Doubt and belief

[Daniel Crandall]

Dennis's Ultimate Issues hour today, 5/13, was interesting. I wonder why no one seems to have asked atheists if they ever doubt their atheism. It's a great question, and I'm not surprised that not a one of them does.

 

It got me thinking about belief systems and doubt. I hope what I write makes sense, because I'm still working this out myself.

 

Judaism and Christianity seem to handle doubt quite well. Why is that? As an Orthodox Christian I hear a great deal about Mystery and how important it is to faith, and how this is related to the many things that Man just cannot know. This seems to leave room for doubt among even the most devout Orthodox.

 

Beside Atheism there is another belief system that leaves no room for doubt. That is Islam. I have never heard a Muslim express doubt about anything in their faith. Allah said it, Mohammad wrote it, and that's that. And I wonder what it is about these two belief systems that leave no room for doubt among their adherents.

 

I'm thinking that is related to each systems relation with day to day life and how much a belief system explains Everything; about who we are, what we are supposed to do, where we are going when we shuffle off this mortal coil, etc. etc. Atheism and Islam are all-encompassing, explaining and controlling all aspects of one's life. Judaism and Christianity leave some areas open, areas in which Mystery dominates.

 

For example, where do we go when we die? Atheists: We go nowhere. Muslims: All Muslims go to Paradise, all infidels, i.e., all non-Muslims go to Hell. Christians: Hope that we go to heavan but only God knows. Jews: Actually I don't know the Jewish ideas about life after death so I'll leave it at that, but I've never heard a Jew say, "I know where I'm going when I die."

 

I think there is something here related to worldly matters, but my thoughts on that aren't clear enough. I'll leave it there, and look forward to others thoughts.

 

Take care,

Daniel

[Vivian Evans]

Since I'm at the office I heard only bits and pieces of today's show, but I thought there were a couple of issues that would make for interesting discussion topics.  The issue you raise about doubt and living by faith is definitely one, and your comments will be food for thought for me.  The other is the issue Dennis raised with the British author (I heard very little of it) about societies with a diversity of belief and opinion being more dynamic and successful than more unified societies.  I'll have to give that one some thought too.  I very much enjoyed the meet-up at Crossroads and hope others are interested in doing it again.  Cheers to all from Vivian

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Date: Tue, 13 May 2008 12:33:10 -0700
From: dpcra...@gmail.com
To: nw-dennis-prag...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [nw-dennis-prager-discussions] Doubt and belief

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[JeffRCu...@aol.com]

I have been trying without success to get my browser to link me to PragerRadio.com.  Has anyone else had this problem?

 

Thanks,  Jeff Cunningham

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[Daniel Crandall]

Try: http://dennisprager.townhall.com/

 

When I type in www.pragerradio.com, it automatically redirects to the townhall.com address.

 

Thoughts on doubt & belief?

 

[David Lund]

I tend to think that people who say they have never had doubts (whether believers or atheists) are being less than fully honest (for some reason).

Given the complexity, ambiguity and strangeness/mystery in the world, and in all of our personal experience, if you are a thinking person, how could you never have doubts about all sorts of things?

And this is coming from a person who, in spite of a sophisticated modern theological education, has continued to be an orthodox believer, when so many others going through the same process have lost their faith.

I find it true that faith is a gift, not our own doing.  Eph 2:8  All the more miraculous because of the existence of reasonable doubt.

David

[Michael]

Doubt is the exercise of reason. Those who claim not to doubt would
be, if true, either deficient in reason or of blind faith both of
which not particularly complementary. Frankly, I do not believe Mr.
Hitchens for a moment that he has never doubted. He is intelligent,
thoughtful, and articulate. On this matter, tho', he has not fully
engaged his intellectual abilities.


Cheers,

Michael

On May 13, 9:26 pm, David Lund <da...@thelunds.us> wrote:
> I tend to think that people who say they have never had doubts (whether
> believers or atheists) are being less than fully honest (for some reason).
>
> Given the complexity, ambiguity and strangeness/mystery in the world, and
> in all of our personal experience, if you are a thinking person, how could
> you never have doubts about all sorts of things?
>
> And this is coming from a person who, in spite of a sophisticated modern
> theological education, has continued to be an orthodox believer, when so
> many others going through the same process have lost their faith.
>
> I find it true that faith is a gift, not our own doing. Eph 2:8 All the
> more miraculous because of the existence of reasonable doubt.
>
> David
>
> At 4:30 PM -0700 5/13/08, Daniel Crandall wrote:
>

> > Try: <http://dennisprager.townhall.com/>http://dennisprager.townhall.com/
>
> > When I type in <http://www.pragerradio.com>www.pragerradio.com, it
> >automatically redirects to the <http://townhall.com>townhall.com address.

>
> > Thoughts on doubt & belief?
>

> > On 5/13/08, <mailto:JeffRCunning...@aol.com>JeffRCunning...@aol.com

> ><<mailto:JeffRCunning...@aol.com>JeffRCunning...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > I have been trying without success to get my browser to link me to
> >PragerRadio.com. Has anyone else had this problem?
>
> > Thanks, Jeff Cunningham
>

> > Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight?

> ><http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001>Get new

[Daniel Crandall]

Hitchens may have realized his error when he rapidly backpedaled from his statement that he never doubts his atheism, claiming, to Dennis during the debate, not to have said it, when he clearly did. But when it comes religion and faith, Hitchens' animus overwhelms his intellectual abilities, proof of which can be seen in how often he resorts to insult against those of religious faith.

 

Daniel

 

[tom bush]

I believe that the PragerRadio.com address is simply a forwarding URL that sends you to http://dennisprager.townhall.com/

 

Try going direct to the page.

 

Tom




[nw-dennis-prager-discussions] Re: Doubt and belief
Date: Tue, 13 May 2008 18:45:33 EDT

I have been trying without success to get my browser to link me to PragerRadio.com.  Has anyone else had this problem?

 

Thanks,  Jeff Cunningham

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Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food.

[Jeanie M. Boddy]

thanks Daniel. I like your possessives... Jeanie

----- Original Message -----

From: Daniel Crandall

To: nw-dennis-prag...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 12:33 PM

Subject: [nw-dennis-prager-discussions] Doubt and belief