Slight bragging inside
Max Quordlepleen
> http://www.google.ca
>
> Type xnews icons }:O) Then, click the Similar Pages link.
>
> I guess this means that I _really_ should finish my site update, huh?
>
A well-deserved plaudit, DC - my sincerest contrafibularities
Yáll maybe interested in an email I received today. I don't think he would
mind my posting this:
----------------
thanks for the kind words.
Yes, I'm afraid Xnews is winding down. I still use it of course, but there
are things I wish it had but they would require a complete rewrite, since
patching won't do anymore.
It was fun though.
cheers
:)
luu
At 10:20 PM 12/02/02 +1300, you wrote:
>Hi Luu, I just wanted to say thanks. I was sans PC when you last
>appeared in n.s.r to basically announce the end of the road for Xnews,
>and have only just stumbled across that black thread. I am deeply grateful
>for having had the pleasure of using your fine tool, and saddened that it
>and I will not continue to grow together. Your decision has at least
>lessened the wrench that my move, next week, to Linux will cause. I feel
>embarrassed to think that I have had nearly three years use of such an
>outstanding tool, and have only given you around $_ in return. The
>scales don't seem even, so I think another Paypal excursion is in order for
>me. Thanks for everything, and whatever you turn your hand to, may it
>succeed, and bring you as much pleasure as Xnews has to me.
>--
>"KyliXnews?" <eg>
Boomer
> DC wrote:
>
>> http://www.google.ca
>>
>> Type xnews icons }:O) Then, click the Similar Pages link.
>>
>> I guess this means that I _really_ should finish my site update,
>> huh?
>>
> A well-deserved plaudit, DC - my sincerest contrafibularities
>
> Yáll maybe interested in an email I received today. I don't think he
> would mind my posting this:
> ----------------
> thanks for the kind words.
>
> Yes, I'm afraid Xnews is winding down. I still use it of course, but
> there are things I wish it had but they would require a complete
> rewrite, since patching won't do anymore.
>
> It was fun though.
>
> cheers
>
>:)
>
> luu
I think I shall cry. :-(((
Thank you for posting this Max.
<sob sniffle sob more>
For Luu here ever you are. Luu am sending many thanks and wishing you the
Very Best!! I've tried quite a few readers and I don't know how Xnews can
be topped. Thank you again.
<sniffle>
John De Hoog
>Xnews and Hamster are the only things holding me to Windows; here
>begins my search for something as good for Linux.
It's funny, I've been seeing posts just like the above for the last several
years (only the names change, e.g., from Xnews to Agent or News Rover or
whatever). It seems people are willing to cut Linux a lot of slack, and wait
forever for decent desktop programs. Either that, or they finally figure out
that there are Unix ways of doing things that are not just the same as Windows
or Mac ways.
My advice to people who want to leave Windows and go to Linux is this: Learn
the tools that Linux already has for doing email and news, such as Gnus/Emacs,
the built in mail and news servers, the filtering tools and so on. If you are
looking for Windows equivalents, you are better off sticking with Windows.
Don't go to Linux expecting to find "just like Windows, only free!" because
you're likely to be disappointed. Either make your peace with Bill Gates or
learn to grovel at the feet of the Unix gods.
--
John De Hoog, Tokyo
http://dehoog.org
Max Quordlepleen
Hash: SHA1
on Sat, 21 Dec 2002 12:52, in <20021220185246.320$3...@news.newsreader.com>,
John De Hoog brashly asserted:
> My advice to people who want to leave Windows and go to Linux is this:
> Learn the tools that Linux already has for doing email and news, such as
> Gnus/Emacs, the built in mail and news servers, the filtering tools and so
> on.
Good advice, which I am trying to heed. From what I've seen so far,
Gnus-emacs is more to my liking than slrn. It must be said, however, that
NNTP clients in general _are_ inferior in Linux. Pan is supposed to be the
Linux equivalent of Agent - it ain't even close. And there is certainly no
client I've found yet that combines CLI configurability with GUI ease of
use the way Xnews did. Gnus-Emacs does seem the best for that, though,
which is why I intend to do some serious reading in the very near future
- --
Blessed are the beaked,
for they shall tear down the Gates of Hell,
and all sectors shall be their /home forever.
To email me - get my GPG key http://maxqnz.com/aliaskey.txt
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Blinky the Shark
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
>
> on Sat, 21 Dec 2002 12:52, in
> <20021220185246.320$3...@news.newsreader.com>, John De Hoog brashly
> asserted:
>
>> My advice to people who want to leave Windows and go to Linux is
>> this: Learn the tools that Linux already has for doing email and
>> news, such as Gnus/Emacs, the built in mail and news servers, the
>> filtering tools and so on.
