAY" computer. (shame on me)
> But, I was smart enough to make them take it back after 15 days!
>
> Explain how GM is going tails up IF they make a product or run a company
> that is decent?
Simple, US sales are not enough to sustain the SIZE of their operations.
Operations the UAW screamed to keep going each time the contract came up.
> Oldmobile?
> Deleted! Once a GREAT car Company!
>
> Pontiac?
> Deleted! Once a great car Company!
>
> Hummer?
> Deleted! Now sold to the Chinese, as GM is a bunch of IDIOTS that
> can't even make a decent toaster!
So when they do downsize you flay them and if they don't you flay them.
Illogical.
> Etc!
In fact they can and do make decent products, though admittedly not
enough yet.
The Volt is due out in 2010, will you consign that to the scrap heap too?
>>> GM refused to learn after several decades of failures, while others
>>> perfected the method of making a DECENT PRODUCT that the US people
>>> want and can afford.
>>
>>
>> GM did learn as evidenced by the stunning reliability ratings at Buick.
>
> One model that comes off the same assembly line as all others?
There are more models and lines - see above.
> Hmmmm.. make me wonder what kinda retard you want to be percieved as.
One of us came with the facts - hint: it wasn't YOU.
>>> The Unions that were forced to evolve, sure didn't help matters much
>>> either.
>
>> The UAW is the MAJOR CAUSE of GM's inability to compete with foreign
>> product, you oaf!
>
> Yet, you don't see Ford or Toyota "suffering", as they are being built
> here in the USA?
Ford was prescient enough to refi the company a year before the credit
crunch, plus they have family cash to shore them up.
Toyota indeed IS suffering:
http://industry.bnet.com/auto/1000395/how-bad-is-us-auto-market-toyotas-losing-money-too/
In the midst of the doom and gloom surrounding Ford, GM and Chrysler,
it�s fair to point out that even mighty Toyota Motor Corp. lost money in
North America in the last six months.
Toyota had an operating loss of 34.6 billion yen in the first half of
its 2009 fiscal year, the period ending Sept. 30, versus an operating
profit of 263 billion yen. Depending on the exchange rate, that�s an
operating loss for the half of about $358 million.
That�s a lot better than the billions lost by the Detroit automakers,
but it�s sufficiently dire by Toyota standards to warrant the creation
of an �Emergency Profit Improvement Committee,� charged with a mandate
to salvage a profit for the 2009 and 2010 fiscal years.
Specifically, the committee will review production capabilities, as well
as the scale and timing of new projects, the company said in a Nov. 6
presentation.
Reading between the lines, Toyota until now has been so successful for
so long, especially in the United States, it may have lost focus on its
penny-pinching tradition.
Meanwhile, Toyota�s U.S. sales fell 32.3 percent in September from the
year-ago month.
The drop prompted the company to offer unprecedented zero-percent
financing deals. Despite the offers and a big advertising blitz, U.S.
sales fell almost as much in October, down 23 percent from the year-ago
month, according to AutoData Corp.
Toyota�s announcement seems to acknowledge the company may be trying to
do too many things at once, like succeed in the fullsize pickup truck
segment with the Toyota Tundra; the minicar segment with the Scion
brand; the luxury car segment with the Lexus brand; and potentially
create yet another entire lineup based around the popular Prius hybrid
model.
It might also be added their CEO stepped down in embarasment.
> Damn, yer dumber then a used cork!
I suspect we'll not be seeing much more of you in future after the
thrashing you're getting here.
Klaus suffered a like fate.
>>
>>> They caused over paid lazy rat bastards that refused to work and
>>> produce a piece of crap, while the executives get paid billions and
>>> live lavishly while they sing: "Crap is good! Fa la laa la la! Let's
>>> send it overseas ...la la"
>>
>>
>> Interestingly enough Buick is the number 1 seller in China and
>> Europe's GM presence is not felt in exports from the US but rather
>> quality products produced by Opel
>>
>>> Your TV?
>>>
>>> Not made in America!
>>
>>
>> You're right - it was labor-costed out to China and Taiwan and Korea.
>
>
> Now you MIGHT be close to a possible understanding.
>
> GM is run by idiots!
Do tell!
So they maybe should have busted the UAW, yes?
Oh...that wasn't possible, was it?
No...
> They should "Get Smart" or die.
The Volt is darned smart.
So are the hybrid Tahoe's and pickups.
> "Sorry about that boss."
>
> But if well made cars are to be made for us in the US, then either let
> our people move to the countries that make them, or make them here!
Huh?
