Why spaces?
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Alex
Sep 23, 2008, 12:27:00 AM9/23/08
to ninerpad
Clark asked me to shed some light on ninerpad spaces, and I suspect
that this concept is not clear for most people. My bad. Terse
documentation and a user interface that still needs work are at work
here.
Why spaces, then. This may help.
In ninerpad...
1. notes are filed in folders. Typically, I create a folder for each
project, and a few extra folders for doodles, reference materials,
projects to be considered someday, and ticklers (things to move on in
a month, or two, or three). I use the top folder (HOME) as my INBOX
(In fact, I renamed it to that). I also have a folder for 1-step
actions named "1OFS".
2. new notes -- in my INBOX -- that are "to be done" are tagged (@work
@waiting @home etc.) before I file them into their corresponding
folders.
3. ninerpad's main form is a view on a note space. With this form, one
can create new notes, can browse the contents of the current note
space, and can drop notes from the current space.
4. ninerpad can populate a note space in one of 2 ways:
a. with the contents of a folder (accessed via the file browser)
b. with the results of a search operation (accessed via the Note
Finder).
5. each project and context has its corresponding mindset (where am I
at, where am I heading, what's next, what's the goal, etc.)
6. because I usually choose to focus on a few -- read, not all --
contexts and projects on any given day, and because interruptions are
the norm rather than the exception, I need to juggle between mindsets
-- metaphorically change hats -- often and throughout the day.
7. Flow _is_ all about rythm. Any deviations from average user_action-
software_response times interfere with flow. The need to switch
mindsets as smoothly as possible, hence with minimal impact on flow,
and while not losing my place in my current mindset, is imperative.
For this, I decided to add a special list, one that keeps track of
what I want to focus on today, independent of my filing and tagging
systems. Each item in that list corresponds to a mindset (hot
projects, contexts I will find myself in today). And I need to be able
switch between these mindsets in as few steps as possible.
8. Thus came the idea for multiple workspaces. Add a new space to the
list. Populate it. Add another. Populate that. Switch between them
with a tap. Add more as needed. And delete when no longer deemed hot
or current, without affecting your data and without having to refile
or retag that data.
I hope this helps more than it confuses.
Cheers
Alex
that this concept is not clear for most people. My bad. Terse
documentation and a user interface that still needs work are at work
here.
Why spaces, then. This may help.
In ninerpad...
1. notes are filed in folders. Typically, I create a folder for each
project, and a few extra folders for doodles, reference materials,
projects to be considered someday, and ticklers (things to move on in
a month, or two, or three). I use the top folder (HOME) as my INBOX
(In fact, I renamed it to that). I also have a folder for 1-step
actions named "1OFS".
2. new notes -- in my INBOX -- that are "to be done" are tagged (@work
@waiting @home etc.) before I file them into their corresponding
folders.
3. ninerpad's main form is a view on a note space. With this form, one
can create new notes, can browse the contents of the current note
space, and can drop notes from the current space.
4. ninerpad can populate a note space in one of 2 ways:
a. with the contents of a folder (accessed via the file browser)
b. with the results of a search operation (accessed via the Note
Finder).
5. each project and context has its corresponding mindset (where am I
at, where am I heading, what's next, what's the goal, etc.)
6. because I usually choose to focus on a few -- read, not all --
contexts and projects on any given day, and because interruptions are
the norm rather than the exception, I need to juggle between mindsets
-- metaphorically change hats -- often and throughout the day.
7. Flow _is_ all about rythm. Any deviations from average user_action-
software_response times interfere with flow. The need to switch
mindsets as smoothly as possible, hence with minimal impact on flow,
and while not losing my place in my current mindset, is imperative.
For this, I decided to add a special list, one that keeps track of
what I want to focus on today, independent of my filing and tagging
systems. Each item in that list corresponds to a mindset (hot
projects, contexts I will find myself in today). And I need to be able
switch between these mindsets in as few steps as possible.
8. Thus came the idea for multiple workspaces. Add a new space to the
list. Populate it. Add another. Populate that. Switch between them
with a tap. Add more as needed. And delete when no longer deemed hot
or current, without affecting your data and without having to refile
or retag that data.
I hope this helps more than it confuses.
Cheers
Alex
Roger
Sep 23, 2008, 2:49:04 PM9/23/08
to ninerpad
Alex,
This is a great start in getting more of the GTD-like attributes of
the program out there. I was going to ask some questions myself as
soon as the next stable release was out, but you left a hook out there
for me to grab. Thans to Clark for asking the question too, since I
was getting bogged down in the graphics-focused area and wanted to use
this more for GTD task management - at least for now.
At the moment, the app has great collection capabilities and can
capture very quickly into the inbox/home folder. I tend to tag and
categorize at that point, where possible, although many would wait
till the appropriate review time to do that.
In GTD-spiel, it looks like you are using tags for context flags and
then use folders for individual projects with one left for your 1-off
actions (next actions?), The Spaces make a good way to filter down
quickly for a context you might find yourself in (pulled into a
meeting, phone call etc), and allow you to switch back to what you
were doing as soon as you return to your preferred state.
I guess the main thrust of the waiting questions (should I set up a
folder for them all ???) is the scope or size of the scope for your
folders/spaces.
I work with a number of different freelance clients and the number of
folders that I can see at one time (even with the favorites flag -
which does what really??) is smaller than the number of projects that
I want to keep track of. In addition, when I add one on, it just gets
pushed to the end, and I cannot really alpha-sort them or anything to
get there quicker.
Being graphically based, ninerpad is wonderful for free form entry,
but hitting that tiny palm down-arrow accurately is not always a first
time occurrence. Since I have a big screen (320x480) Palm, it would
be nice if the folder list would go all the way down; I know you turn
off the graffiti area in some circumstances and it would be nice to do
that when navigating and only turn it on again if I ask for a new
folder and need to name it.
The same comment is true of tags. They exist in the order entered or
edited, so if I change one, it moves to the end of the list and
sometimes off the end of the list with a down-arrow. It would be nice
to sort this list too, so things remain in the same pace for me to
locate optically. I have found myself hesitating from adding a new
context/tag since it will mean they all get out of order.
So back to the deep question - how can you make this part of the
interface a little more versatile?
Why, I hear me ask ? Well, I am looking at keeping the loop closed
for GTD and I can do collect/capture ok, then I can simple review and
work out next actions and tags and other stuff. But the problem comes
when I try to do a big picture review and I have to walk thru
everything, folder-by-folder and look at what it says and where it is
and what tags it has and then visualize this in my mind a little to
help me choose tasks appropriately. In other words, I have still not
learned to use it well enough that I can trust it to tell me what to
do given a specific context/circumstance.