>
> Good advice, which I am trying to heed. From what I've seen so far,
> Gnus-emacs is more to my liking than slrn. It must be said, however,
> that NNTP clients in general _are_ inferior in Linux. Pan is supposed
> to be the Linux equivalent of Agent - it ain't even close. And there
> is certainly no client I've found yet that combines CLI
> configurability with GUI ease of use the way Xnews did. Gnus-Emacs
> does seem the best for that, though, which is why I intend to do some
> serious reading in the very near future
I've considered myself Mr. Xnews for a few years, but I'm gonna have to
quote something I just posted in another group, this afternoon, in reply
to a similar evaluation:
<q>
I'd have posted that five months ago. Maybe three months, ago.
But since late summer, I've been using a non-GUI news client, and I've
(re)discovered that it's a lot more efficient than the gooey one's I'd
been using for the last...uh...seven or eight years, I guess. And no,
that's not because I came here from a bad gooey client -- the one I
converted from is top-notch.
</q>
I just had to internalize the shortcut keys, and install a few macros
and the cleanscore utility. No, that's not quite the same as
outta-the-box slrn. But it wasn't a dealbreaker. And I'm not saying
that I don't use (and enjoy) any other GUIs -- this is only an
Xnews/slrn comparison. Or that I particularly *enjoy* using pine on my
shell, but it's there and all I get is spam in that box, anyway. :)
--
Blinky
Home Entertainment Wonder - http://snurl.com/model_zero
Max Quordlepleen
Hash: SHA1
on Sat, 21 Dec 2002 13:44, in <slrnb07eca....@dora.blinkynet.net>,
Blinky the Shark brashly asserted:
> And I'm not saying
> that I don't use (and enjoy) any other GUIs -- this is only an
> Xnews/slrn comparison.
Fairy nuff. I actually think of Xnews as slrn's Windows cousin - not
brothers, but clearly kin. However, when comparing apples and apples (GUI
vs. GUI) Windoze newsreaders are way out in front, IMHO.
- --
Blessed are the beaked,
for they shall tear down the Gates of Hell,
and all sectors shall be their /home forever.
To email me - get my GPG key http://maxqnz.com/aliaskey.txt
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=FnkW
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Max Quordlepleen
> whiskers <catwh...@operamail.com> wrote:
>
> >Xnews and Hamster are the only things holding me to Windows; here
> >begins my search for something as good for Linux.
>
> My advice to people who want to leave Windows and go to Linux is this: Learn
> the tools that Linux already has for doing email and news, such as Gnus/Emacs,
> the built in mail and news servers, the filtering tools and so on...
> Either make your peace with Bill Gates or learn to grovel at the feet of the Unix gods.
I'm a-grovelling now. Do you have any Gnus pearls to share? 8^)
John De Hoog
Will some perls do?
Truth be told, I'm hardly a Unix god, and no longer use Linux more than
occasionally, mainly because work requirements prevent me from using it as my
production OS. But in all my forays into the Linux or Solaris worlds, I was
never much impressed with the "Windows-like" applications. The real Unix stuff,
though, is pretty impressive once you get into it. After you've set up your
news and mail servers to do what you want, you can interface with them in all
kinds of cool ways.
Anyway, good luck, Max. I'd probably join you if my customers stopped sending
me all the PowerPoint and Visio stuff to work on.
Blinky the Shark
Why do I wish that had been "Gnus perls"? :)
Max Quordlepleen
>> Max Quordlepleen <ma...@ded.com> wrote:
>>I'm a-grovelling now. Do you have any Gnus pearls to share? 8^)
>
> Will some perls do?
>
> Truth be told, I'm hardly a Unix god, and no longer use Linux more than
> occasionally, mainly because work requirements prevent me from using it as my
> production OS. But in all my forays into the Linux or Solaris worlds, I was
> never much impressed with the "Windows-like" applications. The real Unix stuff,
> though, is pretty impressive once you get into it. After you've set up your
> news and mail servers to do what you want, you can interface with them in all
> kinds of cool ways.
>
I agree. The "wannabe Windoze" app.s are not there.
They are neither as polished as their Windoze counterparts,
nor as flexible and configurable as the native *nix app.s
> Anyway, good luck, Max. I'd probably join you if my customers stopped sending
> me all the PowerPoint and Visio stuff to work on.
>
Fro what I'm reading in the OpenOffice.org mailing lists,
its handling of PPT files has improved markedly. Visio I'm not sure about
Max Quordlepleen
> Max Quordlepleen wrote:
> > I'm a-grovelling now. Do you have any Gnus pearls to share? 8^)
>
> Why do I wish that had been "Gnus perls"? :)
>
Whoops! John beat you to it. :)
whiskers
news.software.readers:
snip
>
> My advice to people who want to leave Windows and go to Linux is
> this: Learn the tools that Linux already has for doing email and
> news, such as Gnus/Emacs, the built in mail and news servers,
> the filtering tools and so on. If you are looking for Windows
> equivalents, you are better off sticking with Windows. Don't go
> to Linux expecting to find "just like Windows, only free!"
> because you're likely to be disappointed. Either make your peace
> with Bill Gates or learn to grovel at the feet of the Unix gods.