You want Americans moving to Korea and Japan?!?!?
You're not very rational.
> I bet that make's yer little head spin wondering how easy that could be
> done, eh?
Oh I don't think getting rid of the UAW is feasible at all, all the more
so after Obama made them OWNERS in GM!
Now run along child, you bore me.
Is Ken Darian
> Is Ken Darian wrote:
>
>> JMcVie wrote:
>
>
>>> Your TV?
>>>
>>> Not made in America!
>
>> You're right - it was labor-costed out to China and Taiwan and Korea.
>
> And yet your happy as a clam, intead of doing(demanding!) a damned thing
> about it!
Oh my, you did a hack and reload, how tiresome...
I opposed both NAFTA, and CAFTA, and I'm no fan of GATT either.
Damned bad guess on your part.
> Now you know why GM MUST DIE, as they are doing the same damned thing
> with their CRAP!
No, really they're not.
http://www.automotiveaddicts.com/inthenews/07-10-06.html
US-Assembled Car % US/Canada content Name Corporate Profits
Cadillac DTS 90% USA USA
Chevrolet Silverado, GMC Sierra 90% USA USA
Chevrolet Colorado, GMC Canyon, 85% USA USA
Buick Rainer, GMC Envoy, Chevrolet TrailBlazer 85% USA USA
Cadillac CTS 80% USA USA
Chevrolet Corvette, Cadillac XLR 80% USA USA
Chevrolet Malibu, Pontiac G6 80% USA USA
Cadillac SRX 80% USA USA
Chevrolet Uplander, Pontiac Montana, Saturn 75% USA USA
Chevrolet Cobalt 75% USA USA
> YOU want to save a company that can only outsourse
10-25% content isn't much by way of outsourcing though is it/
> and make a product
> that the Chinese and other countries make cheaper,
Buick is the #1 selling vehicle and brand in China.
> instead of what WE
> (the US people) desire, and purchase.. from overseas!
We still purchase a lot of GM products though:
http://247wallst.com/2009/02/26/gm-gm-the-silver-lining-is-global-market-share/
While GM North American lost $8.8 billion in Q4 2008, and posted red ink
in all of the other regions that it includes in its financials, the
company held onto it 9% plus market share in Europe and its 7% plus
market share in Asia. The drops in US and Latin America, market share
were modest. GM�s share of the American light vehicle market was down
from 22.7% in 2007 to 21% in 2008.
> Yer fucked in the head!
Thanks for the trenchant diagnosis, Dr. Fact-free.
I think I'm going to enjoy having you to bat around!
Klaus Schadenfreude
>Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> In talk.politics.guns 10x <10x@telu�s.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 05:10:08 -0700, Klaus Schadenfreude
>>> <klausscha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In talk.politics.guns "TDNY" <TD...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22786.htm
>>>> China loves GM because up to a few years ago they were all riding
>>>> bicycles and literally shitting in the streets. What toothless peasant
>>>> WOULDN'T like a Buick?
>>> There are more folks with automobiles in China than there are in the
>>> U.S. There is a bigger market for everything in China.
>>
>> Yep. Billions of 'em over there.
>>
>>
>>>> So GM is going to put some money into factories which will all be
>>>> useless when China starts making its own cars in a about fifteen
>>>> minutes from now.
>>> GM has factories in China...
>>
>> Yep. They're building Chinese Buicks right now.
>
>With the profits coming back to US GM...
Which is why they're declaring bankruptcy. LOL
Yer Pal Al
wrote:
> In talk.politics.guns 10x <10x@teluös.net> wrote:
>
> >On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 05:10:08 -0700, Klaus Schadenfreude
>
> >>In talk.politics.guns "TDNY" <T...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
>
> >>>http://informationclearinghouse.info/article22786.htm
>
> >>China loves GM because up to a few years ago they were all riding
> >>bicycles and literally shitting in the streets. What toothless peasant
> >>WOULDN'T like a Buick?
>
> >There are more folks with automobiles in China than there are in the
> >U.S. There is a bigger market for everything in China.
>
> Yep. Billions of 'em over there.
>
> >>So GM is going to put some money into factories which will all be
> >>useless when China starts making its own cars in a about fifteen
> >>minutes from now.
>
> >GM has factories in China...
>
> Yep. They're building Chinese Buicks right now.
>
> >>Fuck GM. If it can't make it on its own, it needs to die.
>
> >You miss the point. It is the owners of GM that are being saved.
>
> No, that IS my point. They should NOT be saved. None of them.
'You own the company. Why not drive the car?'" - New GM slogan