Sometimes I would like to be able to see the big picture to see where
my time is required, rather than just what to do in the current
context; that makes me active rather than reactive. I am currently
looking at using the export to GIF, and a GIF viewer to look at the
items in thumbnail. Grfx Pro seems a good choice so far.
If I clear the inbox/Home and then select home, then Invert, I can
export all items in one fell swoop. Would be nice to have an export
all to save this, even with it exporting in the folder hierarchy that
is set up. Then I could browse directly by project. If you exported
as JPEG instead of GIF , the viewers would be built-in /free, but that
may be too much code - dont want to bloat.
As I said, this is still my daily manager app, so it is doing quite a
bit, but I have the feeling I am underusing it. wish I could work it
out more clearly, but this post helped clarify the thinking behind the
design and make s the whole thing a little more fascinating.
If you ever get the chance to do a writeup on how you - or anyone else
out there - are using this as a GTD action manager, with what sorts of
Spaces, folders and tags you are using it would make this a lot easier
to follow. Anyone who feels like they have the hang of this and want
t journal a couple of days of what they set up, enter, review, etc and
how - with appropriate sanitizing to avoid TMI, I would be very
interested.
Thanks for all the great work, Alex.
Roger
This is a great start in getting more of the GTD-like attributes of
the program out there. I was going to ask some questions myself as
soon as the next stable release was out, but you left a hook out there
for me to grab. Thans to Clark for asking the question too, since I
was getting bogged down in the graphics-focused area and wanted to use
this more for GTD task management - at least for now.
At the moment, the app has great collection capabilities and can
capture very quickly into the inbox/home folder. I tend to tag and
categorize at that point, where possible, although many would wait
till the appropriate review time to do that.
In GTD-spiel, it looks like you are using tags for context flags and
then use folders for individual projects with one left for your 1-off
actions (next actions?), The Spaces make a good way to filter down
quickly for a context you might find yourself in (pulled into a
meeting, phone call etc), and allow you to switch back to what you
were doing as soon as you return to your preferred state.
I guess the main thrust of the waiting questions (should I set up a
folder for them all ???) is the scope or size of the scope for your
folders/spaces.
I work with a number of different freelance clients and the number of
folders that I can see at one time (even with the favorites flag -
which does what really??) is smaller than the number of projects that
I want to keep track of. In addition, when I add one on, it just gets
pushed to the end, and I cannot really alpha-sort them or anything to
get there quicker.
Being graphically based, ninerpad is wonderful for free form entry,
but hitting that tiny palm down-arrow accurately is not always a first
time occurrence. Since I have a big screen (320x480) Palm, it would
be nice if the folder list would go all the way down; I know you turn
off the graffiti area in some circumstances and it would be nice to do
that when navigating and only turn it on again if I ask for a new
folder and need to name it.
The same comment is true of tags. They exist in the order entered or
edited, so if I change one, it moves to the end of the list and
sometimes off the end of the list with a down-arrow. It would be nice
to sort this list too, so things remain in the same pace for me to
locate optically. I have found myself hesitating from adding a new
context/tag since it will mean they all get out of order.
So back to the deep question - how can you make this part of the
interface a little more versatile?
Why, I hear me ask ? Well, I am looking at keeping the loop closed
for GTD and I can do collect/capture ok, then I can simple review and
work out next actions and tags and other stuff. But the problem comes
when I try to do a big picture review and I have to walk thru
everything, folder-by-folder and look at what it says and where it is
and what tags it has and then visualize this in my mind a little to
help me choose tasks appropriately. In other words, I have still not
learned to use it well enough that I can trust it to tell me what to
do given a specific context/circumstance.
Sometimes I would like to be able to see the big picture to see where
my time is required, rather than just what to do in the current
context; that makes me active rather than reactive. I am currently
looking at using the export to GIF, and a GIF viewer to look at the
items in thumbnail. Grfx Pro seems a good choice so far.
If I clear the inbox/Home and then select home, then Invert, I can
export all items in one fell swoop. Would be nice to have an export
all to save this, even with it exporting in the folder hierarchy that
is set up. Then I could browse directly by project. If you exported
as JPEG instead of GIF , the viewers would be built-in /free, but that
may be too much code - dont want to bloat.
As I said, this is still my daily manager app, so it is doing quite a
bit, but I have the feeling I am underusing it. wish I could work it
out more clearly, but this post helped clarify the thinking behind the
design and make s the whole thing a little more fascinating.
If you ever get the chance to do a writeup on how you - or anyone else
out there - are using this as a GTD action manager, with what sorts of
Spaces, folders and tags you are using it would make this a lot easier
to follow. Anyone who feels like they have the hang of this and want
t journal a couple of days of what they set up, enter, review, etc and
how - with appropriate sanitizing to avoid TMI, I would be very
interested.
Thanks for all the great work, Alex.
Roger
matt...@juno.com
Sep 23, 2008, 8:45:33 PM9/23/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
I am working way behind you guys. I am a creative person with some organizational skills. I have my own questions. I have been looking for the parameters of this app; the outer limits. How big a drawing can you make, what size can the app handle. Early on I approached this program to push its canvas size with a very large drawing. NinerPad took all I could give. But for example Leonardo would start to blink, go white until it could catch up. Moepaint just stopped opening up. The famed NinerPaint has a lot of buttons
The folder Idea is interesting, there are people I work for that put everything in a folder. But when I back up files to a DVD I often find that I can not get the file onto the DVD, but off load the folder, and I can get the contents on the DVD for back up purposes. Granted not organized well, but backed up nonetheless.
Knowing that folders must take up space, how many folders will fit on the software. I am on a T/X and it has about 100mb's of memory. Is that my limit? I like the folder idea, I am tempted to make folder after folder and just see.
Months ago Alex sent me an explanation of the canvas capabilities. I wouldn't want that kind of explanation. How big can a Palm App be. Where are you limits? I know here comes a technical answer that I could never understand.
As I said I am way behind most of the technical stuff, but, that my two cents worth.
Dan
____________________________________________________________
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Thea Hardy
Sep 23, 2008, 9:09:03 PM9/23/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
Roger, very useful comments. I have always appreciated the GTD
direction of this app. Like you, though, I would love to be able to do
a sort order that fits my needs, not how it now works. I want to be
able to cluster things in the order I am using, which may not be
alphabetical, either. I am still not as clear on using NinerPad as I
would like, and know I would use it better if I knew more about GTD
and as you say, directly about using NinerPad in a GTD manner.
direction of this app. Like you, though, I would love to be able to do
a sort order that fits my needs, not how it now works. I want to be
able to cluster things in the order I am using, which may not be
alphabetical, either. I am still not as clear on using NinerPad as I
would like, and know I would use it better if I knew more about GTD
and as you say, directly about using NinerPad in a GTD manner.