>
I agree; I don't preclude the possiblity of re-learning command-line
methods, and I used to enjoy getting DOS to do useful things when
there were no 'Windows'. It is a bit of a shock though, after years
of GUI, to suddenly face that cryptic blank screen. I'm getting
there, slowly; I've managed to get some tarballs to work, and even
re-compiled a kernel - but RPMs are easier, as long as the
dependancies are all satisfied. I'm trying to learn about 'leafnode'
at the moment, and downloading all the Linux news-readers I can find;
Knode came with the distro I'm using, but I don't think it will be my
final choice.
The smooth GUI programs are going to be the ones that attract people
away from MS and Apple, though; without them, Linux will remain
something for the fringe enthusiasts and the professional admins.
--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
those who know me have no need of my name
>I'm a-grovelling now. Do you have any Gnus pearls to share? 8^)
relax, obtain a sufficient supply of anti-rsi drugs/habits, put your .gnus
under rcs, visit my.gnus.org (which actually sucks, but there is stuff
collected/described there that's not entirely useless).
--
bringing you boring signatures for 17 years
Galen Boyer
> "John De Hoog"<deh...@dehoog.org> wrote on 20 Dec 2002, in
> news.software.readers:
>
> snip
>>
>> My advice to people who want to leave Windows and go to Linux is
>> this: Learn the tools that Linux already has for doing email and
>> news, such as Gnus/Emacs, the built in mail and news servers,
>> the filtering tools and so on. If you are looking for Windows
>> equivalents, you are better off sticking with Windows. Don't go
>> to Linux expecting to find "just like Windows, only free!"
>> because you're likely to be disappointed. Either make your peace
>> with Bill Gates or learn to grovel at the feet of the Unix gods.
>>
> I agree; I don't preclude the possiblity of re-learning command-line
> methods, and I used to enjoy getting DOS to do useful things when
> there were no 'Windows'. It is a bit of a shock though, after years
> of GUI, to suddenly face that cryptic blank screen.
You'll be quite surprised at the GUIyness of Gnus. There certainly is
nothing anything remotely like a "cryptic blank screen"
> I'm getting there, slowly; I've managed to get some tarballs to work,
> and even re-compiled a kernel - but RPMs are easier, as long as the
> dependancies are all satisfied. I'm trying to learn about 'leafnode'
> at the moment, and downloading all the Linux news-readers I can find;
> Knode came with the distro I'm using, but I don't think it will be my
> final choice.
Hm... I would assume that there exist precompiled Linux versions for
Emacs. I've been using the precompiled version on windows for over
three years now. Gnus plain rocks!
> The smooth GUI programs are going to be the ones that attract people
> away from MS and Apple, though; without them, Linux will remain
> something for the fringe enthusiasts and the professional admins.
I don't actually know alot about the user experience on windows but the
talks I've had with people are that it is quite GUI, whatever that might
actually mean.
--
Galen deForest Boyer
Sweet dreams and flying machines in pieces on the ground.
Max Quordlepleen
> You'll be quite surprised at the GUIyness of Gnus. There certainly is
> nothing anything remotely like a "cryptic blank screen"
>
> Emacs. I've been using the precompiled version on windows for over
> three years now. Gnus plain rocks!
>
Amen! The man speaks nowt but the truth! I am looking forward to
strengthening my tenuous grip on Gnus, to include a grasp of scoring,
filtering, etc. From what I've learned already, it is an _amazingly_
versatile beastie.
--
Blessed are the Gnus,
for they shall slay the slrn,
and all Usenet shall be their alt.home forever.
Galen Boyer
> Galen Boyer <galen...@hotpop.com> writes:
>
>
>> You'll be quite surprised at the GUIyness of Gnus. There certainly
>> is nothing anything remotely like a "cryptic blank screen"
>>
>
>> Hm... I would assume that there exist precompiled Linux versions for
>> Emacs. I've been using the precompiled version on windows for over
>> three years now. Gnus plain rocks!
>>
>
> Amen! The man speaks nowt but the truth! I am looking forward to
> strengthening my tenuous grip on Gnus, to include a grasp of scoring,
> filtering, etc.
Like everything Emacs, takes awhile to get your hands around it, but if
you remember that you can take it a little bit at a time, you'll be
fine. Its when you try to learn everything to start off with, you throw
up your hands, cause you _never_ learn everything.
> From what I've learned already, it is an _amazingly_ versatile
> beastie.
And a beast it is. :-)
Max Quordlepleen
> Like everything Emacs, takes awhile to get your hands around it, but if
> you remember that you can take it a little bit at a time, you'll be
> fine.
That's what won me to Gnus in the first place - it was easier to use
out of the box, as it were, than slrn, with the opportunity to learn
as I go, rather than having to hit the ground running.
> Its when you try to learn everything to start off with, you throw
> up your hands, cause you _never_ learn everything.
--
That can be kinda fun, though
Trying to fly before you can walk.
if you pull it off - wow!