Requests, Demands and Force

[Angela Harms]

It occurs to me that requests are what we make when we're fully aware that the world is a place where we can get our needs met, and other people can too. We are aware that we don't know best, and we are valuing the autonomy of the other person. Demands come from a place of insecurity, but also contain something of a denial of the other person's agency. We want to scare them (or guilt them or intimdate them) into doing what *we* think is the best thing to do.

"Aren't you going to clean that up?"
"Please turn that down."

I've often thought of demands as a kind of force. But now I'm re-thinking that. Now I think that
* a demand is when you try to apply pressure to make someone choose what you want, and
* force is when you do something, yourself, to get your need met without considering the needs of someone else.

Looking at it that way, I feel a lot clearer about my unwillingness to use demands (though I screw up) and my definite willingness to use force, when I think the time is right.

Angela

[Conal Elliott]

force is when you do something, yourself, to get your need met without considering the needs of someone else.

Do you really mean the "without considering" part?

Sometimes I consider their needs, notice that they can be met with strategies other than they're requesting/demanding of me, and unilaterally decline their request.  For instance by locking my treehouse door.

  - Conal

[Angela Harms]

I wondered about that, "without considering."

I think when I use that phrase, I mean that while I'm using force, I'm not engaged with that other person, and not trying to guess at and fulfill their needs while taking care of my own. I think I'm done considering their needs when I make the decision to use force.

Angela
---
Life. Love. Food. www.lifelovefood.com

[Conal Elliott]

Maybe you've considered their needs and are trusting that those needs can be met in ways that don't involve you.

I'm totally fine with an action that meets some needs and not others, or meets one person's needs and not others.  I usually hear the phrase "that doesn't meet my needs for ..." as a misunderstanding of NVC.  More at http://evolve.awakeningcompassion.com/posts/abundance-and-scarcity-in-the-consciousness-and-practice-of-nvc/

  - Conal

[Angela Harms]

On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 5:50 PM, Conal Elliott <co...@conal.net> wrote:

Maybe you've considered their needs and are trusting that those needs can be met in ways that don't involve you.

Generally, I trust that's the case, but I still think when I'm using force, I've already done whatever considering I'm gonna do. So I guess I don't see an improvement to my proposed definition so far.
 

I usually hear the phrase "that doesn't meet my needs for ..." as a misunderstanding of NVC.

Not entirely sure how this connects, but I have to agree. That phrase is one of the butcherings of NVC that most gets my panties in a wad. (Geez I'm crude today.)

Angela - stretching her vocabulary
 

[Conal Elliott]

Generally, I trust that's the case, but I still think when I'm using force [...]

Sure.  Just checking my understanding.  I think we're in sync.

  - Conal