Perhaps because of Photoshop and other such apps, I think of spaces as
workspaces, so that part makes sense, but I am still a little vague on
just how they work in NinerPad. Too much time spent drawing. But
upcoming, I am going to be involved in a lot of writing projects and I
am going to want to be able to use NinerPad to sort and organize those
projects along with regular client work. I want to learn to use it
better, and I think it would not hurt to have some basic spiel on GTD
and how it works with NinerPad available.
But again, I really agree on the ability to sort in a free-form way-
it's one thing that keeps me from using this (or some other apps) as
much as I otherwise would.
Thanks for your post, Roger. It was illuminating.
Thea
Roger
Sep 23, 2008, 9:25:25 PM9/23/08
to ninerpad
I know what you mean about photoshop spaces. I guess we need to think
of them as blinders (like a cart-horse wears) that only allow you to
see a small selection of things.
Unfortunately, the nature of GTD is such that if you set up the
contexts and/or projects and other categorizations wrong, you
eventually run into a brick wall and either give up on the app and go
play "find the newest GTD app" or have to re-categorize your 150 item
list of tasks.
I still only keep about 20-30 actions in ninerpad, as that is as many
as I can safely review, so I have others stored in other palm apps in
simple manners.
I am glad there is interest in the GTD side, as I am very much the
right-brained type and most of the other apps out there are PC/Mac/Web
based and that is just not portable, without an expensive cellphone
data plan. The instant on aspect of the Palm makes it so convenient
compared to any other gadget I have.
We will see whether we can get on the enormous roadmap with this
ordering capability once China wakes up and Alex gets his email.
Cheers
Roger
of them as blinders (like a cart-horse wears) that only allow you to
see a small selection of things.
Unfortunately, the nature of GTD is such that if you set up the
contexts and/or projects and other categorizations wrong, you
eventually run into a brick wall and either give up on the app and go
play "find the newest GTD app" or have to re-categorize your 150 item
list of tasks.
I still only keep about 20-30 actions in ninerpad, as that is as many
as I can safely review, so I have others stored in other palm apps in
simple manners.
I am glad there is interest in the GTD side, as I am very much the
right-brained type and most of the other apps out there are PC/Mac/Web
based and that is just not portable, without an expensive cellphone
data plan. The instant on aspect of the Palm makes it so convenient
compared to any other gadget I have.
We will see whether we can get on the enormous roadmap with this
ordering capability once China wakes up and Alex gets his email.
Cheers
Roger
Thea Hardy
Sep 23, 2008, 9:42:09 PM9/23/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
My favorite Palm drawing app is HandPainter as far as use and options
go - but you can only make this tiny little drawing - the half-size
thing. So really it's pretty useless. But I like the text capability,
the spray paintbrush, the brush selections, shapes - filled or
unfilled, selection box (tho it has glitches). The guy in Israel who
writes it had twin daughters and I don't know if we will see anything
from him on it again. But I would not complain if NinerPaint had some
of those features plus a larger canvas... But we are talking about
NinerPad here, so...
go - but you can only make this tiny little drawing - the half-size
thing. So really it's pretty useless. But I like the text capability,
the spray paintbrush, the brush selections, shapes - filled or
unfilled, selection box (tho it has glitches). The guy in Israel who
writes it had twin daughters and I don't know if we will see anything
from him on it again. But I would not complain if NinerPaint had some
of those features plus a larger canvas... But we are talking about
NinerPad here, so...
Thea
Roger
Sep 23, 2008, 9:42:21 PM9/23/08
to ninerpad
Dan,
I believe that the FAQ docs talk about the canvas being extensible to
several thousand screens - theoretically. If you want to get an idea
of what is being used up, take a look at what you have already in
place on the palm (i.e. how many "screens") and then look at how much
space the appropriate ninerpad database is using up in the palm. To
do the latter, go to the Palm Launcher app, menu->App->Info and look
at the size of the NinerPadTileDB. you will see that it is really
quite small for the amount of TX memory, so you are fine to keep
sketching in detail.
I would be interested in the tech details due to my developer side,
but Alex seems to have built an efficient file-system-like dynamic
database here that makes the whole thing wonderfully versatile,
without losing speed. I am in awe of how he put it together, even
though I would love to take the code and tinker a bit for 'my changes/
way of doing things' - like most users.
One thing that sets this app apart from so many others, is that it has
a robust heritage in NinerJot and NinerPaint yet Alex had the presence
to branch off from those apps to create the fuller featured action
management app and has a laid out vision for getting there. Anything
I can do to influence the roadmap is good, but it is still Alex's app
to built.
Roger
> Are you a homeowner in debt? Need cash now? Click here to refinance your mortgage.http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m3eQpBJxq8PzKFil36...
I believe that the FAQ docs talk about the canvas being extensible to
several thousand screens - theoretically. If you want to get an idea
of what is being used up, take a look at what you have already in
place on the palm (i.e. how many "screens") and then look at how much
space the appropriate ninerpad database is using up in the palm. To
do the latter, go to the Palm Launcher app, menu->App->Info and look
at the size of the NinerPadTileDB. you will see that it is really
quite small for the amount of TX memory, so you are fine to keep
sketching in detail.
I would be interested in the tech details due to my developer side,
but Alex seems to have built an efficient file-system-like dynamic
database here that makes the whole thing wonderfully versatile,
without losing speed. I am in awe of how he put it together, even
though I would love to take the code and tinker a bit for 'my changes/
way of doing things' - like most users.
One thing that sets this app apart from so many others, is that it has
a robust heritage in NinerJot and NinerPaint yet Alex had the presence
to branch off from those apps to create the fuller featured action
management app and has a laid out vision for getting there. Anything
I can do to influence the roadmap is good, but it is still Alex's app
to built.
Roger
matt...@juno.com
Sep 23, 2008, 9:55:38 PM9/23/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
Can you organize/sort by moving or filing the notes to another sub folder?
Lets say you are working on a project in the "in box"... finish it or want to organize... move the notes in order to a new folder.
Wouldn't that work?
Lets say you are working on a project in the "in box"... finish it or want to organize... move the notes in order to a new folder.
Wouldn't that work?
DM
____________________________________________________________
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matt...@juno.com
Sep 23, 2008, 10:05:24 PM9/23/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
I still might not have a clear picture of what you guys are after, but I just tried this filing 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, to another folder and it did work.
I could be over simplifying and not understanding.
