Fwd: Embriodery Machine PSU info and description of error.
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Marion Catlin
Dec 1, 2015, 11:55:33 AM12/1/15
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Hello all and especially Karl and Toby. Here is more info from Jules about her embroidery machine. She is going to come to the hackspace tomorrow but here is some pretty comprehensive info. Mario.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "Julia Devonshire" <julia.de...@gmail.com>
Date: 1 Dec 2015 16:04
Subject: Embriodery Machine PSU info and description of error.
To: "Marion Catlin" <marion...@btconnect.com>
Cc:
Hi Marion
Thanks for putting word out to your contacts. I' every keen to get along tomorrow night with my PSU box. For now you mentioned that Toby was keen to know more about the box... Here goes!
The embroidery machine: Toyota Expert ESP 850 (c. 1992?)
The PSU: Aisin seki co. ltd (see: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Suppy-for-Toyota-Commercial-Embroidery-Machine-AD850-860-/351307065368)
(inside, 1 x cosel p300e-24 smps + 1 x cosel p15e-5)
Background: On arrival when swicthed on the machine's Control box read "Motor Lock Error" which was commonly assigned to machines that had issues with drawing power and those that had CPU/ motherboard issues. Until I eliminate that power might be the issue I am unable to deduce that it is a CPU issue, that if the power issue isn't due to a malfunctioning CPU but due to an error with the PSU. I have has some tinkering (cleaned connections on the machine itself and insopcted connections etc) and now overcome the "Motor Lock Error" and it now reads "Needle Case Position Error" so perhpas because the motors aren't engaging it is stuck?? Anyway that's one idea....
What I do know: The PSU draws some power to control box (the part with the operation buttons and LCD screen, which is also the part that tells you of errors)- but the machine itself is dead. (Nothing happens when it's switched on- motor doesn't spin and nothing engages as I might expect). I have been on every forum and am fixing one error message to uncover another ruling things out as I go. I’ve looked at every troubleshooting possibility PSU up. Yet still no power so I have returned to the PSU as I suspect that it might be faulty. I have been on every forum about the error messages and am very familiar with the advice that drawing enough power might be an issue. i.e. this one selling reconditioned PSUs for $1000!!
"This is a power supply for Toyota AD850 and Toyota AD860 commercial embroidery machines. If you see the error "Sewing Motor Lock" It is likely that your power supply has failed. When you see the error message "Sewing Motor Lock" , this DOES NOT mean your sewing motor is frozen. It means the motor is not getting the correct voltage from the power supply in almost every case….. Before you buy this power supply, make sure your old power supply fuses are not blown. In some cases, blown fuses can occur inside your power supply."
Digging deeper than general forums about the error messages I have found out that the power supply uses these parts which I see can be replaced?
1 x cosel p300e-24 smps
1 x cosel p15e-5
(See diagram for positions)
I'd also expect its' fans to work on ignition?? I'm hugely cautions to go prodding about inside the box, no shocks from this but I'm told that they can take a longtime to discharge.
I've inspected the fuses (which is recommended) and they are fine and all the connections to the cable output are fine (no obstructions when a meter used across connections), the led on the cosel p15e-5 pcb lights up when plugged in (but I've yet to go deeper to inspect the larger cosel p300e-24 smps....BUT I predict that if there is an issue this might be where it is??).
...On learning about the bits inside the PSU box (felt like a breakthrough!) I recently unearthed these forum chats, BUT as I know very little about the language so I can't translate. However it seems like these people have had similar experience to me.
http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/threads/cosel-p300e-24.48006/
http://www.t-shirtforums.com/embroidery/t472890.html
I knowingly took as risk with this machine and would value some advice on the PSU. I'm happy to make some investment to fix its problems (working these machines cost up to £3000 second hand) but am also cautious to cut my losses if it is a dead loss. It’s been fun tinkering!
Any advice much appreciated.
Many thanks
Jules
07930874613
From: "Julia Devonshire" <julia.de...@gmail.com>
Date: 1 Dec 2015 16:04
Subject: Embriodery Machine PSU info and description of error.
To: "Marion Catlin" <marion...@btconnect.com>
Cc:
Hi Marion
Thanks for putting word out to your contacts. I' every keen to get along tomorrow night with my PSU box. For now you mentioned that Toby was keen to know more about the box... Here goes!
