[The Well] Avoiding the presence of gas
Kevin McCray
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Joe Dobry
As pertaining to probable location of a new well, historical records are the first item that I would think about. County records/agents/nearby landowners are all good sources. State water offices usually will have some way to look up wells already installed in the area of interest, and electronic access to those records are becoming more and more easily obtained. Design, construction and operation would then be based on expectations of coming in contact with any of the mentioned problems.
However, there is always going to be the rare incidence of drilling into an unexpected pocket of overpressured gas—in which case, one can only hope it turns out to be non-flammable and short-lived. Handling gas associated with produced water is a different problem best addressed by water treatment/separation experts, I would expect.
I was called in on a water well near Bastrop, TX, that encountered shallow gas that only came in AFTER setting casing. No one was hurt, but it was a somewhat spectacular and costly event. Turns out the nearest well had always produced gas and no one thought to pass it on to the driller, I guess.
Joe Dobry
From: kmc...@ngwa.org
[mailto:blmailer-thewell...@biglist.com] On Behalf Of Kevin McCray
Sent: Thursday, November 05, 2009
3:19 PM
To: the...@ngwa.biglist.com
Subject: [The Well] Avoiding the
presence of gas
What well location, well design, well
construction, and well operation options do you utilize to either avoid or
eliminate the potential for or presence of gases such as methane, hydrogen
sulfide, carbon dioxide, and others?
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Jim Wright
Personal single gas monitors are less than $300 now and many require no daily calibration. Put an H2S meter and or an LEL meter on the control panel if there is ANY concern for gas. It is money well spent.
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Sent: Thu Nov 05 14:09:05 2009
Subject: Re: [The Well] Avoiding the presence of gas
Gary Burchard
Admittedly, this doesn’t answer Kevin’s question. However, I thought it important to share the following associated safety issue:
The work of Professor Carl Mendoza and his student Sarah Hill at the University of Alberta highlights another, and potentially deadly, aspect of gasses in wells. Exhalation from “breathing” wells can create an oxygen-depleted atmosphere in domestic well pits. In the case of their research, nitrogen was the culprit. See the links below for more information.
www.bcgwa.org/ppt/Hill_CW2004.ppt
http://gsa.confex.com/gsa/2003AM/finalprogram/abstract_64373.htm
Gary C. Burchard
Hydrogeologist
Metropolitan Domestic Water Improvement District
P.O. Box 36870
Tucson, AZ 85740
Phone: (520) 575-8100
Fax: (520) 575-8454
From: kmc...@ngwa.org
[mailto:blmailer-thewell...@biglist.com] On Behalf Of Kevin
McCray
Sent: Thursday, November 05, 2009 2:19 PM
To: the...@ngwa.biglist.com
Subject: [The Well] Avoiding the presence of gas
What well location, well design, well construction, and well
operation options do you utilize to either avoid or eliminate the potential for
or presence of gases such as methane, hydrogen sulfide, carbon dioxide, and
others?
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David Haupt
What well location, well design, well construction, and well operation options do you utilize to either avoid or eliminate the potential for or presence of gases such as methane, hydrogen sulfide, carbon dioxide, and others?
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The question is too all encompassing for a short answer.
I'd conclude that Texans potentially drilling through explosive gas pockets is one thing and a Wisconsinite finishing a well that may have dissolved gases such as H2S or CO2 is quite another. If dissolved gas from a well is a problem the water user can't handle with treatment and if the geology would cooperate, one would case off the poor quality and take water from a different depth for better quality. The only methane in this part of the country, that I know of, is generated from landfills or plug digesters handling manure from large dairy operations.
Now, I'm wondering about Alan's comment about (non-naturally occurring natural gas.)
David Haupt
Dwight Hanson
There are several ways to deal with the problem and most are site specific.
Dwight Hanson
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 08:21:13 -0500
From: dlh...@plbb.us
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Subject: Re: [The Well] Avoiding the presence of gas
Tim Parker
Simple technical solutions we discussed for that project, although not simple from regulatory standpoint, included passive or active venting of the well/source – we were pretty convinced that the concentration was a result of accumulation, and if there was a way to eliminate the buildup, the level would not be significant and may not even be a hazard then. This was not a solution the client wanted to consider for political reasons.
Funny thing I’ll never forget about that site – one time when we were actively monitoring – as usual, had notified police and fire dept, isolated areas with ropes and cones, set up huge fans, dressed in LEVEL B on supplied air (hose), and a guy walked right up to us from the LA River canal, who looked like he had been drunk and slept in is own body fluids, and asked if we knew where there was a phone he could use – my partner and I looked at one another I thinking I was glad I was on supplied air and she asked him he if noticed anything unusual about us and the area. Oh well – east LA!
On 11/6/09 5:47 AM, "Dwight Hanson" <dwight...@hotmail.com> wrote:
The best thing to do is contact local drillers and see how they deal with the problem. Discuss with then to see what works well in your area. If they do not have good or sensable solutions then contact your regulators or local university to see if they have solutions.
There are several ways to deal with the problem and most are site specific.