DM
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Roger
Sep 23, 2008, 10:28:12 PM9/23/08
to ninerpad
Dan, you can move things to another folder to archive, but the nature
of the design is GTD based, whose philosophy is more about organizing
things in the right place and then running off the actions quickly by
selecting the ones you can do at the present moment/circumstance.
Gross oversimplification, and I apologize if I that did not come out
right.
The inbox is normally meant as collection land. When you have a
thought, you throw it in the in tray of your system. I dont think GTD
is meant to be big on archiving completed work , but I could be wrong.
Periodically (daily, weekly, whatever suits you best) you go through
the inbox and assign context tags to the items and file them in the
project folders till your inbox is clear. The tags allow you to flag
something according to the context needed (resource/person/place/mood/
energy level/whatever). So when you happen to be in that particular
state (i.e. @home, At the PC, At the store) you look at the list with
that tag and then can do whatever is in the list.
Alex uses the folders to separate projects but my questioning comes
from the purer style of GTD that considers any task that takes more
than one step to be a project. If that is the case, then the list of
folders required would be HUGE and very unmanageable. In my case I
use the folders for Clients - both external billable clients and also
internal clients like family, spouse, self, house, school.
One of the most frustrating things about GTD is that it is very much a
set of guidelines that are never fully fleshed out as each person
works in a different manner, however this leads to confusion on how to
implement it and some enormous flame wars, and associated long
discussions. I love trying to work out how to implement the
guidelines in an app, but have always found it best to listen to how
others are using it and in this case the author himself has his own
vision. If I can just work out how Alex uses it , I might be able to
get there myself.
there is no one right way of doing it but many, many wrong ways, but
each person takes their own path with GTD and hopefully we can share
what seems to work and what frustrates us and I know from reaing the
threads here that Alex listens very actively, so we should get better
at it over time.
Dan, Sorry if I went overboard and addressed the wrong part of your
question. Pleas ejust ignore this if so.
Thanks
Roger
> Click here to find old friends, lovers or family.http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3oCe363uNR9LvW6fOfC...
of the design is GTD based, whose philosophy is more about organizing
things in the right place and then running off the actions quickly by
selecting the ones you can do at the present moment/circumstance.
Gross oversimplification, and I apologize if I that did not come out
right.
The inbox is normally meant as collection land. When you have a
thought, you throw it in the in tray of your system. I dont think GTD
is meant to be big on archiving completed work , but I could be wrong.
Periodically (daily, weekly, whatever suits you best) you go through
the inbox and assign context tags to the items and file them in the
project folders till your inbox is clear. The tags allow you to flag
something according to the context needed (resource/person/place/mood/
energy level/whatever). So when you happen to be in that particular
state (i.e. @home, At the PC, At the store) you look at the list with
that tag and then can do whatever is in the list.
Alex uses the folders to separate projects but my questioning comes
from the purer style of GTD that considers any task that takes more
than one step to be a project. If that is the case, then the list of
folders required would be HUGE and very unmanageable. In my case I
use the folders for Clients - both external billable clients and also
internal clients like family, spouse, self, house, school.
One of the most frustrating things about GTD is that it is very much a
set of guidelines that are never fully fleshed out as each person
works in a different manner, however this leads to confusion on how to
implement it and some enormous flame wars, and associated long
discussions. I love trying to work out how to implement the
guidelines in an app, but have always found it best to listen to how
others are using it and in this case the author himself has his own
vision. If I can just work out how Alex uses it , I might be able to
get there myself.
there is no one right way of doing it but many, many wrong ways, but
each person takes their own path with GTD and hopefully we can share
what seems to work and what frustrates us and I know from reaing the
threads here that Alex listens very actively, so we should get better
at it over time.
Dan, Sorry if I went overboard and addressed the wrong part of your
question. Pleas ejust ignore this if so.
Thanks
Roger
Thea Hardy
Sep 23, 2008, 11:20:47 PM9/23/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
Again, very helpful, Roger!
Thanks,
Thea
newpalpadfoot
Sep 24, 2008, 9:42:41 PM9/24/08
to ninerpad
As a heavy palm user I have been trying to find something that will
implement my somewhat bastardized GTD philosophy in an easy,
streamlined fashion. Which NPad seems to almost there. I am not a
true, GTD Heavy hitter in that I don't practice it to its purest form.
I have, however spent a small fortune on programs that other people
use to implement GTD (Bonsai, ShadowPlan, Memoleaf and NoteStudio) and
always end up with nothing. Each system seemed to be more linear in
its implementation which makes sense to me. Now I find NPad and really
like the idea of the INBOX , the tags and the folders. The problem
arrive for me when I create a note. I can tag it which is great and I
can assign it to a folder. But if I want to open a folder I naturally
want to tap on the cloud (spaces) and then open up a folder for INBOX.
It's just a little confusing for me to know where I am at any moment.
When I think of spaces, I think of physical spaces like "contexts"
@home @computer etc. It would help me if there was a way to display
the path like /Home/@computer or ProjectA/Notes/@computer.
I hope I'm not blathering on and not making sense here. Also, When I
finish a task I want it deleted. do you think it would help if there
was a delete note button or shortcut? I keep looking at the hide
button and want it to delete the note.
Dazed and confused but trying to get a handle on this.
Clark
implement my somewhat bastardized GTD philosophy in an easy,
streamlined fashion. Which NPad seems to almost there. I am not a
true, GTD Heavy hitter in that I don't practice it to its purest form.
I have, however spent a small fortune on programs that other people
use to implement GTD (Bonsai, ShadowPlan, Memoleaf and NoteStudio) and
always end up with nothing. Each system seemed to be more linear in
its implementation which makes sense to me. Now I find NPad and really
like the idea of the INBOX , the tags and the folders. The problem
arrive for me when I create a note. I can tag it which is great and I
can assign it to a folder. But if I want to open a folder I naturally
want to tap on the cloud (spaces) and then open up a folder for INBOX.
It's just a little confusing for me to know where I am at any moment.
When I think of spaces, I think of physical spaces like "contexts"
@home @computer etc. It would help me if there was a way to display
the path like /Home/@computer or ProjectA/Notes/@computer.
I hope I'm not blathering on and not making sense here. Also, When I
finish a task I want it deleted. do you think it would help if there
was a delete note button or shortcut? I keep looking at the hide
button and want it to delete the note.
Dazed and confused but trying to get a handle on this.
Clark
Alex
Sep 24, 2008, 9:57:09 PM9/24/08
to ninerpad
Hi everyone
I was away these past 24 hours, taking time off to drive my GF's
grandparents (83rd bday) out of town to visit teapot making country. I
came back last night to find all your comments on spaces, ninerpad,
art, GTD, and life in general.
