Re: Census Superfluousness
Chris Cox
> I just got a letter announcing that they were going to be sending my
> census packet out soon. ~:-\
>
I really appreciate the amount of OUR money they are spending
on this....
Adam Gabriel
kjhurni
Yeah, got one a few days ago. Nice waste of my taxpayer dollars yet
again.
How about you just send the darn thing out instead of "stimulating" the
post office by sending a letter telling you they'll be sending it out.
--
kjhurni
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Patrick Farrell
>
> Yeah, got one a few days ago. Nice waste of my taxpayer dollars yet
> again.
>
> How about you just send the darn thing out instead of "stimulating" the
> post office by sending a letter telling you they'll be sending it out.
>
Post office has a budget shortfall and they are talking about going to 5
day M-F delivery and cutting Saturday out.
Paul Lamontagne
>
> Post office has a budget shortfall and they are talking about going to 5
> day M‑F delivery and cutting Saturday out.
That's what we have in Canada...though Post Offices are open Saturday
morning til noon......and there are Postal Outlets open in Drug stores
later..etc...but no delivery on Saturday M-F only
And Since the early 80's all new housing developments do not have door
service...everyone picks up mail at a corner Super Mailbox....I'm lucky mine
is right across the street.
--
Paul
kjhurni
Hence my comment on "stimulating" them.
Craig
mailing was estimate to cost millions just to tell you that you were getting
some money.
"Chris Cox" <cj...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote in message
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Donald Albury
wrote:
>How about you just send the darn thing out instead of "stimulating" the
>post office by sending a letter telling you they'll be sending it out.
I suspect they are trying to reduce the number of packets that get thrown
out unopened.
Donald Albury
GofBorg
>> census packet out soon. ~:-\
> I really appreciate the amount of OUR money they are spending
> on this....
I really appreciate the number of trees that sacrificed their lives
for this garbage....I thought there was supposed to be a push to make
government more green...yet somehow, we can't pull this one off online
and without paper.
Craig
hinterlands and may have little or no internet access.
And I guess they have to try really hard, since it's all constitutional-y
and everything.
"GofBorg" <Gof...@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote in message
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kjhurni
hmmm, now that you mention it, I think I do remember that.
George
that used to have three counter clerks now has one. It is at least a
twenty minute wait any time of the day if you need any sort of counter
service. They also removed the various postage machines from the lobby
and replaced them with a credit card only "self service center" that
usually wears a handwritten "out of order" sign. The manager said the
machines were expensive so thats why they removed them...
George
census of which $2,500,000 alone was spent on the superbowl ad...
Susan
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Donald Albury
<plamo...@novell.com> wrote:
>And Since the early 80's all new housing developments do not have door
>service...everyone picks up mail at a corner Super Mailbox....I'm lucky mine
>is right across the street.
That came even earlier in the US. Our street was built up in '72/'73, and
our mailbox is at the other end of the street. At our previous location we
still had the mailbox by the front door, but the post office was trying to
convince the neighborhood to switch to curbside.
Donald Albury
Donald Albury
has in finding the people to count. They simply cannot afford the original
counting method, which was to send census takers out in the field to find
every dwelling and knock on the door. Despite redundancies, people are
missed. I worked with one fellow at the time of the 1990 census who was
quite pleased that he did not receive census forms at either his house or
his post office box. An accurate census count is important for determining
representation in the US House of Representatives and in the distribution
of certain Federal (and, often, state) funds.
Since, for political reasons, the Census Bureau cannot treat the count as a
sample and statistically estimate the final count, and since some people
remain blissfully unaware that a census is taking place while others, for a
variety of reasons, do not want to be counted, the Census Bureau has to
resort to what appears to be redundant measures to increase the actual
percentage of the population that they count. As it is, various
jurisdictions have gone to court because they believe that the census
undercounted their population, and that they are therefore being unfairly
deprived of representation and/or funds that they should receive. Short of
either some "big brother" solution or of a "sample and estimate" system,
the Census Bureau is going to have to spend a lot of money and effort on
finding the "tail end" of the population. I suspect something like the
20/80 function, i.e., 20% of the effort counts 80% of the population, but
counting the remaining 20% of the population requires 80% of the total
effort. Actually, I suspect that 80% of the effort finds something like 15%
of the population, and the other 5% is missed entirely.
Donald Albury
brain
> I just got a letter announcing that they were going to be sending my
> census packet out soon. ~:-\
A friend of mine sent $15 to doctors without borders for Haiti .
They sent a thank you letter. The postage alone was R$1.83
They spent more than 10% saying thank you.
--
brain
Adam Gabriel
Why would they need to send a letter that cost $1.83 to mail?! can't
they sent a 3rd class postcard or something for like $.05?
Adam Gabriel
> As it is, various jurisdictions have gone
> to court because they believe that the census undercounted their
> population, and that they are therefore being unfairly deprived of
> representation and/or funds that they should receive. Short of either
> some "big brother" solution or of a "sample and estimate" system, the
> Census Bureau is going to have to spend a lot of money and effort on
> finding the "tail end" of the population.