Dwight Hanson
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 08:21:13 -0500
From: dlh...@plbb.us
To: the...@ngwa.biglist.com
Subject: Re: [The Well] Avoiding the presence of gas
Kevin McCray wrote:
What well location, well design, well construction, and well operation options do you utilize to either avoid or eliminate the potential for or presence of gases such as methane, hydrogen sulfide, carbon dioxide, and others?
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The question is too all encompassing for a short answer.
I'd conclude that Texans potentially drilling through explosive gas pockets is one thing and a Wisconsinite finishing a well that may have dissolved gases such as H2S or CO2 is quite another. If dissolved gas from a well is a problem the water user can't handle with treatment and if the geology would cooperate, one would case off the poor quality and take water from a different depth for better quality. The only methane in this part of the country, that I know of, is generated from landfills or plug digesters handling manure from large dairy operations.
Now, I'm wondering about Alan's comment about (non-naturally occurring natural gas.)
David Haupt
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Mike Krautkramer
I just want to thank Tim Parker for some good insights and a GREAT story. On this subject my role is to learn and I am finding once again that the braintrust of the industry is quite impressive.
Mike Krautkramer
David Abbott
That away Tim – Good story and I agree with Mike.
David Abbott
Zhao, Lanying
Hello All,
I would like to have your suggestions on our water supply project. Any help will be appreicated.
The current well (PW1, 8'' diameter) is located in the well fractured water-bearing zone. The flow rate at the blow test was over 150 igpm; the well drilling was discontinued at 240 feet since the severely broken sandstone. In order to obtain more flow rate, we are drilling another deep well (PW2) with 10" diameter, which is 6 m away from PW1. The land use for drilling a new well was limited. We assumed that PW2 would be located in the same fracured zone as PW1 and the drilling would be not easy to go through the severely broken bedrock at 240 feet. However, the drilling for PW2 was so smooth and did not encounter any fractures although the bedrock cuttings for the two well are similar (red fine sandstone). The flow rate of PW2 was only 20 igpm with 400 feet depth. As well, PW2 has been installed 100 feet casing and was planned to be linered with sliced pipe for protecting wellbore. Although we know the heterogeneity of fractured aquifer the very difference in such short distance is still hardly understandable.
For this case, do you think there is any way to increase the well yield so that PW2 can be used as pumping well for the village?
Thank you very much for your help,
Lanying
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Lanying
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Alan
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Fred Rothauge
Lanying,
Are you certain that the well has been properly developed. By going deeper is it possible that what fractures are present have some plugging. How were the wells drilled?
Fred Rothauge
Quality Drilling Fluids.
From: LZ...@dillon.ca
[mailto:blmailer-thewell...@biglist.com] On Behalf Of Zhao,
Lanying
Sent: Friday, November 06, 2009 1:27 PM
To: the...@ngwa.biglist.com
Subject: [The Well] Well Development - how to increase the well yield -
fractured aquifer
Hello All,
I would like to have your suggestions onour water supply project. Any help will be appreicated.
The current well (PW1, 8'' diameter) is located in the well fractured water-bearing zone.The flow rate at the blow test was over 150 igpm; the well drilling was discontinued at 240 feet since the severely broken sandstone. In order to obtain more flow rate, we are drilling another deepwell (PW2) with 10" diameter, which is 6 m away from PW1. The land use for drilling a new well was limited. We assumed that PW2would be located in the same fracured zone as PW1 and the drilling would be not easy to go through the severely broken bedrock at 240 feet. However, the drilling for PW2 was so smooth and did not encounter any fractures although the bedrock cuttings for the two well are similar (red fine sandstone). The flow rate of PW2 was only 20 igpm with 400 feet depth. As well, PW2 has been installed 100 feet casing and was planned to be linered with sliced pipe for protecting wellbore. Although we know the heterogeneity of fractured aquifer the very difference in such short distance is still hardly understandable.
You are subscribed as frot...@qdfluids.comZhao, Lanying
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Subject: Re: [The Well] Well Development - how to increase the well yield - fractured aquifer
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Zhao, Lanying
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Don_...@urscorp.com
Do you have information on the strike and dip of the areal fracture trends? 6m can be a long way when you are counting on fractures for your conductivity and yield.
Donald Brice, C.P.G.
URS Corporation
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Zhao, Lanying
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Ralph J Haefner
Your Re: [The Well] Well Development - how to increase the well
document: yield - fractured aquifer
was rhae...@usgs.gov
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document: yield - fractured aquifer
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Kevin McCray
Actually, we have a section on breathing wells in our report, based on other work in Alberta and has reported on in Water Well Journal. I made reference to this work in the USGS Stray Gas workshop last week in Pittsburgh. Thanks!
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Kevin McCray
Attached is a first draft for a proposed best suggested practice. I assembled this for a stray gas conference last week in Pittsburgh at which I was the final presentation of the day. After hearing the first day and half of other presentations, I posted my questions to The Well. I picked up some new insights from the conference and will be incorporating into a revised BSP draft “straw man” document for the New Orleans work sessions. These additional insights will be useful, as well. NGWA hopes that each of the respondents will be able to participate in further refining the draft BSP. If you have an interest, please contact Jonathan Jenkins at jjen...@ngwa.org
Regards.
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David L Nelms
Your Re: [The Well] Well Development - how to increase the well
document: yield - fractured aquifer
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