This is great, but <gulp> I see there is a lot I need to read,
consider, and discuss, while at the same time taking care of my day
job, and life, and wrapping up 1.1R3 for another short round of tests.
I'm not whining. :)
So bear with me as I take this one step at a time.
Thanks
Alex
I was away these past 24 hours, taking time off to drive my GF's
grandparents (83rd bday) out of town to visit teapot making country. I
came back last night to find all your comments on spaces, ninerpad,
art, GTD, and life in general.
This is great, but <gulp> I see there is a lot I need to read,
consider, and discuss, while at the same time taking care of my day
job, and life, and wrapping up 1.1R3 for another short round of tests.
I'm not whining. :)
So bear with me as I take this one step at a time.
Thanks
Alex
matt...@juno.com
Sep 24, 2008, 10:03:01 PM9/24/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
Maybe like a family tree?
DM
____________________________________________________________
Click for free info on online doctorate degrees and make up to $250k/ year.
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matt...@juno.com
Sep 24, 2008, 10:08:13 PM9/24/08
to ninerpa...@googlegroups.com
Life.
These are honorable things. I am with Mom and Pop, and Dad has Alzheimer's.
These are the best years.
DM
____________________________________________________________
Click here to find the perfect picture with our powerful photo search features.
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newpalpadfoot
Sep 24, 2008, 10:26:45 PM9/24/08
to ninerpad
One step at a time is fine with me. At least there is discussion and
people who don't bash each other because they disagree. We all want
this to be a great piece of software. Heaven knows it's been a long
time since there was anything Palm related to cheer about. :)
people who don't bash each other because they disagree. We all want
this to be a great piece of software. Heaven knows it's been a long
time since there was anything Palm related to cheer about. :)
Alex
Sep 24, 2008, 11:06:29 PM9/24/08
to ninerpad
Hi again Clark
To open a folder, you should tap on the large white area at the top
center of the main form. It sits to the left of the small cloud button
and blue backgrounds. By default, it says "HOME", or "INBOX" when you
first launch NPad.
Let's call it the View Settings Trigger.
Tapping on that will launch a form with which you can either:
1. select a favorite search (runs a previously saved search) or folder
(opens a favorite folder)
2. open a folder to browse the folder hierarchy, add folders, set
folders as favorites (will be added to #1)
3. find notes that match clauses and associated tags, save that search
to favorites (#1)
You may already know this. But I know that the UI for this is not self-
evident (why should you know that tapping on a big white area should
launch a popup? my bad, again; UI still not considered final; things
_will_ come), and your post would indicate that this may not be clear.
| It's just a little confusing for me to know where I am at any
moment.
If you are viewing the contents of a folder, the View Settings Trigger
will be named after it. If you are browsing found notes and the search
was saved to favorites, it will reflect that saved search's name. If
the search was not saved, then it will show the names of these tags...
a. in blue, for a "tagged with all selected tags" clause
b. in green, for a "tagged with one ore more selected tags" clause
c. in red, for a "not tagged with any selected tags" clause
Full path: yes, that's part of the plan. Needs somehow to become
clearer where one is in the folder hierarchy, or what search
parameters were used, exactly. Am toying with the idea of:
1. for finding notes, a google-like UI: search box on top, results
overview (all note thumbnails visible) or detailed view (one note at a
time, i.e., the current scheme) below
2. for viewing folder contents, a path field on top, and, below, the
same as for #1 (thumbnails or one note at a time)
But screen space is at a premium. Balancing screen space to provide
information on content (hand-drawn) and GTD mindset (tags, location,
reminders) has been the challenge since day one, many months ago.
| When I think of spaces, I think of physical spaces like "contexts"
| @home @computer etc. It would help me if there was a way to display
| the path like /Home/@computer or ProjectA/Notes/@computer.
|
Okay I think I see. You file by contexts. I don't, but my way may be
less efficient than yours. In fact, it takes fewer taps to (re)file to
a favorite folder than it does to re-tag an item. But if the folder is
not flagged as a favorite, it will take a lot more tapping if you have
a deeply nested folder hierarchy.
But okay for full path info. I will add that to the queue.
| Also, When I
| finish a task I want it deleted. do you think it would help if there
| was a delete note button or shortcut? I keep looking at the hide
| button and want it to delete the note.
The hide button only drops a note from your current note set. It does
not delete it, indeed. But there is a menu for that. Tap on the time
and date segment (yellow background, top screen), and select the Note
> Delete menu item.
I hope this helps. And yes, things will change, once I get 1.1R3 out
the door.
Alex
To open a folder, you should tap on the large white area at the top
center of the main form. It sits to the left of the small cloud button
and blue backgrounds. By default, it says "HOME", or "INBOX" when you
first launch NPad.
Let's call it the View Settings Trigger.
Tapping on that will launch a form with which you can either:
1. select a favorite search (runs a previously saved search) or folder
(opens a favorite folder)
2. open a folder to browse the folder hierarchy, add folders, set
folders as favorites (will be added to #1)
3. find notes that match clauses and associated tags, save that search
to favorites (#1)
You may already know this. But I know that the UI for this is not self-
evident (why should you know that tapping on a big white area should
launch a popup? my bad, again; UI still not considered final; things
_will_ come), and your post would indicate that this may not be clear.
| It's just a little confusing for me to know where I am at any
moment.
will be named after it. If you are browsing found notes and the search
was saved to favorites, it will reflect that saved search's name. If
the search was not saved, then it will show the names of these tags...
a. in blue, for a "tagged with all selected tags" clause
b. in green, for a "tagged with one ore more selected tags" clause
c. in red, for a "not tagged with any selected tags" clause
Full path: yes, that's part of the plan. Needs somehow to become
clearer where one is in the folder hierarchy, or what search
parameters were used, exactly. Am toying with the idea of:
1. for finding notes, a google-like UI: search box on top, results
overview (all note thumbnails visible) or detailed view (one note at a
time, i.e., the current scheme) below
2. for viewing folder contents, a path field on top, and, below, the
same as for #1 (thumbnails or one note at a time)
But screen space is at a premium. Balancing screen space to provide
information on content (hand-drawn) and GTD mindset (tags, location,
reminders) has been the challenge since day one, many months ago.
| When I think of spaces, I think of physical spaces like "contexts"
| @home @computer etc. It would help me if there was a way to display
| the path like /Home/@computer or ProjectA/Notes/@computer.
|
less efficient than yours. In fact, it takes fewer taps to (re)file to
a favorite folder than it does to re-tag an item. But if the folder is
not flagged as a favorite, it will take a lot more tapping if you have
a deeply nested folder hierarchy.