The embroidery machine: Toyota Expert ESP 850 (c. 1992?)
The PSU: Aisin seki co. ltd (see: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Suppy-for-Toyota-Commercial-Embroidery-Machine-AD850-860-/351307065368)
(inside, 1 x cosel p300e-24 smps + 1 x cosel p15e-5)
Background: On arrival when swicthed on the machine's Control box read "Motor Lock Error" which was commonly assigned to machines that had issues with drawing power and those that had CPU/ motherboard issues. Until I eliminate that power might be the issue I am unable to deduce that it is a CPU issue, that if the power issue isn't due to a malfunctioning CPU but due to an error with the PSU. I have has some tinkering (cleaned connections on the machine itself and insopcted connections etc) and now overcome the "Motor Lock Error" and it now reads "Needle Case Position Error" so perhpas because the motors aren't engaging it is stuck?? Anyway that's one idea....
What I do know: The PSU draws some power to control box (the part with the operation buttons and LCD screen, which is also the part that tells you of errors)- but the machine itself is dead. (Nothing happens when it's switched on- motor doesn't spin and nothing engages as I might expect). I have been on every forum and am fixing one error message to uncover another ruling things out as I go. I’ve looked at every troubleshooting possibility PSU up. Yet still no power so I have returned to the PSU as I suspect that it might be faulty. I have been on every forum about the error messages and am very familiar with the advice that drawing enough power might be an issue. i.e. this one selling reconditioned PSUs for $1000!!
"This is a power supply for Toyota AD850 and Toyota AD860 commercial embroidery machines. If you see the error "Sewing Motor Lock" It is likely that your power supply has failed. When you see the error message "Sewing Motor Lock" , this DOES NOT mean your sewing motor is frozen. It means the motor is not getting the correct voltage from the power supply in almost every case….. Before you buy this power supply, make sure your old power supply fuses are not blown. In some cases, blown fuses can occur inside your power supply."
Digging deeper than general forums about the error messages I have found out that the power supply uses these parts which I see can be replaced?
1 x cosel p300e-24 smps
1 x cosel p15e-5
(See diagram for positions)
I'd also expect its' fans to work on ignition?? I'm hugely cautions to go prodding about inside the box, no shocks from this but I'm told that they can take a longtime to discharge.
I've inspected the fuses (which is recommended) and they are fine and all the connections to the cable output are fine (no obstructions when a meter used across connections), the led on the cosel p15e-5 pcb lights up when plugged in (but I've yet to go deeper to inspect the larger cosel p300e-24 smps....BUT I predict that if there is an issue this might be where it is??).
...On learning about the bits inside the PSU box (felt like a breakthrough!) I recently unearthed these forum chats, BUT as I know very little about the language so I can't translate. However it seems like these people have had similar experience to me.
http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/threads/cosel-p300e-24.48006/
http://www.t-shirtforums.com/embroidery/t472890.html
I knowingly took as risk with this machine and would value some advice on the PSU. I'm happy to make some investment to fix its problems (working these machines cost up to £3000 second hand) but am also cautious to cut my losses if it is a dead loss. It’s been fun tinkering!
Any advice much appreciated.
Many thanks
Jules
07930874613
Toby Catlin
Dec 1, 2015, 12:32:46 PM12/1/15
to Norwich Hackspace
Just for the record I am not keen this looks like a nightmare ;) and I have very limited experience with main electrics. However I hate to see a broken machine and have some google fu. I cannot solve this, but might be able to help narrow down where the problem lies. Karl might be able to as he has more experience in this area.
First off from what I see there is nothing special about these power supplies that warrant them costing $1000. All they do is step down mains voltage to something more usable. These are in most consumer electronics and are dirt cheap. I would guess this cosel one is so expensive because it is expected to run continuously for decades.