My cynicism says that the ones doing the complaining about
misrepresentation are the ones ignoring the census, but I would like to
think not.
DougB
> Ha. I heard the same complaint when we got our tax pre-bates in 2k1?. The
> mailing was estimate to cost millions just to tell you that you were getting
> some money.
>
Actually, I think it was to tell you whom you should thank for it.
kjhurni
OMG. You've got to be kidding (I don't watch sports, so I'm unaware of
that). But I believe it.
I think blood may shoot out of my eyes now.
George
If I donate to a charity I want to know that they are making best use of
my money. Paying staff and purchasing postage and materials to thank
donors isn't a good use of money.
brain
Adam Gabriel wrote:
--
brain
Susan
Susan
Tell him to include his email address next time he donates. <G>
Craig
Like Donald posited, if a goal is to ensure that more people don't discard
the packets, end result could be "positive".
"DougB" <dougdo...@geemail.com> wrote in message
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Danita Zanre
> And Since the early 80's all new housing developments do not have door
> service...everyone picks up mail at a corner Super Mailbox....I'm
> lucky mine
> is right across the street.
and we have a real "mailbox" on a post in our front yard. One of the
houses we lived in in California had the door slots where the mail got
pushed through and landed on the foyer floor.
--
danita - www.caledonia.net/blog
Craig
"brain" <br...@wayoutthere.com> wrote in message
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Craig
"Susan" <nscv.sys...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
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Donald Albury
<adr...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote:
>My cynicism says that the ones doing the complaining about
>misrepresentation are the ones ignoring the census, but I would like to
>think not.
The ones complaining about undercounts are the elected officials. The
people missed by the census are largely the powerless: poor, functionally
illiterate, wary of any contact with authorities.
Donald Albury
Donald Albury
>If I donate to a charity I want to know that they are making best use of
>my money. Paying staff and purchasing postage and materials to thank
>donors isn't a good use of money.
If you donate money and never hear back from the charity, are you more or
less likely to donate again, than if you receive a thank you note?
Donald Albury
Susan
George
I would say that is an accurate picture. Here is an interesting idea.
I'll bet they could use one of those computer things I heard about to
just sort out the 95% of the folks who say did respond to the last
census and not bother doing stuff such as sending them a letter telling
them they are going to get a letter.
George
I research the charity looking for sensible and honest ones. The money
order is made out in the name of the charity so it would be difficult
for someone to divert it. I want as much of my donation as possible to
go to the actual charitable purpose so I prefer not to get a thank you
note etc.
Here is a good reference to be able to avoid the organizations that have
huge administrative expense:
Donald Albury
>I would say that is an accurate picture. Here is an interesting idea.
>I'll bet they could use one of those computer things I heard about to
>just sort out the 95% of the folks who say did respond to the last
>census and not bother doing stuff such as sending them a letter telling
>them they are going to get a letter.
Ten years between censuses. People move, get married, get divorced, start
living independently, die. I think some people would be uncomfortable about
any government agency that had a database that could accurately track all
of that for everybody in the country. Do you really want a perfectly
efficient government?
Donald Albury
MichaelC
> Ten years between censuses. People move, get married, get divorced, start
> living independently, die.
Yeah, here's an example:
I've moved 6 times in the last 10 years and will be married later this year.
In that time, my Mum, an Uncle, an Auntie and my Grandma have all died
> I think some people would be uncomfortable about
> any government agency that had a database that could accurately track all
> of that for everybody in the country.
Most definitely - whichever side of the puddle you're on :)
Michael
--
"I've got the key to the gates of paradise, but I've got too many legs!"
Adam Gabriel
> Thank you for injecting some facts into the discussion. : )
Bah, who needs em.
Adam Gabriel
> A friend of mine sent $15 to doctors without borders for Haiti .
>
> They sent a thank you letter. The postage alone was R$1.83
> They spent more than 10% saying thank you.
Next time he's just going to have to donate $16.83...
LarryMateo
adrockk;1945916 Wrote:
> I just got a letter announcing that they were going to be sending my
> census packet out soon. ~:-\
I received two: same name, same address, same apt. number, same
everything.
But when it comes to wasting taxpayer monies, this doesn't even
register a blip on the radar as far as I'm concerned. (Compare this to
600 billion dollars per year as a base expenditure for the War--er, I
mean, Defense--Department, plus billions more per year for the wars in
Iraq and Afghanistan.) The government is just priming people to respond
to the census this time around.
--
LarryMateo
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Craig
"LarryMateo" <Larry...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote in message
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Craig
person? :)
"Donald Albury" <dalbu...@not.bellsouth.net> wrote in message
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kjhurni
Craig;1947579 Wrote:
> I think this is interesting: 'News Headlines'
> (http://www.cnbc.com/id/26941466/)
>
>
> "LarryMateo" <Larry...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote in message
> news:LarryMat...@no-mx.forums.novell.com...
> >
> > adrockk;1945916 Wrote:
> >> I just got a letter announcing that they were going to be sending
> my
> >> census packet out soon. ~:-\
> >
> > I received two: same name, same address, same apt. number, same
> > everything.