But okay for full path info. I will add that to the queue.
| Also, When I
| finish a task I want it deleted. do you think it would help if there
| was a delete note button or shortcut? I keep looking at the hide
| button and want it to delete the note.
not delete it, indeed. But there is a menu for that. Tap on the time
and date segment (yellow background, top screen), and select the Note
> Delete menu item.
I hope this helps. And yes, things will change, once I get 1.1R3 out
the door.
Alex
newpalpadfoot
Sep 24, 2008, 11:49:09 PM9/24/08
to ninerpad
Thanks Alex,
I just going to stay away from folders for now. I can sort by tag
I just going to stay away from folders for now. I can sort by tag
Alex
Sep 25, 2008, 12:26:38 AM9/25/08
to ninerpad
Hi Roger
The reason why I named the folder for my one-action todos "1-off" is
because David Allen's chosen definition for "Next Actions" is that
these include one-action todos as well as todos associated with
multiple-action projects.
If I were to use such a name, it would probably be a named (favorite)
filter, one that would:
1. retrieve the contents of the 1-offs folder
2. add to #1 all notes tagged with a contextual tag (one prefixed with
an "@")
Spaces...
Right now, new spaces automatically target HOME (the root folder).
This will change. The following may be proposed after you tap on the
"Add New Space" button:
1. target HOME
2. duplicate current space
3. <your suggestions>
Also, am thinking of, like Safari and other browser apps, letting you
run a search or open a folder in a new space (in browser-speak: "Open
Link in New Tab").
Furthermore, the UI may need to change, thanks to a Palm OS limitation
(forms that are not full-screen width introduce screen refresh
complications). I may make it full screen and offer spaces in a
similar way to the tagging system (listed in sequence, as many as will
fit in a row, and tappable).
Folder selection...
For now, folders are sorted by creation date. I'd like to add a toggle
to sort them alphanumerically. I prefer not to go much further than
suggesting this for now, as I am toying with other folder hierarchy
visualization ideas and sorting schemes (e.g., tree view, last access
date, last modification date, content size, content tags size, 3D
navigation)
DIA support...
Okay for tagging, finding, and browsing forms to be expanded to full
screen when needed. Queued.
Tag ordering...
Okay I will fix this (most recently created tags on top) and add
alphanumeric sort as well.
Big picture review...
This is a tough one for me to expand on at this point. The way I use
ninerpad -- not necessarily the right way, and definitely not the only
one -- will affect my judgment as to how to best assist this universal
need. But I have an idea. Let me record and post a YouTube tutorial
demonstrating my usage of ninerpad. If you and others can do that too,
we'll have established a common frame of reference, something that
will let us discuss this at greater (and more accurate) length.
Note: perhaps tag usage visualization (e.g., a tag cloud) would help
spot demanding contexts (and even help spot inappropriate
classification schemes).
Note: and then a similar technique for folders
Export All...
You can already export all notes in a space. Selecting the current
space option in the Export form should do it. If any problems, let me
know. However, I have not offered an option to export by folder. Good
one. Queued.
JPEG exports...
You are right. It would not be easy. Third party JPEG libraries exist
for that but they do not support stitching of image tiles, the
fundamental image block of ninerpad. Without it, the unlimited canvas
feature would not have been.
Thanks again
Alex
The reason why I named the folder for my one-action todos "1-off" is
because David Allen's chosen definition for "Next Actions" is that
these include one-action todos as well as todos associated with
multiple-action projects.
If I were to use such a name, it would probably be a named (favorite)
filter, one that would:
1. retrieve the contents of the 1-offs folder
2. add to #1 all notes tagged with a contextual tag (one prefixed with
an "@")
Spaces...
Right now, new spaces automatically target HOME (the root folder).
This will change. The following may be proposed after you tap on the
"Add New Space" button:
1. target HOME
2. duplicate current space
3. <your suggestions>
Also, am thinking of, like Safari and other browser apps, letting you
run a search or open a folder in a new space (in browser-speak: "Open
Link in New Tab").
Furthermore, the UI may need to change, thanks to a Palm OS limitation
(forms that are not full-screen width introduce screen refresh
complications). I may make it full screen and offer spaces in a
similar way to the tagging system (listed in sequence, as many as will
fit in a row, and tappable).
Folder selection...
For now, folders are sorted by creation date. I'd like to add a toggle
to sort them alphanumerically. I prefer not to go much further than
suggesting this for now, as I am toying with other folder hierarchy
visualization ideas and sorting schemes (e.g., tree view, last access
date, last modification date, content size, content tags size, 3D
navigation)
DIA support...
Okay for tagging, finding, and browsing forms to be expanded to full
screen when needed. Queued.
Tag ordering...
Okay I will fix this (most recently created tags on top) and add
alphanumeric sort as well.
Big picture review...
This is a tough one for me to expand on at this point. The way I use
ninerpad -- not necessarily the right way, and definitely not the only
one -- will affect my judgment as to how to best assist this universal
need. But I have an idea. Let me record and post a YouTube tutorial
demonstrating my usage of ninerpad. If you and others can do that too,
we'll have established a common frame of reference, something that
will let us discuss this at greater (and more accurate) length.
Note: perhaps tag usage visualization (e.g., a tag cloud) would help
spot demanding contexts (and even help spot inappropriate
classification schemes).
Note: and then a similar technique for folders
Export All...
You can already export all notes in a space. Selecting the current
space option in the Export form should do it. If any problems, let me
know. However, I have not offered an option to export by folder. Good
one. Queued.
JPEG exports...
You are right. It would not be easy. Third party JPEG libraries exist
for that but they do not support stitching of image tiles, the
fundamental image block of ninerpad. Without it, the unlimited canvas
feature would not have been.
Thanks again
Alex
Alex
Sep 25, 2008, 12:59:05 AM9/25/08
to ninerpad
Hi Dan
Folders...
Technically, you can create up to 65000+ folders. But you are likely
to run out of note space before that (see my next post, answering some
of Roger's technical questions for more info).
Alex
> Are you a homeowner in debt? Need cash now? Click here to refinance your mortgage.http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m3eQpBJxq8PzKFil36...
Folders...
Technically, you can create up to 65000+ folders. But you are likely
to run out of note space before that (see my next post, answering some
of Roger's technical questions for more info).
Alex
Alex
Sep 25, 2008, 1:04:26 AM9/25/08
to ninerpad
Hi Thea
Another good one. And free-form sorting about to be added to the
queue.
:)
A.
Another good one. And free-form sorting about to be added to the
queue.
:)
A.
Alex
Sep 25, 2008, 1:26:17 AM9/25/08
to ninerpad
Notes are split into 160*160 tiles. Empty (nothing drawn within) tiles
are not stored. The others, when off-screen, are compressed to save
storage space. So loading and saving is fast (only changed tiles are
re-compressed and written to storage). I have restricted note size to
a maximum of 100 tiles (100 by 1, or 1 by 100, or 31 by 31, etc).