You can buy something like this for about £25
First thing to do is check the output voltages on that white plastic plug. You can do this with a multimeter without opening the box and without any danger. 5v & 24V DC are not dangerous at these current levels. If the 24v output is borked then it is likely one or more capacitors has blown or you have some fault solder joints. This is repairable by someone who knows what they are doing and should not cost more than £100 or so. Alternatively just buy a unbranded replacement from China. I have a spare 24v PSU with the CNC machine waiting to be fitted and would be happy for it to be used for testing purposes.
t
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Marion Catlin
Dec 1, 2015, 12:45:38 PM12/1/15
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I dont suppose the one i bought for Tank is any use?
Marion Catlin
Dec 1, 2015, 12:48:18 PM12/1/15
to norwich-...@googlegroups.com
As Toby says it could be a nightmare. I suggest that whatever happens we establish a principle of expecting donations for projects such as these a la Mens Shed. Jules is not well off but should be prepared to chip in i think
On 1 Dec 2015 17:32, "Toby Catlin" <to...@korfball.com> wrote:
Toby Catlin
Dec 1, 2015, 12:58:14 PM12/1/15
to Norwich Hackspace
My position is that I will only get involved if it is fun. Hackspace for me is leisure time and I don't have a huge amount of it.
If we fix the machine then I would expect some recompense, minimally get some embroidery done, or a donation or she becomes a member. We are definitely not a repair shop.
t
Karl Ablitt
Dec 1, 2015, 4:54:36 PM12/1/15
to norwich-...@googlegroups.com
There are also a couple of untested industrial 24v supplies in our cupboard at the shed. I'm afraid I won't be able to make it tomorrow, Louise has work and I have no baby sitter, Toby do you have your keys? Or is it better to re-schedule?
Karl Ablitt
Dec 1, 2015, 4:55:01 PM12/1/15
to norwich-...@googlegroups.com
I agree with Toby!
Marion Catlin
Dec 1, 2015, 5:36:26 PM12/1/15
to norwich-...@googlegroups.com
Is there anyone that can cover tomorrow evening if Karl can't be there?
Karl did you get Matt's contact details?
Marion
Marion Catlin BA(Hons) Design PGDip Cultural Planning AD:UK Senior Fellow
Free range cultural development and communications professional
Free range cultural development and communications professional
specialising in arts, culture and heritage
Director The Shift Norwich: Culture Shift, Design Shift and Digital Shift
Developing and promoting Norwich as a city of culture
Arts Development UK East Regional Co-ordinator
Trustee Norwich Puppet Theatre and Chair C>Media
Steering group member Sistema in Norwich
Convenor: Music in Norwich and Art in Norwich Forums
Co-director Norwich Fringe Festival
Founder member Norwich Hackspace and What Next? Norfolk
Telephone office 01603 765353 Mobile 07946 261651
LinkedIn Marion de Mello Catlin Skype marionecatlin
Twitter accounts marionofnorwich and norwichcultcity
LinkedIn Marion de Mello Catlin Skype marionecatlin
Twitter accounts marionofnorwich and norwichcultcity
Website: www.theshiftnorwich.org.uk
Karl Ablitt
Dec 1, 2015, 5:51:46 PM12/1/15
to norwich-...@googlegroups.com
I didn't get his details, no, he didn't attend last Wednesday, Dan did say he'd try get Matt's details for us, he may have forgotten though.
Marion Catlin
Dec 1, 2015, 6:06:00 PM12/1/15
to norwich-...@googlegroups.com
I'll try Andy again
Marion Catlin BA(Hons) Design PGDip Cultural Planning AD:UK Senior Fellow
Free range cultural development and communications professional
Free range cultural development and communications professional
specialising in arts, culture and heritage
Director The Shift Norwich: Culture Shift, Design Shift and Digital Shift
Developing and promoting Norwich as a city of culture
Arts Development UK East Regional Co-ordinator
Trustee Norwich Puppet Theatre and Chair C>Media
Steering group member Sistema in Norwich
Convenor: Music in Norwich and Art in Norwich Forums
Co-director Norwich Fringe Festival
Founder member Norwich Hackspace and What Next? Norfolk
Telephone office 01603 765353 Mobile 07946 261651
LinkedIn Marion de Mello Catlin Skype marionecatlin
Twitter accounts marionofnorwich and norwichcultcity
LinkedIn Marion de Mello Catlin Skype marionecatlin
Twitter accounts marionofnorwich and norwichcultcity
Website: www.theshiftnorwich.org.uk
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