> >
> > But when it comes to wasting taxpayer monies, this doesn't even
> > register a blip on the radar as far as I'm concerned. (Compare this
> to
> > 600 billion dollars per year as a base expenditure for the War--er,
> I
> > mean, Defense--Department, plus billions more per year for the wars
> in
> > Iraq and Afghanistan.) The government is just priming people to
> respond
> > to the census this time around.
> >
> >
> > --
> > LarryMateo
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> (http://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=12424)
> > View this thread: 'Census Superfluousness - NOVELL FORUMS'
> (http://forums.novell.com/showthread.php?t=404427)
> >
Too bad it only accounts "tax dollars" I believe if one looks at the
"pie graph" of what the US gov't spends (since they spend more than they
take in via taxes), what 17% of outlays go to the nat'l debt interest,
then factor in social security, medicare and medicaid and that's like
what, 2/3 or thereabouts?
But I digest.
--
kjhurni
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DougB
> Can't we just count remote, poor people who don't have computers as 3/5 of a
> person? :)
>
ISWYDT ;-)
Craig
future, past or present debt.
"kjhurni" <kjh...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote in message
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kjhurni
Craig;1947655 Wrote:
> I don't think that matters really. I think it's still proportional,
> whether
> future, past or present debt.
> "kjhurni" <kjh...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote in message
> news:kjhurni...@no-mx.forums.novell.com...
> >
> > Craig;1947579 Wrote:
> >> I think this is interesting: 'News Headlines'
> (http://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=12424))
> >> > View this thread: 'Census Superfluousness - NOVELL FORUMS'
> (http://forums.novell.com/showthread.php?t=404427))
> >> >
> >
> > Too bad it only accounts "tax dollars" I believe if one looks at
> the
> > "pie graph" of what the US gov't spends (since they spend more than
> they
> > take in via taxes), what 17% of outlays go to the nat'l debt
> interest,
> > then factor in social security, medicare and medicaid and that's
> like
> > what, 2/3 or thereabouts?
> >
> > But I digest.
> >
> >
> > --
> > kjhurni
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> (http://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=734)
> > View this thread: 'Census Superfluousness - NOVELL FORUMS'
> (http://forums.novell.com/showthread.php?t=404427)
> >
I don't think so. According to the slideshow there's nothing about
Social Security or Medicaid, but if one lumps the "healthcare" and
non-military debt interest it only comes up to 32.3 cents out of every
dollar which is about 1/3
That's a large (IMO) chunk less than 2/3 or thereabouts of what the
gov't spends on interest payments on the nat'l debt, social security,
medicare and medicaid.
But back to the Census.
Donald Albury
>Can't we just count remote, poor people who don't have computers as 3/5 of a
>person? :)
Wouldn't that be messy? I mean, 3/5 of a person would tend to leak all over
the place.
Donald Albury
Donald Albury
Never let a fact stand in the way of a good rant.
Donald Albury
kathcarruthers
I sent some money to Doctors without Borders Canada, but online, and
noticed that if you're giving less that $25 they ask if you want a
receipt or not. I got an email thank you note and a tax receipt by
post. Apparently the tax people don't allow them to do official
receipts by email.
--
Kathryn Carruthers
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brain
Odd, doesn't Doctors without borders 'Canada' imply a border?
> I sent some money to Doctors without Borders Canada, but online, and
> noticed that if you're giving less that $25 they ask if you want a
> receipt or not. I got an email thank you note and a tax receipt by
> post. Apparently the tax people don't allow them to do official
> receipts by email.
--
brain
Craig
"brain" <br...@wayoutthere.com> wrote in message
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kathcarruthers
Actually it's MSF (Medecins sans frontiers). The doctors may have no
borders, but the tax departments do :)
Craig
"kathcarruthers" <kathcar...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote in message
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zeffan
>
> The ones complaining about undercounts are the elected officials. The
> people missed by the census are largely the powerless: poor,
> functionally
> illiterate, wary of any contact with authorities.
>
That's why whenever I, as a local elected official, knock on my
friends' doors I always start with, "I'm from the government, and I'm
here to help you."
It cracks them up every time.
--
zeffan
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zeffan
> I just got a letter announcing that they were going to be sending my
> census packet out soon. ~:-\
I got that same letter last week (in about 9 languages) and got my
census form yesterday.
I'm thinking about holding it for a week, and immediately sending them
a letter telling them that I'm going to be sending my census form back
and that they should be watching for it. (translated into 9 languages,
of course)
Craig
"zeffan" <zef...@no-mx.forums.novell.com> wrote in message
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Donald Albury
>They should only send it to landed gentry!
What? Exclude the nobility?
Donald Albury
Mary Wood
Craig
:)
"Donald Albury" <dalbu...@not.bellsouth.net> wrote in message
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jbericks
"GOVERNMENT: If you think the problems we create are bad, just wait
until you see our solutions."
'Government' (http://despair.com/government.html)
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Joel Erickson
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