Folders, tags, favorites, and spaces each reside in their
corresponding dbs.
All records contain the IDs of relevant partners.
| I would love to take the code and tinker a bit for 'my changes
Alex
are not stored. The others, when off-screen, are compressed to save
storage space. So loading and saving is fast (only changed tiles are
re-compressed and written to storage). I have restricted note size to
a maximum of 100 tiles (100 by 1, or 1 by 100, or 31 by 31, etc).
Folders, tags, favorites, and spaces each reside in their
corresponding dbs.
All records contain the IDs of relevant partners.
| I would love to take the code and tinker a bit for 'my changes
| way of doing things' - like most users.
|
Plug-in support, scripting, or macros?
|
Alex
Alex
Sep 25, 2008, 1:28:27 AM9/25/08
to ninerpad
You are right. Notes can be filed in any folder and at any time. What
you can't yet do is to move folders to another location.
Alex
> Hit it out of the park with a new bat. Click now!http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3n5YOvTPYWIepqxHGVK...
you can't yet do is to move folders to another location.
Alex
Alex
Sep 25, 2008, 1:52:52 AM9/25/08
to ninerpad
Hi again+ Roger
| Alex uses the folders to separate projects but my questioning comes
| from the purer style of GTD that considers any task that takes more
| than one step to be a project. If that is the case, then the list
of
| folders required would be HUGE and very unmanageable. In my case I
| use the folders for Clients - both external billable clients and
also
| internal clients like family, spouse, self, house, school.
|
I agree. The more you organize (or code), the more difficult keeping
track (or debugging) becomes.
A large number (100+) of folders may not be difficult to create.
Moving them around, pending introduction of such a feature in
ninerpad, is impossible, making the system risky. I'll need to add
that.
Seeing the larger picture is almost impossible however, unless you
offer other visualization tools.
I am still not sure where this takes us, but I do remember GTD
mentioning a project list, a one-page list of all projects. Could it
be that a combination of:
1. Thea's requested freeform ordering of the folders list,
2. your requested alphanumeric sort
3. folder comments (more info about the project(s) it may contain)
4. folder tagging (HOT, DUE, WIP, etc)
would help see in one's review?
My concern, examplified...
Project A: Attend MIPCOM
Project B: Visit Family while in France
Upon review, I see that A and B are related (MIPCOM is held in
France). So, I create a folder named "PROJECT C: France Oct 2008" and
(new feature) move folders for A and B into C.
Later, I add this:
Project D: Sell stamp collection to famous French collector, Mrs. Elle
Timbré.
Naturally, I move D into C as well.
Problem: what if D needs a second trip to France, one that will take
place in Apr 2009? Where do I move the folder?
I do this on my Mac all the time, using folder aliases. But that
feature is missing from ninerpad. Would it really help, or only
complicate?
Cheers
Alex
| Alex uses the folders to separate projects but my questioning comes
| from the purer style of GTD that considers any task that takes more
| than one step to be a project. If that is the case, then the list
of
| folders required would be HUGE and very unmanageable. In my case I
| use the folders for Clients - both external billable clients and
also
| internal clients like family, spouse, self, house, school.
|
track (or debugging) becomes.
A large number (100+) of folders may not be difficult to create.
Moving them around, pending introduction of such a feature in
ninerpad, is impossible, making the system risky. I'll need to add
that.
Seeing the larger picture is almost impossible however, unless you
offer other visualization tools.
I am still not sure where this takes us, but I do remember GTD
mentioning a project list, a one-page list of all projects. Could it
be that a combination of:
1. Thea's requested freeform ordering of the folders list,
2. your requested alphanumeric sort
3. folder comments (more info about the project(s) it may contain)
4. folder tagging (HOT, DUE, WIP, etc)
would help see in one's review?
My concern, examplified...
Project A: Attend MIPCOM
Project B: Visit Family while in France
Upon review, I see that A and B are related (MIPCOM is held in
France). So, I create a folder named "PROJECT C: France Oct 2008" and
(new feature) move folders for A and B into C.
Later, I add this:
Project D: Sell stamp collection to famous French collector, Mrs. Elle
Timbré.
Naturally, I move D into C as well.
Problem: what if D needs a second trip to France, one that will take
place in Apr 2009? Where do I move the folder?
I do this on my Mac all the time, using folder aliases. But that
feature is missing from ninerpad. Would it really help, or only
complicate?
Cheers
Alex
Roger
Sep 27, 2008, 9:57:30 PM9/27/08
to ninerpad
Alex,
On the Projects side of things, I think we are both looking for a good
way to handle that in GTD in general as well as Ninerpad.
For thos ewho are not familiar with the depths of GTD, it defines
projects very narrowly as any tsk which takes more than one action.
so Alex using the 1OFS folder for all the single actions means that
every other taks he has in the system is by definition either a GTD
Project (more-than-one-action) or one of the special classes like
Someday/Maybe or Waiting-For status. The traditional project, in
contrast, is a set of tasks and actions that go together to meet a
goal of some kind - Arranging an anniversary party, Launching a
website, releasing another version of Ninerpad...
GTD allows for both, but tries to break the traditional project down
into phases, sub-phases etc or whatever grouping you need to call it.
It feels foreign and unnatural initially to get an idea (goal) like
"see a movie" and then break it down into th e component tasks (next
Actions) of Ask significant other if they want to see movie, pick
movie, verify movie with S.O., go to movie. but that is how GTD makes
you think and those items that are almost no-brainers are not normally
put into the system if they take less than a short time (couple of
minutes) to do. Still it is seen as a project if the whole thing
cannot be done at one time.
tech aside - - - Now that I know that Alex uses 160x160 tiles , I can
think about that a little more, as it tells me that he has chosen the
lowest screen resolution as tile size. The reason that is important
to me is that I thought about asking if the tiles could be treated
like excel cells on a spreadsheet. when you actually delete a cell,
it asks if you want to move the other cells up, or over as
appropriate.
With that in mind, I was wondering about having a "tile" at the top
with the main project goal laid out and under that would be tiles with
each action in the list in a form of graphical outline. As you
completed a task in the project, the completed task tile could be
cleared and the one below could be moved up - or the completed one
could be marked complete somehow and moved to the bottom if you
require a record of it.
The above might work in a hi-res screen where the 320x320 or 320x480
means 2x2 or 2x3 tiles to a screen, but not sure how it would work on
earlier simpler models. Hence my interest in how it actually worked.
/ tech aside
Going back to Folders and projects, there is still a need to group GTD-
projects into related groupings and the folders are still useful for
that.
i.e if I need to group Home stuff away from Work stuff, then Folders
make a good way of doing it. I still use the Tags for what context I
require and may need the tags to spell out a particular sug-grouping
(like the work project involved) rather than creating a folder for a
couple of items. Tags are a lot quicker.
Then using the Spaces (see title of this post series) for getting to
my various active tasks and projects becomes more important. This is
a skill I have not yet mastered :-)
The example you offer above is more based on organizationally grouped
projects than GTD projects. If it was GTD, the project goal would be
something like "go to France" and everything else would be an action
in there. GTD projects are not intuitive and I think that each of the
A B and D is really a separate GTD project and so your moving them to
sub folders makes sense but may be overly complicating.
One of the things that seems to be very subjecting in GTD is how much
to flesh out a project. Traditional project management is about
drilling down all the way till you have it estimated and thought
through to the nth degree. GTD is much more of a just-in-time (JIT)
style at one extreme:
1. You define the project - Go to MIPCOM
2. You define the first action (Next Action) needed to get there. -
visit MIPCOM website to get conference details (gotta have those
action words at the beginning :-)
3. As you complete the Next Action to check it off, you decide what
you need as the new Next Action. - iterate ad nauseam
As you can see that is playing pretty fast and loose if there are lead
time and dependencies that you have not thought of, and so most people
go for a variant somewhere in between fleshing the entire thing out
and fleshing out 1 action. For myself, being rather er um retentive
(?) I tend to err on the side of well fleshed out as I hate having to
think things through several time and waste time reinventing.
There are a great many outliners out there that are capable of helping
with that sort of thing on the palm, but the great strength of
Ninerpad to me, is the graphical nature and that is really hard to use
to create the outline.
It is not that I cannot create a basic outline one the canvas and move
the origin around to keep focus on the next action defined - I could
do that in either nested bullets or mindmap form - it is a desire to
change things around bey dragging and dropping objects (tiles?) rather
than erasing and rewriting.
I could blather on in this direction for a long time, but I hope this
is succinct enough to explain what I think I am looking for. This is
really why I am interested in how you and others are using this tool
to implement parts of GTD. to implement GTD fully is an awful lot of
work, due to these little semantic quirks of taking a word like
project that is already in major use and restricing its use.
Enjoy your France trip, next month.
Roger
On the Projects side of things, I think we are both looking for a good
way to handle that in GTD in general as well as Ninerpad.
For thos ewho are not familiar with the depths of GTD, it defines
projects very narrowly as any tsk which takes more than one action.
so Alex using the 1OFS folder for all the single actions means that
every other taks he has in the system is by definition either a GTD
Project (more-than-one-action) or one of the special classes like
Someday/Maybe or Waiting-For status. The traditional project, in
contrast, is a set of tasks and actions that go together to meet a
goal of some kind - Arranging an anniversary party, Launching a
website, releasing another version of Ninerpad...
GTD allows for both, but tries to break the traditional project down
into phases, sub-phases etc or whatever grouping you need to call it.
It feels foreign and unnatural initially to get an idea (goal) like
"see a movie" and then break it down into th e component tasks (next
Actions) of Ask significant other if they want to see movie, pick
movie, verify movie with S.O., go to movie. but that is how GTD makes
you think and those items that are almost no-brainers are not normally
put into the system if they take less than a short time (couple of
minutes) to do. Still it is seen as a project if the whole thing
cannot be done at one time.
tech aside - - - Now that I know that Alex uses 160x160 tiles , I can
think about that a little more, as it tells me that he has chosen the
lowest screen resolution as tile size. The reason that is important
to me is that I thought about asking if the tiles could be treated
like excel cells on a spreadsheet. when you actually delete a cell,
it asks if you want to move the other cells up, or over as
appropriate.
With that in mind, I was wondering about having a "tile" at the top
with the main project goal laid out and under that would be tiles with
each action in the list in a form of graphical outline. As you
completed a task in the project, the completed task tile could be
cleared and the one below could be moved up - or the completed one
could be marked complete somehow and moved to the bottom if you
require a record of it.
The above might work in a hi-res screen where the 320x320 or 320x480
means 2x2 or 2x3 tiles to a screen, but not sure how it would work on
earlier simpler models. Hence my interest in how it actually worked.
/ tech aside
Going back to Folders and projects, there is still a need to group GTD-
projects into related groupings and the folders are still useful for
that.
i.e if I need to group Home stuff away from Work stuff, then Folders
make a good way of doing it. I still use the Tags for what context I
require and may need the tags to spell out a particular sug-grouping
(like the work project involved) rather than creating a folder for a
couple of items. Tags are a lot quicker.
Then using the Spaces (see title of this post series) for getting to
my various active tasks and projects becomes more important. This is
a skill I have not yet mastered :-)
The example you offer above is more based on organizationally grouped
projects than GTD projects. If it was GTD, the project goal would be
something like "go to France" and everything else would be an action
in there. GTD projects are not intuitive and I think that each of the
A B and D is really a separate GTD project and so your moving them to
sub folders makes sense but may be overly complicating.
One of the things that seems to be very subjecting in GTD is how much
to flesh out a project. Traditional project management is about
drilling down all the way till you have it estimated and thought
through to the nth degree. GTD is much more of a just-in-time (JIT)
style at one extreme:
1. You define the project - Go to MIPCOM
2. You define the first action (Next Action) needed to get there. -
visit MIPCOM website to get conference details (gotta have those
action words at the beginning :-)
3. As you complete the Next Action to check it off, you decide what
you need as the new Next Action. - iterate ad nauseam
As you can see that is playing pretty fast and loose if there are lead
time and dependencies that you have not thought of, and so most people
go for a variant somewhere in between fleshing the entire thing out
and fleshing out 1 action. For myself, being rather er um retentive
(?) I tend to err on the side of well fleshed out as I hate having to
think things through several time and waste time reinventing.
There are a great many outliners out there that are capable of helping
with that sort of thing on the palm, but the great strength of
Ninerpad to me, is the graphical nature and that is really hard to use
to create the outline.
It is not that I cannot create a basic outline one the canvas and move
the origin around to keep focus on the next action defined - I could
do that in either nested bullets or mindmap form - it is a desire to
change things around bey dragging and dropping objects (tiles?) rather
than erasing and rewriting.
I could blather on in this direction for a long time, but I hope this
is succinct enough to explain what I think I am looking for. This is
really why I am interested in how you and others are using this tool
to implement parts of GTD. to implement GTD fully is an awful lot of
work, due to these little semantic quirks of taking a word like
project that is already in major use and restricing its use.
Enjoy your France trip, next month.
Roger
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